The Gun Control Debate Thread

[TheGreatBuzz]

3 hours ago, LD0506 said:

until there is a drastic reset and the guns go away a la Australia.

 

Can you please explain to the class what in the blue hell you are talking about? 

 

I'm not even gonna ask what makes you think this WILL happen.  What even makes you think there is the tiniest possibility that it potentially may come even close to a .00001% chance of this even slightly becoming a possibility?  A person literally walked into an elementary school and mowed down 20 children and nothing happened.  We are at a point in this country where we have multiple mass shootings a day and it is barely a blip on the news.  It isn't even a big talking point for the Dems right now.  They have decided infrastructure is more pressing.  Even in The Tailgate, which I'd describe as Left leaning and populated by people that actually care about social issue more than the general public, what page is the Mass Shooting thread on?  When I looked a minute ago, it was the last thread at the bottom of page two.  It will more than likely fall to page 3 before the end of the day.  That while headlines like "At least four people were killed and four others were injured Tuesday morning in the second mass shooting in Chicago in four days" go around but it isn't even worth talking about anymore.   And even if someone tried to enact major legislation, much less than the "guns going away a la Australia" you forecast, we have a Conservative majority in SCOTUS that will never let major reform stand.  In fact, they will be hearing a gun control case this fall and from what I understand, many expect SCOTUS to strike down the ban, thus expanding gun rights further.  And that majority could likely be in place for the next 20+ years.  CNN had a tracker up on the screen showing gun deaths for a couple days like they did with COVID deaths but that didn't last long.  No one cared enough.  

 

So if you really think there is even a remote chance of guns going away in this country, please stop what you are doing immediately and seek professional mental help because you must clearly be living in an alternate reality and I worry for your safety.

Edited June 17, 2021 by TheGreatBuzz

[Califan007 The Constipated]

On 6/15/2021 at 11:34 AM, China said:

Missouri Law Enforcement No Longer Required To Enforce Federal Gun Laws

 

Gov. Mike Parson signed legislation Saturday that invalidates federal gun laws in Missouri.

Missouri law enforcement officials no longer have to execute federal gun laws.

 

Missouri Gov. Mike Parson signed a bill Saturday that declares all federal gun laws past, present and future must be invalid in the state.This includes taxing, tracking and registration of weapons.

 

The bill is called the “Second Amendment Preservation Act.”

 

 

 

 

Revoke all federal funding for anything to Missouri.  

 

 

Justice Dept.: Missouri governor can't void federal gun laws

 

WASHINGTON (AP) — The Justice Department is warning Missouri officials that the state can’t ignore federal law, after the governor signed a bill last week that bans police from enforcing federal gun rules.

 

In a letter sent Wednesday night and obtained by The Associated Press, Justice officials said the U.S. Constitution's Supremacy Clause outweighs the measure that Gov. Mike Parson signed into law Saturday. The new rules penalize local police departments if their officers enforce federal gun laws.

 

https://www.yahoo.com/news/justice-dept-missouri-governor-cant-010218695.html

[China]

Publix shooter’s ex-wife says she warned authorities about his mental health

 

alm County Sheriff Ric Bradshaw expressed outrage last week, saying that the murder-suicide at a Royal Palm Beach Publix could have been avoided if someone came forward to alert authorities about Timothy Wall.

 

Bradshaw said no one told his agency that Wall had mental health issues before Wall, 55 of Loxahatchee, shot dead a 69-year-old woman and her toddler grandson before taking his own life.

 

The shooter’s ex-wife expresses her condolences to the family that lost its loved ones, but she says her family has made numerous efforts to get Wall the help that he needed and that they did contact the sheriff’s office.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[China]

Where is that good guy with a gun when you need him?

 

Surveillance video released of suspects accused of shooting woman to death in front of southeast Houston gym

 

A woman is dead after she was shot in front of a gym in southeast Houston Thursday morning.

 

The victim was identified by Houston police as 62-year old Elsa Mikeska. The shooting happened just before 5 a.m. in front of the Life Fit Personal Fitness Studio on Fuqua Street near Beamer Road, authorities said.

 

“That doesn’t happen around here. That’s just not something we see around here. It’s scary,” John Gregory said.

 

Thursday evening, Houston police released surveillance video of the suspects and a vehicle wanted in connection to the shooting.

 

John Gregory works at the Kirkwood Veterinary Hospital on Fuqua Street and couldn’t believe Mikeska was gunned down outside the gym, which sits right next to his job.

 

“The family it happened to, I’m sorry for their loss. Their mom, their wife, was just going to work out, how do you expect something like that? How do you deal with someone like that?” Gregory asked.

 

According to the Houston Police Department, Mikeska was just trying to go to the gym when she was gunned down. Police said she arrived at the gym, parked her car, and got out when three men in their mid-20s pulled up in an older model, white Chevy Suburban.

 

Two of the men got out of the vehicle as the Mikeska began walking toward the gym, police said. Authorities said the men said something to her and she began running towards the gym.

 

At that point, police said the men opened fire and the woman was struck in the back. She was pronounced dead at the scene. Police said the three men fled the scene without stealing any of the woman’s belongings.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[China]

Shocking video shows masked gunman opening fire on NYC sidewalk

 

A 10-year-old girl and her kid brother were trampled and nearly shot when their trip to buy some candy became a first-hand look at the city’s escalating gun violence, according to cops and chilling video.

 

 

At least a dozen shots whizzed by the terrified children as the black-masked gunman repeatedly aimed for his fallen target — who knocked the kids down while trying to escape.

 

The shocking footage shows the 5-year-old boy’s legs shaking in fear at one point amid the bloodshed.

 

Miraculously, neither child was hit.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[China]

Police: Man pulled gun at Starbucks over cream cheese

 

An angry Florida man pulled a gun on a drive-thru worker because they forgot the cream cheese with his bagel, according to Miami Gardens Police. The employee just happened to be the daughter of the police chief.

 

Police said the man became angry at a Starbucks drive-thru when they messed up his order earlier this week. He returned to the window, screaming at the employee. She asked whether he had paid for the cream cheese, at which point he became enraged and pulled out a gun, according to an arrest report.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[China]

Former NRA president, gun rights advocate speak at fake high school graduation representing kids killed by gun violence

 

The speeches were organized by the group Change the Ref, which was founded by Manuel and Patricia Oliver, whose son was killed in the 2018 shooting at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland, Fla. 

 

The 3,044 chairs represent the students who did not graduate with the high school class of 2021 because they were killed by gun violence, according to a statement obtained by The Hill. 

 

In the videos of the speeches, the speakers are seen delivering addresses to a Las Vegas-area high school named James Madison Academy, which does not exist. 

 

One of the videos features Keene telling students to “follow your dream and make it a reality” between 911 calls of school shootings.

 

"Picture for a minute the young James Madison, for whom this school is named," Keene says in his speech. 

 

“This year, you focused on one of the most important of Madison’s amendments, the Second Amendment,” he added. “There are some who continue to fight to gut the Second Amendment, but I’d be willing to bet that many of you will be among those who stand up and prevent them from succeeding.”

 

 

Click on the link for the full story

[Cooked Crack]

 

[tshile]

Not trying to be a jerk but:

a) yeah that’s a risk you accept when you draw a gun. It just is. 
 

b) super stupid to kill a guy called into 911 as an active shooter with ar-15, **then pick up his ar-15 and start walking around with it**
like wtf were you thinking was going to happen. 
 

they showed up looking for an active shooter with an ar-15 and you made you the guy with the ar-15….

[Larry]

Recall reading something in here. Active shooting.  Guy called 911.  Told dispatcher he was standing guard till the cops got there.  

 

Dispatcher told him to make sure to put the gun down before the cops arrive.  

 

[skinsmarydu]

https://www.cnn.com/2021/06/29/us/statesville-nc-shooting/index.html

[China]

It's the Wild, Wild, West Midwest...

 

Gun deaths rising in Iowa as new law removes handgun permits

 

Gun deaths are surging in Iowa as a law is set to go into effect Thursday that will allow people to more easily buy handguns and carry them in public without training or a permit.

 

A record 353 Iowa residents died from gunshot wounds in 2020, including 263 suicides and 85 homicides, an Iowa Department of Public Health spokeswoman said Tuesday. The shooting deaths represent a 23% increase from Iowa’s previous high of 287 in 2019, including an 80% jump in homicides, according to state data.

 

It's the most dramatic one-year hike in an upward trend that has accelerated since 2016. From 1999 to 2001, Iowa averaged only 194 annual gun deaths, including just 25 homicides, according to federal data.

 

Iowa is among several Republican-led states that have passed laws this year allowing for the permitless carry of guns, including one that will take effect Thursday in Tennessee and another in Texas on Sept. 1. Iowa's new law also eliminates a requirement that people pass background checks to obtain permits to purchase handguns, breaking with more than 20 other states that have similar policies.

 

Click on the link for the full article

 

 

[TheGreatBuzz]

Quote

Five new gun control laws take effect July 1 in Virginia.  

RICHMOND, Va. (WRIC)- At least five new gun control laws take effect in Virginia on July 1.

https://www.wric.com/news/five-new-gun-laws-take-effect-july-1-in-virginia/

 

Quote

Starting July 1, most people won’t be allowed to bring a gun or any other weapon to Capitol Square in downtown Richmond. Any firearms or explosives carried in violation of this law are subject to seizure and forfeiture.

According to Virginia Capitol Police Spokesperson Joe Macenka, the ban also covers the four streets that surround the perimeter of the square, including sections of Bank, 9th, Broad and Governor St. Generally, he said people are at risk of violations if they are travelling on foot with a firearm on those streets but not if it’s responsibly stored in a vehicle.

Those who break the new law risk being charged with a Class One Misdemeanor, which carries a maximum punishment of one year behind bars and a $2,500 fine.

 

I got no issues with this.  You normally can't take a gun to most government locations.

 

Quote

Democrats also led a push to ban firearms within 40 feet of polling places with some exceptions. Levine said a majority already did this by nature of being located at schools but the new law will ensure outliers are covered.

 

Not really sure I understand this one.  If firearms at polling places is such a big issue, 40 feet doesn't seem like enough.  But I'm not sure this is even needed.  Seems more like it is a solution looking for a problem.  I can't find specifics on where the "border" starts at either.  Can I have a gun in the parking lot as long as I'm 40 feet away from the doors leading into the polling machines?  Or do I have to be 40 feet away from the borders of the property on which the polling is being conducted at?  Not that this would change my opinion.  Really just a general question.

 

Quote

Another reform clarifies that school boards can generally ban guns in buildings that they own. This comes after a 2020 policy change that gave local governments the option to adopt stricter gun control policies in various places.

 

I honestly thought this was already the case.  I don't have any issues here.

 

Quote

One of the most contentious gun safety debates of the 2021 session was over the scope of a bill to restrict firearm access for certain domestic abusers.

 

This is one I struggle with.  The debate is generally the type of domestic abuse the person does (beating spouse vs beating kids, etc).  I'm inclined to say it should include any form of domestic abuse.  But I also know that A LOT more spouses are killed by domestic violence than kids, etc.  Is including the kids, etc another case of a solution in search of a problem?  At the end of the day, I don't really care because I don't have kids to beat and I don't plan on beating my wife.

 

Quote

a red flag law

 

I really struggle with red flag laws.  I know it has been debated here many times so I won't go beating that dead horse again.  I will say I support the idea but it seems like an idea that could be easily abused by people with an agenda that goes past it's intent.

 

Quote

a “one handgun per month” policy

 

This is one I disagree with.  How many acts of violence is this expected to stop?  I know that there are people who buy multiple guns a month as straw purchases but I think there is a better way to target them (and do so harshly).  But if Glock has a big sale, I don't think I should be limited to only one.  

 

 

This article doesn't go into great depth about each of the individual laws so if someone wants to post more detail regarding one of the laws to discuss, feel free.

[Larry]

7 hours ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

I really struggle with red flag laws.  I know it has been debated here many times so I won't go beating that dead horse again.  I will say I support the idea but it seems like an idea that could be easily abused by people with an agenda that goes past it's intent.

 

I can understand the desire behind red flag laws.  It comes from "Neighbor of WalMart shooter says he warned police about shooter a year ago".  

 

But I always try to caution people that if you're planning on trying to pass a law that says the cops should take away all guns from anybody who's neighbor has ever called the police about him once, then you're going to get a ****load of guns taken away from people who would not have become mass shooters.  

 

(And that's even before you get into, if such a law passes, the number of neighbors will will be calling in each other, for other reasons.)  

 

Same thing with trying to take away weapons from anybody with "mental health issues".  There's a ****load of people in this country with mental health issues.  (Enough to get somebody elected President).  Very few of them become mass shooters.  Try and legislate that, you're going to get a lot of "false positives".  

[skinsmarydu]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/golf/kennesaw-golf-pro-identified-as-victim-in-shooting-at-cobb-county-country-club-a-member-says/ar-AALK7h3?ocid=winp1taskbar

[skinsmarydu]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/two-boys-8-and-9-charged-with-involuntary-manslaughter-for-fatally-shooting-62-year-old-south-carolina-man/ar-AALLiMi?ocid=winp1taskbar

[Larry]

Seems weird, to me.  

 

If the two kids were just shooting blindly at random, then that seems an excessive change.  (Even though technically accurate.)  Considering their age, I wouldn't do that.  

 

If they were actually firing at the victim, then the charges seem too low.  

[China]

BREAKING: Triple homicide probed after shooting on Cobb golf course

 

A day after a golf pro at a Kennesaw-area country club was shot and killed on the course Saturday afternoon, authorities revealed they also are investigating two other deaths related to the incident.

 

Cobb County police told The Atlanta Journal-Constitution on Saturday they were investigating the deadly shooting, which occurred sometime before 2:30 p.m. at the Pinetree Country Club.

 

On arrival, officers located a male, identified as Pinetree Country Club employee Eugene Siller, unresponsive on the green of the 10th hole with an apparent gunshot wound to the head, agency spokeswoman Officer Shenise Barner said in an email Sunday evening. Siller was pronounced deceased at the scene.

 

A white Ram 3500 pickup truck was also located on the green, police said. Upon further investigation, two other deceased males were discovered in the bed of the pickup truck. Both males suffered apparent gunshot wounds. One of them was identified as Paul Pierson, the registered owner of the Ram 3500. The other male has not yet been identified, Barner said Sunday.

 

Police have not said what led to the deadly shooting, but several people told The Atlanta Journal-Constitution it appeared the gunman’s truck got stuck near the 18th green after he drove onto the course from an adjacent neighborhood.

 

Siller was shot when he went onto the course to investigate, they said.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[Dont Taze Me Bro]

Just bought a new gun Saturday.  Glock 34 Gen 4, 9mm, used but had a new barrel along with a muzzle break and red dot sight.  Love it, can't wait to target shoot with it.  My wife was not happy with the price, but I told her for 15 months I was going to buy one.

Edited July 5, 2021 by Dont Taze Me Bro

[Fan since a Fetus]

Here in Texas Abott recently signed a law that you do not need training or permits for purchasing a handgun. I believe a background check is not necessary, however, I am not sure, so please don't quote me on that. This goes into affect in September.

 

A lot of people own guns here in TX. In fact, when I was buying houses I did not come across one that did not have a gun safe. I inherited one that is now being used for adult toys

[Larry]

7 hours ago, Fan since a Fetus said:

A lot of people own guns here in TX. In fact, when I was buying houses I did not come across one that did not have a gun safe. I inherited one that is now being used for adult toys

.... which actually are illegal in Texas. 

[skinsmarydu]

Welp...

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/gun-violence-claims-14-lives-over-july-4-weekend-in-chicago/ar-AALNT0y?ocid=winp1taskbar

[Fan since a Fetus]

14 hours ago, Larry said:

.... which actually are illegal in Texas. 

 

Are you commenting on the adult toys? Because I have read about several adult places around here that have been raided over their selections. It is an archaic ruling that they are eluding to. In fact, I think the last one was around 2008? an employee got arrested at one of the Cindie's adult stores here for selling products that have a life like look to human anatomy. 

 

Honestly it is a stupid law and adults can make their own decisions. **** anyone that thinks otherwise. Also, to be clear Larry, I am not saying that you feel this way,

[China]

Hotel Worker ‘Averted Disaster’ Finding Loaded Rifle And Scope In Guest’s Room Overlooking Ohio Street Beach; Keegan Casteel Faces Weapons Charges

 

A worker at a prominent Gold Coast hotel “averted disaster” on the Fourth of July, after spotting a rifle with a scope and laser sight a guest had left “in a very suspicious position” in a room overlooking Ohio Street Beach, police and the mayor said Tuesday.

 

Police and prosecutors said, around 5:45 p.m. Sunday, an employee at the W Chicago Lakeshore hotel, at 644 N. Lake Shore Dr., found a .308-caliber rifle with a high-powered scope and laser sight attachment inside a 12th floor room. The worker also found a handgun and several magazines of ammunition.

Police said thanks to that alert by housekeeping, they recovered a semi automatic rifle with a live round in the chamber, handgun and several loaded rifle magazines on the window sill of Room 1208.

 

The Joint Terrorism Task Force interviewed him along with a companion. It’s an arrest that CPD Superintendent David Brown said would not have been made without the hotel’s help.

 

“This was unique that we’re still within COVID restrictions somewhat and this employee saw something by entering the room to clean it that likely prevented a tragedy from happening,” Brown said. “So it was significant and very valuable and we ought to keep a lot of praise on that employee for letting us know so we could act quickly and potentially avoid a tragedy. Thank God for that hotel worker, who saw something, and said something, and I believe averted disaster,”

 

The room overlooks Ohio Street Beach, which was crowded with visitors for the Fourth of July on Sunday, according to prosecutors.

 

Officers with the CPD Joint Terrorism Task Force questioned the guest, along with a companion, and arrested him on weapons charges.

 

Keegan Casteel, 32, of Ankeny, Iowa, was charged with two felony counts of unlawful use of a weapon. Prosecutors said Casteel admitted owning the guns, but he does not have a Firearm Owners Identification card, which is required to legally possess a gun in Illinois.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[China]

4 arrested at Maven Hotel, police feared a ‘Las Vegas style shooting' during All-Star Game in Denver

 

Police feared a “Las Vegas style shooting” during the All-Star Game in Denver after receiving a tip from a maid working at a hotel not far from Coors Field, who discovered more than a dozen weapons and more than 1,000 rounds of ammunition inside one of the rooms Friday night.

 

Multiple informed law enforcement sources connected with the investigation told Denver7’s Liz Gelardi and Denver7 chief investigative reporter Tony Kovaleski that they found the weapons inside a room on the eighth floor of the Maven Hotel as All-Star Game celebrations got underway.

 

Sources said police removed 16 long guns, body armor and more than 1,000 rounds of ammunition from the room which featured a balcony overlooking the downtown area. The sources said they feared the number of weapons, ammo, vantage point and large crowds could have resulted in a "Las Vegas style shooting."

 

Click on the link for the full article