2024 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[Est.1974]

[Koolblue13]

I'm out on Coleman and Wilson. I don't think I'd even think about them until some time on day three. Oversized no twitch WRs don't seem to do well. Chase Claypool vibes.

 

I don't see teams sleeping on the Metcalfs and AJ Brown types any more.

 

I like Pearsail and Thrash in the 3rd a lot. Malik W on day three.

 

The NFL defenses have gone back to the *sigh* two high shell and most passing games have guys getting the ball in space quickly underneath. It was one of the most frustrating things about EBs offensive buffoonery. 

 

It's great to have a big X that can produce, but they're special.

 

I'd also take a shot on Rice and McCaffery because I love heritage players.

[MartinC]

5 hours ago, Going Commando said:

Coleman is electric on punt returns and other open field runs, and he's special as a 50-50 ball weapon in the red zone.  It's an unusual combo of skills.  But I think the issues with separation are pretty clear from his film.  His speed isn't threatening and he isn't a savvy route runner, so it's really easy to just sit on him.  I think that's the source of his lack of collegiate production.  To me, the second round is too early to draft a special teamer and red zone specialist.

 

I like Johnny Wilson over him in the third.  Wilson is rough, but he's a ridiculously special athlete.  He's got legit build up speed to keep DBs honest, and he wins leverage so easily because of his size.  His release game and route savvy don't have to be special, because DBs are terrified of pressing him or crowding him through his break.  They play for space with him because he is intimidatingly big, and they are scared of him getting a step on them because they know they can't run with him in the open field.

 

But I do think the hands issues with Wilson are legit, and I think he has awkward biomechanics too, and doesn't have good lower body flexibility or coordination.  His feet kind of die on him when he braces for contact, and he ends up getting folded up too often.  I think he's going to miss a lot of time at the next level too.

 

My day three guy is Jamari Thrash.  He looked as good as McConkey did at the SB IMO, but he's going to go in like the fifth or sixth round instead of the top of the second.   He lacks play strength, but he is such a slick route runner.  He's constantly open and he gets a ton of deep ball production despite his average timed speed.  He is killer against off and zone coverage, and I think the release game can develop over time too.  Route running translates to the NFL.  Once his gets stronger and develops an ability to win against press, I think he can be a starter.

Johnny Wilson is someone I’d love us to take a swing on. He can play outside or big slot. He could run some TE type routes from a tight split as well (I don’t think he’s going to bulk up and turn into a H-back type though, he way too athletic for that). 

[Going Commando]

I watched Tyrone Tracy from Purdue and was pleasantly surprised by his feel for running between the tackles.  He's a converted wide receiver with only one season of RB experience, but he has advanced vision and patience as a runner.  Really good in gap scheme runs if we go that route on offense.  Good speed for the position.  Good balance, really good at changing paces.  Elusive and creative in the backfield.  Hands are soft and natural and has highly developed feel for running routes from the backfield.  He's got receiver hands and route skills, as you'd expect.  He's a good special teamer too.

 

PFF has him 174 on their board, so he's in a really good range for our sixth round pick.  If we go with a power run game, which I think we should eith BRob as our starter, then I think Tracy would be a really good fit as our second string back.

[mhd24]

1 minute ago, Going Commando said:

I watched Tyrone Tracy from Purdue and was pleasantly surprised by his feel for running between the tackles.  He's a converted wide receiver with only one season of RB experience, but he has advanced vision and patience as a runner.  Really good in gap scheme runs if we go that route on offense.  Good speed for the position.  Good balance, really good at changing paces.  Elusive and creative in the backfield.  Hands are soft and natural and has highly developed feel for running routes from the backfield.  He's got receiver hands and route skills, as you'd expect.  He's a good special teamer too.

 

PFF has him 174 on their board, so he's in a really good range for our sixth round pick.  If we go with a power run game, which I think we should eith BRob as our starter, then I think Tracy would be a really good fit as our second string back.

Tony Pauline was hyping him up on a post-combine podcast I just listened to.

[RWJ]

@Skinsinparadise has mentioned his name.  Pearsall from Florida.  Watch his tape in games.  He catches everything, has good, adequate speed and is tough!  Great get with our 1st pick in the 3rd.  Doubt he last longer than that pick and may go higher.  

[Est.1974]

Also consider Chris Jones just dropped 32mil per year off KC.

 

I mean, even DT should be on the table for taking. Draft premier positions where possible.

[Bifflog]

I know PFF's rep around here is uneven, but below is a pretty neat chart (courtesy of SL4MUEL of r/nfl) that includes the top 300 prospects on PFF's Big Board and are organized into positional groups and separated into ranks of 20 and given a draft round.

 

[Warhead36]

That's a cool table. Based off that, we got a real good shot at getting an OL ranked top 20 at 36. 40 feels like a good trade down spot.

[Warhead36]

So just looking at that table, I feel like this is how we'd maximize the value of our draft capital:

 

2-QB. This is obvious.

36-OT or CB. Good chance a top 20-30 ish player will fall so good value.

40-Ideally trade down. If not take Braswell or one of the IOL. Peyton Wilson's injury history scares me.

67-Another good trade down spot. If not take WR. Should be a good one here. Edge isn't bad either.

100 & 102-Sweet spot for RB here. 

137-IOL should be good value here or a WR that falls. 

180-Best OL left, likely IOL.

 

Just really strong WR and OL depth all around and good CB depth at our draft slot range.

 

Would love to trade down from 40 and add another pick in the 80 range. Premium WR and Edge talent there.

 

[Going Commando]

Here is Tyrone Tracy Jr's RAS chart:

 

[mac8887]

8 hours ago, Est.1974 said:

Lack of separation doesn’t bother me as much. With a good qb all the receiver needs is a half a step on the defender. This guy can go up and get it and doesn’t mind running routes in the center of the field. I wouldn’t mind adding him, we need a big receiver. At worst he is a bust, at best, he is the next Brandon Marshall. 

[Est.1974]

1 minute ago, mac8887 said:

Lack of separation doesn’t bother me as much. With a good qb all the receiver needs is a half a step on the defender. This guy can go up and get it and doesn’t mind running routes in the center of the field. I wouldn’t mind adding him, we need a big receiver. At worst he is a bust, at best, he is the next Brandon Marshall. 

Good value in the lower 4th/high 5th IMO

[Going Commando]

2 hours ago, mhd24 said:

Tony Pauline was hyping him up on a post-combine podcast I just listened to.

 

Nice.  He's got a pretty good grade from Zierlein too, which is why I looked into him.  NFLDraftBuzz has him at 120 overall too, and projected to go in the fourth.  I think that's definitely too early for him given his age and position value.  A 24 year old time share RB who is probably a second stringer and special teamer is probably a fifth rounder at best.  I think he might make it to our pick in the sixth.  There are quite a few backs ahead of him on the draft board who are probably still going to be on the board in the fourth and fifth, like Estime, Shipley, Davis, Lloyd, Guerrendo, and Allen.

 

I wish I could find more game cut ups from him, but I really liked what little I saw.  He ran well against a tough Michigan front, despite limited opportunities.  What fascinated me was the vision and ability to follow his blocks to find the space between the tackles.  Just a little bit of a lane and he finds you nine yards.  I don't think he'd be a great fit for a Shanny run scheme because he's not a decisive one-cut guy.  He likes to pick his way up field with patience and string together moves.  And I think the big issue with his running style right now comes from a lack of situational experience in the position, where he hasn't yet developed the anticipation for knowing when a play is dead and just getting up field and getting what you can.  But a few negative runs aren't scaring me away from him.

 

I think he's the quintessential #2 back for a team.  Talented and willing special teamer who has the athleticism and patience to maximize a very limited number of touches per game.  Like a microwave scorer in basketball, where he might only get four creases worth a damn per game, but will hit those holes and get you 60 yards.

[mhd24]

3 minutes ago, Going Commando said:

 

Nice.  He's got a pretty good grade from Zierlein too, which is why I looked into him.  NFLDraftBuzz has him at 120 overall too, and projected to go in the fourth.  I think that's definitely too early for him given his age and position value.  A 24 year old time share RB who is probably a second stringer and special teamer is probably a fifth rounder at best.  I think he might make it to our pick in the sixth.  There are quite a few backs ahead of him on the draft board who are probably still going to be on the board in the fourth and fifth, like Estime, Shipley, Davis, Lloyd, Guerrendo, and Allen.

 

I wish I could find more game cut ups from him, but I really liked what little I saw.  He ran well against a tough Michigan front, despite limited opportunities.  What fascinated me was the vision and ability to follow his blocks to find the space between the tackles.  Just a little bit of a lane and he finds you nine yards.  I don't think he'd be a great fit for a Shanny run scheme because he's not a decisive one-cut guy.  He likes to pick his way up field with patience and string together moves.  And I think the big issue with his running style right now comes from a lack of situational experience in the position, where he hasn't yet developed the anticipation for knowing when a play is dead and just getting up field and getting what you can.  But a few negative runs aren't scaring me away from him.

 

I think he's the quintessential #2 back for a team.  Talented and willing special teamer who has the athleticism and patience to maximize a very limited number of touches per game.  Like a microwave scorer in basketball, where he might only get four creases worth a damn per game, but will hit those holes and get you 60 yards.

 

 

Yeah, it's a really good podcast.  Even though it is from the Giants, it is NOT giants-focused and is entirely based on the draft.  I don't agree with Pauline on everything (he has Daniels solidly as the 2nd QB for example), but he's entertaining and you can tell he knows about everyone.  He's also been consistently low on Estime, but is very high on Corum.  His take on Rosengarten was intriguing.  Basically, he's got LT experience, but was moved to RT to protect Penix's blindside.  Maybe he makes it to our early 3rd?

 

https://www.giants.com/podcasts/draft-season-new-nfl-draft-podcast

Edited March 10 by mhd24

[Est.1974]

9 hours ago, mhd24 said:

 His take on Rosengarten was intriguing.  Basically, he's got LT experience, but was moved to RT to protect Penix's blindside.  Maybe he makes it to our early 3rd?

Yeah I read that too. Feels like one of the better OT options at that stage of the draft. 
 

I do get the impression we like Patrick Paul though. 

[Chump Bailey]

Drake Maye will be a white Jason Campbell MF'ers !!!

 

Thanks for the klnd words and sentiment everyone - everything is cool @Skinsinparadise

 

Good to be back...

On 3/2/2024 at 12:46 PM, Chump Bailey said:

 

Me either. For me, George Holani & Tyrone Tracey Jr. perhaps the 2 RB's I'd be interested in that I've not looked at that closely when ranking.

 

I like Tracey too @Going Commando could be a real gem lost in the shuffle. 

[The Consigliere]

On 3/6/2024 at 10:44 AM, Warhead36 said:

This WR class is like 2019 all over again where so many good ones went in rounds 2-3. Lets see if we can find another McLaurin.

I don't know, I think teams have learned from butchering that class, letting AJ and Metcalf fall into round 2, and lots of other guys like speculative outlier McLaurin (for you, SIP), I think the NFL has looked at what WR's command in FA and is just being a lot less risk averse reaching for guys in round 1. I suspect we will see a ton of guys go in round 1 just to get them on cheap cost controlled contracts to avoid looking for answers in FA etc. 

[The Consigliere]

On 3/6/2024 at 1:41 PM, Skinsinparadise said:

Posted this in the QB thread but meant to post it here, it would suck if McConkey goes in the first.  I've become hung up on getting McConkey or Pearsall, especially if they take Maye.  Maybe Roman Wilson but I don't like him as much as the other 2 but I think all three are high floor.

 

If its Daniels, I am more in that Legette, Polk -- maybe even Coleman, Franklin mode.

 

Both Barton and Morgan are gone.

 

 

 

I have no interest in Leggette, and Polk just seems like a guy for round 3, late round 2, Coleman and Franklin are scary to me, and I'd rather leave them to someone else. 

 

For me, for 36th/40 at WR:

1. Ladd McConkey

2. Ricky Pearsall

3. Adonai Mitchell

4. Ja'Lynn Polk via trade down

 

if McConkey and Pearsall are both off the board, I think I'd be depressed enough to just ignore WR until day 3, and dart throw it, and leave the rest to '25, and focus on OL help, maybe an RB like Jonthan Brooks or Jaylen Wright. I don't want any part of Corum, and I'm concerned with Benson. Not sure what I think about that guy. One piece of good news is that while TE is 2 deep in terms of good options, there was great news from the combine, where the athletic tests (which are hugely correlated with future success at the position unlike WR) were great. We could dart throw TE in round 3 or 4 or 5. 

 

I think McConkey is 100% a pick if he's still there, but man does he seem like a guy who will go right before we pick in that 28-35 area. Pearsall seems more like 35-60, so maybe he's there. 

[Warhead36]

Ladd will be a 1st rounder. Too many good teams picking late in round 1 that will need a WR.

[mhd24]

With Atlanta now out of the QB market, Vegas and Minny probably have to trade up to ensure they get JJ.  Chargers are a trade down option.

Edited March 11 by mhd24

[The Consigliere]

On 3/6/2024 at 2:53 PM, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

 

I wonder if I can request a thread, or if it can just be done here. Not sure if people share my interest in this, but what I'd really love to see, in some ways, just as much and moreso than individual player talk, is for people who do break down lots of prospects positionally, to tier them out. Who are the guys you like in day 1, day 2 projections, 4th/5th round etc at OT, IOL, DB, DL, LB etc. I already more or less know the playmaking positions from having done the work for dynasty, but for defense and OL, I don't know squat. I, personally, not sure of others, would get a lot more out of tiered out thoughts, rather than just individual player break downs, because to be honest, usually 98% of the individual dudes posted, aren't drafted by us anyway (though admittedly only a very small portion of players sign contracts with their 2nd teams, but by then, we're usually more familiar anyway). 

[The Consigliere]

On 3/8/2024 at 2:34 PM, Skinsinparadise said:

Keon Coleman.  Definitely a darling of most of the draft media.

 

Also feels a bit boom-bust like his teammate Johnny Wilson but I do like him over Wilson.  I'd be OK with rolling the dice.  I know some draftniks had him top half of the first round earlier in the process and now you see him in the early 2nd often enough where it feels like a "steal".  I am not sure about that myself.  I wouldn't hate it but he's not a pound the table for me guy.  I think he can easily end up in the late 2nd.  But I defnitiely get the logic of taking him in the early 2nd -- lots of upside

 

I like him more inside the numbers, 2nd level throws, crossers, digs, etc. than I do with out routes- corner rutes

 

He can be lethal on crossers up the middle.   He seems to have a good feel for seperating in that part of the field and keeps working on getting open when his QB scrambles which I like.  He is definitely not a lazy player.  He keeps working to get open.

 

As for contested catches, some nice highlights but then meh on some others -- inconsistent.  Great one though against Clemson.  PFF gives him a poor grade on contested catches.

 

More dynamic with the ball in his hands than Wilson and the stats back that.  Even though Wilson ran faster at the combine, Coleman to my eyes seems to be less stiff as a runner.   And especially up the middle he catch the ball in stride and can motor for a big dude.  He looks faster than his 40 time. 

 

Good-sticky hands.  Doesn't have the speed to be DK Metcalf explosive deep threat type.  Sort more of a poor man's Drake London.  He's not the physical player that Drake is but is more dynamic and I think he's dangerous in the same parts of the field that Drake was.

 

I also like that he returns kicks.  Intriguing.  But I have some caution with him.  

 

 

 

 

 

Dynasty Tape and Analytics community generally hate the guy. View him as too slow, unathletic, won't get separation, and his contested catch rate #'s suck. Otoh, a few pointed out that his play speed is faster than his track speed, and pointed to the gauntlet drill where he was much faster than guys who had higher 40's than him (much faster in the context of executing the movements of the drill much faster than a typical 4.61 type would). 

 

For me, the problem with him is that there is a real, bright, shinning, "reasons why this guy will be a bust," sign blinking on the street corner, and the subtle potential that he'll find a way through, Boldin/Keenan Allen style, when he's actually slower and less versatile than the mega bust (who I liked) N'Keal Harry. 

 

I just would pass. Let someone else figure him out. He may hit, but I'm just more worried. Rather get Pearsall or McConkey, though admittedly I can't see either of them being alpha's, just more complimentary guys. 

[method man]

26 minutes ago, The Consigliere said:

Dynasty Tape and Analytics community generally hate the guy. View him as too slow, unathletic, won't get separation, and his contested catch rate #'s suck. Otoh, a few pointed out that his play speed is faster than his track speed, and pointed to the gauntlet drill where he was much faster than guys who had higher 40's than him (much faster in the context of executing the movements of the drill much faster than a typical 4.61 type would). 

 

For me, the problem with him is that there is a real, bright, shinning, "reasons why this guy will be a bust," sign blinking on the street corner, and the subtle potential that he'll find a way through, Boldin/Keenan Allen style, when he's actually slower and less versatile than the mega bust (who I liked) N'Keal Harry. 

 

I just would pass. Let someone else figure him out. He may hit, but I'm just more worried. Rather get Pearsall or McConkey, though admittedly I can't see either of them being alpha's, just more complimentary guys. 

I totally hear you. I think a reason he will get taken in the 2nd is the lack of true big X receivers in this draft after Harrison and Odunze

[The Consigliere]

On 3/9/2024 at 5:40 AM, Skinsinparadise said:

Rewatching FSU last night, makes me double down on Trey Benson.  I think his skill set translates to the NFL.  Patient runner who follows his blocks.  Makes something out of nothing.  Good vision.  Gets skinny in the hole.    Has power-speed.  Not the game breaker runner that some others like Brooks was.  But with his speed and his hands, I think he will make his share of big plays in the NFL.

 

I watched one of his interviews, articulate comes off smart.

 

 

 

Haven't been able to decide how I feel about the guy. The speed is good, the explosion drills were average, the production #'s were generally meh. Not bad, just not great either. Size is pretty ideal, he's gonna be age 22 for his rookie year. He should be fine at the next level, I'm just not sold he's a difference maker. Better than Robinson? Probably, but special? I don't see it. Otoh, he is an improvement on Robinson, probably, otoh, I think he's probably the first RB off the board, so he's not gonna be ours, probably (only way I could see us taking him is if all the WR's and OL's we like our gone in round 2 and we need to go another direction, just to give our QB a more athletic weapon than Robinson and the blah other guy, sure, but otherwise, I think somebody else takes him between late 1st and mid 2nd).