Starting QB 2019???

[Poindexter]

12 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

He did say they have interest still.  He believes they won't give up a first.  They don't want to give up multiple picks in this draft but are open to give up another pick in next year's draft.  Keim in a podcast implied they like but don't love Rosen and aren't pining for him but if they can get a good deal for him they'd go for it. 

 

I've said this on another thread, the Redskins have done a nice job of putting just about every scenario out there where it's really confusing as to QB.  The Giants, ditto.  Depending on whose talking they either like QB X or don't.  They really really want to take a QB at 15 or they really don't.  They would trade up for a QB or pass up on a QB who lands at 15 to accrue picks. 

 

Case in point.  I watched Friday's version of NFL Live where Diane Russini said she's heard the Redskins love Haskins.  Then you got Craig Hoffman who says they don't love any QB in the first round sans Murray.   Finlay says they like Lock.  Keim and Hoffman say they don't.  Keim said they'd consider taking a QB at 15 suggesting Jones or Haskins if they fall.  Hoffman says they won't.  Jay supposedly isn't a fan of Haskins.  But Doug supposedly does like Haskins.  Finlay thinks they'd consider trading up for Murray if they have an opportunity. Hoffman says no way.

 

My point is I don't really know what to make of any of it.  There is a counter argument to every argument.  Way different than last year before the draft where we heard a lot about them liking Payne and Guice among others.  The pre-chatter talk before this draft is confusing as heck as to QBs.    As for WRs that seems more consistent -- multiple reporters say they like Marquise Brown.   Hoffman thinks they also like N'Keal Harry. 

I think there's a lot of truth to what we are hearing.  Jay likes mobile QBs for his variation of the West Coast offense.  I look back to his time with the Bengals; Jay had to deal with Carson Palmer who is like a Dwayne Haskins clone during his first stint as an OC....the next year Carson is done and they bring in a mobile and accurate passer in Andy Dalton.

 

It's Drew Lock or nothing IMO.  If Lock isn't available I think we wait until next year to draft a QB.  Lock has amazing arm talent, confidence, and his lack of footwork can certainly be coached up.  But like you stated, the Skins have not given any indication on who they will draft.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

4 hours ago, Jericho said:

 

Unless you get into the pre-Super Bowl era picks, what's the high water mark here? Mark Rypien? He had the one really great season and QB'd a Super Bowl win. but outside of that year, his career was neither long nor particularly successful.

 

 

 

In terms of helping lead the team to success, it would be Theismann.

[Skinsinparadise]

This logic from Finlay about taking Daniel Jones IMO is a bit warped.    He's making the case more or less that he likes Alex Smith for a team in win now mode.  He isn't sexy as a player and doesn't have elite skills but if you want to win grind it out close games he's the dude.

 

The thing that escapes some from what I observed about Daniel Jones is you'd think because of all of his conservative short throws and unwillingness to throw into tight windows that he is really good at avoiding turnovers.  But the reality is he has his share of turnovers.  And not just interceptions.  He led the draft eligible QBs in fumbles.   He takes a lot of sacks.  Lot of tipped balls.  Yes he's conservative.  But he's also one of the more turnover prone QBs in this draft.  And this happens with the one of the lowest YPA's in college.  Imagine if the dude starts flinging it a little.   

 

https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/redskins/why-daniel-jones-might-make-sense-if-redskins-truly-believe-theyre-close

The Duke quarterback does nothing that screams first-round pick. His combine numbers were good and his game film seems good. At the same time, there aren’t any real knocks against him either, other than Jones doesn’t have the super star potential the other three have shown. 

Jones isn’t a sexy pick. He’s not even a PG13 make-out scene pick. 

And that might be just what the Redskins want. 

For months, the Washington front office has repeatedly talked about being “close.” Close to what remains a question, but it must at least mean competing for the NFC East title and winning a playoff game. 

Well, of all the rookie passers, Jones might be the one that presents the least risk. He might not make jaw dropping deep throws or electric moves outside of the pocket, but he probably won’t throw 20-plus interceptions either. 

Last year, the Redskins traded for Alex Smith to run their offense. Smith’s best traits are controlling the football and making the smart, not sexy, play. 

You know what rookie could fit that mold? 

Certainly isn’t Murray. Probably isn’t Lock. And Haskins likely needs to sit a year to learn NFL offenses. 

Jones, however, has been playing in a pro system for years at Duke. He’s been coached by the Manning-Whisperer in David Cutcliffe. 

Veteran NFL personnel executives believe in Jones in a major way. Gil Brandt, a Hall of Fame former Cowboys GM, compared Jones to Peyton Manning. Seriously.

"When you watch him and you go back (20) years and watch Peyton Manning, you are watching the same guy. He's athletic," Brandt said on an SiriusXM pre-draft conference call. "He doesn't have a rocket for an arm, but neither did Peyton. Very smart."

ESPN's Mel Kiper believes Jones will be the best QB in this draft. Former Redskins GM Charley Casserly thinks Jones is the most ready for the NFL of any 2019 passer.

Add all of that up, and the Redskins taking Jones with the 15th overall pick starts to make sense. Then go back and listen to some Jay Gruden quotes, and it makes even more sense. 

Speaking at the NFL League Meetings in Arizona last month, Redskins head coach Jay Gruden explained that he likes winning low-scoring, grinding football games. 

[Jericho]

4 hours ago, Califan007 said:

 

In terms of helping lead the team to success, it would be Theismann.

 

But the team didn't draft Theismann either. If you're look at just draft picks, what's the best QB the team picked in the last 50 years?

[HigSkin]

38 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

This logic from Finlay about taking Daniel Jones IMO is a bit warped.    He's making the case more or less that he likes Alex Smith for a team in win now mode.  He isn't sexy as a player and doesn't have elite skills but if you want to win grind it out close games he's the dude.

 

The thing that escapes some from what I observed about Daniel Jones is you'd think because of all of his conservative short throws and unwillingness to throw into tight windows that he is really good at avoiding turnovers.  But the reality is he has his share of turnovers.  And not just interceptions.  He led the draft eligible QBs in fumbles.   He takes a lot of sacks.  Lot of tipped balls.  Yes he's conservative.  But he's also one of the more turnover prone QBs in this draft.  And this happens with the one of the lowest YPA's in college.  Imagine if the dude starts flinging it a little.   

 

https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/redskins/why-daniel-jones-might-make-sense-if-redskins-truly-believe-theyre-close

 

 

 

Sheesh, not a fan of Jones but gonna trust the Skins scouting/coaches on this one.  Hearing more and more chatter about Jones to Skins, i.e. Casserly says the dude is a Brad Johnson, Trent Green or Kurt Warner - not strong arm but super smart and great game tape....okay.  LOL  This Jones stuff to Skins started earlier in the year so there must be something people are hearing.

 

From January....

https://www.redskins.com/news/2019-mock-drafts-daniel-jones-to-the-redskins 

[Skinsinparadise]

8 minutes ago, HigSkin said:

 

 

Sheesh, not a fan of Jones but gonna trust the Skins scouting/coaches on this one.  Hearing more and more chatter about Jones to Skins, i.e. Casserly says the dude is a Brad Johnson, Trent Green or Kurt Warner - not strong arm but super smart and great game tape....okay.  LOL  However, this Jones stuff to Skins started earlier in the year so there must be something people are hearing.

 

From January....

https://www.redskins.com/news/2019-mock-drafts-daniel-jones-to-the-redskins 

 

I don't take Casserly even a little seriously on Jones after hearing him tout him early in the process while admitting he hasn't watched him much, yet.  He clearly is in love with the Cutcliffe narrative.

 

This organization isn't exactly the shining beacon of the NFL as to getting the QB position right.  I'd say we along with Cleveland and the Lions might actually warrant a 30-30 special as being the 3 worst franchises historically of botching the QB position in every form, trades, draft, FA. 

 

If its really Jay calling the shots at QB which I wonder (not saying he isn't but it doesn't seem crazy that someone else's voice looms larger) about, I'd take that ride.  But if I hear later it was Doug or Dan or Bruce falling in love with whomever QB, then I'll be skeptical and cynical.   This team hasn't earned the status of if you got some doubts at a QB selection be at ease since its the Redskins making the call -- so you know its likely going to be just fine.  😀 

 

Yep I am aware, I think most of us are, the links to Daniel Jones from the outset.  It's part of the reason why there has been so much angst for such a long time on the board about the dude. 😀

 

[Skinsinparadise]

from Peter King today

 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/04/22/nfl-mock-draft-fmia-peter-king/?cid=fmiatw

...So I believe the Cardinals, should they—as I suspect—choose Kyler Murray number one overall, will be inclined to make the best deal they can for the quarterback they picked last year 10th overall, Josh Rosen. It’s easy to say Rosen’s a big boy and he’s going to have to get over the biggest snub job in recent NFL history. But he heard Kliff Kingsbury take the job and say on several occasions, Josh is our quarterback, or words to that effect. Now you draft a guy number one overall and asked Rosen to be a good soldier and carry the clipboard and help Kyler Murray win games for the team that misled him about being the quarterback under the new coach? Awkward.

I don’t know how the draft is going to fall, but if Miami or Washington or the Giants do not draft a quarterback high in the draft, what seems fair to me is offering a third-rounder (78th overall by Miami, 95th overall by the Giants, 96th overall by Washington) to Arizona for Rosen. And Arizona, I’m assuming, would strongly consider doing the best deal it could at that point.

I’d be really interested if I were Miami. Imagine trading the 78th pick and having a year to see if Rosen has a chance to be the long-term guy. If the Dolphins are unconvinced at the end of 2019, they could use a first-round pick (plus other draft capital if need be) to draft the quarterback of the long-term future in a year when the quarterback crop is better than this year.

 

 

 

Who knows if true but for entertainment purposes

 

 

 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Neither dude below is an insider.  The dude SteveDraft months ago decided to pretend that him piecing together tea leaves is actually the FO really talking to him -- and its funny that he's sticking with the ruse even though he's been exposed multiple times of late.  However, the tea leaves does feel a little bit this way if they take Haskins.  We got Sheehan saying he knows Jay doesn't like Haskins.  We got multiple reporters saying Jay would prefer not to go QB in round 1.  We got Jay himself saying he wants a player who can hit the ground running this year.  We also got Jay specifically calling out Haskins as a player he doesn't think is ready to hit the ground running.  

 

The thing is if it does goes down we will never know because Jay is good at playing the company man when he has to.  And I don't fault him for that, it's what you got to do to survive.

 

 

 

 

Schefter isn't perfect but he's the closest typically as for being on the money

 

 

 

[HardcoreZorn]

What would everyone prefer? Override Jay but secure what the FO believes to be the QBOTF (Haskins in this case). Or Jay is allowed to roll with colt/case and we draft an impact player elsewhere? 

 

Pretty torn. But if they think he has the goods and Jay doesn’t want him bc he’s not going to step in week 1 as the starter so we pass on him, I think that’s more dentrimental than potentially overriding the HC on who to draft. 

[bowhunter]

If we ended up with Rosen, would/should we keep 3 QBs on the roster? Both Case and Colt are on 1 year contracts are leave nothing for future development.. But then again we seem to be good friends with the injury bug.

[Skinsinparadise]

10 minutes ago, HardcoreZorn said:

What would everyone prefer? Override Jay but secure what the FO believes to be the QBOTF (Haskins in this case). Or Jay is allowed to roll with colt/case and we draft an impact player elsewhere? 

 

Pretty torn. But if they think he has the goods and Jay doesn’t want him bc he’s not going to step in week 1 as the starter so we pass on him, I think that’s more dentrimental than potentially overriding the HC on who to draft. 

 

Depends on who made the call.  If it's Kyle Smith doing it, i'll ride with him.  I want the top football mind making the top football call.  Personally I think Jay is the 2nd top football mind -- so I trust him 2nd most.

 

If its Doug, I'd trust Jay over him.  if its Dan, I definitely don't trust him.  In a way I've defended Dan (and even took some arrows for him on the FO thread) on one point which I do believe that he's not that involved anymore with personnel.  Having said that, I do believe his soft spot to interfere is historically the Qb position.  And that still is the one position where I don't fully believe that he can keep his hands off the wheel.

 

Having said all of that, this is the highmost BS portion of the draft typically -- draft week.  That's why I say on some of these posts from insider types -- they can be completely wrong but I'll post for entertainment purposes.   I do believe these guys believe in what they are saying but this is the season where leaks are given to them purposely to mislead. 

 

 

[HardcoreZorn]

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Depends on who made the call.  If it's Kyle Smith doing it, i'll ride with him.  I want the top football mind making the top football call.  Personally I think Jay is the 2nd top football mind -- so I trust him 2nd most.

 

If its Doug, I'd trust Jay over him.  if its Dan, I definitely don't trust him.  In a way I've defended Dan (and even took some arrows for him on the FO thread) on one point which I do believe that he's not that involved anymore with personnel.  Having said that, I do believe his soft spot to interfere is historically the Qb position.  And that still is the one position where I don't fully believe that he can keep his hands off the wheel.

 

Having said all of that, this is the BS season of the draft.  That's why I even say on some of these posts from insider types -- they can be completely wrong but I'll post for entertainment purposes.   I do believe these guys believe in what they are saying but this is the season where leaks are done to them purposely to mislead. 

 

 

Personally I think it makes too much sense to add an impact player elsewhere and roll with Colt/Case. I have to think that’s Jay’s mindset as well. However I have zero doubt that Snyder is less than enthused to market to the STH the case and Keenum show and I’m sure that’s where some of the disagreement lies. Like you said, I would really hope this was a Kyle Smith/scouring decision and not a hailmary to put butts back in seats.

[Skin'emAlive]

So the plan is to draft Jones because there is low expectations for him to be good? Get real

[Skinsinparadise]

7 minutes ago, HardcoreZorn said:

Personally I think it makes too much sense to add an impact player elsewhere and roll with Colt/Case. I have to think that’s Jay’s mindset as well. However I have zero doubt that Snyder is less than enthused to market to the STH the case and Keenum show and I’m sure that’s where some of the disagreement lies. Like you said, I would really hope this was a Kyle Smith/scouring decision and not a hailmary to put butts back in seats.

 

Yeah agree with all of this.   I get they are in a quandary where they are trying to sell some excitement and might be feeling desperate to do something.    But if it were me I'd take my medicine and risk the fan apathy.  Don't force a pick especially at QB.   Worse case, they'd have a fairly stacked roster to set up for a good QB draft in 2020.   And if they are moving on to another coach, GM or whatever in that case it would be a more attractive destination.  

 

I go back and forth on it myself but when I settle down, I am cool with taking no QBs in this draft.   In the mix of the rumors, there is plenty I hear that I like, too.  I just watched Doug's presser and he said that they are more likely to trade down than trade up.  I liked hearing that.  If that's what they are thinking in the FO then I hope they ride with that thought. 

 

Looks like Montez Sweat might be falling and there are other prospects I like that might end up in the low 20s.  I am totally cool with trading down.  I am also OK with staying pat if they love someone at 15.  It's a good draft as for matching weaknesses to the depth in this draft.  You got some good possibilities at Edge, WR, FS, TE., OG    If they trade down and end up with 5 picks in the top 3 rounds they can have a killer draft.  It's another reason why I don't want to trade up in the draft for a QB -- I think the opportunity cost is high if they did that. 

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

 

Specifically, that begins with Kyler Murray being the first-overall pick of the Arizona Cardinals. I don't believe this has been in question, truly, since Kliff Kingsbury was hired and especially since the combine, when Murray measured a tick or two higher than many anticipated. I'm not buying there is any doubt or uncertainty to this process, and I fully expect it to lead where everyone who has been sniffing around on it has expected it to lead for months. (As for Josh Rosen, I keep coming back to the Bengals – clearly renting Andy Dalton year-to-year at this point – as being a great Day 2 trade partner for the Cardinals. Rosen would basically be cheaper than a QB drafted in the second round at this point, with his signing bonus already paid, and he's a year older and more mature than these 2019 prospects. The Chargers would be a good fit, as well).

 

...Dan Snyder has known of Haskins since the QB's high school days, and I continue to hear that a move up to third overall with the Jets is hardly out of the question. Sure, maybe there is some scenario where Haskins is there at pick 15, but the Jets are highly motivated sellers – they could still land a promising pass rusher in the middle of the first round – and the Skins going into the season with Case Keenum and Colt McCoy as the options at QB seems ludicrous. No team has a more glaring need at the most important position in football, and they've traded future draft capital plenty of times in the past. I see Haskins in Washington, one way or the other.

[redskinss]

So if you don't want to read this whole thread I'll summarize it for you.

We've pretty much ruled out Tom Brady and Betty white for next year but all others are still in play.

 

And we're not positive on white either I heard they may bring her in for a workout after the draft.

[carex]

If Gruden is on as hot a seat as people think doesn't the decrease the likelihood we go QB in the draft with the Cards showing the reason why?

[bakedtater1]

No kiddin huh..Dwayne Haskins?....ugghhh personally I hope not..I'd rather go edge or wr or ol...nahhh there not gonna go qb at 15..no way it happens.

[skins2victory]

-Doug said today that a trade down would be much more likely than a trade up. I for one sure hope this is true.

 

-Trading up for Haskins sounds like a terrible idea to me. But trading up to the number 3 spot of the Jets, which some are rumoring would cost the house and then some. I can't think of a much worse way to spend Thursday night watching that poop show.

[bakedtater1]

Oh dear gods the skins better not trade up to 3 and trade away a bunch of stuff... Unacceptable!

[Malapropismic Depository]

2 minutes ago, bakedtater1 said:

Oh dear gods the skins better not trade up to 3 and trade away a bunch of stuff... Unacceptable!

 

Not only is that a bad idea, but I don't see them doing that.

For the same exact reason they were careful not to overpay Cousins.

They realize this team is not built to win if they put most of their stock in the QB position, no matter how good he is.

9 minutes ago, skins2victory said:

-Doug said today that a trade down would be much more likely than a trade up. I for one sure hope this is true.

 

-Trading up for Haskins sounds like a terrible idea to me. But trading up to the number 3 spot of the Jets, which some are rumoring would cost the house and then some. I can't think of a much worse way to spend Thursday night watching that poop show.

 

Take everything with a grain of salt, that you hear a Front Office say BEFORE the draft.

[carex]

Is it me or do draft rumors seem to cycle back to where they started?  I mean for the past few weeks Haskins wasn't even going to be the second QB drafted and now someone might trade up to 3 to get him?  And what happened to Drew Lock?  I suppose the Skins were never really connected to him, like Haskins and Jones but people act like the only QBs out there are ones we might be interested in so we have to jump up to grab them

[actorguy1]

Final Take: Murray, Haksins, Lock or Rosen or wait until late 5th or 6th round pick for QB

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

9 hours ago, HardcoreZorn said:

What would everyone prefer? Override Jay but secure what the FO believes to be the QBOTF (Haskins in this case). Or Jay is allowed to roll with colt/case and we draft an impact player elsewhere? 

 

Pretty torn. But if they think he has the goods and Jay doesn’t want him bc he’s not going to step in week 1 as the starter so we pass on him, I think that’s more dentrimental than potentially overriding the HC on who to draft. 

 

 

Generally, I'd want my HC to pick his QB but I can't stand Jay so yeah, override his lameduck butt.

 

PS: Jay thinks/thought Colt was really good. Not exactly the person I want evaluating QBs.