MartinC Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 10 minutes ago, tshile said: A true/pure democracy is everyone having one vote on every issue. A republic is everyone having one vote vote for a representative; who then convenes with their peers to vote on issues, presumably on your behalf (lol) it’s usually brought up to illustrate that simple majority rule is silly. Almost every form of democracy is representative - a republic is far from unique in that way. The UK is a representative democracy but it’s not a republic. But we are going to stray way off topic if we continue down this route. So let’s leave this here. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Well I guess I should have seen that coming i don’t really like that much more than the Alabama ones. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 3 minutes ago, tshile said: Well I guess I should have seen that coming i don’t really like that much more than the Alabama ones. Neither one matters unless allowed by the feds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 Hopefully scotus recognizes this as legislating from the bench and throws them all out and says try again. Just make them all waste their money and political capital 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 3 minutes ago, tshile said: Hopefully scotus recognizes this as legislating from the bench and throws them all out and says try again. Are you talking about the Vermont law passed by the legislature? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 Just now, visionary said: Are you talking about the Vermont law passed by the legislature? I’m talking about all of them. I believe the pro-life ones were coordinated. This is a response. Im picturing a point where there’s 30 different states with some ridiculous abortion law. So they’re all staring at SCOTUS. And, I believe it was Larry who said this a few days ago, I hope scotus says something like “we don’t know where the line is but all 30 of you crossed it; in two different directions nonetheless. So, no X 30, established laws rules you’re all thrown out. Try again” the thought that they spent all this money creating a situation to force scotus to weigh in (I believe this coordinated effort cost a lot GOP $, and the response will cost the dems) and that’s ridiculous so let it be a complete waste. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 (edited) 12 minutes ago, tshile said: I’m talking about all of them. I believe the pro-life ones were coordinated. This is a response. Im picturing a point where there’s 30 different states with some ridiculous abortion law. So they’re all staring at SCOTUS. And, I believe it was Larry who said this a few days ago, I hope scotus says something like “we don’t know where the line is but all 30 of you crossed it; in two different directions nonetheless. So, no X 30, established laws rules you’re all thrown out. Try again” the thought that they spent all this money creating a situation to force scotus to weigh in (I believe this coordinated effort cost a lot GOP $, and the response will cost the dems) and that’s ridiculous so let it be a complete waste. Ok...but you do realize that 'legislating from the bench' is mostly a conservative term used to refer to judges interpreting the constitution in ways that cause significant (generally progressive) legal changes. The idea behind the phrase is that the judges are acting as if they were a legislature, thus legislating from their bench. Edited May 21, 2019 by visionary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 Just now, visionary said: Ok...but you do realize that 'legislating from the bench' is mostly a conservative term used to refer to judges interpreting the constitution in ways that cause significant (generally progressive) legal changes. The idea behind the phrase is that the judges are acting as if they were a legislature, thus legislating from their bench. Right..... so theyll have all these extreme bills on both on both sides and the hope is they’ll pick and choose which parts of which are ok and which aren’t. which is bull****. They aren’t the legislature. They should kick them all back for being extreme for the sake of being extreme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 48 minutes ago, visionary said: Ok...but you do realize that 'legislating from the bench' is mostly a conservative term used to refer to judges interpreting the constitution in ways that cause significant (generally progressive) legal changes. The idea behind the phrase is that the judges are acting as if they were a legislature, thus legislating from their bench. tshile is right, the pro-life folk are largely playing the same game the SSM crowd did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 How many weeks along does it take to detect a heart beat on migrant children in cages? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 1 minute ago, NoCalMike said: How many weeks along does it take to detect a heart beat on migrant children in cages? Subpoena Obama and ask him....plenty of experience to draw from. 🧐 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, twa said: Subpoena Obama and ask him....plenty of experience to draw from. 🧐 Sure thing, I will use my special concerned tailgate poster subpoena powers! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Springfield Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted May 21, 2019 Author Share Posted May 21, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, tshile said: Hopefully scotus recognizes this as legislating from the bench and throws them all out and says try again. Just make them all waste their money and political capital I do have the impression that at least some times, what legislatures do is "Pass the most extreme bill imaginable, expect the court to line-item veto parts of it, and the result will be the most extreme law the court will allow." In effect, demanding that the court actually write the legislation. (And thus also exempting the legislature from actually having to come to any kind of consensus or compromise, too.) Yeah, the Alabama law sure smells like one of those cases. And yeah, at least in my imagination, Judge Larry, if he doesn't want to legislate from the bench, simply throws out the whole law and tells them to try again. If the legislature wants to say "Here, judge, you write it", the judge says "That's your job." Although, that assumes that the judge(s) don't want to legislate from the bench. I'm pretty sure that at least some of the current SCOTUS were specifically picked for that very purpose. (Although, they might not be able to get five of them to all do it, and to agree.) Edited May 21, 2019 by Larry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 20 minutes ago, Springfield said: What kind of fathering should we expect from men denied the right to prevent their children's birth? Last I checked the women could walk away after birthing if they desire. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted May 21, 2019 Author Share Posted May 21, 2019 35 minutes ago, twa said: What kind of fathering should we expect from men denied the right to prevent their children's birth? Last I checked the women could walk away after birthing if they desire. Yeah. Pregnant women who are being ordered by the government to just shut up and stay pregnant have it easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nonniey Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 (edited) . 15 hours ago, twa said: Neither one matters unless allowed by the feds Vermont's is nothing new in practice. Courts will allow it. Further Edit. This law just codifies what already existed in Vermont (Unrestricted abortion). They didn't have anything on the books prior to this. H57 "....The legislation draws no distinction between the first and final month of pregnancy. However, supporters of the bill say that physicians can be trusted to only perform procedures when it is medically and ethically appropriate." Can't see how supporters on this bill can say that with a straight face when examples like Gosnell are out there. Edited May 21, 2019 by nonniey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozo the kKklown Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 12 hours ago, Springfield said: The type that would have that child either join the military or goto prison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nonniey Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 19 hours ago, tshile said: Well I guess I should have seen that coming i don’t really like that much more than the Alabama ones. Vermont didn't change anything they just codefied what they already had (unrestricted abortion at any time) into law. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 Is there a poll of just people from Alabama? Cause they are the only one's that matter with a state law. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CousinsCowgirl84 Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 15 minutes ago, twa said: Is there a poll of just people from Alabama? Cause they are the only one's that matter with a state law. Right. Let Alabama do what Alabama wants. Let California do what California wants. It’s not that hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 1 hour ago, nonniey said: Vermont didn't change anything they just codefied what they already had (unrestricted abortion at any time) into law. I didn’t realize anyone had unrestricted. Shows what I know. As far as state law arguments go, I’m usually a states rights person but I have limits. This is one of those cases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted May 21, 2019 Author Share Posted May 21, 2019 1 hour ago, twa said: Is there a poll of just people from Alabama? Cause they are the only one's that matter with a state law. Actually, if you really want to restrict the poll to only people affected, that would be pregnant women who want abortions in Alabama. Is that really the poll you want to see? Or was this more a case of "try to find an excuse to ignore, whether it actually makes sense or not"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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