2024 NFL Draft Position/Tracker - Final Pick #2

[skinsfan66]

20 minutes ago, Conn said:

This has been explained to you a thousand times, why do you just keep posting the same thing over and over? It’s been explained to you using math. It’s been explained to you using logic/reasoning. It’s been explained to you using colorful metaphors (a @Skinsinparadise specialty). 
 

It’s fine if you disagree. But the points against your POV, and the underlying reasons, have been widely, deeply, broadly, thoroughly made to you. 

Why keep explaining it as if that's the absolute right thing to do over and over, teams get burned all the time, we have (RG3), with that thinking as well.  Logic, Reasoning and Math can all be disputed easily with facts.  

[Conn]

45 minutes ago, tmandoug1 said:

I don't suppose I could just get some starting stud olineman and worry about QB next year could I? If you let me have that this year I will never bring it up again. Pinky swear!

You’d rather draft an OT at 2 this year (in a deep OL class) despite the lack of a premium prospect, and then try to draft a QB in a weaker class next year around pick #14 or wherever we’ll end up? It’s just not logical. We’re going to get plenty of OL help. The value isn’t right at #2 and trading back takes you out of range of a potential franchise-changing QB pick. 
 

There’s levels to this. It can’t just be “our OL is bad so draft an OT at #2 overall”. 

6 minutes ago, pcbothwel said:

 

Im not "Old". I just turned 37, and many of my friends are 31-36. And if a player wants to paint his nails and say cringy slang, fine...BUT NOT THE F'n QB. Save it for a WR/CB...

Stroud, Richardson, Howell, Lawrence, Burrow, Herbert... All of these guys are Calebs peers and dont act like that.

I see much more Cam Newton in Caleb, and we've seen how that worked out. Won 12 games twice over 11 years and had a losing record in 8/11 years.

 

Again, I am not saying he will completely wash out, but if Caleb has a Newton type career (And please dont pin your hopes on one miraculous 15-1 year), then that would be a bust for how highly he is being touted.

 

I would probably rank Maye as QB1, but I dont LOVE him as a prospect. Daniels is great, but when you look deeper there are some concerns about the parts being greater than the Sum.

I.e. Daniels has a good arm, quick release, and amazing deep ball accuracy, but only with a clean pocket. His accuracy falls off pretty bad and he really doesnt drive the ball well.

His running ability is 2nd to only Lamar, but his frame is TERRIBLE, and he takes big hits. Also, his ability to throw on the run is very underwhelming.

We should probably talk about getting Cam a spot in Canton now that we realize what he was fighting against under Rivera all those years. The fact he was an MVP candidate and carried that franchise beyond mediocrity multiple times during his career is borderline miraculous, looking back. He made Rivera almost $50M here. 

[skinsfan66]

2 minutes ago, Conn said:

You’d rather draft an OT at 2 this year (in a deep OL class) despite the lack of a premium prospect, and then try to draft a QB in a weaker class next year around pick #14 or wherever we’ll end up? It’s just not logical. We’re going to get plenty of OL help. The value isn’t right at #2 and trading back takes you out of range of a potential franchise-changing QB pick. 
 

There’s levels to this. It can’t just be “our OL is bad so draft an OT at #2 overall”. 

It seems like the only Position we hit with any way are OL picking this high ,so it's not that far out there. Maybe a trade down and extra pick. We have choices.

[tmandoug1]

1 hour ago, mistertim said:

 

Why would you want to put off the most important position when we have the 2nd overall pick in a draft that's top heavy at QB?

I wanted to trade back and get more picks and still get Alt or Fashanau. Has the world decided Howell can't possibly be a great QB behind a better line and with better coaching? Is it worth a shot to let him roll next year with a better line or not? It would be nice to be the team that gets a haul of picks for trading back for once. But I do get it....as long as we don't pick Williams I won't be upset.

[Est.1974]

Anything but QB with our first pick would be staggering at this stage. 

[mistertim]

55 minutes ago, tmandoug1 said:

I wanted to trade back and get more picks and still get Alt or Fashanau. Has the world decided Howell can't possibly be a great QB behind a better line and with better coaching? Is it worth a shot to let him roll next year with a better line or not? It would be nice to be the team that gets a haul of picks for trading back for once. But I do get it....as long as we don't pick Williams I won't be upset.

 

Good lord, we've already tried the "draft OL high and hope a good QB comes along" thing before and it failed. We drafted Trent top 5, got us nowhere. We drafted Scherff top 5, got us nowhere. We've traded back for more picks, got us nowhere.

 

The missing piece was always QB. And now that we have a shot at a true blue chip prospect in a good QB class you want us to just keep trying the exact same thing that has failed for decades?

 

You can't possibly be serious.

[mistertim]

1 hour ago, skinsfan66 said:

Why keep explaining it as if that's the absolute right thing to do over and over, teams get burned all the time, we have (RG3), with that thinking as well.  Logic, Reasoning and Math can all be disputed easily with facts.  

 

[tmandoug1]

35 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

Good lord, we've already tried the "draft OL high and hope a good QB comes along" thing before and it failed. We drafted Trent top 5, got us nowhere. We drafted Scherff top 5, got us nowhere. We've traded back for more picks, got us nowhere.

 

The missing piece was always QB. And now that we have a shot at a true blue chip prospect in a good QB class you want us to just keep trying the exact same thing that has failed for decades?

 

You can't possibly 

We've done both multiple times for decades and neither has worked and you know it. I asked if it was possible Howell had a chance of being that guy behind a solid oline. You could have just said no, tmandoug1, I believe this is the year to get a blue chip prospect. This is (was) a never ending carousel of failure and I look forward to the draft with a whole new crew doing the selecting....as long as it isn't Caleb....lol. 

 

Yes I can be serious.....usually I am, but there are times when I am kidding and I try to express that the best way possible in an open message board. 

Edited January 19 by tmandoug1

[mistertim]

2 minutes ago, tmandoug1 said:

We've done both multiple times for decades and neither has worked and you know it. I asked if it was possible Howell had a chance of being that guy behind a solid oline. You could have just said no, tmandoug1, I believe this is the year to get a blue chip prospect. This is a never ending carousel of failure. I look forward to the draft with a whole new crew doing the selecting....as long as it isn't Caleb....lol. 

 

We've drafted a QB in the top 10 twice in the last 30 years. Once in 1994 and once in 2012. That's nuts, considering how ridiculously important the position is. So please don't try and tell me we've tried drafting blue chip QBs a bunch and it hasn't worked.

 

As far as Howell, I guess anything is possible, and I do like him, but IMO you don't pass up an opportunity to draft a blue chip prospect in a good QB class because you're hoping that your current mediocre QB will become great with other pieces around him. We've made that mistake before as well, most recently in 2020 by not replacing Haskins (RIP) with a superior talent.

 

We need a QB first and foremost, and I'm guessing the incoming regime will think along the same lines and will go in that direction, unless they truly don't have good grades on any of the top prospects, which I would find surprising.

[skinsfan66]

43 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

We've drafted a QB in the top 10 twice in the last 30 years. Once in 1994 and once in 2012. That's nuts, considering how ridiculously important the position is. So please don't try and tell me we've tried drafting blue chip QBs a bunch and it hasn't worked.

 

As far as Howell, I guess anything is possible, and I do like him, but IMO you don't pass up an opportunity to draft a blue chip prospect in a good QB class because you're hoping that your current mediocre QB will become great with other pieces around him. We've made that mistake before as well, most recently in 2020 by not replacing Haskins (RIP) with a superior talent.

 

We need a QB first and foremost, and I'm guessing the incoming regime will think along the same lines and will go in that direction, unless they truly don't have good grades on any of the top prospects, which I would find surprising.

3 times in the last 30 years Heath Shuler 1994 3rd pick, Also Jason Cambell was a 1st. rd.1995 All Misses. 3 out of 4 were blue chippers. I am not saying do not take a QB. 5th time is the charm? Have we hit on any Blue Chippers other than OL in the last 30 years? 

[mistertim]

3 minutes ago, skinsfan66 said:

3 times in the last 30 years Heath Shuler 1994 3rd pick, Also Jason Cambell was a 1st. rd.1995 All Misses. 3 out of 4 were blue chippers. I am not saying do not take a QB. 5th time is the charm? Have we hit on any Blue Chippers other than OL in the last 30 years? 

 

Who cares if we've failed before? It's irrelevant. In the modern NFL you need to have a franchise QB if you're going to be a perennial contender. So you keep trying. And who cares if we hit on a blue chip OL if the QB they're protecting is a scrub? Hitting on a blue chip Tackle isn't going to make you a contender year after year. Hitting on a blue chip QB is. That's why teams keep on taking them high until they do hit.

 

Pretty much every single team, FO, and coach in the NFL realizes this and accepts this QB reality, even older school guys like Rivera. I have no clue why some fans seem to think every single NFL team is wrong and they're right.

[Die Hard]

1 hour ago, mistertim said:

 

Who cares if we've failed before? It's irrelevant. In the modern NFL you need to have a franchise QB if you're going to be a perennial contender. So you keep trying. And who cares if we hit on a blue chip OL if the QB they're protecting is a scrub? Hitting on a blue chip Tackle isn't going to make you a contender year after year. Hitting on a blue chip QB is. That's why teams keep on taking them high until they do hit.

 

Pretty much every single team, FO, and coach in the NFL realizes this and accepts this QB reality, even older school guys like Rivera. I have no clue why some fans seem to think every single NFL team is wrong and they're right.

 

[zCommander]

2 hours ago, mistertim said:

...even older school guys like Rivera...

 

Ummm, he took Chase over Tua 😂

[Warhead36]

10 minutes ago, zCommander said:

 

Ummm, he took Chase over Tua 😂

Tua is mediocre carried by amazing coaching and supporting cast. Honestly that's looking like the right call. Young is better at his position than Tua is at his.

 

The mistake was not taking Herbert, but NOBODY had him as a legit option at that time.

[RWJ]

4 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

Tua is mediocre carried by amazing coaching and supporting cast. Honestly that's looking like the right call. Young is better at his position than Tua is at his.

 

The mistake was not taking Herbert, but NOBODY had him as a legit option at that time.

You've said it and others have too, Maye is so much like Herbert in comparison it isn't even funny!  

[Warhead36]

3 minutes ago, RWJ said:

You've said it and others have too, Maye is so much like Herbert in comparison it isn't even funny!  

Maye is Herbert with more mobility and athleticism. He's kinda like a Herbert/Josh Allen hybrid. 

 

Pair him with Ben Johnson and we run this division for a decade Reid/McNabb style.

[illone]

6 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

Why would you want to put off the most important position when we have the 2nd overall pick in a draft that's top heavy at QB?

again, not everyone has these supposed top heavy qbs ranked the same. 
 

Assuming Caleb is gone, what if drake turns out to be daniel jones esq, and our front office ranked him as such and smartly passed on him… wouldn't you be happy they did their due diligence and didn't select that player?

 

moreover, there are other qbs in this draft beyond the top 3 guys that could turn into excellent football players. 

[Warhead36]

1 minute ago, illone said:

again, not everyone has these supposed top heavy qbs ranked the same. 
 

Assuming Caleb is gone, what if drake turns out to be daniel jones esq, and our front office ranked him as such and smartly passed on him… wouldn't you be happy they did their due diligence and didn't select that player?

 

moreover, there are other qbs in this draft beyond the top 3 guys that could turn into excellent football players. 

Anything is possible. All we can do is give our opinions and analysis based on the information we have in front of us right now. By all counts this is a stacked QB class and Maye is 1B to Williams 1A in many people's minds. Of course, some people have Daniels higher than him, and some might even have Penix jr or Nix.

[Darrell Green Fan]

6 hours ago, skinsfan66 said:

Why keep explaining it as if that's the absolute right thing to do over and over, teams get burned all the time, we have (RG3), with that thinking as well.  Logic, Reasoning and Math can all be disputed easily with facts.  

Notice all the people who are laughing at you?  "Math can be disputed with facts" may be an all time classic.  

6 hours ago, skinsfan66 said:

It seems like the only Position we hit with any way are OL picking this high ,so it's not that far out there. Maybe a trade down and extra pick. We have choices.

Who the team drafted in 2010 is completely irrelevant to today with totally different people making the decision.  And taking an OL at 2 in this draft is a huge waste of value.

Edited January 19 by Darrell Green Fan

[KillBill26]

5 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

You can't possibly be serious.

(John McEnroe voice).

[mistertim]

1 hour ago, zCommander said:

 

Ummm, he took Chase over Tua 😂

 

And Herbert.

 

And yes he took Chase but he has said when asked that he knows it's a QB driven league and you need to have a franchise QB to be a consistent contender. He's well aware of it, he just didn't act on it, unfortunately.

 

1 hour ago, illone said:

again, not everyone has these supposed top heavy qbs ranked the same. 
 

Assuming Caleb is gone, what if drake turns out to be daniel jones esq, and our front office ranked him as such and smartly passed on him… wouldn't you be happy they did their due diligence and didn't select that player?

 

moreover, there are other qbs in this draft beyond the top 3 guys that could turn into excellent football players. 

 

If they truly have Maye pegged as a mediocre prospect and have Daniels ranked low then sure, they can pass on them. Maybe they have Nix rated very high and will trade down. Who knows. I'll trust this FO much more than previous ones. But one thing is for sure...if you have a #2 overall pick in a good QB draft, you're a brand new regime and in dire need of a franchise QB, and you pass on picking a QB high...you damn well better be right in your evaluation. Because if Maye or whoever becomes a stud then it's a titanic setback and there's going to be multiple cartons of egg on on many peoples' faces.

Edited January 19 by mistertim

[kingdaddy]

6 hours ago, Est.1974 said:

Anything but QB with our first pick would be staggering at this stage. 

Nah, think about it, after the combine and the pro days, things could tighten up amongst these QB prospects meaning we could look to get our QB later in round one or early in round 2. 

Chicago passed on QB last year with the #1 overall pick and it worked out nicely for them.....who's to say the same happen for us if we trade back from the #2 pick? If Peters plays this out, he could take a QB mid-round or late in round 1 this year and still be in position to go QB next year if need be with multiple picks in the 2025 1st round. Again, this is only if he sees multiple QB's this year who are very close as prospects....if 2 jump clearly ahead of the class then I suspect he'll sit tight at #2 and grab one of them. Right now most people feel 3 QB's are the top QB's in the class but there's still a ways to go with interviews, pro days, combine etc....

[Command The 414]

1 hour ago, Warhead36 said:

 Young is better at his position than Tua is at his.

 

 

LOL 😝 CMon man really? You really think that… Tua is definitely not what a lot of ppl thought he was going to be but to say this is just absurd and totally misinformed…a horrible take… not 1 game in his career has Chase Young taken over, Tua arguably walked off the field in a lot of his games being the best player that day…. Wow 

[illone]

39 minutes ago, mistertim said:

I'll trust this FO much more than previous ones. 

 

Absolutely agree 100%. 

 

39 minutes ago, mistertim said:

But one thing is for sure...if you have a #2 overall pick in a good QB draft, you're a brand new regime and in dire need of a franchise QB, and you pass on picking a QB high...you damn well better be right in your evaluation. Because if Maye or whoever becomes a stud then it's a titanic setback and there's going to be multiple cartons of egg on on many peoples' faces.

 

Exactly right. That sword cuts both directions, though. At least if Maye flops it wont be a trade up situation with multiple picks invested, but it will still be a huge setback. We shall see if the new staff agrees with me in a few short months, or perhaps even sooner if some trade if negotiated before draft day.

 

I also agree this is a DEEP qb draft, I've been kinda anticipating this for a few years since I watch more college football than pros.

 

I'm sticking with my prediction that there are some less heralded prospects that will be worth the risk of trading down and accumulating more picks for Peters to work with. However, I reserve the right to change my mind at any moment 😂

 

[kingdaddy]

11 minutes ago, illone said:

Exactly right. That sword cuts both directions, though. At least if Maye flops it wont be a trade up situation with multiple picks invested, but it will still be a huge setback. We shall see if the new staff agrees with me in a few short months, or perhaps even sooner if some trade if negotiated before draft day.

 

Bears did this last year (traded the #1 overall pick) and are watching Stroud have a great season....but they've got the #1 pick this year to right that wrong so to speak. They have DJ Moore and others to compensate for not having Stroud.