Moving Towards our Future Front Office and Coaching Hires. All the Way to the Water Boy - Adam Peters Hired as GM! The Mighty Quinn is HC Kliff Kingsbury as OC. Joe Whitt jr at DC.

[Warhead36]

3 minutes ago, Command The 414 said:

Me too, Arthur Smith offenses to me are pretty bland, vanilla and even back in Tennessee w/Titans he had studs on the OL, RB & AJ Brown and still imho was Bland … no thanks to Smith for me 

I think thats more of a product of his QBs. I mean Ryan Tannehill is as bland as it gets and then he was stuck with the likes of Ridderer and Heinicke in Atlanta. 

Just now, Conn said:

No leaks from SEA or SEA beat reporters about how splendid the interview went and how he’s their top target? Seems positive

They are 3 hours behind the EST but if they had made him an offer last night, we probably would have heard something by now.

 

My guess is both teams and sets of coaches will be doing their due diligence. First bullet will be fired later today or tonight when we make Johnson a formal offer.

[HeHateMe75]

34 minutes ago, ThatNFLChick said:

In this mic'd up, Johnson seems nice but kind of gives off Jim Zorn corny energy. Maybe not as bad as Zorn but he has a  'gee golly, awww shucks' kind of demeanor which might be part of the holdup. He doesn't really seem like a guy who commands a room which might be part of the hold up 

 

Macdonald's mic'd up made me feel better about him, his personality came off very Alpha, Johnson is a bit like Kirk Cousins

 

I think you are making way too much out of one clip where he's coaching/talking to college kids.

[Conn]

Just now, OtisDriftwood25 said:

I think he’s a run oriented OC. I believe there was a reason he was hired as a head coach because he was a Ben Johnson a few years ago. Cooley liked him when he was here. Ridder and Heinecke were the worst quarterback situation in the league. 

He was never Ben Johnson. Schematic brilliance and disguising run/pass at top of the league levels was never his bag. He had a great OL, Derrick Henry, and AJ Brown and still wasn’t lauded for being an X’s and O’s genius. Just a competent one. Another nepotism hire btw, one of the biggest. 

[Renegade7]

5 minutes ago, Conn said:

The talent runs dry eventually, if you’re successful enough. Don’t you want to plan for success? You don’t ever need to replace your genius offensive playcaller if he’s the HC, then he grooms his OC and position coaches to maybe get hired away someday (but it’s less likely bc they don’t call the plays—this helps ensue more stability on offense). And defensive coaches get stolen much less often, and if they are stolen, there’s usually a small batch of recently fired DC’s who tried their hand at being a HC and failed. So that encourages stability. Also defensive dominance is much more up and down unless you’re the Ravens. It’s not as sticky year over year as offensive dominance (because on offense, the right QB/playcaller marriage can carry you for a generation if you’re lucky). 
 

Basically I couldn’t disagree with you more, but it’s been talked to death on this board and elsewhere and something like 70%+ of people understand the point even if they disagree with it or don’t care. So it’s kind of a pointless conversation, you’re arguing against the new conventional wisdom that has a lot of data points to look at for affirmation. 

 

I don't spend all day in here anymore, so thanks for the clarification.

 

You make a good point on if the HC is the one implementing the system.  I'm nervous about needing to pick a HC that will also be calling plays, I'd prefer they focus on being head coach and groom their playcallers.

 

I stand by if it was that simple as conventional wisdom and not worthy of conversation we wouldn't be interviewing this many defensive coaches right now.  Even if you make fair points, you don't get to decide what should be talked about.

[Curtisp5286]

1 hour ago, KDawg said:

I don’t buy it.

 

There are quite a few offensive minded guys available. There is one we aren’t linked to at all that would be a good get (unless he lacks some sort of leadership quality, but I don’t know him) in Bobby Slowik. 
 

I don’t agree with the logic proposed by someone else earlier in the thread that if we hire an offensive HC then our DC could get poached so what’s the difference?

 

Offenses are MUCH harder to install. Offensive language is so all over the place. That doesn’t mean that defenses are plug and play - they aren’t. But offenses are so difficult. Especially with play call verbiage and conceptual verbiage. They take a lot of time and studying to learn the words. Defenses are much more universal in concept. Yes, verbiage varies, but it’s not as verbose. 
 

I am not a big fan of getting a defensive guy and quite frankly any defensive guy would feel extremely lackluster out of the gate. That doesn’t doom them, of course. But it would feel… not great. 
 

D guys work for some teams. 100%. I’m not sure this is one. If you hire a D guy he better be able to relate to that quarterback 100% and help nurture him. Ryans and Stroud are a great fit together. If we go D it has to be that situation. 
 

And I am still really, really out on Quinn. He’s a good coach. But I don’t think he translates on this franchise all that well and, well, he’s a Cowboy.

Why are you not considering Slowik a finalist?

 

He is one of the 7 candidates that they may interviewed.  There just hasn’t been much talk about him recently because his interview process is complete already.

 

They started off their search with 2 offensive and 5 defensive candidates.

[ThatNFLChick]

6 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

I know Ben Johnson came from the Joe Phlibin tree, if any. Let’s just hope he learned how NOT to lead a group of men from Philbin.
 

As good of an offensive mind as he was, Philbin had one of the most bland personalities in HC history; that’s really my only concern with BJ. It’s not a major concern though. 

 

Philbin is the connection between Johnson and the Seahawks GM

[RWJ]

1 hour ago, FrFan said:

 

Let's bring in the Rock to our defense ! Johnson Bros

 

 

I'd rather have Weaver if he's a leader of men than Dan Quinn.  

[ThatNFLChick]

1 minute ago, HeHateMe75 said:

 

I think you are making way too much out of one clip where he's coaching/talking to college kids.

 

I watched a lot of his pressers and interviews and he comes off the same way. Its not bad but its not Dan Campbell and if Dan Campbell is more of what they are looking for I understand some of the hold up. 

[Conn]

2 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

 

They are 3 hours behind the EST but if they had made him an offer last night, we probably would have heard something by now.

 

My guess is both teams and sets of coaches will be doing their due diligence. First bullet will be fired later today or tonight when we make Johnson a formal offer.

I agree, both teams were serious about giving a real shot to both Johnson and MacDonald. Quinn is a fallback option or DC option for both. Both top HC candidates were also serious about hearing the pitch of both organizations. Nothing is set in stone despite there being favorites. 

[Skinsinparadise]

Ben Johnson

Current position: Detroit Lions offensive coordinator Interview status: In-person Tuesday in Detroit. He interviewed via Zoom before the divisional playoff round. Connection: Chris Spielman, a special assistant to Detroit owner Sheila Ford Hamp, is the brother of former NFL general manager Rick Spielman, who is part of Washington's advisory board during its search.

 

The Commanders will interview Lions offensive coordinator Ben Johnson on Tuesday. AP Photo/Carlos Osorio)

Many in the NFL have long anticipated Johnson would get this job. However, multiple sources said, his hire is not a foregone conclusion in Washington. Seattle, the only other coaching vacancy, remains interested in Johnson as well.

Teams want him because of his offensive acumen: In his two seasons as Detroit's coordinator, the Lions are a combined second in yards per game and third in points.

More than X's and O's, new Commanders general manager Adam Peters said leadership will be the No. 1 trait they desire. Those who have worked with Johnson say he's a clear communicator. One opposing assistant coach considered Johnson "innovative."

Johnson is considered the best offensive coach available during this coaching cycle, but he would not be inheriting the same offensive talent he has with the Lions. Washington needs to rebuild its offensive line, find its quarterback of the future and add a shifty third-down back like Detroit's Jahmyr Gibbs.

The Lions also had quarterback, Jared Goff, who threw a combined 59 touchdown passes to 19 interceptions under Johnson. Washington has Sam Howell, who has started 18 games and has thrown 22 touchdowns and 22 picks. But the Commanders also have the No. 2 pick and drafting a quarterback will be high on their list.

As one NFL executive said, "It's about quarterback."

Johnson has worked in numerous offenses, allowing him to adapt to his talent. He knew Howell because both played quarterback at North Carolina -- Johnson was a walk-on whose only time occurred on special teams -- and he coached him at the 2022 Senior Bowl.

Two weeks ago Johnson said of Peters, "I've heard nothing but fantastic things about people that have worked with him directly or have met him over the course of scouting on the road. I look forward to meet him and talking with him."

Aaron Glenn

Current position: Detroit's defensive coordinator Interview status: In-person Tuesday in Detroit. Connection: Same as Johnson's.

Multiple sources, who either coached Glenn or coached with him, consider him a strong leader. He played corner in the NFL, a position that's typically not one of leadership for an entire team, but that's the trait that clearly would draw him to Washington. Chris Spielman's insight in this area would help as well.

"The biggest thing is he's ambitious and a competitor," said one person who coached Glenn and remains in the league. "He has infectious enthusiasm."

The leadership and motivational skills are two traits that have consistently come up in Washington's coaching search. The Lions' defense has not been as good statistically as their offense. In three seasons combined under Glenn, the Lions rank 31st in both yards and points. But they did improve in both categories this season compared to 2022: going from 28th in points to 23rd and from last in yards to 19th.

Dan Quinn

Current position: Dallas' defensive coordinator Interview status: In-person interview Tuesday. Connection: No direct connection.

Quinn is the only candidate who has been a head coach, compiling a 43-42 record in five-plus seasons with Atlanta. He led the Falcons to the Super Bowl after the 2016 season, where they lost to the Patriots in overtime -- after leading 28-3.

Multiple people who played for Quinn, coached under him or worked in the same organization have raved about his ability to lead, with one of his former coaches saying he set the standard for a team as well as any coach he has been around. One current assistant coach, whose team has faced Dallas, praised Quinn for adjusting his scheme over the years.

Quinn also remains among Seattle's possible choices, having interviewed with the Seahawks. He spent four years in the organization -- including three after John Schneider took over as general manager -- with the last two as defensive coordinator. He coached Seattle's defense when it won Super Bowl XLVIII.

Quinn has served as Dallas' defensive coordinator the past three seasons. The Cowboys rank a combined fifth in points and seventh in yards. But they lead the NFL with 93 turnovers forced under Quinn.

 

...Mike Macdonald

Current position: Baltimore's defensive coordinator. Interview status: His in-person interview occurred Monday in Baltimore. He interviewed via Zoom before the wild-card round. Connection: Washington's senior vice president of football strategy Eugene Shen was the Ravens' director of coaching analytics from 2014 to 2019 and initially shared an office with Macdonald; the two became close.

Like Johnson, he has drawn widespread praise for how his side of the ball played all season. Also like Johnson, he's expected to interview with Seattle.

Macdonald climbed from a coaching intern with Baltimore in 2014 to its defensive coordinator starting in 2022. In his two seasons as coordinator, the Ravens were a combined second in scoring and sixth in yards.

Even in Sunday's loss to Kansas City, the Ravens allowed only 17 points and none in the second half. In two postseason games, the Ravens allowed a combined 27 points and only 266 yards per game -- 56 fewer per game than anyone else.

One person familiar with Macdonald considered him a "great communicator and organized" with a reputation for maximizing his group's talent -- evidenced by how they altered their looks to attack various offenses. Macdonald's secondary coach, Dennard Wilson, has been interviewed for multiple defensive coordinator openings.

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/39417508/looking-commanders-head-coach-candidates

Edited January 30 by Skinsinparadise

[Conn]

Also just want to point out how quiet our burgeoning insider has been who “was just trying to share some information with you, if you don’t want to take it that’s your loss”. As soon as the strong SEA/Johnson fear settled in and people started to accept that it wasn’t secretly already agreed upon behind the scenes… 👋

[Ball Security]

Just now, Conn said:

I agree, both teams were serious about giving a real shot to both Johnson and MacDonald. Quinn is a fallback option or DC option for both. Both top HC candidates were also serious about hearing the pitch of both organizations. Nothing is set in stone despite there being favorites. 

I’d be surprised if Quinn leaves Dallas to be DC elsewhere. Jones pays him extremely well and there is a lot of talent there to show off.

 

Anyway, reading through this thread, “leader of men” is now the new “position flex”.

[RWJ]

48 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

So who else gonna be alt F4-ing all day at work today? Even my boss told me to let him know if I have anything breaks lolol

Work and earn your pay!  LOL  I remember those days, WH.   

[OtisDriftwood25]

12 minutes ago, Conn said:

He was never Ben Johnson. Schematic brilliance and disguising run/pass at top of the league levels was never his bag. He had a great OL, Derrick Henry, and AJ Brown and still wasn’t lauded for being an X’s and O’s genius. Just a competent one. Another nepotism hire btw, one of the biggest. 

That’s your opinion. He won the division 2 years in a row and how has Tennessee fared since him?  2 bad season, quarterback benched and head coach fired.

Edited January 30 by OtisDriftwood25

[Warhead36]

If BJ is our HC we really don't need an established vet OC. I'd rather get someone that BJ has worked with, that he trusts to help develop the game plan and teach/implement it to the players. 

 

What we need is a vet on the defensive side of the ball for DC. I was hearing John Fox before and that wouldn't be a bad get.

[Bantu]

5 minutes ago, Conn said:

That’s what you get when half the league’s prominent offensive guys are nepotism hires. The fact that many of them turned out to be great doesn’t really change the fact that they got their start as Quality Control guys or whatever through family connections. The entire landscape of the league’s coaching trees is affected by that. And it seems to happen less on defense, in recent times. Or at least those guys rise to coordinators more slowly (probably because there is less of a DC —> HC pipeline these days so people aren’t moving up as fast on the offensive side of the ball)

I was thinking about this exact thing a few weeks ago and was wondering if the very slow trend of non-white QBs becoming commonplace over the last 15-20 years could be the precursor to non-white offensive coaches breaking into the coaching ranks, eventually. Progress on that front was slow, so perhaps the progress on the coaching front may take longer? Idk, just a thought. 

 

Side note, I'd prefer an offensive minded, play caller to be HC to marry with young QB... But I'm not going to act like I'm in on these interviews and know much about non-retread coaches.

[Conn]

14 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

I don't spend all day in here anymore, so thanks for the clarification.

 

You make a good point on if the HC is the one implementing the system.  I'm nervous about needing to pick a HC that will also be calling plays, I'd prefer they focus on being head coach and groom their playcallers.

 

I stand by if it was that simple as conventional wisdom and not worthy of conversation we wouldn't be interviewing this many defensive coaches right now.  Even if you make fair points, you don't get to decide what should be talked about.

I’m speaking for me only in terms of what’s worth discussing. Just don’t want to clog the thread because this discussion has been had a LOT lately. 
 

Interviewing so many defensive guys despite the perceived top guy available being an offensive guy is a product of two things imo:

 

1. Young offensive talent has been sucked up and promoted so quickly in this league for the reasons I’ve already been arguing to you that the pool is getting shallower. That’s why you don’t want to just hire any offensive guy just to say you did—but Johnson imo is the real deal. So if he’s our top choice the rest of the field becoming more barren isn’t our problem.

 

2. We’re doing an entire cultural reset and many of the top perceived “culture and leadership” guys are defensive guys right now due to the aforementioned traffic jam of defensive candidates who aren’t getting promoted to HC as quickly as their offensive peers. There’s a bottleneck on the defensive side, rightly or wrongly, so the strong candidates there have to wait longer and be more impressive to deserve a shot.

Edited January 30 by Conn

[RWJ]

29 minutes ago, Command The 414 said:

I’m probably way off base here but I’m really thinking that if by the end of the day Ben Johnson isn’t hired (or at least working on the specifics of a deal) I can see a Weaver or Glenn hire which imho fits their desire for leading… we’ve all heard when Mike Tomlin interviewed with the Steelers nobody gave him a shot, but his interview with the brass went so well and he knocked the socks off of them… I could see Anthony Weaver being that guy…. just a hunch and nothing definitive, just opinion 

Weaver, yes.  Glenn, no.  First reason is that Weaver has been round the culture that Harris has preached about and Shen was exposed to.  That seemed to be important to Harris and Co.  Glenn's D just gives up too much in points and yards, overall.  JMO. 

2 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

If BJ is our HC we really don't need an established vet OC. I'd rather get someone that BJ has worked with, that he trusts to help develop the game plan and teach/implement it to the players. 

 

What we need is a vet on the defensive side of the ball for DC. I was hearing John Fox before and that wouldn't be a bad get.

It's been reported time and time again that Hank Fraley, his OL coach will be coming with him as his OC.  We will have to wait and see. 

[Conn]

3 minutes ago, OtisDriftwood25 said:

That’s your opinion. He won the division 2 years in a row and how has Tennessee faired since him?  2 bad season, quarterback benched and head coach fired.

Also coinciding with Tannehill going downhill, AJ Brown getting traded and replaced by a bust, and most importantly Derrick Henry starting to fade compared to his short HOF-level peak. OL has declined as well. 

[RWJ]

3 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

If BJ is our HC we really don't need an established vet OC. I'd rather get someone that BJ has worked with, that he trusts to help develop the game plan and teach/implement it to the players. 

 

What we need is a vet on the defensive side of the ball for DC. I was hearing John Fox before and that wouldn't be a bad get.

Man, Fox has been so so to me as a DC.  I like Weaver as DC or another vet not named Dan Quinn.  

[ThatNFLChick]

I find it odd Keim said he doesn't know if Magic is part of the second interviews. Johnson was very clearly in Chicago yesterday. Perhaps he participated via Zoom but he was at a well publicized forum in Chicafo yesterday with the Illinois state legislature. 

[RWJ]

3 hours ago, actorguy1 said:

Listening to Keim, he also said don't expect any announcement on Wednesday. More likely to hear something official by Thursday or even Friday.

It is what it is but seems kind of crazy when all the interviews were supposed to be wrapped up today/tonight.  Oh well.    

[Chris 44]

31 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

I think thats more of a product of his QBs. I mean Ryan Tannehill is as bland as it gets and then he was stuck with the likes of Ridderer and Heinicke in Atlanta. 

They are 3 hours behind the EST but if they had made him an offer last night, we probably would have heard something by now.

 

My guess is both teams and sets of coaches will be doing their due diligence. First bullet will be fired later today or tonight when we make Johnson a formal offer.

Pretty sure we know something late tonight

[Skinsinparadise]

11 minutes ago, ThatNFLChick said:

I find it odd Keim said he doesn't know if Magic is part of the second interviews. Johnson was very clearly in Chicago yesterday. Perhaps he participated via Zoom but he was at a well publicized forum in Chicafo yesterday with the Illinois state legislature. 

 

Keim is super careful.  His #1 thing isn't to guess right but to avoid getting something wrong.  So I gather he doesn't want to speculate if he doesn't know.

 

He does know Spielman and Myers are part of this process as to the coaching interviews.

Edited January 30 by Skinsinparadise

[MartinC]

33 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

I think thats more of a product of his QBs. I mean Ryan Tannehill is as bland as it gets and then he was stuck with the likes of Ridderer and Heinicke in Atlanta. 

They are 3 hours behind the EST but if they had made him an offer last night, we probably would have heard something by now.

But he had some really good offensive talent around his not very good QBs in Atlanta and his refusal to run the offense through them was baffling at times.