Espn: Robert Griffin Iii Report: Better Mechanics

[Mahons21]

I'd take Griffin's bucket throwing ability over Kaep any day of the week.  Harbaugh has setup a good scheme with Kaep that allows him to use his rocket of an arm, using throwing lanes.  I think teams are going to start forcing him to make touch passes, where I believe he'll struggle.

[DC9]

In that clip, all Gruden was saying was that with Luck & RGIII coming out of college, the Rams should definately evaulate their options, especially if a new coach came to town. They should really take the time to study Bradford and decide if he is the QB to move forward with or if they should trade him and go with Luck/RGIII, and then you see Jaworski get all perturbed and bothered like someone peed in his cheerios just because they have a different opinion.

 

Someone suggested RGIII might be a better choice than the traditional drop back statue prototype QB, and Jaws looked like he was about to abandon ship.

 

Well, to be fair to the Rams, there was no way they'd be able to move that contract.  Bradford was one of the last #1's to receive rediculous money. 

I'd take Griffin's bucket throwing ability over Kaep any day of the week.  Harbaugh has setup a good scheme with Kaep that allows him to use his rocket of an arm, using throwing lanes.  I think teams are going to start forcing him to make touch passes, where I believe he'll struggle.

 

 

Mahons and I agree on something?

 

Stop playing!

 

I agree.  Kaep doesn't complete that pass to Tana against the Giants (1st meeting).  No touch and no arch.

 

Good post, bubba.

[NoCalMike]

Yeah I think one of the reasons Jaws's (and other's analysis) bug me so much at times because they totally discount RGIII's ability as a passer.

 

I expect idiot fans of other teams who are not paid to pay attention to these things and get 90% of their football knowledge from highlight packages to look at RGIII as a running QB, but these so-called "experts" should know better by the evidence of the kind of throws RGIII made as a rookie.

 

Everytime I see comment threads on sites like ESPN or Yahoo etc etc it is flooded seemingly with Cowboys/Eagles/Seahawks fans who claim RGIII is just a gimmick and not a real QB.  Chances are they are merely trolling and wishing harm against a QB they know can beat their team, but it makes me wonder if they even watched their own team's games against the 'Skins.

 

Did they watch RGIII throw a perfect bomb to Alrdick, or beat the blitz to find a wide open Niles Paul. Did Eagles fans watch the destruction of their team and then RGIII beat them a 2nd time on a hurt knee etc etc etc

[ejay183]

Well, to be fair to the Rams, there was no way they'd be able to move that contract.  Bradford was one of the last #1's to receive rediculous money. 

 

 

Mahons and I agree on something?

 

Stop playing!

 

I agree.  Kaep doesn't complete that pass to Tana against the Giants (1st meeting).  No touch and no arch.

 

Good post, bubba.

 

Or that beauty of a throw to Tana during the second Eagles game

[Califan007 The Constipated]

Or that beauty of a throw to Tana during the second Eagles game

 

Or during the first Giants game...

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

This totally contradicts what Jaws said.

 

Jaworski is a brain dead, Philthy homer jack waggon. 

 

Hail. 

[Fat Stupid Loser]

Yeah I think one of the reasons Jaws's (and other's analysis) bug me so much at times because they totally discount RGIII's ability as a passer.

 

I expect idiot fans of other teams who are not paid to pay attention to these things and get 90% of their football knowledge from highlight packages to look at RGIII as a running QB, but these so-called "experts" should know better by the evidence of the kind of throws RGIII made as a rookie.

 

Everytime I see comment threads on sites like ESPN or Yahoo etc etc it is flooded seemingly with Cowboys/Eagles/Seahawks fans who claim RGIII is just a gimmick and not a real QB.  Chances are they are merely trolling and wishing harm against a QB they know can beat their team, but it makes me wonder if they even watched their own team's games against the 'Skins.

 

Did they watch RGIII throw a perfect bomb to Alrdick, or beat the blitz to find a wide open Niles Paul. Did Eagles fans watch the destruction of their team and then RGIII beat them a 2nd time on a hurt knee etc etc etc

Its our offense.  We've all seen Robert make the throws. Its clear he is a great passer when called on to be. But that isn't very often. I don't have numbers to look at, but it seems he is 15/18 for 220 yards and 3 tds every week. Great percentage and production but passing the ball 18 times a game and running for 80 a game in this league makes you a running QB. Rightly or wrongly. 

 

When our offense changes and he is 31/38 every week, then the perception will change. Its not that he can't throw the ball with great success 40 times a game, its that he doesn't. Its the offense.

[NoCalMike]

Having a RB who rushed for 1600 yards also effects his passing attempts though, and if Helu can stay healthy and take some of the burden off of Morris, I don't see the running game slowing down much at all going forward.

[Farbod21]

Jaws is a clown.  He has gotten worse every year and at this point everything he says is pure garbage.  His personal bias is basically the only thing left at this point.  

[darrelgreenie]

Apparently Jaws sais something about Griffin's mechanics, not just that he doesn't look 100% healthy.

 

If so, this article would seem to contradict his veiwpoint.

 

Jaws:

 

 

Yeah...I'd say this article contradicts Jaws' opinion.

Again I don't see how this article contradicts Jaws.

 

Jaws is talking about a difference between Griffin now and Griffin he saw pre-injury even going back to Baylor pro-day.

 

JAWS:

ESPN analyst Ron Jaworski said on "Mike & Mike in the Morning," that he noticed a difference in watching Griffin warm up before the Monday night game versus Pittsburgh. Jaworski said he didn’t see the weight transfer that he would have liked, though pointing out he was not watching him in person.

 

What from the article contradicts this?

 

Kyle Shanahan said. “He just can’t come out there and just go as hard as he can. He is slowing everything down and really focused on his technique and focused on his mechanics. I think he worked at that his whole rehab session, and he is trying to carry it over to the field now. I see it getting better, and I think it will get better each week. Hopefully we will get him ready for that first week.”

Kyle sees it getting better. Which is quite different from Griffin is where he was or needs to be.

 

It’s not like Griffin is perfect. One of his worst throwing days in camp occurred more because of sloppy footwork than anything. He tried to throw to his right while his feet remained pointed either straight ahead or slightly to the left. Bad misses followed. Veteran quarterbacks struggle with this issue at times (Tom Brady missed on a couple throws against the Redskins two years ago for this reason). But it’s one the Redskins will continue to harp on with Griffin.

Oh? One of his worst passing days occurred because of *gasp* sloppy footwork?

But the Redskins are going to work with it. If he was back to where he was why the need to harp on it?

 

 

“We’ve been watching him practice and he’s getting better and better. We see progress,” Shanahan said. “One of the reasons we didn’t throw him right in the fire is because we didn’t think he was ready right away.”

Again, he's getting better. They're seeing progress. But, they're not saying he's back to where he was yet.

 

In case people forgot this is the measuring stick:

[rdskn4eva]

Go to the last minute... you're welcome

 

Jaw's didnt say anythign wrong here.  I agree with him and Gruden.  All Jaws said was, you dont go looking for a new QB when the QB you have now is one year removed from Rookie of the year.  I agree.

 

But Gruden was right as well.

[skins214428hail]

We have nothing to worry about. RG3 appears to be rocking a Jerry Curl. When you let your soull glow it shines through. All the way to the super bowl baby!!!!

[rdskn4eva]

Its our offense.  We've all seen Robert make the throws. Its clear he is a great passer when called on to be. But that isn't very often. I don't have numbers to look at, but it seems he is 15/18 for 220 yards and 3 tds every week. Great percentage and production but passing the ball 18 times a game and running for 80 a game in this league makes you a running QB. Rightly or wrongly. 

 

When our offense changes and he is 31/38 every week, then the perception will change. Its not that he can't throw the ball with great success 40 times a game, its that he doesn't. Its the offense.

I think you both make valid points.  RG3 has proven that when called to do so, he can throw the ball 30-35 times, but he did set the NFL Rookie record for rushing yards for a QB and led all QB in rushing attempts.

 

He averaged 26 pass attempts per game last year.  He had 9 games where he threw the ball 25 or more times and 4 games where he threw the ball 30 or more times and 6 games where he threw the ball less than 25 times.

 

I think he is the perfect balance of a run and pass QB.  This year will tell us a lot of how he will play.  If he's still taking unecessary hits, not getting out of bounds and not sliding, I'm going to be highy disappointed.

[Mr. Sinister]

We have nothing to worry about. RG3 appears to be rocking a Jerry Curl. When you let your soull glow it shines through. All the way to the super bowl baby!!!!

 

Jheri curl?  When did this happen? I thought he had cornrows

[Califan007 The Constipated]

Again I don't see how this article contradicts Jaws.

 

Jaws is talking about a difference between Griffin now and Griffin he saw pre-injury even going back to Baylor pro-day.

 

JAWS:

ESPN analyst Ron Jaworski said on "Mike & Mike in the Morning," that he noticed a difference in watching Griffin warm up before the Monday night game versus Pittsburgh. Jaworski said he didn’t see the weight transfer that he would have liked, though pointing out he was not watching him in person.

 

What from the article contradicts this?

 

I'm guessing you decided the Jaws quotes from my posts weren't worth using lol...so I'll use them. Again. Along with how PFT interpreted his stance (which seems to mimick many others):

 

"Ron Jaworski, the former NFL quarterback and current ESPN analyst, said on Mike and Mike in the Morning that when Griffin warmed up before this week’s preseason game, he looked like a fundamentally different passer than he had last season."

 

Now tell me...you see NOTHING in the OP article that contradicts that part in bold? Really?

 

 

From Jaws:

“I was watching him throw the football — there were a few clips — and I was concerned in the weight transfer,” he said. “I didn’t see the clean mechanics I’ve seen in the past."

 

From the OP Article:

 

The lower body mechanics are clearly a big deal. He can put more zip on the ball with better weight transfer, being able to fully plant and drive. As LaFleur said, there were days early in camp where it was clear Griffin could not plant and drive with authority because of his surgically-repaired right knee. But that hasn’t been the case the past couple weeks.

 

What LaFleur likes is how quickly Griffin learns when it comes to his throwing mechanics....

[...]“In two days he looks flawless,” LaFleur said. “He is a quick learner. You only have to tell him something once.”

 

Again...you see NOTHING between the two bolded parts from Jaws and then from the article that contradict each other? Really?

 

It should be obvious. Actually, I know it's obvious.

 

 

 

 

Kyle sees it getting better. Which is quite different from Griffin is where he was or needs to be.

 

Interesting is that Jaws does NOT say it's "getting better" in any way, shape or form. That's because he's so incredibly lacking any real knowledge or experience of RG3's rehab that he can only comment on things as if whatever he sees in some short clips is more than enough to draw any conclusions from. He doesn't even allow for the possibility that RG3 might have looks a little worse than he normally does, for whatever reason. Nope. It's important in Jaworski's mind to make declarative startements from a thimbleful of observation, and to make them NOW. Let's all applause the wonderful Jaws analysis folks.

 

 

 

Oh? One of his worst passing days occurred because of *gasp* sloppy footwork?

But the Redskins are going to work with it. If he was back to where he was why the need to harp on it?

 

Oh please...every freakin' QB in the league constantly works on sloppy footwork. Peyton Manning was on record as saying one of the best things he works on every season is correcting sloppy footwork. Notice how the article even mentions Tom Brady  had sloppy footwork when he played the Skins recently? I did. Keim's point was to show that RG3 having "sloppy footwork" during a practice and working on it is about as mention-worthy as saying he had an incomplete pass lol...

 

Saying a 2nd year QB is working on "sloppy footwork" one day shouldn't allow ANYONE to start making negative or pessimistic analysis of ANY sort. It's to be expected. I guarantee you Luck has been working on sloppy footwork as well. Should Jaws start analyzing his flawed mechanics as well?

 

 

Again, he's getting better. They're seeing progress. But, they're not saying he's back to where he was yet.

 

In case people forgot this is the measuring stick:

 

Again, Jaws' comments were not him saying "RG3 is still being affected by his injury in certain ways, but he's improving. He'll get back to form soon enough." He made no mention of the progress Griffin has shown since OTAs...he made no mention of how RG3 will eventually get back to his old self soon enough. No, his comments were more of the "pronouncement" type. As I said earlier in the thread, he seems way too eager to announce that RG3 is a "fundamentally different passer" now....that his knee injury has changed him as a QB.

 

A little early to be giving that type of analysis, don't you think?...Especially considering how little Jaws himself admits he's observed of Griffin.

[Mahons21]

DC9,

 

Guess you were finally right about something then .

[Skinsinparadise]

The one thing I like that Griffin has over Colin K. is that quick release. Griffin's release is super quick, close to Marino's release speed.

 

Agree, also RG3 IMO has better touch on his passes.  Kaepernick has a rocket but IMO needs to improve his intermediate passing.

[darrelgreenie]

This thread is nuts. Seriously.

I'm guessing you decided the Jaws quotes from my posts weren't worth using lol...so I'll use them. Again. Along with how PFT interpreted his stance (which seems to mimick many others):

 

"Ron Jaworski, the former NFL quarterback and current ESPN analyst, said on Mike and Mike in the Morning that when Griffin warmed up before this week’s preseason game, he looked like a fundamentally different passer than he had last season."

I'm not sure you realize this but Jaws DID NOT SAY the part you bolded above. The above is an example of media mis-quote.

The quotation states that Jaws said 'he looked like a fundamentally different passer than he had last season.' but Jaws did not say that.

Its akin to creating a strawman. And I'm actually disappointed that you've repeated PFT interpretation as if it was Jaws actual statement.

Thats an example of how false perception is created and pushed through the viral media cycle.

 

You can listen to what Jaws actaully said right here:

http://espn.go.com/espnradio/play?id=9587712

 

Here's what he actually said:

“I was watching him throw the football — there were a few clips — and I was A LITTLE concerned in the weight transfer,” he said. “I didn’t see the clean mechanics I’ve seen in the past. I’m not there every day, I’m not a doctor, but he just looks a little different right now. It’s pregame, it was warmup, people can discount that. I’m just saying from my eye, I didn’t see the clean drops, the weight transfer, stay on that back foot, snap the hips, that I’d seen out of him.”

 

And I agree with his observation. Keep in mind Jaws is comparing what he saw from Griffin going through warms to the pre-injury Griffin. I posted his pro-day workout from Baylor. Maybe you can't see it. But, clearly Griffin right now is not moving nor displaying the mechanics he did then.

 

Period. That is all Jaws is saying and he's right.

Don't confuse your interpretation nor your insecurity with his actual statement.

 

From Jaws:

“I was watching him throw the football — there were a few clips — and I A LITTLE was concerned in the weight transfer,” he said. “I didn’t see the clean mechanics I’ve seen in the past."

 

From the OP Article:

 

The lower body mechanics are clearly a big deal. He can put more zip on the ball with better weight transfer, being able to fully plant and drive. As LaFleur said, there were days early in camp where it was clear Griffin could not plant and drive with authority because of his surgically-repaired right knee. But that hasn’t been the case the past couple weeks.

Where is the contradiction? Just because Griffin can plant and drive with authority now compared to early days in camp does not mean that Griffin can plant and drive and more specifically display the same weight transfer and mechanics he did from the Baylor pro-day.

 

 

What LaFleur likes is how quickly Griffin learns when it comes to his throwing mechanics....

[...]“In two days he looks flawless,” LaFleur said. “He is a quick learner. You only have to tell him something once.”

Griffin's ability to learn or correct mistakes doesn't mean that Griffin right now is throwing with the same weight transfer and mechanics as he did pre-injury.

Again, Jaws' comments were not him saying "RG3 is still being affected by his injury in certain ways, but he's improving. He'll get back to form soon enough." He made no mention of the progress Griffin has shown since OTAs...he made no mention of how RG3 will eventually get back to his old self soon enough. No, his comments were more of the "pronouncement" type. As I said earlier in the thread, he seems way too eager to announce that RG3 is a "fundamentally different passer" now....that his knee injury has changed him as a QB.

 

A little early to be giving that type of analysis, don't you think?...Especially considering how little Jaws himself admits he's observed of Griffin.

It seems you struggle with the idea of an observation. Jaws is comparing Griffin right now to Griffin pre-injury. Sad to see you passing off PFT interpretation of Jaws comments off as Jaws actual comments, when you know they're not.

It surprising to see you so overly sensative and insecure about someones opinion that you seem not to value.

 

Also, why would Jaws have to phrase his observation in another way? To appease you?

[TSO]

The one thing I like that Griffin has over Colin K. is that quick release. Griffin's release is super quick, close to Marino's release speed.

 

And he's more accurate than both Kaep and Wilson, something that often gets overlooked. 

[darrelgreenie]

And he's more accurate than both Kaep and Wilson, something that often gets overlooked. 

 Wilson to my eye is was the best rhythm passer (accuracy included) from last years rookie class.

 

Next to Vick, Griffin is one of the most dynamic QBs I've ever seen. Compared to Kaep I think Griff has much cleaner throwing motion and better deep ball accuracy.

 

But, Kaep actually has a very quick release himself I bet the difference is negligible or the edge goes to Kaep.

http://blog.sfgate.com/49ers/2012/12/18/colin-kaepernick-is-quick-to-get-rid-of-the-ball-according-to-sports-science/

[DC9]

Jaw's didnt say anythign wrong here.  I agree with him and Gruden.  All Jaws said was, you dont go looking for a new QB when the QB you have now is one year removed from Rookie of the year.  I agree.

 

But Gruden was right as well.

 

didn't mean to say anything was wrong on that.  I meant to bring everyone to what I believe is the inception of why he's uber critical about number 10.

 

It was more to the "don't know why he'd start now" portion of what I quoted.

[TSO]

Wilson to my eye is was the best rhythm passer (accuracy included) from last years rookie class.

 

 

Next to Vick, Griffin is one of the most dynamic QBs I've ever seen. Compared to Kaep I think Griff has much cleaner throwing motion and better deep ball accuracy.

 

But, Kaep actually has a very quick release himself I bet the difference is negligible or the edge goes to Kaep.

http://blog.sfgate.com/49ers/2012/12/18/colin-kaepernick-is-quick-to-get-rid-of-the-ball-according-to-sports-science/

 

 

 

 

Have to disagree. I saw Wilson miss guys who were wide open at least once a game, if not two or three times. He's even done that this preseason numerous times already. Robert doesn't miss often, especially if the guy is wide open. I know that because it's been so nice that for once when someone got open deep we'd actually hit him almost every time instead of Campbell's constant over throws to Moss.   

 

The stats also indicate this. Robert is the more accurate passer. And if we wanted to be fair, we'd look at how Wilson's stats looked when he was running the more traditional Seahawk offense versus the one later in the season that incorporated our style of attack.

 

Not saying Wilson is a bad QB at all, of course. I just think we have the best one in every facet, by my eye test and by the stats adding to that evidence.

As for Kaep, from the article you linked to:

 

However, when Kaepernick is throwing 10 or more yards down field, he gets the ball out rapidly. However on shorter throws, he isn’t nearly as quick. Ask about this a few weeks ago, offensive coordinator Greg Roman admitted that Kaepernick’s delivery was “a work in progress.”

......

Miller also jokingly said, “He’s 6 yards away from you, take it easy. Make him throw the check downs under hand.”

That might be one reason the 49ers don’t have as many plays with check down options when Kaepernick is playing. Here’s a look at Keapernick in the Sports Science episode, throwing the ball from 10 yards away.

 

Griffin certainly doesn't have that issue, and shorter throws are a huge part of the NFL nowadays.

[skins214428hail]

Jheri curl?  When did this happen? I thought he had cornrows

If you look at today's rg3 presser it looks like the curl to me. redskin.com

[elkabong82]

This totally contradicts what Jaws said.

 

Reality does that to him a lot

[nuposse87]

Go to the last minute... you're welcome

 

him vouching for the fact that the rams should actually add some talent around Bradford was not idiotic in the least bit. Bradford still doesn't have much talent around him, and there is no doubt the guy had/has talent but it is being wasted in St. louis. I don't think Jaws hates RG III either, I just think he doesn't like anointing young guys until they've won something of consequence, like a playoff game. That and I think ESPN is telling him to stir up BS when they know there isn't much to talk about during summer.