JamesMadisonSkins Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said: I'd have no problems if they kept expending draft picks until they find their guy. 1. Same. NOW, if there is a guy in this draft that they have confidence in that can be "the guy" then go trade up and get him. 2. If there's a guy that they think could be that guy but aren't 100% sold, then sit at #11 and see what happens. 3. If there isn't a guy they think is worth #11, but there is a raw talent later that they want to kick some tires on, absolutely draft him in Round 2 or 3, and try to get creative with #11 I am assuming #1 is not likely. But we'll see. Or the price is just too much. So if #2 and #3 are likely scenarios, you bring in that veteran to be insurance. If #11 rolls around and that guy isn't there (fields, jones last year), then you go to Plan 3. And in Plan 3, my preference would be to try and trade down from #11 and accumulate draft capital in 2023 somehow while getting a rookie in Round 2 or 3. It gives you the most options long-term. - Jameis/veteran balls out, leads you to the playoffs, and you now have the option to re-sign them to be "the guy" or you move on and have a 2nd rounder in the folds you like that could develop into the guy long-term, and you now have 2 1st round picks to spend elsewhere - Jameis/veteran does okay, backup 2nd rounder is TBD ... you have the draft capital to go all-in on QB next year - Jameis/veteran is a disaster, we have another 6-7 win season, backup 2nd rounder gets some play but not clear if they can be "the guy" ... you now have 2 likely early-mid 1st round picks to get aggressive on your QB, regardless of who your HC is in 2023. You can let the 2 QBs battle it out, and potentially eventually trade the 2nd rounder should they be deemed to hold value. Edited January 28, 2022 by JamesMadisonSkins 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 1 minute ago, wit33 said: What’s wrong with Lamar? He's a running QB who has declined every year since his one great season as teams got better at game planning for him. This season he barely had more TD passes than interceptions. If you trade 3 1st round picks for a QB, he better be an elite passer and not a running back who's a mediocre passer. I know you apparently think the dude is HoF bound, but so far his trajectory doesn't look even close to it. Unless he suddenly rebounds and starts dominating again, he'll just join the line of running QBs who briefly had huge success but then quickly came back down to reality. Just say no to running QBs. They aren't a long term answer at all, and giving up 3 1sts for one (who has already started to decline significantly in production) would be the height of absurdity. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesMadisonSkins Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 (edited) @mistertim Through the first 6-7 weeks of the season Lamar was on his insane MVP-like run before he tailed a bit then got hurt. I am not saying he should get what Watson gets (Watson being a more prolific passer) but Lamar was absolutely balling out this year. He's insanely dynamic, and if we had him on our team next year we'd be a favorite in the NFC, hands down. I had him this year in fantasy so I watched a lot of Ravens games. He makes the game must-watch TV and he ended up falling apart toward the end of the year before getting hurt because their OL was atrocious and they had no running game outside of Lamar. It was painful to watch, yet he somehow continued making play after play. He was a one-man offense. Again, no run game. And Alejandro Villanueva was his starting LT because they traded Orlando Brown and lost Ronnie Stanley for the year. Edited January 28, 2022 by JamesMadisonSkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 1 hour ago, mistertim said: Vet min + incentives Sign Crazy Monkey now. Actually, let’s have a team of 12 Monkeys to celebrate the new name; the Monkeys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 6 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said: @mistertim Through the first 6-7 weeks of the season Lamar was on his insane MVP-like run before he tailed a bit then got hurt. I am not saying he should get what Watson gets (Watson being a more prolific passer) but Lamar was absolutely balling out this year. He's insanely dynamic, and if we had him on our team next year we'd be a favorite in the NFC, hands down. I had him this year in fantasy so I watched a lot of Ravens games. He makes the game must-watch TV and he ended up falling apart toward the end of the year before getting hurt because their OL was atrocious and they had no running game outside of Lamar. It was painful to watch, yet he somehow continued making play after play. He was a one-man offense. MVP level? In his first 7 games he threw for 10 TDs and 5 INTs with 2 rushing TDs. And the only reason he even had that many passing TDs is because of 1 game where he threw for 4 of them. Outside of that game he never passed for more than 1 TD per game. And it's not like he was running for a bunch either. Contrast that with an actual elite QB's numbers like Mahomes, Allen, Rodgers, etc. The idea that putting up that kind of production would put him in MVP territory his laughable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wit33 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 21 minutes ago, mistertim said: He's a running QB who has declined every year since his one great season as teams got better at game planning for him. This season he barely had more TD passes than interceptions. If you trade 3 1st round picks for a QB, he better be an elite passer and not a running back who's a mediocre passer. I know you apparently think the dude is HoF bound, but so far his trajectory doesn't look even close to it. Unless he suddenly rebounds and starts dominating again, he'll just join the line of running QBs who briefly had huge success but then quickly came back down to reality. Just say no to running QBs. They aren't a long term answer at all, and giving up 3 1sts for one (who has already started to decline significantly in production) would be the height of absurdity. 4 minutes ago, mistertim said: MVP level? In his first 7 games he threw for 10 TDs and 5 INTs with 2 rushing TDs. And the only reason he even had that many passing TDs is because of 1 game where he threw for 4 of them. Outside of that game he never passed for more than 1 TD per game. And it's not like he was running for a bunch either. Contrast that with an actual elite QB's numbers like Mahomes, Allen, Rodgers, etc. The idea that putting up that kind of production would put him in MVP territory his laughable. The plight of being an athletic QB is arduous. Yes, he was in the MVP discussion (again) in the first half of the season due to his overall impact game to game. It’s archaic to just look at passing numbers and specifically point out Passing TDs and Ints. What year are we in lol. You’re choosing to completely ignore his rushing and the impact this has game to game. Not just his individual statistics, but also other runners. The Ravens we’re decimated by injuries and Jackson was keeping them afloat single handedly at times (In his way- Running and inconsistent passing leading the way). This seems more like a philosophical discussion in regards to the running QB. You appear not to value the dual threat type QB that Jackson is. Who am I to argue that. I will argue that’s it not a right or wrong discussion though. His first four years have been historic in every way and yes, at this point, he’s trending towards the hall of fame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesMadisonSkins Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, wit33 said: This seems more like a philosophical discussion in regards to the running QB. You appear not to value the dual threat type QB that Jackson is. Who am I to argue that. I will argue that’s it not a right or wrong discussion though. His first four years have been historic in every way and yes, at this point, he’s trending towards the hall of fame. Looking at the box score doesn't tell the whole story with Lamar. He won games and kept them in games against top-flight opponents and defenses that they had no business being in. He had Hollywood Brown, Mark Andrews ... a patchwork OL ... and RBs of Ty'Son Williams, Latavius Murray, and Devonta Freeman. Their 1st round pick Rashod Bateman didn't see the field for the first few weeks either. He took entirely too many sakcs this year, but he was also constantly under pressure. Their OL was pretty bad. Plugging him into our offense ... I think we'd be instantly a Top 5-10 offense much like we'd be if we added Watson, and probably Wilson. Edited January 28, 2022 by JamesMadisonSkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExoDus84 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 I wonder if Matt Ryan is an option this offseason. Falcons are going through a rebuild. I think Arthur Smith has come out and said Ryan will be the QB in 2022, but they don't have a lot of cap room, and he's coming to the end of his contract. The falcons would have to eat $40M in dead cap, but for a good draft haul, it would probably be worth it for a rebuilding roster. On our end, Ryan would cost roughly $20M per year for the next 2 years. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 2 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said: Looking at the box score doesn't tell the whole story with Lamar. He won games and kept them in games against top-flight opponents and defenses that they had no business being in. He had Hollywood Brown, Mark Andrews ... a patchwork OL ... and RBs of Ty'Son Williams, Latavius Murray, and Devonta Freeman. Their 1st round pick Rashod Bateman didn't see the field for the first few weeks either. He took entirely too many sakcs this year, but he was also constantly under pressure. Their OL was pretty bad. Plugging him into our offense ... I think we'd be instantly a Top 5-10 offense much like we'd be if we added Watson, and probably Wilson. I vehemently disagree. Lamar is good because Baltimore has the offense to sustain it. He excels in a specific offense. Coming here and asking him to run our offense is asking for a disaster. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 (edited) 14 minutes ago, wit33 said: The plight of being an athletic QB is arduous. Yes, he was in the MVP discussion (again) in the first half of the season due to his overall impact game to game. It’s archaic to just look at passing numbers and specifically point out Passing TDs and Ints. What year are we in lol. You’re choosing to completely ignore his rushing and the impact this has game to game. Not just his individual statistics, but also other runners. The Ravens we’re decimated by injuries and Jackson was keeping them afloat single handedly at times (In his way- Running and inconsistent passing leading the way). This seems more like a philosophical discussion in regards to the running QB. You appear not to value the dual threat type QB that Jackson is. Who am I to argue that. I will argue that’s it not a right or wrong discussion though. His first four years have been historic in every way and yes, at this point, he’s trending towards the hall of fame. Again, I'm not talking about being an athletic QB. I'm talking about being a running QB. Guys like Mahomes, Allen, Watson, Rodgers, Murray, Wilson are athletic QBs who can make things happen and scramble when things break down. Jackson is a completely different thing than that. He's a running QB who's only a marginal passer. Sure, Jackson's running had an effect on the team. But he's not in the same category as the guys I mentioned above. And IMO you also have to take into account history and longevity. There's no history of continued success for running QBs. Cam was marginally successful but only really put it together for 1 year (which also seems common for running QBs). And there's no way a running QB is going to last anywhere near as long as an elite passing QB who can also run. I have no interest in running QBs. They tend to be one hit wonders, their longevity is questionable at best, and they only tend to be mediocre passers. If you want to call it a "philosophical difference" that's fine. The label doesn't really matter to me. But I have no interest in that kind of QB, and from what I've read in his interviews, Turner probably doesn't either. He definitely wants an athletic QB, but he also stressed that passing comes first. Edited January 28, 2022 by mistertim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins 2021 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, JamesMadisonSkins said: Hypothetically - what would the cost be for Lamar Jackson? I know a lot of the talk out there is crazy internet rumors, but there had been some talk last year about whether the Ravens might consider moving Jackson since it doesn't exactly fit their motto to pay a lot of money for a QB. They do have Huntley ... and they might think Huntley + a draft pick might be the best way to hit rebuild. But I just don't know if that's a reality. But let's say that it is? Probably similar costs to Watson right? 3 1sts and some players? I like Jackson alot I think it would be 2 to 3 first round picks but I don't know. I doubt he would be traded. He would be a really good QB for are team. Huntley would cost more then he is worth. He is ok but he is cheap so it would take alot to get him. Edited January 28, 2022 by Redskins 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 This entire debate is moot anyway. There's no reason to think the Ravens are going to trade Jackson, so probably not worth wasting any more time arguing about it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 Get a winning QB for a decade, nobody ultimately gives a **** what’s it costs. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins 2021 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 (edited) If we have to go place holder Qb how would you want to go Trubisky Winston Marrota Bridgewater Dalton I guess if we go that way it would be Trubisky. He has the most potential of the bunch. Edited January 28, 2022 by Redskins 2021 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 (edited) 44 minutes ago, Redskins 2021 said: If we have to go place holder Qb how would you want Trubisky Winston Marrota Bridgewater Dalton I guess we go that way it would be Trubisky. It was a topic on Sheehan's show today, he discussed it with Standig. He liked Mariota as did I best, Trubisky next as do I as well. Trubisky to me is a full peg below Mariota. IMO Trubisky is more or less Daniel Jones. He has Heinicke's handicaps as far as his accuracy. But he does have a much stronger arm and more mobility. Mariota to me has decent accuracy, even more mobility than Trubisky and a better arm than Heinicke. His issue is staying healthy. Standig said if they went with Trubisky they'd have to endure much whining from fans until the draft -- he said based on that he thought maybe they'd go with Willis in the draft because he'd bring some excitement/juice perhaps. Edited January 28, 2022 by Skinsinparadise 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 45 minutes ago, Redskins 2021 said: If we have to go place holder Qb how would you want to go Trubisky Winston Marrota Bridgewater Dalton I guess if we go that way it would be Trubisky. He has the most potential of the bunch. If pressed, Mariota. Ron really likes Trubisky apparently so there is that. Not sure a place holder is a way I would go at all. I’d probably pay TH and Kyle Allen next to nothing to tank in 2022 before I paid a placeholder 10mil plus per year to go 7-10. Bridgewater is looking for 20-25mil per year. Placeholder ? **** or bust for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 2 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koolblue13 Posted January 28, 2022 Author Share Posted January 28, 2022 2 hours ago, Redskins 2021 said: I like Jackson alot I think it would be 2 to 3 first round picks but I don't know. I doubt he would be traded. He would be a really good QB for are team. Huntley would cost more then he is worth. He is ok but he is cheap so it would take alot to get him. Why stop at Lamar? Why not go after Burrow or Herbert or Allen? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zim489 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 3 hours ago, wit33 said: What’s wrong with Lamar? He rarely can throw them to victory when the team needs him to. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wit33 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 7 minutes ago, Zim489 said: He rarely can throw them to victory when the team needs him to. This isn’t completely true, but yes, he struggles in 3rd and medium to long situations. He operates in a different lane than what everyone is romantic with at the QB spot. He’s experienced great individual and team success early in his career, but some choose to focus on only his shortcomings, because it doesn’t fit the model they are comfortable with or prefer. It appears philosophically you dislike the style in which Jackson gets it done, because there’s no denying the results by most football metrics. No doubt the Ravens hope he makes strides as a passer though. He seems like a dedicated dude from afar, I expect to make progress in the pass game. 56 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said: No way he comes here everyone said lol. If made available, Washington will be in the running. Too much to like not to. I’m not the biggest Russel Wilson guy, but not crazy enough to say I wouldn’t want him. Somewhat worried he’s becoming less willing to be a runner and wanting to dictate too much on how to do things. Also, he hasn’t proven to be an elite paid guy and produce in the playoffs, but he usually gets there, which is significant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redskin301 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 58 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said: That would be amazing I feel like our team Can be like the 2012-14 Seahawks If our defense gets it together Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HigSkin Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said: Whoot, whoot, that's what I'm talking about!!! Driving that bandwagon for Russell Wilson baby...LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jericho Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 Although Wilson SHOULD be better, there's something about trading for another QB heading into his age 34 season after doing it for Alex Smith, Donovan McNabb, and Mark Brunell. Just repeating the same story over and over. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinny21 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 14 minutes ago, Jericho said: Although Wilson SHOULD be better, there's something about trading for another QB heading into his age 34 season after doing it for Alex Smith, Donovan McNabb, and Mark Brunell. Just repeating the same story over and over. I feel you. Not that I’d turn my nose up at Wilson, he’d be a great addition, but I’d really like to find our own young guy that can play 10 years for us at a high level, not to mention 4-5 years on a rookie contract. On a semi-related note, I was thinking about the qbs that changed teams in recent times that had great success - Brees, Brady and Manning. The two established ones were (IIRC) essentially given tons of license with their offenses, which really makes me wonder what happens when/if Rodgers or Wilson go to a new team… specifically one with a very different system than they’re used to. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chump Bailey Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 3 hours ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said: Bridgewater is looking for 20-25mil per year. Placeholder ? **** or bust for me. Anyone that doles out that amount of coin for TB is nuts IMO. I hope that's not accurate. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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