Destino Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 expiring contracts are good to trade for assets to either 1) get your team below the cap to pick up more players in the futre 2) get yourself out of the luxury tax 3) use as a trade chip to get something of value in return.We did none of this. Crawford might not be an idea player to start, but he can score, and that is a commodity in the NBA. The expiring deals don't help us at all....we didn't flip them for anything, and we still wont have any cap space in FA 2013. Horrible trade. On this we agree. Not sure what the heck they were thinking here. Good for Crawford though, I wish him the best of luck. His being gone is on Wittman as much as anyone. ---------- Post added February-21st-2013 at 05:58 PM ---------- We traded crawford for a guy with a torn ACL? Are you f'n kidding me??? If someone told me we had simply wanted to do Boston a favor this would make more sense. We traded one of the few players on this team that can dribble, shoot, and create for a minimal salary benefit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Genius Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 As someone who doesn't get to watch many of the games, was dumping Crawford more about his ****ing and jacking early bad shots lately? Seems like they think dumping him for nothing is still a plus... Still, financially the deal makes little sense, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 They saved about 1.5M next year. Ernie is a ****in idiot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StillUnknown Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 http://www.nba.com/wizards/wizards-acquire-collins-and-barbosa-boston Wizards President Ernie Grunfeld announced today that the Wizards have acquired guard Leandro Barbosa and center Jason Collins from the Boston Celtics in exchange for guard Jordan Crawford.“Our team has started to come together and play well over the last 20 games,” said Grunfeld. “This trade allows us to keep moving in that direction with the solid rotation and defensive commitment we have established on the court, helps us continue to build on the culture we are establishing in the locker room and gives us additional financial flexibility.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuposse87 Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 Financial flexibility? Not like they're gonna pull miracle sign someone worth a damn in the offseason. Seriously, Ernie needs to contract ebola. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skin'emAlive Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 **** this team. Ill see u guys around draft time.mim done with them for the year. Trading our only other scorer on the tea, for a guy with a torn ACL!? I'm out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WALEOVECHKIN Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 Even if you subscribe to the thought that Jordan Crawford is a no good cancer and ruined the team and had no value, the fact that they turned down Fab Melo (a legit 7 footer with upside) and instead got "salary relief" of 1.5 mil in the form of Barbosa and Collins is embarrassing. What an awful deal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shuler74 Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 I am a sad sad sad person because no matter how bad they f things up....I will still watch fml. I keep hoping one day, just one day we will amount to something, people have every right to laugh at me at my local bar, where I'm the only idiot in the bar that asks to put on the wizards game, literally the bar stops and everyone stares at me and laughs...fml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skin'emAlive Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 Crawford is an end of the bench player because he got himself demoted on an awful team. I'm not sure what value fans were expecting him to have. Boston only dealt for him because they've got no guards left and he's probably a bit better option than a street FA, but replacement level gunners like Crawford are a dime a dozen. You've lost your mind. There is no defending this trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 (edited) Even if you subscribe to the thought that Jordan Crawford is a no good cancer and ruined the team This is the usual claim made about players after a trade to justify moving them. Crawford wasn't a cancer and two weeks ago when he was hitting game winners no one was claiming he was. They weren't claiming he was a cancer over the last year either. He's another victim of the Ernie Grunfeld scapegoat experience. Seraphin or Booker will be next is my guess. Edited February 22, 2013 by Destino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonArtest15 Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 (edited) What was Crawford worth? To us? He wasn't even playing at all any more, he was useless to us.They made the move for financial reasons because the team's salary is going to be high next year and they got a little relief for a player they would have waived anyway. The fan histrionics about such an insignificant move are laughable. People must have really liked Steez I guess. You're really defending this? TGW's post from RealGM sums up my thoughts... The reason people are ******** over the trade is because it's symptomatic of what's wrong with the Wizards front office. They constantly misjudge talent, squander assets, and miss opportunities to add talent to the roster. They give away players and picks, but have no problem taking another team's trash. They squabble over some pennies but trade an expiring contract for two bloated overpaid contracts. In other words, it seems as though they have absolutely no direction for this team. Just look at my signature—they were calling this guy a building block not too long ago, and now they traded him for nothing. ---------- Post added February-21st-2013 at 07:39 PM ---------- You've lost your mind. There is no defending this trade. I'm too lazy to go back and look, but I would love to see what SM said about Crawford right after he hit the game winner vs. Portland..... Like Destino said, where was all of this "cancer" talk a few weeks ago? Edited February 22, 2013 by RonArtest15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gator Bait Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 (edited) One of the reasons they have a better front office is because they do things like trade for Harden instead of praying for potential in a rookie. People may not have known Harden would be this dominant but most people knew he was a star. Pretending he came out of no where is absurd. The wizards front office **** the bed and if you would have turned the deal down too, you're just as bad. not if he refused to extend genius ---------- Post added February-21st-2013 at 08:18 PM ---------- I can see how the team saw Crawford as a cancer....he didn't play team ball and played no defense. Kind of reminded me of Blatche....an inefficient, unteachable, selfish player....I still think he's a talented player though. You just need the right coach to get it out of him (like Doc Rivers) I'm not defending the trade....I think it was terrible, but I am glad he isn't on the team anymore. I do buy into the whole culture thing Ernie was talking about...unfortunately to change the culture of this team, you must start at the top. Ted needs to fire Ernie; Hire a competent GM; and then be a hands off owner (like Snyder learned a couple years ago). The GM needs to hire a decent coach and try to get the most of Wall, Seraphin, and Beal. Edited February 22, 2013 by Gator Bait Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 You've lost your mind. There is no defending this trade. No' date=' the fan who actually gets upset about this has lost his mind. This trade means pretty much nothing for either team. We dumped an end of the bench gunner the staff had soured on to save a little bit of money next year. BFD! ---------- Post added February-21st-2013 at 10:06 PM ---------- You're really defending this?TGW's post from RealGM sums up my thoughts... I'm not defending it. I don't think it really even needs defense. It's obvious why the move was made and it doesn't even move the needle for me. They traded a player they were otherwise going to waive to save some money next season. I think all of the histrionics and overreaction to such a nothing move are just fans looking for an excuse to piss and moan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Excuses Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 It's the little things with this franchise. Getting a player with potential, not developing them properly. Benching them and destroying their reputation/trade value. Trading them for total crap. Look no further than the team record. This is a team almost maxed out on salary and they are at best, 30-35 win team. This is what happens when you can't develop talent on the cheap but you to choose to blame the players instead of the **** management/coaching. Keep trading away raw potential. I'm sure Booker and Seraphin are next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StillUnknown Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 Somebody needs to nail that sig to Ted's office door. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 (edited) The problem with this trade is we traded a guy with potential for potentially nothing. You can make arguments for him being here or not being here, but we got rapped on this trade. Just because we weren't giving him minutes doesn't mean anything. Look how long Singleton stayed in the dog house, for no damn reason, then first game back scored in double figures. This is the one step forward, two step back nonsense that has kept us in loserville for so long. The dude is 30 years old with a knee injury, and the other guy is 34. Crawford is going to score double digits for Boston, and maybe even grow into their starting two guy. That's what bothers me about this more then anything else. Edited February 22, 2013 by Renegade7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StillUnknown Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 The problem with this trade is we traded a guy with potential for potentially nothing. You can make arguments for him being here or not being here, but we got rapped on this trade. Just because we weren't giving him minutes doesn't mean anything. Look how long Singleton stayed in the dog house, for no damn reason, then first game back scored in double figures. This is the one step forward, two step back nonsense that has kept us in loserville for so long. The dude is 30 years old with a knee injury, and the other guy is 34. What the hell, man, really, what the hell. Say what you will about Crawford, he put up numbers the entire month of December, and is still on his rookie contract. A competent GM does not walk away with literally nothing in return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wizards-insider/wp/2013/02/21/wizards-agree-to-trade-jordan-crawford-to-celtics-for-leandro-barbosa/ That doesn't bother me. Melo looks like a total stiff. Saving money probably is more valuable. Maybe Ted's a bit cheap, maybe he's trying to keep the decks clear for something he's planning for later. I don't begrudge him trying to save a few million where he can. Who knows what kind of budget the team is operating upon? The team salary is already expensive for next season with only 9 players under contract even after the Crawford trade. I believe we're just under 65 million in salary with about 57 or 58 million counting towards the cap. That's a lot to pay for such a ****ty team. Maybe this move lets them give a contract to Martell this offseason. If that's the case will the fan base still be whining about this move then? ---------- Post added February-21st-2013 at 10:32 PM ---------- I'm too lazy to go back and look, but I would love to see what SM said about Crawford right after he hit the game winner vs. Portland..... Like Destino said, where was all of this "cancer" talk a few weeks ago? I actually like Steez and seem to remember defending him against a lot of people that thought he was worthless and/or actively detrimental. But I have no illusions about his value or his future with the team after he got benched. He was a goner and there was no point keeping him around any more. Same is probably true of Booker and Ves too, although Ves at least has some upside and Booker has been getting in some games lately. I'll miss Crawford the personality, I enjoyed his absurd swagger, but the team won't miss Crawford the player at all. They had already moved on. This move was insignificant. Pardon me for not really giving a **** about it I guess. I am actually genuinely surprised people are soooo pissed about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor703 Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 What was Crawford worth? To us? He wasn't even playing at all any more, he was useless to us.They made the move for financial reasons because the team's salary is going to be high next year and they got a little relief for a player they would have waived anyway. The fan histrionics about such an insignificant move are laughable. People must have really liked Steez I guess. Didnt you recently blast me when I basically said Crawford was garbage? Now that he's been dealt I was actually right lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 It's the little things with this franchise. Getting a player with potential, not developing them properly. Benching them and destroying their reputation/trade value. Trading them for total crap.Look no further than the team record. This is a team almost maxed out on salary and they are at best, 30-35 win team. This is what happens when you can't develop talent on the cheap but you to choose to blame the players instead of the **** management/coaching. Keep trading away raw potential. I'm sure Booker and Seraphin are next. I think what you said about being unable to develop raw, cheap talent is probably true. But if I'm being honest with myself, I admit that Crawford, Booker, and Seraphin don't have much in the way of potential. The only waste that really bothers me right now is Vesely. That's a 6th overall pick. ---------- Post added February-21st-2013 at 10:46 PM ---------- Didnt you recently blast me when I basically said Crawford was garbage? Now that he's been dealt I was actually right lol Did I? If so, I'm sorry. I liked big balls Crawf and had sentimental attachment to him and I wanted him to work out here. But when he got benched the writing was on the wall and I think deep down, everyone here knew it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skin'emAlive Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 No, the fan who actually gets upset about this has lost his mind. This trade means pretty much nothing for either team. We dumped an end of the bench gunner the staff had soured on to save a little bit of money next year. BFD!---------- Post added February-21st-2013 at 10:06 PM ---------- I'm not defending it. I don't think it really even needs defense. It's obvious why the move was made and it doesn't even move the needle for me. They traded a player they were otherwise going to waive to save some money next season. I think all of the histrionics and overreaction to such a nothing move are just fans looking for an excuse to piss and moan. It was not a nothing move. We traded our only attractive asset that we deemed trade worthy by the FO for less than nothing. We gave a playoff team a guy they desperately needed due to injuries for people that arent even playing for them. This is just another stupefying move by the wizards that has no defense. So here we are again saving money to overspend for some potential player that will inevitably be a guy we could have picked up for nothing! ( Ariza, Okafor) I said it was a terrible trade for Yi years ago. He hasnt played minutes in the nba since. Said out trade of Jamison for nothing was ridiculous. We havent replaced him yet on this roster. Said we shouldnt trade Haywood, Caron, and Dshawn for peanuts. All 3 are still either starting, or playing quality minutes. I said it was a terrible trade when we picked up miller and foye for our 1st years back. Proven right. Said it would be a terrible trade getting rid of McGee for Nene. And while Nene is the better player, he has played less than half the time that McGee has so far, and we have won less games than when Mcgee was here for a guy who is being paid 14m per. Not only that, but his athleticism is beginning to fall quite quickly. Said it was a terrible trade of Lewis for Ok and Ariza. Proven right. They havent made us any better than before, ruined the growth of Seraphin and Singleton, and destroyed our cap space. Seraphin btw will soon be the next " cancer " cut from this team for absolutely nothing. In fact, we are currently making sure his minutes will make him as unattractive as possible. And no it is not obvious why we made the move. We saved potentially nothing on our cap because that would mean that we would have to pick up Crawford's 4th year extension. Which obviously we werent going to do. This team is always about making moves for the future. And then when the future comes we piss it all away for nothing. ---------- Post added February-21st-2013 at 11:35 PM ---------- And before anyone says that these guys we have gotten rid of werent going to contribute to this team, so let it go. Let me ask you. Who will contribute to this team then? We are coming up to year 4 of the rebuild, and only 2 guys seem to be a core that we can maybe build around. 4 years, and 2 guys ( one of which we drafted last year) are worthy to stay for the rest of the rebuild. That is a catastrophic failure. Meanwhile the rockets just flipped their entire team in 1 year, are on the verge of the playoffs, and still have room to make more moves should they find an attractive piece in the offseason. Which btw shouldnt be hard because they now have an allstar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 I have to agree that this is not a nothing trade. It's one more cut in the death by a thousand cuts that we're all currently enjoying. On it's own it appears to by minor but the problem is that these moves accumulate. We send out bench scoring and we get nothing in return. We do it because of "culture" when the truth is that Crawford isn't the culture problem, he's just the latest victim of it. The worst part of this is that Crawford is one of the few well rounded players on the team. How many other players does the team have that can create off the dribble, drive, shoot, and pass? Let's just say few instead of depressing ourselves and going through the roster. This trade is great example of what is wrong with this franchise. The organization is a cancer and they try to keep the locker room under control by ejecting young players with some talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 I have to agree that this is not a nothing trade. It's one more cut in the death by a thousand cuts that we're all currently enjoying. On it's own it appears to by minor but the problem is that these moves accumulate. We send out bench scoring and we get nothing in return. We do it because of "culture" when the truth is that Crawford isn't the culture problem, he's just the latest victim of it. The worst part of this is that Crawford is one of the few well rounded players on the team. How many other players does the team have that can create off the dribble, drive, shoot, and pass? Let's just say few instead of depressing ourselves and going through the roster. This trade is great example of what is wrong with this franchise. The organization is a cancer and they try to keep the locker room under control by ejecting young players with some talent. At some point you guys will realize it's not the GM, it's the ownership. Steddy Teddy is a mirror image of Honest Abe. It's all about the money saved on a contract. Abe's finest hour (other than their championship years) was AFTER he shipped Jordan out of town he was forced to actually try and field a good team. Our GM did so much. Then he made our GM trade picks and players for $$$ in return. Now Steady Teddy is doing the same. Our GM doesn't make decisions based on his own thought process, he does what the owner wants. It was true under Abe and it's true now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shabby Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 And they are a 1 seed with him. That didnt answer my question. And they are really not. Especially the way Miami is playing. ---------- Post added February-22nd-2013 at 01:33 AM ---------- By the way' date=' Stevemcqueen is completely off the deep end with his views on Harden. Harden is already one of the 15 best players in the league. Maybe one of the ten. He can play either guard position. He can score 40 against pretty much anyone. He plays hard on D. And he seems to be a really good teammate.Of course, until about four months ago, Steve was still trying to sell us all on Vesely who could still magically grow into a good player while Harden is apparently stuck as who he is forever. I think it's entirely possible that Houston will be the second best team in the West within the next three years, depending on how the young players develop and whether they can bring in one more star. I see no reason why a team with Harden as their best player can't make the Finals. There is not a player in Houston's core older than 26 and they've had a relatively chaotic season. (Massive trade before the season, Lin's injury, Kevin McHale's daughter's death, the Royce White saga). Give that team a year to grow together and they could be a terrifying playoff matchup in 2014. Frankly, they are the kind of team that can give San Antonio trouble in Round One this year.[/quote'] Also anyone who quotes Metta world piece regarding how good a player is, well, crazy. He knew how good harden is so he took him out with an elbow lol ---------- Post added February-22nd-2013 at 01:36 AM ---------- That's debatable, but I still don' think the C's win a title without Rondo at the 1. I dont think thunder make it to the finals without Harden ---------- Post added February-22nd-2013 at 01:44 AM ---------- This team is a joke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 I have to agree that this is not a nothing trade. It's one more cut in the death by a thousand cuts that we're all currently enjoying. On it's own it appears to by minor but the problem is that these moves accumulate. We send out bench scoring and we get nothing in return. We do it because of "culture" when the truth is that Crawford isn't the culture problem, he's just the latest victim of it. The worst part of this is that Crawford is one of the few well rounded players on the team. How many other players does the team have that can create off the dribble, drive, shoot, and pass? Let's just say few instead of depressing ourselves and going through the roster. This trade is great example of what is wrong with this franchise. The organization is a cancer and they try to keep the locker room under control by ejecting young players with some talent. It was a saving money move. At some point Crawford ****ed the dog and got himself exiled to the end of the bench. This move was a de facto waiving. It was a way to save a little bit of extra money in the process. I don't blame the FO for wanting to do that, and if you wanted to get rid of him anyway, why not? Let's be honest, we can take off the homer glasses now that he's gone: Crawford was not a well rounded player. He was a below average offensive player and a bad defender, a gunner with a career FG% of .400. He's also 24 and has now been traded three times. In general, there was a lot of optimism coming out of the 2010 draft class of four rookies. I was unrealistically optimistic and I know I definitely wasn't the only one. At times, each guy has played well. But the truth is none of the bottom three guys were very high quality prospects and the only reason they got so many opportunities early was because the roster was a disaster in the middle of a total demolition with horrible or injured or "injured" vet players. Their chief value came from the fact they were cheap and they had upside to their careers. Maybe some of them would beat the odds and emerge as a steal or at least a modest surprise. Perhaps Seraphin has, that's a different discussion. But what was always the case is that they were a bunch of cheap contract place holders during a total rebuild that were a long shot to become long term contributors. You specifically used complain about running a college squad out on the floor and that guys should have to earn their playing time behind vets who actually knew how to play. Well, that's what happened here. A too young core gets broken up because it's difficult to get the roles and minutes for a bunch of young players to develop. If every player on the court at once is substandard for their position, you're going to get pounded and have trouble executing even basic things and then you get guys whose lose trust in the system and start gunning and freelancing and then you get horrible basketball and an environment where no one can develop. Anyway, Crawford didn't work out. It barely a blip and everyone who isn't a total Crawford fanboy knows it. Odds are none of the other late draft picks we've made will work out either. And that's not just us, that's the NBA. Ted's flaw is that he's probably too conservative and put too much faith in the ability of a group of young players to develop properly. He holds onto young players until it's painfully clear they aren't going to work out, holds onto a bad asset too long. But if you trade a young player off before that's obvious, you're going to piss people off too, especially if the guy goes somewhere else and thrives. Regardless I think Ted's learning that too young cores are a disaster of opportunity cost and disappointment and he's trying to transition the rebuild into a phase with more veterans and more modest ambitions of only developing a key group of 3, maybe 4 young players at once rather than 7 or 8. Personally, I don't think I'd really care if they dump Singleton and Booker during the offseason. Ves would sting a little since he was a 6th overall pick with rare attributes. But he's got no skills to claim a role plus he's physically underdeveloped and so we aren't developing him and he's languishing and we're probably just going to have to eat it. Dumping Seraphin would sting too since an athletic true big man with shooting touch and go to weapons (one of the best hook shots in the league) is hard to find. But he's got such a crappy BBall IQ and he's such a crap rebounder that he takes more off the table than he brings to it right now and I'm losing hope the lightbulb is going to turn on for him. ---------- Post added February-22nd-2013 at 07:45 AM ---------- That didnt answer my question. And they are really not. Especially the way Miami is playing. Ok, they are a one or two seed with Rose. They were a 1 seed with him in 2011. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now