BatteredFanSyndrome Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 4 hours ago, Lombardi's_kid_brother said: That's really insightful. But I won't to build on this. You know what other fan base is exactly like this. EVERY ****ING SINGLE ONE OF THEM. Thank you. You made an excellent point. Except other fan bases don’t bring in 1 HOF coach and a fringe HOFer and still get less than desirable results like they do here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kleese Posted October 19, 2018 Author Share Posted October 19, 2018 8 hours ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: Holy ****, I think we may have been separated at birth. The 3 hours of a Redskins game are so excruciating for me. I do much of what you just described. I assume the worst, I complain, I pace, and I'm constantly nervous. I probably lose 3-4 pounds during a Redskins game (during the competitive aspect of a season). But somehow I look forward to that feeling! It reminds me of Fever Pitch...something Jimmy Fallon said in that movie: It's good for your soul to invest in something you can't control. This is a great, great quote. When it all boils down to it, I’m so deep into my sports teams simply because I love to compete. Playing in the NFL wasn’t in the cards for me (although when I was all-time QB during our neighborhood football games I thought I was on my way), so attaching myself to a team was the closest I could get. I like to have something on the line. I like to bet on games (rarely bet on my teams though). I like to have silly little competitions with my friends and family, etc. What’s on the line for me with my teams is my own emotions. I know that my day/week/season will be better when they win and worse when they lose. So I have something VERY important on the line. I figure if I ever lose that— if I ever stop having that on the line then what’s the point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickyJ Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 26 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: Except other fan bases don’t bring in 1 HOF coach and a fringe HOFer and still get less than desirable results like they do here. Which Hall of Fame coaches are you thinking of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 Just now, NickyJ said: Which Hall of Fame coaches are you thinking of? Huh? Gibbs and obviously the fringe HOF would be Shanny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickyJ Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 1 minute ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: Huh? Gibbs and obviously the fringe HOF would be Shanny. Gibbs was a decade behind the ball, but still managed to keep up because he's Gibbs. Shanny was an awesome Terrell Davis and John Elway coach. Hall of Fame, not so much. That and the whole being a terrible GM thing that ruined him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 8 minutes ago, NickyJ said: Gibbs was a decade behind the ball, but still managed to keep up because he's Gibbs. Shanny was an awesome Terrell Davis and John Elway coach. Hall of Fame, not so much. That and the whole being a terrible GM thing that ruined him. Both were also employed here where strengths dry up and weaknesses become more glaring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 I think a big part of the problem is the Scot departure and the Kirk botched contract -- and Bruce's dumb public statements -- that all didn't happen 15 years ago or during the Vinny era. It's been the last 1-3 years. So the idea that this whole new leaf is turned and people are sulking about the past is a bit silly IMO. I know some think that neither the Scot situation or Kirk deserves to be an issue but that's a vocal minority -- judging by call in shows and polls. The dysfunction is felt loud and clear by anyone bothered by that stuff. I've actually heard people call in to talk shows saying they gave up their season tickets for those specific reasons. So the idea that the fan base has been beaten down but that's about stuff from years ago that they can't simply get over and ever since its been going good with just some minor hiccups -- I think is a misperceptiion. It's not hard to notice that to many fans the Scot-Kirk stuff wasn't just small potatoes but instead loud reminders about perceived dysfunction. Steinberg I think is a good read on this stuff, he's talked about his comment section over the years and got into the history and he cites the Scot-Kirk stuff as big time issues and high up there on the list of fan gripes over the Dan years. Heck even Chris Russell said that Dan still fumes about how Bruce handled the Scot departure. Is all of this so? Don't know. But its clear that plenty of fans are bothered by recent stuff as opposed to being hung up by the past. So again, I think the only thing that works is winning. If they are going to sell the dysfunction is in the past -- plenty I don't think are buying it. And I am not buying it myself. But just like the Jerry Jones situation if Jerry wants to say his unorthodox way of running a team works -- then he has to win to prove it. Dan unfortunately hasn't won to prove squat. If he finally turns that corner, I think he'd win people over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickyJ Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 13 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: Both were also employed here where strengths dry up and weaknesses become more glaring. Both were employed long after their heydays. Like I said earlier, Gibbs was great but 10 years behind. Shanny bounced in Denver, not exactly hall of fame material after 2005. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hail2skins Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 Ed's thread here did the trick...…….I'm fired up! Dallas, we are going to beat you this Sunday, and the next time we see you on Thanksgiving, you'll be playing the 8-2 leader in the division. The Redskins are about to ride a hungry defense on a winning streak. Lets do this! PALOFFS ARE NOW!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 1 hour ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: Both were also employed here where strengths dry up and weaknesses become more glaring. They were brilliant coaches who were put in charges of personnel, and both were kind of terrible at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koala Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 I can proudly say that I havent watched a game since they fired Scott McCloughlan. The reason I say proud, is that I finally got over the whole rooting for a color-scheme-thing. And so I am mildly amused when someone comes along and tries to chastize me, saying that real fans are always there no matter what. I dunno as I get older, that seems so naive, so childish to me. Save that kind of loyalty for family, for humanity, for God, for something of real consequence -- not for a bunch of men playing a game. Im not knocking fandom as a concept completely -- I get the need for an escape. But for me, fandom comes with a caveat -- I have to be rooting for something. That means the team needs a discernable identity, something to root for, to tell kids, "you can learn something from the way these guys play." This team again has no identity. Plenty of identity in Gibbs I. Same in Gibbs II-- they werent always good, never the best team, but always the toughest and they always left it all on the field. That was something I could root for. That was a palpable indentity, that was real. Even 2012 with RGIII, their was a palpable identity. We were new, innovative, cutting edge, fast, and running almost a futuristic offense. Scott McCloughlan didnt have a chance to build a true identity, but I have a feeling he would have had he been allowed to stay. As of now, we have no identity. I challenge anyone to answer, what the **** exactly is our identity? Who are we? And if you cant answer that question, then what the hell exactly are you rooting for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgundy Yoda Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 18-18-1 in our last 37 We aren't bad by any means but this team is so average and inconsistent it feels almost as bad as our terrible stretch between 08-11. Now THAT was an awful time, but I can't say this is an overall night and day improvement over that span either because it isn't. We still have drama constantly, and still make head scratching personnel decisions just like always. This will follow us as long as Snyder is the owner, I can guarantee that. The guy cannot operate and run the team like a business like it should be ran. He should hire the right people that are knowledgable and simply let it operate itself. Just sit back and collect the cash, intervene only when necessary. It shouldn't be hard but he has no idea where to even start when it comes to hiring personnel, so literally every decision he makes is a massive risk and has big potential to backfire. Your optimism is great and I wish I shared it with you. Here's the thing though, we haven't won a playoff game in 13 years. Haven't had an 11 win season in 27 years. I stay medium about the team because they're average and the stats and recent history show that, shoot 18-18-1 shows me that's how I should be. The first sign of us fading during a game my initial move is to change the channel or do something else, I used to get upset but I'm past that stage. Against New Orleans when we didn't recover that fumble and McPhee jogged towards that loose ball ever so hesitantly like it was his mamas used bra, I knew it was over. We all should have at that point. Missed chances like that will kill your chances of winning the game. It's the main reason why the Patriots are so good, they do all the little things like that perfectly. Sometimes I feel like I'm more of a spectator than an actual fan when I watch the team and I used to get crazy excited about every little good thing they did. If we had multiple years of good drafts and good decisions being made for once the fans would have something to believe in. We've never had a truly good draft in the Snyder era. Not having a single draft in 20 years where you pull multiple stars from it is bad, now I know it's not incredibly common but it should at least happen once every 8-10 years where you get multiple REALLY good players from the same draft. 20 years of losing and the only constant is Danny. If he ever sells I will sing our fight song loud and proud all the way over here in Northern California. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HardcoreZorn Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 No one and I mean no one to my knowledge knows how the Scott thing went down exactly. The perceived dysfunction is actually for that very reason, we don’t actually know. Is it not possible we hired him, he’s totally on the sauce and is doing clownish things behind the scenes (not totally crazy with the whole Diana Russini situation, punching a wall and breaking his hand, etc.) and then disappears during the biggest part of a GM’s job? Look, I was a Scott fan and by no means a Scott hater, but how is it not somewhat obvious that was an extremely difficult situation to go about? Fire the guy out of thin air and try and sell the fan base he wasn’t doing a good job? Could have aired out his dirty laundry and been accused of dragging his name through the mud. They told a fib (grandma) because they knew how absurd it was for the GM of the team to be absent during the effing combine of all places. But they promised him full control over personnel and he didn’t have it! Believe it if you want, he had 99% control over shaping the roster. He was only struck down on minor roster decisions during cuts times and was told they weren’t going to negotiate with Kirk during the 2015 season and also presumably told Scott they weren’t going to trade him after 2016 which he was in favor of. Ironically, had Scott gotten his way this board would have gone up in flames for trading away a homegrown franchise QB in his prime. In hindsight, it’s exactly what they should have done, even though those stomping up and down for losing him for nothing would have done exactly what we tried to do, hold onto him and try and strike a deal. It’s so painfully obvious these are totally overblown, and it’s because “same old redskins” as I’ve tried to articulate many times. If you want to take those two things, claim it was the past 3 years therefore dysfunction is still running rampant, go ahead. But those two situations don’t hold a candle to how this franchise used to operate, and anyone who thinks otherwise spends entirely too much time listening to beat reporters who have about as much of clue as we do on these matters and has completely forgotten how embarrassingly incompetent we used to be in every facet. It’s literally like people forget how utterly incompetent 1999-2009 was. I think I’m going to go dig up some articles around that time, maybe that will conjure up some memories and put this damn Kirk/Scott stuff into context. Actually that reminds me, pre 2010 this team wouldn’t have dreamt of hiring a Scott Mc to run the draft. They didn’t even have any picks for anyone to run anything with for that matter. What a joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 Yeah, I mean why listen to what beat reporters have to say? All they are is around the team all year long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Kev Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 I couldn't agree more with the OP and think they nailed it with the self-loathing and whining comment. I understand people wanting to create a doom-and-gloom thread after a loss, it can make you feel better to let everyone else know what's wrong with the team (even though most already do know). But a doom-and-gloom thread created straight after a win?!? WTF. At least enjoy a win for a few days, there's not many of them in a year. Give the team some credit first for what they did right and then maybe analyse the game deeper with a "Yeah we won, but......" thread. It's not a case of being blindly optimistic or a Kool-Aid-gulping homer, it's just wanting your team to win, and enjoying it when they do. **** dallas, HTTR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 1 hour ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: Yeah, I mean why listen to what beat reporters have to say? All they are is around the team all year long. Also, you dont have to listen to beat reporters to read the comments they leaked to the Wp about Scot. You dont have to hear from beat reporters that Bruce has been a douche in the negotiations with Kirk, you can see it for yourself when he reads that inane press release. What other team does nonsense like that? Its part of the reason why the team is still a national laughing stock to some as to how they operate. Agents ranking Bruce as the least trustworthy GM in the league. On and on. It's not as if the optics have been good but we are convinced by people covering the team that it may look good but dont believe it. Instead its yeah the optics stink and there is more to it here is what they were told... Yes they keep their draft picks now. And no they don't stink. But that to me doesn't erase the stench that there is some dysfunction in that building. A vocal small group think it's all overplayed and things are on the right track. But they are clearly a minority as to the dysfunction is over. If I recall it was Galdi who has tracked fan sentiment over the years said recently Bruce might be the most reviled figure in DC sports history. I think that's hyperbole but I get the point. And I think it's funny how some of those people who defend the operation label themselves positive because a lot of them especially on twitter have a lot of anger as to how they make their points and engage. And I notice a lot of them turned on Jay after the NO game. Switching back to optimism, they have a chance to change the narrative that they are better than mediocre. Go win, that's a big deal. I think Dan and Bruce can be jerks and incompetent but I dont think either is evil. I've said many times Dan reminds me of Steinbrenner who also had the rep of being a jerk and incompetent but not evil. Steinbrenner later in life mellowed and won a lot. Hopefully Dan turns that corner. And I think it's possible. Will see. They win on Sunday and I expect a lot of happy campers. They make the playoffs ditto. To win back the casual fan to me the formula is simple. Win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightningBuggs Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 4 hours ago, Koala said: I can proudly say that I havent watched a game since they fired Scott McCloughlan. The reason I say proud, is that I finally got over the whole rooting for a color-scheme-thing. And so I am mildly amused when someone comes along and tries to chastize me, saying that real fans are always there no matter what. I dunno as I get older, that seems so naive, so childish to me. Save that kind of loyalty for family, for humanity, for God, for something of real consequence -- not for a bunch of men playing a game. Im not knocking fandom as a concept completely -- I get the need for an escape. But for me, fandom comes with a caveat -- I have to be rooting for something. That means the team needs a discernable identity, something to root for, to tell kids, "you can learn something from the way these guys play." This team again has no identity. Plenty of identity in Gibbs I. Same in Gibbs II-- they werent always good, never the best team, but always the toughest and they always left it all on the field. That was something I could root for. That was a palpable indentity, that was real. Even 2012 with RGIII, their was a palpable identity. We were new, innovative, cutting edge, fast, and running almost a futuristic offense. Scott McCloughlan didnt have a chance to build a true identity, but I have a feeling he would have had he been allowed to stay. As of now, we have no identity. I challenge anyone to answer, what the **** exactly is our identity? Who are we? And if you cant answer that question, then what the hell exactly are you rooting for? Couldn't have said it better myself. I've checked out on watching this team anymore. If I have absolutely nothing else to do, I'll tune in on Sundays. But even then, I don't have a rooting interest. More often than not, it's comedy relief for me. I agree that this team has no identity. And I'll add that it has no plan going forward. Every year they're in "Win Now" mode. And that gets them mediocrity at best every single year. My attachment to this franchise is at least temporarily gone. Maybe one day it will come back when I see a real plan in place. But I'm resigned to the fact that it's probably gone forever. And I'm fine with that. I should add here that I've been a Redskins fan since 1971. So for me this is giving up on something that I've held tightly for a long time. In my family I'm known as "THE Redskin fan". But no longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 5 minutes ago, London Kev said: It's not a case of being blindly optimistic or a Kool-Aid-gulping homer, it's just wanting your team to win, and enjoying it when they do. **** dallas, HTTR. That sounds good and all but this place has endless debate. I wouldn’t debate someone on whether or not to be happy the team wins. I don’t see anyone crying foul on fans for being happy about winning. What I see is debate around how all that does or doesn’t happen. The optimistic folks your talking about constantly enter debate with those who aren’t very optimistic and vice versa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Kev Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 18 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: That sounds good and all but this place has endless debate. I wouldn’t debate someone on whether or not to be happy the team wins. I don’t see anyone crying foul on fans for being happy about winning. What I see is debate around how all that does or doesn’t happen. The optimistic folks your talking about constantly enter debate with those who aren’t very optimistic and vice versa. You're right of course, it's not my place to try and tell people how they should feel. It just seems weird to me that some people don't seem to be able to (or want to) be happy even when the team wins. I mean this is a fan forum, so I would imagine that most of the posters here invest at least some of their time/money/emotion into following the team. If they can't be happy when the team wins then why are they here? It does annoy me that even after a win some people seem to want to be proved right (by confirming their prediction that we suck) rather than admit that they were wrong (because we actually won). I don't know, maybe I should learn to be more tolerant of other people's views, but I just can't..... BECAUSE I'M RIGHT GODDAMMIT!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 10 minutes ago, London Kev said: It does annoy me that even after a win some people seem to want to be proved right (by confirming their prediction that we suck) rather than admit that they were wrong (because we actually won). I don’t really get that. I’ve said time and time again that I’d be more than happy to be wrong. I don’t get paid for my opinion or my fandom nor does anyone else here. My wholistic view of this team is pessimistic. However I thought before the season started if everything shook our way for once, the team is good enough to make the playoffs. It kind of looks that way right now, as far as things breaking our way. The offense has been primarily terrible minus AP running it but the team is still 3-2 with what appears to be a very favorable schedule from here. But I’m under no illusion that that we will at any point in the next few seasons have a realistic shot to win it all for a number of reasons I’ve talked about before but I’ll spare you here. That’s where the apathy comes from. I hope they prove me wrong. I also hope to win the Mega Millions this evening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCtoSC_SKINS_LIFER Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 7 hours ago, Koala said: As of now, we have no identity. I challenge anyone to answer, what the **** exactly is our identity? Who are we? And if you cant answer that question, then what the hell exactly are you rooting for? Why do I have to answer a question about the teams identity to root for them? Your post came across like you hate when someone tells you how to be a fan, yet you end it with that question?!? Seems very contradictory to me. Maybe that wasn’t your intention. I am not trying to be abrasive here. Anyway, the answer is simple for me....I’m rooting for the Washington Redskins. Their identity has no bearing on that. HAIL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 @Koala & @LightningBuggs I understand becoming disinterested and tuning out, but what you guys describe is almost adversarial. I could be reading it wrong, but it's almost like you have such hard feelings against the front office, etc. that you take some element of pleasure if things don't work out. And, for the record, this isn't judging or accusatory because I can understand how that type of relationship could develop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickyJ Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 9 hours ago, Koala said: I challenge anyone to answer, what the **** exactly is our identity? The Washington Redskins. 9 hours ago, Koala said: Who are we? A football team. Next question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightningBuggs Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 3 hours ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: @Koala & @LightningBuggs I understand becoming disinterested and tuning out, but what you guys describe is almost adversarial. I could be reading it wrong, but it's almost like you have such hard feelings against the front office, etc. that you take some element of pleasure if things don't work out. And, for the record, this isn't judging or accusatory because I can understand how that type of relationship could develop. Speaking for myself, I wouldn't call it taking pleasure in the team's failures. Honestly and bluntly, I no longer care enough to. The comic relief I alluded to is more in response to the team and organization giving me so many opportunities for a chuckle due to their ineptness. A "laugh instead of cry" response. I knew you weren't judging just as I don't judge others for staying the course with this franchise. "To each his or her own" as I always say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 I totally get why people who’ve been so turned off by the team could render some semblance of pleasure out of the team’s failure. At the end of the day, you loved the Redskins and they’ve taken the fun out of that for you. Thats kind of why why this season is a can’t lose for me in a way. If I’m wrong and they are better than I think, good for me. If they are what i think they are, there is good reason to believe change is coming. Obviously change isn’t always a good thing but Im willing to see what Dan comes up with next. I’m still not there yet. No matter what, I’ll be pulling for the team to beat Dallas come Sunday. Even though, I know it’s just a blip on the radar and really won’t matter for much in a few months Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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