Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 2 minutes ago, markmills67 said: I know we had to start somewhere so we have offered Cousins $20m per year. What exactly do you fellow Skins think Cousins agent is looking for? Would Cousins not take say $22m a year but with more money guaranteed, let's say $80/85m ?. HTTR The numbers are window dressing. I think they want $50 million in guaranteed money. I have to think that the major sticking point now is the guaranteed dollars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 4 minutes ago, SkinsPassion4Life said: I would make Kirk 3 offers.... 1) 5 yrs, 120 mil - 70 guaranteed 2) 5 yrs, 115 mil - 75 guaranteed 3) 5 yrs, 110 mil - 80 guaranteed And he would pick 3, 3, and 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Just now, TD_washingtonredskins said: And he would pick 3, 3, and 3. Yea. I don't see how there is any choice in those three. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 1 minute ago, Lombardi's_kid_brother said: Yea. I don't see how there is any choice in those three. Not only that, but if even the $70M in guaranteed money was on the table right now, he'd be signed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 10 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: Not only that, but if even the $70M in guaranteed money was on the table right now, he'd be signed. That's why this has been such a debacle. The Redskins have put themselves in the position where that has to damn near be their STARTING point for what everyone agrees is a good but not great QB. They absolutely have to set records in order to have any chance of signing him when last year at this time, $25 million in guaranteed cash probably would have easily done it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 6 minutes ago, Lombardi's_kid_brother said: That's why this has been such a debacle. The Redskins have put themselves in the position where that has to damn near be their STARTING point for what everyone agrees is a good but not great QB. They absolutely have to set records in order to have any chance of signing him when last year at this time, $25 million in guaranteed cash probably would have easily done it. I agree with everything but the last sentence. But, I think $40-45M in guarantees last year would have locked him up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 12 minutes ago, Lombardi's_kid_brother said: That's why this has been such a debacle. The Redskins have put themselves in the position where that has to damn near be their STARTING point for what everyone agrees is a good but not great QB. They absolutely have to set records in order to have any chance of signing him when last year at this time, $25 million in guaranteed cash probably would have easily done it. IIRC I recall reading that Kirk wanted something like 21/year after 2015 but the Skins were at around 16 so they were just too far apart. Yes the Skins could have signed him for 21/year after 2015 but they obviously still had reservations. We'd all be singing a different tune if we signed him for 21 million per year after half a good season and it ended up being a fluke and we were stuck with Bad Kirk and a very large contract for him. I certainly still have concerns but I also think we need to sign him to a LTD anyway. As others have said, he is really our only decent option at the moment. But it feels like a Dalton/Flacco situation where we're overpaying for a good but not great or elite QB (though to be fair, Flacco does have a SB win so that's a big factor). But it is what it is. I also really worry about him losing weapons. Our receiving corps is very good and very well rounded and he certainly benefited from it. With Reed's injury history if we lose Garcon and DJax I feel like Kirk might regress quite a bit because that would basically leave us with Crowder as his only legit receiver if Reed is out. Hopefully Doctson can step up and be healthy if we lose those guys, though ideally I'd love to have them both back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 27 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: I agree with everything but the last sentence. But, I think $40-45M in guarantees last year would have locked him up. That much more than Osweiler? After the season, you are probably right, I guess. I used to be better at predicting contracts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Ross TuckerVerified account @RossTuckerNFL 4m4 minutes ago More Ross Tucker Retweeted SiriusXM NFL Radio Redskins President calling any Cousins trade "nonsense" which is what I'll say about their strategy if no long term deal by July 15th. Ross Tucker added, SiriusXM NFL RadioVerified account @SiriusXMNFL Allen on Cousins: We did exclusive deal because we were tired of the nonsense of possible trade scenarios out there. #Redskins #HTTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 9 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said: "Allen on Cousins: We did exclusive deal because we were tired of the nonsense of possible trade scenarios out there. #Redskins #HTTR" according to Sheehan the Skins did exclusive FT in order to control the public dialog and to make it look like they want Cousins when they really don't lol... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice_of_Reason Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 I will say, the news that at least Eric and the agent are talking and at least both sides say they want a deal, that's the first LTD good news since ... ever? I don't think they're going to trade Cousins. Never did. I think they're going to try and sign him. They better be successful though. 8 minutes ago, Califan007 said: according to Sheehan the Skins did exclusive FT in order to control the public dialog and to make it look like they want Cousins when they really don't lol... Sheehan has gone a little crazy. Even Cooley said that "Redskins at 10 is brought to you by Kevin SHeehan's obsession with Kirk Cousins." Which was pretty damn funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 15 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said: SiriusXM NFL RadioVerified account @SiriusXMNFL Allen on Cousins: We did exclusive deal because we were tired of the nonsense of possible trade scenarios out there. #Redskins #HTTR Not the best reason to give. I detect sarcasm. Our starting offer is 5/100mil then going off the reports. 15-20mil short then. Would love to know what % gtd we had in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 28 minutes ago, Califan007 said: according to Sheehan the Skins did exclusive FT in order to control the public dialog and to make it look like they want Cousins when they really don't lol... LOL, yeah I've been following the local-national media too -- Peter King also speculated that the exclusive is about controlling a trade. This is the wildest off season I can remember with the media running crazy. We got the actual sources (Kirk, McCartney, Bruce, Jay) being really positive and among other things shooting down the idea a trade. But you got the media on a number of fronts putting out the opposite message. Kirk says he "loves" being a Redskin and "definitely" wants to be back. So that means the opposite to the media and that he can't wait to leave. McCartney said he and Kirk haven't been thinking trade and don't discuss the idea. So that means the opposite to the media -- Kirk and his agent are obsessing about how to leave town. Scot and Bruce talked about being positive about a long term deal and said they are confident they will get it done. Apparently, that means the opposite -- they have no intention of keeping him and looking to trade the dude. You cant win since everything said apparently means the opposite when its positive while the negative stuff must be true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Slow getting the 23mil p/y gossip in here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 20 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said: Not the best reason to give. I detect sarcasm. Our starting offer is 5/100mil then going off the reports. 15-20mil short then. Would love to know what % gtd we had in there. Keim has said that the $20 mil/yr offer was not a recent offer. Take that for what it's worth... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Just now, Califan007 said: Keim has said that the $20 mil/yr offer was not a recent offer. Take that for what it's worth... Twitter thread says more........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Here's a new one -- must mean the opposite , Bruce doesn't think they will get it done and is pessimistic. Ben StandigVerified account @BenStandig BA on Cousins. Remains optimistic on a LTD after coming up short in 2016. "This year we'll get it done." Like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zCommander Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said: Don't really care what outside people say but the point you make isn't true. Eric Weddle was on First Take just the other day, saying Kirk is a top 10 QB. David Carr said on NFL Network he's one of the best QB's in the league and top 10 guy, link below. Shannon Sharpe was singing his praises recently. Adam Schefter has said he's top 10. Jimmy Johnson has said he's a franchise QB. Speaking of outside of the realm of ES....Mike Shanahan said you can win a SB with Kirk. He said this after he left the Redskins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Well if we're at 5/115 now, it's only a matter of time before a deals done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Just now, zskins said: Speaking of outside of the realm of ES....Mike Shanahan said you can win a SB with Kirk. He said this after he left the Redskins. Yeah I thought of including Shanny but I know some here discount him. I ultimately was one of Shanny's critics at the end but I always consistently thought the dude knows offense. My issue with him was everything else -- defense, special teams, FO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 8 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said: You cant win since everything said apparently means the opposite when its positive while the negative stuff must be true. LOL @ the video This is typical Sheehan lately: Cooley: "Redskins put the exclusive tag on Cousins today..." Sheehan: "Cooley, I told you--I told you WEEKS ago--didn't I tell you? I said when Allen made the statement that they want Cousins to play for the Skins, didn't I say that it sounds like Bruce is only saying that so that when they're not able to sign Cousins to a LTD and end up trading him that he can say to the fan base "Hey, we said we wanted him long term"?...And now they are using the exclusive tag because they are scared...they are scared, Cooley. They are scared "S"-less to see what Kirk Cousins is really worth. And they don't want the fans to see it, either. That way when Kirk doesn't take their offer Allen and Snyder can say "Hey, look, we made a fair offer to Cousins"...and now the only option if Cousins isn't signed to a LTD is to pay him $34 million next year as a one-year rental? Cooley, if the Redskins end up paying $79 million for Cousins and he walks and signs with the 49ers or Rams and we get nothing?!...Oh my god, Cooley, how did we end up here!" Me, listening: " 'We' didn't end up ANYWHERE YET, ya idgit!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 We all know Bruce is going to close the deal out for Kirk whilst Scot is out the picture. Perfect fuel for the internal power struggle fire Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 21 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said: Twitter thread says more........ So it was an old offer being thrown around on twitter as if it was proposed to Cousins' agent yesterday? lol... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peregrine Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 If the reports about $23 mill per are correct, I dont think we are all that long for for a deal here, and it looks like contrary to the unsubstantiated random whining, the Redskins DID step up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Consigliere Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 2 hours ago, mistertim said: It just seems like the only place you really hear about Kirk being a top 5 / Tier 1 sort of guy is on ES. Outside of here the general consensus according to people in the league as well as sports writers/analysts, seems to be that Kirk is a Tier 3/borderline Tier 2 guy. Now that can obviously be taken with a grain of salt because the league sources who are being asked this are doing it anonymously (or just referred to as an "NFC GM" or something generic), and sports analysts can be dumbasses. However, it just feel like we're overestimating how good everyone outside of ES thinks he is. I really haven't seen any analyses were he's above top 15 to top 10. And while sports writers can be dumbasses and NFL GMs, etc can certainly be wrong....the same can be said for fans on a message board. Nobody views Cousins as a top 5-7 QB except redskins fans, and possibly Mike Shanahan. His raw #'s this past year were ridiculous no doubt, but most people evaluate QB's based on a mix of #'s and performances, fair or unfair, and thus far, Kirk's been great at producing #'s the past 24+ games, but not so great at producing in big time, prime time games when it matters most, and he has no playoff pedigree to speak of either, not all on him by a long shot, he's not responsible for the run game and the D after all, but he didn't help his case throwing game ending interceptions against Arizona and NYG when neither had anything to play for, and puking all over himself at home on MNF against a Carolina side that had been shreded left and right all season. That's what's odd to me. This guy produced mad #'s this year other than in terms of the red zone, but man did he ever come up small in big games, repeatedly. The weirdest aspect of this was winning and/or performing well when Silverback was suspended and whe had a tough schedule in November. Why he suddenly fell apart as Silverback came back from suspension and the schedule eased up but still required us to do better than 2-4 in our final 6 games. As a result most fans, and casual observers find the idea laughable. He has zero playoff wins, and is memorable for throwing horrible interceptions in crunch time, consistently losing under the lights, and a couple of weird moments screaming at reporters and his GM. All that being said, his metrics looked fantastic on outsiders, improved at PFF, and with playerprofiler, everything other than the red zone efficiency was great. Imagine if he fixes that, the team makes the playoffs no problem, and honestly, that ties into Doctson. If Doctson was healthy this year, I think we win 10 or 11, and make the playoffs no problem. The guy is a monster red zone target, and renown as an absolute monster when it comes to high pointing the ball for contested catches, a HUGE weapon in the red zone, with him and Reed in the red zone, and having to account for Crowder and Jackson and Garcon, I think our red zone offense would have been a helluvalot better. I think he can be a top 5-10 QB over the next 4-5 years if he can figure out the red zone issues, keep his turnovers low, especially in big games, and get some help in the run game and D. A lot of ifs, but he showed enough this year to believe the pieces are there for the makings of a very good QB, if not a truly elite one (and maybe even that given time and experience). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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