The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[Redskins 2021]

 

21 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

Trubisky’s one of a few (cheap and available) qbs that has the potential or possibility to reach roughly a league average play, but there’s no guarantee.

 

It seems the plan would be Trubisky and a 2nd rounder - semi-competency (hopefully better) and a guy to develop that has some potential.  So hedging bets?  Yes.  Going all in?  Not really, no.

 I think we will get a vet of some sort Trubisky,JimmyG, or Baker Mayfield. I don't think we will get anyone to be excited about. We most likely trade are second round pick for someone. 

 

If cleveland got JimmyG we probably get can get Mayfield. There probably alot going on behind the scenes with all this Qb stuff. Mayfield could be a chip if one of big Qb change teams.

 

With the rebranding I am sure they want someone who will get excitement up in dc.

Edited February 11, 2022 by Redskins 2021

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, bowhunter said:

The smart play for NYG would be to take Kyle Hamilton at 5, and then trade #7 for a later 2022 and next years 1st. That would keep them with multiple firsts ad infinitum and add a huge talent if Hamilton is there at 5

 

McKinney is developing into one of the better FS in the league.  they are strong at safety.  What's missing with that team is pass rush and O line and the top 10 is tailor made for it. 

27 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Sign me up for Baker Mayfield. I think that's the best possible outcome this offseason, especially for the cost.

 

Not sure about the best possible outcome.  But among the 2nd-3rd tier options he IMO stands out.

 

I'd take him over Mariota, Trubisky, Wentz and Jimmy G.   Mariota otherwise would be my fav in that class, but I can't get fully excited about Mariota because of his injury history. 

3 hours ago, RWJ said:

I think Trubisky and our #11 or 2nd rounder is our probable course of action too.  

 

that's what most have been saying, including me so no argument there.  I am hoping for better but I think this is how it ends up.

[Koolblue13]

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

McKinney is developing into one of the better FS in the league.  they are strong at safety.  What's missing with that team is pass rush and O line and the top 10 is tailor made for it. 

 

Not sure about the best possible outcome.  But among the 2nd-3rd tier options he IMO stands out.

 

I'd take him over Mariota, Trubisky, Wentz and Jimmy G.   Mariota otherwise would be my fav in that class, but I can't get fully excited about Mariota because of his injury history. 

You know that I'm a hard no on trading 3 1rsts and a player for anyone, so for me, Baker is Tier 1. Wonder about the cost though. Our 2nd? Our 1rst for their 2nd? It wouldn't be a first, although it would probably be worth it.

[Redskins 2021]

3 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

You know that I'm a hard no on trading 3 1rsts and a player for anyone, so for me, Baker is Tier 1. Wonder about the cost though. Our 2nd? Our 1rst for their 2nd? It wouldn't be a first, although it would probably be worth it.

More then you think look what Sam Darnold got.

[lavar1156]

Mariota or Trubiski seem most likely.

 

Interesting discussion about Lamar Jackson. I tell my Ravens friends all the time I would tread softly with him. Do you really want to give him a 200 million dollar deal? I'm not sure he can win a super bowl by himself. 

[Redskins 2021]

7 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

You know that I'm a hard no on trading 3 1rsts and a player for anyone, so for me, Baker is Tier 1. Wonder about the cost though. Our 2nd? Our 1rst for their 2nd? It wouldn't be a first, although it would probably be worth it.

More then you think. First cleveland would have to get someone. Then if you look at Sam Darnold trade they got a 2, 4, and 5 rounder from him. I think they are more likely to do a Jimmyg or Mayfield then just sign a Trubsiky 

 

2 minutes ago, lavar1156 said:

Mariota or Trubiski seem most likely.

 

Interesting discussion about Lamar Jackson. I tell my Ravens friends all the time I would tread softly with him. Do you really want to give him a 200 million dollar deal? I'm not sure he can win a super bowl by himself. 

I would give him the money here. You think he is any worst then Watson.

Edited February 11, 2022 by Redskins 2021

[Koolblue13]

3 minutes ago, Redskins 2021 said:

More then you think look what Sam Darnold got.

First, they're not comparable. Baker is a good QB with wins under his belt. Darnold has always sucked. It would be closer to us trading for Trubisky.

 

Second, last year we saw great examples of QB trades that set a precedent.

1 minute ago, lavar1156 said:

Mariota or Trubiski seem most likely.

 

Interesting discussion about Lamar Jackson. I tell my Ravens friends all the time I would tread softly with him. Do you really want to give him a 200 million dollar deal? I'm not sure he can win a super bowl by himself. 

I would never give him that kind of money. Ever. You can't run like that and stay a viable QB.

[Redskins 2021]

9 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

First, they're not comparable. Baker is a good QB with wins under his belt. Darnold has always sucked. It would be closer to us trading for Trubisky.

 

Second, last year we saw great examples of QB trades that set a precedent.

I would never give him that kind of money. Ever. You can't run like that and stay a viable QB.

Baker will cost more then Darnold for sure it would be are first to start probably more. To get a top Qb you are looking at 25 million to start in a year or two you will be looking at 30 million.

 

Jackson will be getting a 200 million dollar deal from someone. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 11, 2022 by Redskins 2021

[VirginiaVibes]

2 hours ago, zCommander said:

Any news on if we might even go after Huntley? Will the Raven be willing to part from him? Can he work in our offense is the bigger question though.. 

 

I find it interesting that people want Huntley but are opposed to Corral because of his size? They are the exact same size and weight. Huntley is 6'1, 205 and Matt Corral is either 6'1 or 6'2 and 205.

[KDawg]

Huntley is not a fit here.

 

I wouldn’t pay Jackson 200+M. I think he’s peaked as a player due to his limited passing ability… unless he improves that considerably. 
 

Mayfield is a good pick up but like most of these scenarios I’ll believe it when I see it.

 

Can we ban Darnold’s name from this thread?

[Zim489]

 

[FootballZombie]

1 hour ago, VirginiaVibes said:

I find it interesting that people want Huntley

 

I'm surprised people want Huntley at all as any kind of viable answer and/or bridge.

[Skinsinparadise]

2 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

You know that I'm a hard no on trading 3 1rsts and a player for anyone, so for me, Baker is Tier 1. Wonder about the cost though. Our 2nd? Our 1rst for their 2nd? It wouldn't be a first, although it would probably be worth it.

 

I actually think it might take a first for Baker, best case scenario a 2nd.  The trading for one pick for another usually happens in the mid rounds or done in trades that aren't big trades -- I doubt the Browns would do a deal with the end result is the pick compensation is even 1 for 1.  I would say no to a deal like that in their shoes. 

 

In general I just don't think you are going deep in the playoffs or winning a SB with any of the low end 2nd tier types but maybe its possible once in a one off year if everything goes right.  It's definitely better than doing nothing IMO. 

 

As for not trading three #1's.  Worth it IMO for an elite franchise QB. I agree with you on a lot of the QB things.  But we disagree and big time on the price for a franchise QB.  I actually think its their only shot to stop this franchise from hitting even further depths of people bolting to the Ravens, etc.  I'd add if we end up with Trubisky or Jimmy G and the Eagles acquire Russell Wilson it will create a 10 of 10 level meltdown with the fanbase, me included in that mix -- it will mean the season is likely already over for us, it will be a battle for third place with the Giants.  PR disaster on an epic scale IMO.  

 

I used to say this on the FO thread back when Bruce had some fans who argued with me, some who really over time hated me for it .  I woud say the crime among others that Bruce has done to this franchise is remove what little pizzazz still existed out of the team while piling on more smugness and sleaziness.  It's been a boring team for years and they've paid a price for it.    Beckham said after being traded from the Giants that he thinks he helped save them from irrelevancy during their down years because of his star power -- in a way I think he was right.  This team doesn't do stars like it doesn't do QBs.  

 

A year or so ago I was listening to a Ravens reporter talking about how he felt that interest in the Ravens was declining some before they drafted Lamar Jackson even though they were winning because the team was considered by some boring.  The Ravens issue with fans losing interest for a small spell is Minor League stuff compared to anything we've got.  But yeah in 2017-2016 we outdrew Baltimore.  But no more.

 

My point is they maybe can sell Jimmy G or Trubisky or a player like that as being a bandaid and that circumstance isn't the end of the world.  But if that's what happens juxtaposed with the Eagles getting that shiny new toy, that franchse QB that has eluded this team forever it seems -- mega PR disaster IMO and a ceiling next season for third place. 

Edited February 11, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

Keim just on 630, on Wilson.

 

Said 10-20% chance when asked what are the odds they get Wilson.

 

He said obstacles in the way including Seattle would want a QB in return and Heinicke wouldn't move the needle at all on that front. 

 

Bram talked to some people who he implied were in the know, and was told Wilson wasn't that picky about where he'd go to right now, he's fairly open on that front at the moment, if he got traded.

 

They then talked about not having the Qb chip in return is a problem perhaps for other potential trades

Edited February 11, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Redskins 2021]

41 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I actually think it might take a first for Baker, best case scenario a 2nd.  The trading for one pick for another usually happens in the mid rounds or done in trades that aren't big trades -- I doubt the Browns would do a deal with the end result is the pick compensation is even 1 for 1.  I would say no to a deal like that in their shoes. 

 

In general I just don't think you are going deep in the playoffs or winning a SB with any of the low end 2nd tier types but maybe its possible once in a one off year if everything goes right.  It's definitely better than doing nothing IMO. 

 

As for not trading three #1's.  Worth it IMO for an elite franchise QB. I agree with you on a lot of the QB things.  But we disagree and big time on the price for a franchise QB.  I actually think its their own shot to stop this franchise from hitting even further depths of people bolting to the Ravens, etc.  I'd add if we end up with Trubisky or Jimmy G and the Eagles acquire Russell Wilson it will create a 10 of 10 level meltdown with the fanbase, me included in that mix -- it will mean the season is likely already over for us, it will be a battle for third place with the Giants.  PR disaster on an epic scale IMO.  

 

I used to say this on the FO thread back when Bruce had some fans who argued with me, some who really over time hated me for it .  I woud say the crime among others that Bruce has done to this franchise is remove what little pizzazz still existed out of the team while piling on more smugness and sleaziness.  It's been a boring team for years and they've paid a price for it.    Beckham said after being traded from the Giants that he thinks he helped save them from irrelevancy because of his star power -- in a way I think he was right.  This team doesn't do stars like it doesn't do QBs.  

 

A year or so ago I was listening to a Ravens reporter talking about how he felt that interest in the Ravens was declining some before they drafted Lamar Jackson even though they were winning because the team was considered by some boring.  The Ravens issue with fans losing interest for a small spell is Minor League stuff compared to anything we've got.  But yeah in 2017-2016 we outdrew Baltimore.  But no more.

 

My point is they maybe can sell Jimmy G or Trubisky or a player like that as being a bandaid and that circumstance isn't the end of the world.  But if that's what happens juxtaposed with the Eagles getting that shiny new toy, that franchse QB that has eluded this team forever it seems -- mega PR disaster IMO and a ceiling next season for third place. 

 

To get Mayfield we would need the Browns to get JimmyG. If they get Cousins minnesota will take Mayfield back and run with him.

 

What would the 49ers take for JimmyG. The  Browns I think would take a first for Baker. The 49ers maybe a second for JimmyG.. So Browns would trade a first for a second and get JimmyG back. 

 

I like L. Jackson more then most. I think he would fit perfect in are offense. He can run and throws better then people think. I would not want to give 3 ones for anyone but would consider it for Jackson. 

Edited February 11, 2022 by Redskins 2021

[mistertim]

The idea of giving up 3 1sts and a $200+ million contract for Lamar Jackson is abject insanity.

 

He's a running QB who has an entire system tailored to his skill set and who is only a mediocre NFL passer. He's also steadily declined since his one huge year. This past season he threw for 16 TDs and 13 INTs while running for 2. Yes he only played in 12 games, but that doesn't change the fact that his trajectory was pretty much crap.

 

If you give up 3 1st round picks and a record breaking contract for a QB then he damn well better be an elite passer. That's why Watson, Rodgers and Wilson are probably worth that and why I'd probably only give up one 1st for Jackson.

[Redskins 2021]

5 minutes ago, mistertim said:

The idea of giving up 3 1sts and a $200+ million contract for Lamar Jackson is abject insanity.

 

He's a running QB who has an entire system tailored to his skill set and who is only a mediocre NFL passer. He's also steadily declined since his one huge year. This past season he threw for 16 TDs and 13 INTs while running for 2. Yes he only played in 12 games, but that doesn't change the fact that his trajectory was pretty much crap.

 

If you give up 3 1st round picks and a record breaking contract for a QB then he damn well better be an elite passer. That's why Watson, Rodgers and Wilson are probably worth that and why I'd probably only give up one 1st for Jackson.

You think Watson is that much  better then Wilson. L Jackson is a top 5 Qb I am not going up 3 first rounders for anyone but there not 5 or 6  guys better Jackson.

Edited February 11, 2022 by Redskins 2021

[Inigo Montoya]

4 minutes ago, Redskins 2021 said:

You think Watson is that much  better then Wilson. L Jackson is a top 5 Qb I am not going up 3 first rounders for anyone but there not 5 or 6  guys better Jackson.

This isn't fantasy football, there are absolutely 5-6 guys

 

1. Rodgers

2. Mahomes

3. J Allen

4. Murray

5. Wilson

6. Stafford

7. Burrow 

8. Herbert 

 

Prescott, Carr, Jackson... I'd put him in this tier 

[Darth Tater]

In the SB era, coaches that started out with 2 seasons of 10 or more losses got to the SB in year 3, got fired, or never amounted to anything. A rookie QB has never lead a team to the SB. You are probably not going to the dance without at good QB. Unless you believe Rivera is an exception, want a new coach (and think we can find one) or accept ongoing suck (mediocrity at best), you've got to know that we need a top-tier vet no matter the risk.

[mistertim]

8 minutes ago, Redskins 2021 said:

You think Watson is that much  better then Wilson. L Jackson is a top 5 Qb I am not going up 3 first rounders for anyone but there not 5 or 6  guys better Jackson.

 

I didn't say who I think is better between Watson and Wilson. I said they're both way better than Jackson. 

 

Jackson isn't a top 5 QB. He's not even top 10 at the moment. PFF has him ranked 17th in their ranking system and he was 17th ranked in QBR. Like most running QBs, he had one great year and then petered out.

 

He's only a mediocre NFL passer and an elite passer is what you'd consider giving up 3 1sts for, not a running QB who has steadily declined and who needs an entire system built around him to be successful...and even then it was short lived.

[Redskins 2021]

16 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

This isn't fantasy football, there are absolutely 5-6 guys

 

1. Rodgers

2. Mahomes

3. J Allen

4. Murray

5. Wilson

6. Stafford

7. Burrow 

8. Herbert 

 

Prescott, Carr, Jackson... I'd put him in this tier 

Wilson and Burrow are better then Murray.  Jackson probably six. He was injured all year ankle and covid. His team collapsed with out him. His running is key bit no one runs like him.

11 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

I didn't say who I think is better between Watson and Wilson. I said they're both way better than Jackson. 

 

Jackson isn't a top 5 QB. He's not even top 10 at the moment. PFF has him ranked 17th in their ranking system and he was 17th ranked in QBR. Like most running QBs, he had one great year and then petered out.

 

He's only a mediocre NFL passer and an elite passer is what you'd consider giving up 3 1sts for, not a running QB who has steadily declined and who needs an entire system built around him to be successful...and even then it was short lived.

He fits in are system rite now. He throws alot better then Heinicke.  

Edited February 11, 2022 by Redskins 2021

[Skinsinparadise]

Seattle reporter on Standig's podcast today

 

A.  Carroll said unprompted in an interview last year that he wouldn't have lasted tenure wise as long as he has if it weren't for having a QB like Russell Wilson.  The reporter thinks no way Carroll wants to trade Wilson and said it likely would lead to Carroll being fired sooner than later and Carroll knows that.

 

B.  He bet about 90% he stays in Seattle.  But thinks there is a shot he's traded

 

C.  He and Standig agreed the value of a QB has never been higher than it is now.  It's become a league of the haves versus have nots when it comes to QBs so why would Seattle enter the have not terrain.

 

D.  If Wilson makes some noise about wanting to go and some team offers something really good, there is a shot he's traded

 

E.  They both made the point that Jay Gruden likes to make, which is teams without QBs translate to coaches getting fired -- its just a matter of time.  Having that QB gives you job security so teams/coaches wanted to hang on to their QBs if they got that guy.

Edited February 11, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

4 hours ago, Riggo#44 said:

His best season, however, was under Zampese as QB coach.

 

If his rookie season was his best, then why has he not reached that level again with 3 more years of experience and a much better supporting cast?  Maybe Baker is just kind of damaged goods at this point.  He's gunshy on his reads and pump fakes when he should pull the trigger.  He's not trusting what he's seeing, and has shown an inability to handle Choice routes by WR's (Odell).  He supposedly needs a far more rigid offense to not be a trainwreck.

 

He's had a great running game and good OL for several seasons, which is supposed to make everything easier for a QB.  Manageable down and distances, defenses keying on the run as the primary threat, but he hasn't capitalized.  We likely won't have that run game in 2022 that Cleveland did over the past few seasons.

 

I'm clearly in the minority here, but Baker is now a reclamation project.  Add in injury history and does he really provide more value than Trubisky, who isn't good value as it is?  Do we want to give up draft picks + pay Baker 19 million when Trubisky could be had for what, 4 million?  Also, if we trade for Baker, he has leverage and could force us to give him an extension.

[Skinsinparadise]

A Godfather offer for Jimmy G?