2023 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, Warhead36 said:

Kyle Pitts was supposed to be transcendent as well. What has he done in Atlanta? Honestly kinda tired of hearing that term thrown around. 

 

Like I said, the best TEs tend to be mid round guys who develop over time. I'd like to see what we have in Cole Turner in year 2. That kid Armani Rogers looked pretty good in limited time as well. 

 

I'm not saying it isn't a need, it absolutely is. But burning a 1st rounder on one is not the answer I don't think. 

 

Kyle Pitts becomes second rookie tight end to eclipse 1,000 yards in NFL history, breaks Julio Jones' franchise record. Kyle Pitts added another record to his historic rookie season on Sunday against the Buffalo Bills. Pitts became the only rookie in Falcons' history to amass over 1,000 receiving yards.Jan 2, 2022

33 minutes ago, Conn said:

 

Pitts is a jumbo WR playing TE, that’s all. It’s a position dependent on targets, not really one that can excel on its own. That should maybe be factored into expectations of what you’re getting with a high draft pick (if you don’t have a QB), but if you’re drafting for the overall roster you’ll have a couple years down the road, I’m not sure how heavily you should weigh it. If they draft or sign a QB this year and then Pitts and London each put up 1200+ yards, do they retroactively become better value picks? I don’t think so, great talent is great talent even if things don’t come together right away. 

 

Agree.

 

Pitts was banged up and hurt this year.

 

His first year though was very special --elite level rookie year.  Electric

 

 

 

Edited December 25, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

14 hours ago, Going Commando said:

Mayer is a transcendent prospect and would be a good get.  So is Jaxon Smith-Njigba.  We just need talent, no matter the position. Go BPA at every pick.

 

I haven't watched much Ohio State this year, but did the previous year and Njigba was arguably their best receiver.  Considering Wilson and Olave have killed it or close enough in their rookie year -- bodes well for Jaxon. I got to back and watch some of his games, your enthusiasm has made me want to watch.

 

 

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/ncaa-football/news/ohio-state-jaxon-smith-njigba-top-buckeyes-star-wideouts/xrfsirbiiu6fo8yq7kjq94jv

Every artist has a signature pattern. With Smith-Njigba, it starts with the release from the line of scrimmage. Where does that inspiration come from? 

"I like to try to be creative," he said. "Work on my creativity. It's fun because I can do that sitting on the couch in my mind. I've tried some new things, new releases. There is stuff that I can always improve on. I like to work on my overall game and see where it takes me." 

Smith-Njigba recalled thinking about those releases before his breakout performance against Oregon on Sept. 11, 2021. He finished with seven catches for 145 yards and two TDs, and one of those scores was after a stutter-step juke where he froze the Ducks cornerback in the middle of the field. 

"That one I was waiting on," Smith-Njigba said. "Before I line up, I always have a pre-snap idea of what I'm going to get done; a pre-snap plan." 

 

Stroud recalled a scenario against Maryland when the Terrapins switched to a Cover-2 before the snap, and he did not have to say anything. Smith-Njigba rerouted toward the linebacker, split the safeties and made the catch in the seam. Smith-Njigba's 75-yard touchdown against Nebraska caught the attention of Michigan State safety Xavier Henderson, who warned the other Spartans' defensive backs during the film session. 

 

"He's a lot faster than you think," Henderson said. "I didn't really know he had shake like that until he made that big play vs. Nebraska where he caught the pass, made the cutback and got up the field. 

"When you watch him, it looks like he's a vet – like he's been in college for about four years," Henderson said. "Just the way he runs his routes, manipulates his body and he might be covered but it is the way he contorts his body, gets dudes away from him so he can make a tough catch. It really reminds me of a dude in the NFL. From a kid so young, it's really impressive."

College GameDay analyst Desmond Howard, who won the Heisman Trophy in 1991 as a receiver at Michigan, sees yet another hidden skill in Smith-Njigba's game. 

 

"I think he has great hand-eye coordination and his ability to track the ball is uncanny," Howard told SN. "When I say track the ball, he's a guy who can be running down the right sideline – and naturally you would be looking over your left shoulder for the ball – and he can track it to the point where he can catch it with his right shoulder on the sideline. There are not too many people who can do that." 

Harrison Jr., who is primed to be Ohio State's next breakout receiver, sees the precision at practice. 

"Jaxon is very smooth and quick and his change of direction is probably the best in the country," he said. "It's kind of hard to do what he does. I can't really mimic it too much, but that's what makes him great for sure." 

Harrison Jr. watched that on the field at last year's Rose Bowl Game against Utah, where Smith-Njigba had six catches of 30 yards or more. That included the go-ahead TD with 4:42 remaining in the end zone that led to the 48-45 victory. Smith-Njigba said that was his favorite play from 2021. 

 

 

"I don't know too many people that's making that catch," Harrison said. "I was blessed to be right in front of it. I ran the hitch, and he ran the slot fade. I got a good angle of it, and it was just an amazing catch." 

Edited December 25, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Warhead36]

First off, 1000 yards in today's pass happy NFL in a 17 game season isn't THAT impressive.

 

Again, I'm not saying Pitts is some scrub. But has he really been worth a top 5 pick? When you could have had a Micah Parsons, Penei Sewell, Patrick Surtain jr. etc. etc.? Guys who have been even better and at more premium positions? 

 

If this Mayer kid really is head and shoulders above every other player at our draft position then, okay I guess. I don't think that'll be the case though. 

[KDawg]

I think ultimately if Anthony Richardson is in striking distance Rivera is going to pick him. 
 

Am I on board? I don’t know. Dude has a rocket for an arm and is athletic as hell. Good size.

 

Want to talk about footwork issues? He has them. If Howell can’t play because of footwork issues there is no **** Richardson would be ready. But the thing with him Is you almost need him to play to gather the experience to improve. 
 

He also doesn’t seem to play in a multi read offense. Looks like it’s one and go. There’s a place for that but it handicaps your offense in other ways than a guy like Heinicke who limits the routes and play types. 
 

But watching a bit more of him I can see where people say he’s a similar college QB as a guy like Josh Allen (though Richardson is faster and less of a tank, which means less sturdy. So it’s not a great comparison

[@DCGoldPants]

14 hours ago, KDawg said:

I think ultimately if Anthony Richardson is in striking distance Rivera is going to pick him. 
 

Am I on board? I don’t know. Dude has a rocket for an arm and is athletic as hell. Good size.

 

If there is new ownership, Rivera might still be HC but I doubt he's picking in the draft. 

 

Folks running those mock draft websites seem to have a lot of OL in the first round. Any QB here is going to need a better one than they have now. Now time like 2023 to throw a lot into drafting/signing OL to reset that. 

[KDawg]

7 minutes ago, @DCGoldPants said:

 

If there is new ownership, Rivera might still be HC but I doubt he's picking in the draft. 

 

Folks running those mock draft websites seem to have a lot of OL in the first round. Any QB here is going to need a better one than they have now. Now time like 2023 to throw a lot into drafting/signing OL to reset that. 

You don’t have to convince me on the OL. I just don’t think that’s the route they want to go.

[@DCGoldPants]

26 minutes ago, KDawg said:

You don’t have to convince me on the OL. I just don’t think that’s the route they want to go.

 

I think it's the "they" we don't know about yet. New ownership and front office maybe want to start with building an foundation before reaching on a QB immediately. Like a lot here, been reading about Howell and his fall from 1st round prospect having so much to do with UNCs loss of talent and change in offense his final year there. Wondering if a year sitting, watching, going through and NFL season with no pressure, and still only 22 could be a real possibility for him. This offseason he has an opportunity to grind. Hope he takes it. 

 

Don't think Wentz is back. Do think TH4 could be. Don't know the options in FA and do not want to trade. 

[KDawg]

44 minutes ago, @DCGoldPants said:

 

I think it's the "they" we don't know about yet. New ownership and front office maybe want to start with building an foundation before reaching on a QB immediately. Like a lot here, been reading about Howell and his fall from 1st round prospect having so much to do with UNCs loss of talent and change in offense his final year there. Wondering if a year sitting, watching, going through and NFL season with no pressure, and still only 22 could be a real possibility for him. This offseason he has an opportunity to grind. Hope he takes it. 

 

Don't think Wentz is back. Do think TH4 could be. Don't know the options in FA and do not want to trade. 

Agree again. But for right now we have Rivera and Snyder and until otherwise noted I’m operating on the assumption that is what we have going into 2023.

 

I would have played Howell before the win streak started. Now I think it’s imperative he plays in the next two weeks so we have an idea of what he is going into the offseason. Though if he plays well that doesn’t bode well for Rivera not playing him sooner. 
 

I think Howell could absolutely wind up being a very quality starter for us. I think I was his biggest cheerleader this offseason.

 

But I don’t believe our current regime is going to want to go that route. They are going to try to make a splash. Vet is a route but expensive.

 

My early thought is they are going to try for Richardson (via trade up if necessary) and address OL with Wentz’ salary.

[Warhead36]

I think we'll address OL in FA. Then take our stab at a QB in the draft. Maybe Richardson. Maybe someone like Levis.

[Warhead36]

I think we'll address OL in FA. Then take our stab at a QB in the draft. Maybe Richardson. Maybe someone like Levis.

[Koolblue13]

I want Porter in the first. I asked Forehead about Brisker last year and dudes a stud. I was way off on that one.

[philibusters]

I almost view Richardson in the same light as Malik Willis--talented, but you have to draft him planning to sit him.  In college football where a 65% completion percentage is normal, Richardson was at 53.8 percent.  His TD to Int ratio was okay 17 to 9 and he can run but he is very raw.  Richardson is a middle of the pack SEC starter, so he is going to be bad in the NFL until he develops.  I just don't want to develop him.  I am not a huge fan of trading up to draft a QB in this draft.  I like one QB, Bryce Young.   I am intrigued by others, but not confident in them.   I'd rather not go QB.

[Warhead36]

3 minutes ago, philibusters said:

I almost view Richardson in the same light as Malik Willis--talented, but you have to draft him planning to sit him.  In college football where a 65% completion percentage is normal, Richardson was at 53.8 percent.  His TD to Int ratio was okay 17 to 9 and he can run but he is very raw.  Richardson is a middle of the pack SEC starter, so he is going to be bad in the NFL until he develops.  I just don't want to develop him.  I am not a huge fan of trading up to draft a QB in this draft.  I like one QB, Bryce Young.   I am intrigued by others, but not confident in them.   I'd rather not go QB.

Yeah I really don't love any of the QBs in this class. But then again, I was a big Zach Wilson fan in 2021 so what the heck do I know LMAO 

[method man]

On 12/25/2022 at 9:01 AM, Warhead36 said:

Kyle Pitts was supposed to be transcendent as well. What has he done in Atlanta? Honestly kinda tired of hearing that term thrown around. 

 

Like I said, the best TEs tend to be mid round guys who develop over time. I'd like to see what we have in Cole Turner in year 2. That kid Armani Rogers looked pretty good in limited time as well. 

 

I'm not saying it isn't a need, it absolutely is. But burning a 1st rounder on one is not the answer I don't think. 

We have 4 young TEs that seem to be well regarded by the people in the know - I am betting at least one can emerge as a TE1. My bet is Rogers given his growth trajectory. If there were one position, I wouldn’t mind going into next season wo a proven starter, it is TE

 

Given the depth in this draft, I wouldn’t hate it if they took a guy in Day 2

[KillBill26]

52 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

I want Porter in the first. I asked Forehead about Brisker last year and dudes a stud. I was way off on that one.

CB is deep on the top end this year, I'd love to get one in the 1st, with porter at the top of the list. Big, strong, feisty.  A couple olinemen In mid rounds, and I'll be happy with the 23 draft.

12 minutes ago, method man said:

We have 4 young TEs that seem to be well regarded by the people in the know - I am betting at least one can emerge as a TE1. My bet is Rogers given his growth trajectory. If there were one position, I wouldn’t mind going into next season wo a proven starter, it is TE

 

Given the depth in this draft, I wouldn’t hate it if they took a guy in Day 2

I don't know where I stand on TE.  I get the mayer love, he has been regarded as a top prospect for years now.   True double threat.  Man that would be nice.

 

But with other needs, should we be investing that high of a pick on tight end?   I also think with three stud wide receivers, a serviceable tight end should do, but then I also would love to see a top notch tight end in this offense just to see it taken to a whole another level.

[@DCGoldPants]

3 hours ago, KDawg said:

Agree again. But for right now we have Rivera and Snyder and until otherwise noted I’m operating on the assumption that is what we have going into 2023.

 

 

 

If that happens, then something REALLY went wrong or Snyder never intended to sell. I believe pretty deeply right now that coming back from $7B+ isn't going to happen, that because of a short window, Ron will survive another year but without front office control.... and even if by chance that didn't happen. They played themselves out of one of the top few QBs to go next draft. Maybe saving themselves from potentially the next Zach Wilson. 

[skinsfan66]

If RB Bijan Robinson is the highest rated player on your draft board do you take him at 20 if you are picking for Wash?  Next best in order DE Bresee, TE Mayer, G OCyrus Torrence, highest OT, QB, LB that is there? If me yes, I would think hard about Breese or Torrence as my next choice not going to take QB Or T just because they are next best at postion. I am not seeing Mayer as a difference maker at that pick with the team. Give me a TE who blocks well and can be a decent receiver. We are built at the receiver spot, We run the ball and that makes a back who does run and catch well, another weapon. I would take a chance on building Oline, TE, QB,LB with the rest of picks and free agency.  Brian R. has won the starting job why overpay for Gibson later, trade him after pick if possible.  I guess What I am saying is I would take impact over need if player is rated higher.

[Redskins 2021]

Richardson has a ton of ability but has not put it together reminds me of Cardale Jones from ohio state. Someone will take him in first round but I be surprised if he puts it together. Definitely a project.

[KDawg]

25 minutes ago, Redskins 2021 said:

Richardson has a ton of ability but has not put it together reminds me of Cardale Jones from ohio state. Someone will take him in first round but I be surprised if he puts it together. Definitely a project.

I don’t think anyone here disagrees. The conversation here is that what the Commanders might do.

[Zim489]

2023 NFL Draft: Ranking the top 10 offensive tackle prospects | NFL Draft | PFF

[Skinsinparadise]

11 hours ago, KDawg said:

You don’t have to convince me on the OL. I just don’t think that’s the route they want to go.

 

O line is the one spot Rivera called out as the downgrade problem from this year compared to last.   And he seems to obsess in his rhetoric about the trenches. O line, O line, O line.  So not sure where you are coming from that its not what you think they will do -- unless you mean they are more obsessed with QB?

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 26, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[KDawg]

30 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

O line is the one spot Rivera called out as the downgrade problem from this year compared to last.   And he seems to obsess in his rhetoric about the tenches. O line, O line, O line.  So not sure where you are coming from that its not what you think they will do -- unless you mean they are more obsessed with QB?

 

 

 

 

 

That’s exactly what I mean. I thought that was implied with me talking about Richardson.

[Skinsinparadise]

33 minutes ago, KDawg said:

That’s exactly what I mean. I thought that was implied with me talking about Richardson.

 

OK, yeah I can see them thinking he's potentially a Cam, etc.

 

Otherwise it seems clear to me as heck that Ron will go to town on O line, and that's not just wishful thinking on my end, he's telegraphed that loudly. 

[Going Commando]

On 12/25/2022 at 9:55 AM, philibusters said:

This board loves Mayer, but on the college football podcasts I listen to like Cover3, a lot of college football analysts think Brock Bowers is clearly better  than Mayer (though he was a true sophomore and is not draft eligible this year).   I have not studied either of them, but its just interesting to get the diverging opinions.

 

Bowers is a better athlete and player than Mayer, and Mayer is still a transcendent TE prospect.  Bowers was the best player on a national championship Georgia team full of stone cold blue chips as a true freshman, that's how good he is.  This year, he's probably still the best player on their team but Jalen Carter is now good enough to give him a run for his money, and they also now how a transcendent true freshman DB named Malaki Starks with a Champ Bailey type ceiling.  Bowers is so good that he was the clear cut best player on the field when they played Alabama in last year's SEC championship when he was sharing a field with Will Anderson and Jamison Williams and Bryce Young and John Metchie.  He's going to enter his draft year as the strongest TE prospect since Kelen Winslow Jr.

 

Mayer is really good too though.  He too was the best player on a stacked college blue blood as a freshman, and is the best of the Notre Dame TE prospects IMO, which is saying something.  I think he enters the draft as the answer to what would Gronk have looked like and where would he have gone in the draft if he hadn't ****ed up his back at Arizona.

[method man]

16 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

O line is the one spot Rivera called out as the downgrade problem from this year compared to last.   And he seems to obsess in his rhetoric about the trenches. O line, O line, O line.  So not sure where you are coming from that its not what you think they will do -- unless you mean they are more obsessed with QB?

 

 

 

 

 

This draft feels absolutely loaded with center prospects. This Tippman guy seems to have athleticism that the bigger center prospects like Schmitz and Avila don’t have.

 

I think the play is to bring Roullier back one more year (his net cost for keeping vs cutting is < $3M). One of these bigger guys can learn the center position and compete for one of the starting G spots in year 1 with Paul and a vet like Norwell.

 

The other key move on OL has to be to find a starting RT to move Cosmi inside. If they keep the first and don’t use it on a QB and don’t find an RT answer in FA, that would be the pick I’d make