StillUnknown Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 This is frightening. Why would you trade a blue chip like the third pick in the draft? Only Ernie could go from potentially having picks 3 & 10 to having picks 6 & 11. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 How do you stop LeBron James or Kevin Durant? How do you beat two players who are impossibly good already (and they keep getting better)? With a dominant big man coupled, with a perimeter star, and a coach/system that fits. Lucky for them there is only one big that is nearly dominant at the moment and he's likely not going to end up on a good team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 I only watched Rivers in games even though I hate Duke. I prefer to go on game video as a whole than any private workout. Rivers, while flawed like everyone else, hit clutch shots and has the pedigree to be a smart, talented NBA player. My Problem with Rivers is that he's a selfish player and a shotjacker with no mid range game. He's not the type of element we want to add to the locker room. Right now he's a weak defender and I think his ceiling is as a passable but indifferent defender. I'd be happy with Sullinger too. I just figured Meyers since he wouldn't be getting much playing time right away anyways. Leonard is smart and a terrific athlete. But he's never really put it all together for himself on the court. I don't trust him to become more than a Spencer Hawes. ---------- Post added June-22nd-2012 at 10:34 AM ---------- Only Ernie could go from potentially having picks 3 & 10 to having picks 6 & 11. Hahahaha. I didn't think about it like that. Ouch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMS Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 Ernie Grunfeld has no business drafting for upside anymore, this team needs a star now. MKG/Beal/TRob, leave Drummond to a team that can afford to take that chance. like I said, Drummond has the highest upside in the entire draft. If that is guy ernie ultimately wants, it makes sense to trade down because he will likely still be there at 6. You don't have a shot at a championship without taking chances and hitting ocassionally. Drummond would be a huge win if he developed. Much better than MKG/Beal or TRob who are all more sure of being competent professionals. Only you don't win championships with just having a team stocked with competent guys. You need a super star. A super star at center is still the surest way to NBA sucess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsiaticSkinsFan Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 NBA players can and should be able to hit jump shots with no one guarding him. The fact that he couldn't, and that he has a low release point on his jumper, is troublesome. Rivers is a great slasher tho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 **** Andray Blatche for being such a train wreck that we can't even trade him despite the fact he's a 26 year old 6'11 270 pound player that can run the floor, faceup, drive the lane, and score from the post making just 7 million a season. It's absurd when you think about it. On paper he's one of the most valuable commodities in basketball but he's got such a ten cent head that none of that stuff is actually worth a thing to another NBA team. What happens if we amnesty Blatche and then he goes to some serious, veteran laden organization that reforms him and he becomes a consistent force? We'll hate him even more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBash Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 **** Andray Blatche for being such a train wreck that we can't even trade him despite the fact he's a 26 year old 6'11 270 pound player that can run the floor, faceup, drive the lane, and score from the post making just 7 million a season.It's absurd when you think about it. On paper he's one of the most valuable commodities in basketball but he's got such a ten cent head that none of that stuff is actually worth a thing to another NBA team. What happens if we amnesty Blatche and then he goes to some serious, veteran laden organization that reforms him and he becomes a consistent force? We'll hate him even more. Fattest skinny guy I have ever seen. I am ashamed to say this, but I am going to admit it. About 3 years ago, I started a fake NBA Facebook fan page about Andray Blatche claiming we were going to make the playoffs with a healthy Gilbert. I even reached over 500 fans. I think I shut it down after the start of last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 Ernie Grunfeld has no business drafting for upside anymore, this team needs a star now. MKG/Beal/TRob, leave Drummond to a team that can afford to take that chance. Every draft is about upside. Gerald Wallace is good but four of him doesn't change a franchise like one Dwight Howard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor703 Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 Every draft is about upside. Gerald Wallace is good but four of him doesn't change a franchise like one Dwight Howard. While very true, I just think there a far too many question marks surrounding Drummond for Ernie to take the chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 With a dominant big man coupled, with a perimeter star, and a coach/system that fits. Lucky for them there is only one big that is nearly dominant at the moment and he's likely not going to end up on a good team. In the summer of 2014, DeMarcus Cousins joins John Wall and MKG/Beal in D.C. That could possibly do it. We'll have so much salary off the books by then. IIRC, it should just be Nene's 13 million + Vesely + Singleton + MKG or Beal + 2013 first rounder under contract by then. We'd be able to afford maxing out both Cousins and Wall most likely. Build around those two as your stars plus Beal or MKG as your glue guy and third wheel. That'd be as talented a big three as any in the league at that point IMO. We'd have a shot. If we start winning by 2014 and Sacramento is still struggling, there is no way they'll be as attractive a place to play as D.C. with Wall. We should even have some trade assets to try and deal for him by that point if need be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 While very true, I just think there a far too many question marks surrounding Drummond for Ernie to take the chance. Agreed and at the end of the day, as with all draft picks, there is an element of luck involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky21 Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 (edited) What happens if we amnesty Blatche and then he goes to some serious, veteran laden organization that reforms him and he becomes a consistent force? I think I'm OK risking this at this point. Edited June 22, 2012 by Rocky21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 Blatche isn't going to be a beast anywhere. People said the same thing when the Skins got rid of Haynesworth. He is what he is at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StillUnknown Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 I think I'm OK risking this at this point. Makes no difference what #7 will do elsewhere, he'll always be a worthless piece of **** here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 What happens if we amnesty Blatche and then he goes to some serious, veteran laden organization that reforms him and he becomes a consistent force? We'll hate him even more. You just accept the fact that in sports, some players are not going to thrive in certain situations. How many teams has Z-bo burned to the ground? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 What happens if we amnesty Blatche and then he goes to some serious, veteran laden organization that reforms him and he becomes a consistent force? We'll hate him even more. And whats wrong with hating him more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 You just accept the fact that in sports' date=' some players are not going to thrive in certain situations.How many teams has Z-bo burned to the ground?[/quote'] That's a good analogy. Normally I wish former players well when they go to other teams but I hope Blatche fails at his next stop too. He is the most irritating player non named Haynesworth to play in D.C. in a while. ---------- Post added June-22nd-2012 at 02:08 PM ---------- The decision not to take on any new contracts by our FO is looking like a really smart one. I still think this was the primary motivation behind the Shard trade. They wanted to get two veteran players without taking on contracts for more than two years each. The reason being the free agent class of 2014 looks pretty amazing. Check it out: Old hand FAs LeBron, Wade, Kobe, Carmelo, Bosh, Dirk, Pau, Granger, Pierce, Rudy Gay, and Z-Bo. All of those guys are UFAs except LeBron, Wade, Bosh, Carmelo, Amare, Gay, and Z-Bo. These guys have either player options or early termination options. Next consider that it's the first year the big time rookies of the draft class of 2010 will be eligible for restricted free agency. And the unextended rookies from the draft class of 2009 will be UFAs. Either way it shakes down, it's going to be such a banner year for free agency that there will be so many quality FAs even the Wizards might be able to get in on the action. Amnesty Blatche and Nene's 13 million dollar contract is the only one we're on the hook for that summer. We have the ability to go out and sign two max deals. We probably won't entice the Carmelos or LeBrons of the world to come here. But the younger generation of guys who've gotten to work with Wall is a possibility. I think it's entirely possible to win enough games in the next two years for Wall to make a leap and also to entice Wall into staying with a big extension. I think where ever Wall commits to long term, there is a very good chance that's also the place DeMarcus Cousins commits to long term. I think we have a good shot at signing Cousins unless he signs an extension in Sacramento. And if he's not winning in Sacramento, I have a hard time seeing him want to extend there. Here's a question: If we were to sign Cousins in 2014 or 2015, who would be the best player to take in this draft to compliment a Wall/Cousins foundation? ---------- Post added June-22nd-2012 at 02:35 PM ---------- Harrison Barnes was 53-0 his final two years in High School. What happened at UNC? He came in a sure thing and never quite lived up to his billing. Last year UNC was one of the most talented teams ever assembled, four current lottery picks and at least one future one, a Senior All American and ACC POTY Center and a Junior two time ACC DPOY. I want to know what was going on at UNC for why he and the team did not meet expectations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonArtest15 Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 SM...that's my one red-flag with Barnes. I like the kid. I really do. But when people go ape **** at his combine numbers, all I could help to think was "where was all of that during his time at UNC?" Having those gifts are great...not showing those gifts consistently is a problem My draft board right now: Beal MKG T-Rob Barnes Drummond The more I think about it, the more I think that we are going to take MKG and Beal MIGHT be a smokescreen. That being said, EG will have to make a move to bring in some shooters. I'd explore some sort of deal w. Houston for Kevin Martin if we end up taking MKG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 I'd explore some sort of deal w. Houston for Kevin Martin if we end up taking MKG. The only issue is that Martin is not really a shooter. I've watched Kevin Martin for a few years and I can't really describe him. He weighs less than I do. He can't play D. He doesn't have a great handle. He's not a great shooter. Yet, the game ends and he has 22 points. He gets to the line an insane amount and I have no idea how he does it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBash Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 I read on another board the Cavs are seriously considering doing the 24 plus 4 for 2 deal to assure they get Beal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samuels Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 That's a good analogy.Normally I wish former players well when they go to other teams but I hope Blatche fails at his next stop too. He is the most irritating player non named Haynesworth to play in D.C. in a while. ---------- Post added June-22nd-2012 at 02:08 PM ---------- The decision not to take on any new contracts by our FO is looking like a really smart one. I still think this was the primary motivation behind the Shard trade. They wanted to get two veteran players without taking on contracts for more than two years each. The reason being the free agent class of 2014 looks pretty amazing. Check it out: Old hand FAs LeBron, Wade, Kobe, Carmelo, Bosh, Dirk, Pau, Granger, Pierce, Rudy Gay, and Z-Bo. All of those guys are UFAs except LeBron, Wade, Bosh, Carmelo, Amare, Gay, and Z-Bo. These guys have either player options or early termination options. Next consider that it's the first year the big time rookies of the draft class of 2010 will be eligible for restricted free agency. And the unextended rookies from the draft class of 2009 will be UFAs. Either way it shakes down, it's going to be such a banner year for free agency that there will be so many quality FAs even the Wizards might be able to get in on the action. Amnesty Blatche and Nene's 13 million dollar contract is the only one we're on the hook for that summer. We have the ability to go out and sign two max deals. We probably won't entice the Carmelos or LeBrons of the world to come here. But the younger generation of guys who've gotten to work with Wall is a possibility. I think it's entirely possible to win enough games in the next two years for Wall to make a leap and also to entice Wall into staying with a big extension. I think where ever Wall commits to long term, there is a very good chance that's also the place DeMarcus Cousins commits to long term. I think we have a good shot at signing Cousins unless he signs an extension in Sacramento. And if he's not winning in Sacramento, I have a hard time seeing him want to extend there. Here's a question: If we were to sign Cousins in 2014 or 2015, who would be the best player to take in this draft to compliment a Wall/Cousins foundation? ---------- Post added June-22nd-2012 at 02:35 PM ---------- Harrison Barnes was 53-0 his final two years in High School. What happened at UNC? He came in a sure thing and never quite lived up to his billing. Last year UNC was one of the most talented teams ever assembled, four current lottery picks and at least one future one, a Senior All American and ACC POTY Center and a Junior two time ACC DPOY. I want to know what was going on at UNC for why he and the team did not meet expectations. Can't put all that on Barnes although he did struggle. And nobody ever mentions that Roy Williams system is'nt designed for a guy like Harrison to really get off. In the NBA he will have a more wide open, heavily spaced league that fits his strenghts much better. I think that to many people scream to draft certain guys based on college play and there not projecting them into the next level or looking at the overall big picture coaching,systems,teammates etc. UNC had a great chance to win it all this year. Marshall going down killed them and any chance they had especially with his primary backup out as well, that little dude who took his spot was just awful. The NBA is a pick&roll heavy league with lots of isolations. Barnes has proven that he is by far the best midrange shooter in this draft. He has also scored in isolations a ton his 2 dribble pullup and step back jumpers are NBA caliber. He has proven he can shoot off screens much more then Beal did this year. He is a good long defender with a NBA offensive game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 The only issue is that Martin is not really a shooter. I've watched Kevin Martin for a few years and I can't really describe him. He weighs less than I do. He can't play D. He doesn't have a great handle. He's not a great shooter. Yet' date=' the game ends and he has 22 points. He gets to the line an insane amount and I have no idea how he does it.[/quote']He's an odd bird. He gets his points off threes, and really, his 3 PT percentages aren't that bad. 2010-2011 season he made 176 threes and shot .383 from behind the arc. Not terrible. He's a player that needs a ton of shots and minutes to thrive. But, for one thing, he gets hurt all the time. I think he's only been healthy for one or two seasons of his career. He's definitely a shooter though. He just doesn't shoot all that well. For the 2010-2011 season he took 1,000 jumpers, which is getting into Durant territory. A huge number of them were unassisted dribble pull ups, so he is somewhat creative. Like Durant, he'll pull up in your face and fire away. He's so tall and spindly that spacing is rarely an issue for him against other 2s. But unlike Durant, he doesn't make his shots at remotely the same clip. He shot .364 on jumpers that season. On over a 1,000 of them. That is not good. By comparison, Durant shot .427 on the same number of jumpers this season. .364 isn't that much higher than Jordan Crawford's percentage of .349. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 (edited) He's an odd bird. He gets his points off threes, and really, his 3 PT percentages aren't that bad. 2010-2011 season he made 176 threes and shot .383 from behind the arc. Not terrible.He's a player that needs a ton of shots and minutes to thrive. But, for one thing, he gets hurt all the time. I think he's only been healthy for one or two seasons of his career. He's definitely a shooter though. He just doesn't shoot all that well. For the 2010-2011 season he took 1,000 jumpers, which is getting into Durant territory. A huge number of them were unassisted dribble pull ups, so he is somewhat creative. Like Durant, he'll pull up in your face and fire away. He's so tall and spindly that spacing is rarely an issue for him against other 2s. But unlike Durant, he doesn't make his shots at remotely the same clip. He shot .364 on jumpers that season. On over a 1,000 of them. That is not good. By comparison, Durant shot .427 on the same number of jumpers this season. .364 isn't that much higher than Jordan Crawford's percentage of .349. This year, he seemed to rely on shooting more because his free throw attempts collapsed. Historically, he makes his living at the line. He averages 6.6 FTs a game. 6.6 a game would be 8th highest in the league this year, around Carmelo, Blake, and Westbrook. He's just such an odd player and he needs the ball so much to be effective. I think the Wizards need a classic knock down shooter at the 2 spot. That is not Martin by any stretch. Martin is a World B. Free type. He needs to always play on a 30 win team were he can score 20 a night while dominating the ball. That's his destiny. Edited June 22, 2012 by Lombardi's_kid_brother Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonArtest15 Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 What other options are out there via trade if we dont target martin at SG? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 What other options are out there via trade if we dont target martin at SG? Hard to say via trade because we don't really know who is actually available. What about someone on the Magic? They probably have surplus shooters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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