KDawg Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 IIRC, I think the "Deal" was that Hart would retain the title at Survivor Series, and drop it the following night, because he didn't want to lose in Canada (which was selfish as hell). As a 9 year old kid, not fully aware of everything, and seeing Bret Hart at Raw one week, and the next, he's completely gone, I sided with him. But as I got older, and began to understand how things work in the business world, I realized that he pretty much put Vince in a no win situation. Vince paid him that ridiculous contract the year prior in order to keep him away from WCW the first time, while WWE was getting hammered in the ratings department. Then Hart thinks he''s going to go out on his terms and get what he likes, when both companies are at war with each other. Doesn't work like that. When it's time to drop the belt, you drop the belt. And don't live your role, thinking it's your birthright to hold the strap. Thats something the Rock always used to say when I read his autobiography back in the day. Montreal was interesting. 1) I don't blame Bret for not wanting to drop the title in Canada. 2) I don't blame Vince for wanting him to drop the title. The situation was all sorts of screwed up. McMahon signed Bret to a HUGE deal, but then told him he couldn't afford it and had to cut the deal down. Bret was offered more money from WCW, and Bret was getting screwed on his contract in WWF. Do I blame Vince for telling Bret he couldn't afford it? No. Do I blame Vince for signing him to such a huge contract to begin with? Yes and no. Probably shouldn't have given him that kind of money, but he thought he had it so he did it. Do I blame Bret for being pissed about the money? No. It's such an odd situation. Bret didn't want to lose in Canada. Vince didn't want Bischoff to tell the world he signed the WWF champion (WCW did its best to bury Hart, by the way. They totally misused the Hitman). So what do you do? A) Bret should have agreed to lose the title. Mistake 1. Vince should have told Bret that he HAD to drop the title, or the match would be pulled and he'd have a match to crown a new WWF champion, or some other solution. Mistake 2. C) Both parties screwed up. D) Neither party is a "bad person" or the lone culprit. There's a lot of blame to go around. E) I think Bret realized that eventually, as he and Michaels and Vince seem to get along now. F) Michaels feigning surprise didn't help the whole thing. The lying was amplified because of the plan to make Bret think Michaels wasn't a part of it. G) That incident led to the Attitude Era, right, wrong or indifferent. It broke kayfabe. It brought Mr. McMahon to the center and made him the ultimate heel. WCW flubbing Hart helped, too. They really dropped the ball with him. That incident, for as stupid as it was, changed wrestling. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forehead Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 He said he was in Montreal, asked Vince if there was a finish, Vince said "yes," and Cornette left the building halfway through the match because he didn't want to be around for the fireworks. Just watched that shoot interview last week. Apparently he stuck around by the back entrance waiting to see what the finish was (curiosity), but as soon as it happened, he decided he wasn't going to stick around for the aftermath and bolted. Jim Cornette is funny as hell. I may not agree with everything in his interviews, but that man can spin words. My favorite so far was him ripping on the "Brawl for All" and referring to Butterbean as a 375 pound human waterbed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Jim Cornette is funny as hell. I may not agree with everything in his interviews, but that man can spin words. My favorite so far was him ripping on the "Brawl for All" and referring to Butterbean as a 375 pound human waterbed. I stumbled upon that Gunn-Butterbean fight on Youtube recently. That may have been the most ridiculous thing the WWE has ever done. We accidently built up this going-nowhere lower midcarder into a legit toughman. There is always a place for a legit toughman in wrestling. What should we do with him? I know....let's put him in the ring with a professional boxer and have him get annihilated in ten seconds, thereby destroying his credibility as a legit toughman and making pointless the tournament that already ruined Steve Williams and injured several other wrestlers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DM72 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 I stumbled upon that Gunn-Butterbean fight on Youtube recently. That may have been the most ridiculous thing the WWE has ever done. We accidently built up this going-nowhere lower midcarder into a legit toughman. There is always a place for a legit toughman in wrestling. What should we do with him? I know....let's put him in the ring with a professional boxer and have him get annihilated in ten seconds, thereby destroying his credibility as a legit toughman and making pointless the tournament that already ruined Steve Williams and injured several other wrestlers. Interesting that you bring this up. JBL has stated that the WWE put Gunn in the ring against Butterbean as "punishment" for beating Dr Death Steve Williams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Interesting that you bring this up. JBL has stated that the WWE put Gunn in the ring against Butterbean as "punishment" for beating Dr Death Steve Williams. Part of me buys that. Another part of me wonder if anyone in WWE - aside from Jim Ross - was that high on Williams in the first place. A lot of people like to talk about an Austin-Williams dream match (which, I agree, would have been a good match) and pretend that Williams had any relevance in US wrestling after 1991 or so. Williams had never been an upper-carder in the US except in promotions where Bill Watts was in charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DM72 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Part of me buys that. Another part of me wonder if anyone in WWE - aside from Jim Ross - was that high on Williams in the first place. A lot of people like to talk about an Austin-Williams dream match (which, I agree, would have been a good match) and pretend that Williams had any relevance in US wrestling after 1991 or so. Williams had never been an upper-carder in the US except in promotions where Bill Watts was in charge. According to JBL, the issue was that Gunn was a nobody and no one knew he was THAT good at fighting. Williams, on the other hand was an established wrestler was considered a legit tough guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samy316 Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Damn, there's word going around the Internet & especially twitter that Viscera/Mable died of a Heart Attack earlier today. He was only 43. No official word yet, but there are a lot of wrestling insiders & people in the know who have confirmed it's true. R.I.P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sinister Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Sad. I figured he would've died years ago. Normally guys who are that big, tend to start having serious problems in their 40's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrypticVillain Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Man, RIP to Big Daddy V... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DM72 Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 RIP Big Man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sacks 'n' Stuff Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 The simulated anal raping of his opponents was groundbreaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeesburgSkinFan Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 RIP. I thought he had already passed to be honest. His 1995 King Mabel run was a guilty pleasure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DM72 Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Today's the big day for the launch of The WWE Network and as I expected, it's impossible to order it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THUNDERDOME Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 its working fine for me.......watching royal rumble 2000 hardys and dudleys doing crazy **** jumping off balconies through tables, and cactus jack shredding HHH's head with that barbed wire 2x4 ......****s awesome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sinister Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Ahh yes. The epic street fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THUNDERDOME Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Hell yea that match was ****in awesome......... that piledriver where the table didn't break was awesome......i always wondered if those damn tacks were real or not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sinister Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Hell yea that match was ****in awesome......... that piledriver where the table didn't break was awesome......i always wondered if those damn tacks were real or not Pretty much every thing in a Mick Foley match is real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrypticVillain Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Finally got in. Watching the Greatest Rivalries Bret Hart vs Shawn Michaels Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forehead Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Just saw on the Yahoo News wire that Jake the Snake has cancer. Apparently they're going to do immediate surgery. Feel bad for the guy and I hope he makes it through, though in all honesty, I'm surprised he's still alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Mine's just started working lol. Backlash 99 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sinister Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Just saw on the Yahoo News wire that Jake the Snake has cancer. Apparently they're going to do immediate surgery. Feel bad for the guy and I hope he makes it through, though in all honesty, I'm surprised he's still alive. Its a shame that we pretty much say that about every wrestler nowadays Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Mine's just started working lol. Backlash 99 That's the on ethat was at Verizon right? I was there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrypticVillain Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Backlash 99 I was going to watch that next too lol. I had to watch Invasion first though. Just watched the referee fight. I swear that got a louder pop then some of the main event matches at the recent PPVs. Speaking of recent PPVs, the WWE can't have Orton and Batista headline WrestleMania. Don't get me wrong, people are still going to watch, but you can't have that as your main event. Just saw on the Yahoo News wire that Jake the Snake has cancer. Apparently they're going to do immediate surgery. Feel bad for the guy and I hope he makes it through, though in all honesty, I'm surprised he's still alive. He was getting inducted to the WWE HOF this year too. I guess he won't be able to make the ceremony now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sinister Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 (edited) That's the on ethat was at Verizon right? I was there! I think that was Backlash '00, when Steve Austin wiped out DX with the steel chairs while he was still out with the neck surgery Edited February 24, 2014 by Mr. Sinister Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 I think that was Backlash '00, when Steve Austin wiped out DX with the steel chairs while he was still out with the neck surgery Yeah you may be right. I remember going to a RAW and Backlash at Verizon back in the day, but can't remember what year it was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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