Which Player Woud You Select at #5?

[Wildbunny]

Feels like the JAgs will go offense if they don't trade down. Their OL is a complete mess so far.

[nemocystem]

Yeah...i'm not much for caring about the whole value for pick argument. I feel you take the guy you like, unless you can get another guy at close to equal value at another position, while feeling pretty confident that you can grab another guy you think is relatively close to the other at his position.

This year, OG/OT is a perfect example of this.

Let's say you go with the consensus & have your top 5 something like this:

1) Collins

2) Peat

3) Humphries

4) Flowers

5) Clemmings

1) Scherff

2) Erving

3) Cann

4) Tomlinson

5) Tre Jackson

Now...firstly, you have to believe that any 1 of those guys is a better prospect than anyone else on your board, & by a WIIIIIIDE margin...& here's why. Forget about where you normally take who. The thing is that unless you are dead set on filling out 2 OL in this draft, & absolutely nobody is even willing to discuss a trade scenario without insulting you. you see....there just isn't a wide enough margin between players 1-5 at either position that you couldn't get a guy who is right in line with the guy you woukd be reaching to take.

There's no matter or amount of convincing you can do, that i haven't already tried on myself, that tells me that Scherff (for instance) is so overwhelmingly better than Tomlinson that i absolutely cannot afford to wait on him in round 2. The more I look at both prospects, the more i'm convinced that Tomlinson is better, in fact. The same goes for OT. I like Flowers, & Collins a lot...but i can't see myself being so enamored with their potential that if i wanted to fill OT that badly, that i couldn't just wait for Clemmings in the 2nd, or even Fisher possibly in the 3rd.

So to me...it's less about whatever anecdotal risk-averse business-speak nonsense will try to convince you of...it's just simply the value of spending the #5 pick on a guy you can essentially get in the 2nd round who isn't all that different a player.

Conversely...if you like White or Cooper...there isn't another one of either after they're gone. Sure, there are guys who have potential like DGB or Agholor, but their questions put them almost 2 tiers down the totem pole imo. The same goes for edge rusher. Again...some gem or another will be found & (more importantly) properly nurtured...but the top 3-4 are extremely plausibly studs at the next level.

Gurley is an example of the latter...except for us, it may be about whether or not we care to pile on that sort of duplication (we do still have AlMo at last check). So i don't rule him out of the equation, although i consider the possibility to be highly unlikely.

About the biggest spark of intrigue for me is whether or not ee might consider Dupree or Fowler as ILB? Now that's a curious notion.

Worth mentioning, I get the feeling Oakland is going Cooper at #4.

Just a hunch. Like, they've gone Carr now. Sure, he's not Manning, but you've got to develop him nonetheless. Before he trotted along, you could keep adding to the defense. But now, I think they go BPA on offense, and that's Cooper.

Mariota seemingly is too hot to make it to 5 at this point. Titans might grab him, or make a trade. If not, probably 3 or 4 will move.

JAX is the real wild card here. Can't tell if they'd prefer Fowler or Williams here.

We might end up with whoever they don't choose.

Almost 100% in agreement here...i just hope it works out that all the above happens, & JAX takes Fowler.

One can dream.

[Napredskins1]

Watching highlights of Amari Cooper and he looks really fast. He seems to gret a lot of separation once he has the ball.

[Gary Clark Fan]

hopefully trading down but if williams falls to us and we cant trade out he is the guy.  If we goes before then its fowler.

[mike42]

Cooper, Beasley, Fowler.

 

Cooper? Why are people pushing for Cooper? Out of all the issues we have, why would we ever consider drafting a wide receiver?! WR position is the least of our worries.

 

SM may pick the best player available, but historically he doesn't have that approach it in the first round. He picks the player most needed.

 

I'm not too impressed with this draft. Either we get Fowler or trade down to generate more picks, which might will bring us more luck.

[Warhead36]

Cooper? Why are people pushing for Cooper? Out of all the issues we have, why would we ever consider drafting a wide receiver?! WR position is the least of our worries.

 

SM may pick the best player available, but historically he doesn't have that approach it in the first round. He picks the player most needed.

 

I'm not too impressed with this draft. Either we get Fowler or trade down to generate more picks, which might will bring us more luck.

What makes you think SM drafts for need in the 1st round? In San Fran the 9ers roster was so terrible that just about any position he drafted was a position of need. SM comes from the Packers roots which is all about drafting the best player available.

 

WR may not be a need right now, but it easily could be in two years when Garcon hits 30 and Jackson's contract explodes. If/when that happens and Cooper is putting up Pro Bowl seasons, we'll look back and ask why we didn't take him.

[klwilkins1977]

Scherr gives us protection/leverage for Williams negotiations Going into next year. Plus he is nasty as hell on the field. Day One starter, and an immediate attitude change on a visually old and underachieving portion of our team.

[Koolblue13]

Too bad this is multiple choice.

[DogofWar1]

Cooper? Why are people pushing for Cooper? Out of all the issues we have, why would we ever consider drafting a wide receiver?! WR position is the least of our worries.

 

SM may pick the best player available, but historically he doesn't have that approach it in the first round. He picks the player most needed.

 

I'm not too impressed with this draft. Either we get Fowler or trade down to generate more picks, which might will bring us more luck.

 

WR is definitely a major position of need at this point.  Jackson and Garcon are creeping towards 30, but more importantly, their costs are getting extremely high.  Between them and Roberts, the cap hit is almost 25M.

 

That brings us to today, and the announcement of taking the 5th year option.

 

RGIII's cap hit in 2016 will be 16M.  Suddenly, DJax, Garcon, Roberts, and RGIII are 40M in cap space.

 

Something has to give on the QB/WR front.  Not only are our WRs creeping towards the wrong side of 30, they're creeping towards being too expensive to keep.  In 2-3 years down the road, one or more WILL be gone, and we'll need new players to replace them.

 

For that reason I wouldn't mind Cooper at 5.  He's extremely complete, and can be a cheaper (than DJax/Garcon), long term alternative to our current guys.

 

That being said, I suspect the more likely spot for a new guy might be the 2nd or 3rd.  Talent is deep enough that we could address Fowler/Williams in the first and return for WR in the 2nd or 3rd.

 

Moreover, I think Cooper goes to Oakland is they stand pat.

 

Scherr gives us protection/leverage for Williams negotiations Going into next year. Plus he is nasty as hell on the field. Day One starter, and an immediate attitude change on a visually old and underachieving portion of our team.

 

I don't think Scherff can play LT at this level.

 

Maybe RT, but even then, he projects much better as a guard at this level.  A REALLY GOOD guard, but a guard nonetheless.

 

If we really wanted to get leverage over Trent, we'd need to trade back and aim for someone like Peat or Flowers, who can develop in a year or so.  Alternatively, grab someone in the 2nd.  I feel like Clemmings might sneak into the first (Denver would be a good landing spot) but someone like Fisher could be there.

 

Anyways, Scherff I don't think is the guy to fix/secure tackle.  Guard, maybe, but not tackle.

[mike42]

What makes you think SM drafts for need in the 1st round? In San Fran the 9ers roster was so terrible that just about any position he drafted was a position of need. SM comes from the Packers roots which is all about drafting the best player available.

 

WR may not be a need right now, but it easily could be in two years when Garcon hits 30 and Jackson's contract explodes. If/when that happens and Cooper is putting up Pro Bowl seasons, we'll look back and ask why we didn't take him.

 

WR is definitely a major position of need at this point.  Jackson and Garcon are creeping towards 30, but more importantly, their costs are getting extremely high.  Between them and Roberts, the cap hit is almost 25M.

 

For that reason I wouldn't mind Cooper at 5.  He's extremely complete, and can be a cheaper (than DJax/Garcon), long term alternative to our current guys.

 

 

I know age isn't on their side, but I can't see either Garcon/Jackson being unproductive at 30, especially DJaxs speed. I see everyones point, but couldn't we hold off another year addressing the WR position? Are we sold that Copper is the answer to Randy Moss? Doesn't other positions elsewhere outweigh the WR position?

 

Never been a fan of drafting high for WR.

[Gregpeck99]

The perfect pick is La'el Collins who can step in and play on Rt side immediately.  

 

You can't tell me he isn't upgrade over Compton.

 

Then next year when Skins move Trent out ... Collins moves seamlessly over to left side to protect Connor.

 

I would take La'el Collins at 5, torpedoes be damned.

[Supreme Wu]

I know age isn't on their side, but I can't see either Garcon/Jackson being unproductive at 30, especially DJaxs speed. I see everyones point, but couldn't we hold off another year addressing the WR position? Are we sold that Copper is the answer to Randy Moss? Doesn't other positions elsewhere outweigh the WR position?

 

Never been a fan of drafting high for WR.

 

I'd consider going WR at 5 only on the conditions outlined in this thread (No Leonard, no trade-down available).  Coopers strong after the catch and we need a reliable short & screen passing game to help mask the protection and QB issues.  Garcon can do this too but why not add another elite option, in a draft with no top-ten OLine or DB.

[DogofWar1]

I know age isn't on their side, but I can't see either Garcon/Jackson being unproductive at 30, especially DJaxs speed. I see everyones point, but couldn't we hold off another year addressing the WR position? Are we sold that Copper is the answer to Randy Moss? Doesn't other positions elsewhere outweigh the WR position?

 

Never been a fan of drafting high for WR.

 

I mean, we could try and hold off another year, but the issue is the floor drops out on us in the 2016-2017 time frame.  Our current WRs' contracts balloon/end in that range.  Roberts hasn't earned his pay either.

 

We could go from having two very good receivers in Garcon and DJax to no good receivers very quickly.

 

And that's assuming we're willing to stomach their costs in the interim.  DJax and Garcon are 17M this year combined, and 20M next year.  Garcon's contract is up after 2016.  Jackson's only goes through 2017, as does Roberts.  All are very expensive; Jackson is the only one who might be able to put up production similar to his cost barring a major shift back to Garcon and/or vast improvement on Roberts' part.

 

Like, yes, we've got a WR corps lined up for 2016, but it's super expensive and we lose everyone very quickly thereafter.  One new WR isn't going to cut it, unless we re-sign one of Garcon or DJax after their deal is up; we need two guys capable of playing at WR1 or WR2 level, and ideally another guy for WR3, unless Grant shows a lot of growth.

 

If a guy like Cooper falls into our lap, who allows us to cut Garcon, save 5ishM, and have a guy signed through 2018 at that cheaper price, it's hard to pass up.

 

Still, even if we pass on or miss Cooper, we've got to go back to WR sooner rather than later.  Especially this draft, with this talent out there.  I mean, it's so deep, a guy in the early 2nd would likely be a 1st rounder most years, and guys in the 3rd probably are 2nd round quality.

 

Add one quality pick this year, one next year, and we'll have largely avoided the loss of talent, and given ourselves cap flexibility if we need to free up space by allowing ourselves to tell DJax or Garcon to walk.

[Laron Burgundy]

The perfect pick is La'el Collins who can step in and play on Rt side immediately.

You can't tell me he isn't upgrade over Compton.

Then next year when Skins move Trent out ... Collins moves seamlessly over to left side to protect Connor.

I would take La'el Collins at 5, torpedoes be damned.

Move trent out like move him out to tight end? I mean he could maybe play it, I dunno.

[Stefanskins]

The perfect pick is La'el Collins who can step in and play on Rt side immediately.  

 

You can't tell me he isn't upgrade over Compton.

 

Then next year when Skins move Trent out ... Collins moves seamlessly over to left side to protect Connor.

 

You think Trent is gone? I was hoping he would be our LT for another 5-8 years

 

/ Oh, Laron, that's what Peck meant? Well he did run a 4.8 40...lose a little weight.. he's got great hands... saw him in practice with a back corner td catch... layin out with his toes draggin grass..

[Koolblue13]

The perfect pick is La'el Collins who can step in and play on Rt side immediately.  

 

You can't tell me he isn't upgrade over Compton.

 

Then next year when Skins move Trent out ... Collins moves seamlessly over to left side to protect Connor.

 

I would take La'el Collins at 5, torpedoes be damned.

Ya started out so nicely with this post and yet spiraled out of control again. 

[TheGreek1973]

This for me is a very very good article, totally agree with the list of just 5 best.

 

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/jason-la-canfora/25164871/there-are-only-five-cant-miss-players-in-the-2015-nfl-draft?FTAG=YHF7e3228e

 

1. Leonard Williams

2. Dante Fowler Jr

3 Shane Ray

4 Kevin White

5 Amari Cooper

 

Shane Ray can be that awesome pass rusher but we need to make sure the brainfart he had its a one time thing and he can recoup going forward like Trend Williams did. 

 

BUT here is the rub, if the two QBs go forward and Jacksonville goes for Flowler and Oakland goes for White, man oh man we are looking so freaking good with Leornard seating there waiting for us.  Crazier things have happened, NO WAY I want a trade back if we can pick him...no way.

[Nighthawk]

I'm all in on Vic Beasley. 

[Probos]

This for me is a very very good article, totally agree with the list of just 5 best.

 

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/jason-la-canfora/25164871/there-are-only-five-cant-miss-players-in-the-2015-nfl-draft?FTAG=YHF7e3228e

 

1. Leonard Williams

2. Dante Fowler Jr

3 Shane Ray

4 Kevin White

5 Amari Cooper

 

Shane Ray can be that awesome pass rusher but we need to make sure the brainfart he had its a one time thing and he can recoup going forward like Trend Williams did. 

 

BUT here is the rub, if the two QBs go forward and Jacksonville goes for Flowler and Oakland goes for White, man oh man we are looking so freaking good with Leornard seating there waiting for us.  Crazier things have happened, NO WAY I want a trade back if we can pick him...no way.

 

Really curious who the "phantom" scout is JLC used for his article. 

 

I'd take any of those guys at 5 and would be very happy.  If Williams is there it would surprise me,....

[DogofWar1]

Scot's comment at his presser make it sound like he might like Beasley over others.

 

Like, he talked a lot about physical abilities when discussing pass rushers, which makes me think someone like Beasley, who is an athletic freak, might be chosen over someone like Fowler, who is merely good athletically (though Fowler is more "skilled" overall).

 

“As they say, defensive end/outside linebacker in our 3-4 scheme, you look for a pass rusher. That’s the most important thing, especially with the Will – the weakside outside linebacker. But again, you want size, you want some length, you want speed, you want toughness, you want strength, you want to be able to not just win with speed and quickness, but also win with power. They’re hard to find. We’re very lucky to have Ryan [Kerrigan] on the team. He’s one of those players and hopefully not just in the first round but throughout this draft we can add a couple more pass rushers.”

 

Beasley's combine was absurd.   4.53 forty, sub 7 second 3 cone, 35 reps on the bench.  One of the top performers in every category.

 

Still, I do wonder about their skillsets in the game.  Like, for all his strength, one would think Beasley could rush the passer from anywhere, outside or inside, but he excels primarily from outside.  He also leaves something to be desired in run defense, and I wonder how much his lopsided abilities work against him.

[skinsmania123]

If we are going with the best all around "ready to go" day 1 player available I would pick Cooper but I know the Raiders are going to take him because they need a receiver desperately.   

 

Even though there are a number of quality edge rushers in this draft they all need work in one area or another.  I really wanted Shane Ray and I know he seems like a long shot BUT once again here is another pro athlete with "marijuana issues" and it is not easy for some folks to give it up.  I think Fowler is the safest pick but Ray had flashes of pure brilliance and dominance in college and I think if coached up properly he would have been a great addition for the Skins because he can play in the 3-4 and 4-3,  BUT now with this bone headed move forget it.  Right before the draft?   Bonehead.  Fall on your sword sort of move.   

[TheGreek1973]

In that case skinsmania123, Williams just might be there and he is a must pick.  Hell I would not even want the Browns 12th and 19th pick for him, they would have to give up more.  Williams on DL can be a rock for many years to come.  Think JJ Watt possibilities here, you can't pass that up.

[Nighthawk]

Dante Fowler is this years Bacarri Rambo or Morgan Moses to Redskins fans.

 

A player most Redskins fans want but will turn out to be a big mistake once he's drafted.

[Wildbunny]

Morgan Moses hasn't been a big mistake so far.

Rambo was what? a 6th rounder... Hardly a big mistake either, just a guy that didn't panned out for us.

[SkinsGuy]

Dante Fowler is this years Bacarri Rambo or Morgan Moses to Redskins fans.

 

A player most Redskins fans want but will turn out to be a big mistake once he's drafted.

And why is that?