Corcaigh Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 On Samoa, the girls have dreamy eyes over that video. The Rock Band for Xbox 'drum kit' in the corner is a nice touch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 The Rock Band for Xbox 'drum kit' in the corner is a nice touch. I didn't even know Forehead could dance like that. ---------- Post added January-24th-2013 at 11:24 AM ---------- Similar to you, I tend to get a bit more "outspoken" (if that's possible), in real life, when I hear complete ignorance regarding many personal issues. When I read you, I'm often reminded of someone I hang with from time to time. It's always a bet among our other acquaintances as to who's going to get into the most trouble first when we hit the bars. I think age (she's 31) is finally (thing goodness) evening things out and I am mellowing (and just more beat-up). :evilg: I actually try to go out in "disguise" and never carry any business cards. :pfft: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo-toni Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 How about we require nutrition as a prerequisite course for HS and college. For that matter, let's stop having the Dept of Agriculture - the salesrep for our nation's overly subsidized farmers- advising our citizens on what to eat. My wife gets supremely pissed off because I insist on reading the labels of any processed food before buying or eating such products, but it's not rocket science to learn what ingredients should be avoided or acceptable levels of carbs, sugars, or saturated fats. Meanwhile our high fructose ad agencies manage to convince a lot of nitwits that they can feel good about eating fat free candy bars.. While the quasi-starvationist image of many models should be repudiated, society should not be embracing obesity any more than any other harmful addiction, whether it's cocaine, cigs, alcohol, or sugar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom [Giants fan] Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 As someone who has dealt with weight problems his whole life, people making fun of me just makes me want to eat more. And makes me want to punch them right in the face in all honesty. And think about it this way. With the rising rate of violence, how long would it be before someone shoots someone or goes on a spree and they blame it on being ridiculed and made fun of because they are fat? This is the dumbest thing I have ever heard suggested in any form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special K Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 When I read you, I'm often reminded of someone I hang with from time to time. It's always a bet among our other acquaintances as to who's going to get into the most trouble first when we hit the bars. I think age (she's 31) is finally (thing goodness) evening things out and I am mellowing (and just more beat-up). :evilg: I actually try to go out in "disguise" and never carry any business cards. :pfft: Fantastic! I remind you of an mentally uneven chick I suppose it's deserved...my friends and I don't even make bets anymore: I'm always the one who gets into trouble first. Recognizing this, I've placed a curfew on all peripheral identification in my purse - everything has to be out by happy hour :pfft: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Agree to all that, RT. We can positively endorse what's best without hypocritically/selectively crapping all over those who "do it wrong" when it comes to thing that don't impact us real directly (as opposed to drunken driving or second hand smoke concerns, for instance). There's even plenty of justifiable room for blunt approaches among educational or positional statements on health of various forms. The hard, no-punches pulled, but intelligently constructed technique, when reviewing consequences of behavioral choices, has a definitive place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special K Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 ;9409866'] And makes me want to punch them right in the face in all honesty. I, for one, say go for it! Just PM me where you want the bail money sent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom [Giants fan] Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 I, for one, say go for it! Just PM me where you want the bail money sent If people did it to me enough, I wouldn't even think or care about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Fantastic! I remind you of an mentally uneven chick I suppose it's deserved...my friends and I don't even make bets anymore: I'm always the one who gets into trouble first. Recognizing this, I've placed a curfew on all peripheral identification in my purse - everything has to be out by happy hour :pfft: Hey, she's highly intelligent, beautiful, strong, interesting, and volatile---or as I put it, perfect! You should feel complimented. My fave happy hour place that was my fave hang out (one of the best bars in the country IMO) is in the most fun few blocks of downtown (including proximity to awesome waterfront and parks with one hosting lots of free music in the summer), and favored by everyone from the college crowd to collars of all colors and all angles of diversity, and it's about 7 blocks from the state capital campus, and from 4-7 (365) the beers are $1 pint or $1.50 for some imports and well drinks (very stiff pouring) are $1.50. Let your imagination flow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popeman38 Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Nah, Bioethics is a real thing. In fact, most hospitals have them to help determine tough end of life situations, along with the family that is. Not unilaterally. Please god don't think I'm talking death panels anyone. Point is, there are real docs who are bioethicists.See! Death panels are real!!! Obama is the anti-Christ!! :evilg: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Symbol Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Obese people know they're fat, many of them are either:. C. Unhappy with how they look, and in denial about their ability to lose weight (ie they use bad genetics, medications, childhood issues, etc. as excuses) To explain C- yes, there are people who are more genetically prone to being fat, there are certainly health issues, surgeries, medications, and any number of problems from a person's past which can all serve to increase the likelihood that a person will be fat. It does not mean that a person has to be fat and obese, and is likely an excuse. What about a D? I am fat, but at the same time, I don't eat a lot of unhealthy foods, my caloric intake is between 2000-2500 per day. I do not eat fast food, because quite frankly that stuff is disgusting. My problem is the fact that injuries when I WAS NOT overweight and played sports has caused me to be no where near as active as I need to be. I have a knee injury that multiple doctors have ensured me might or might not work. I was in a car accident that has tore up my back, I have arthritis in my shoulder and both wrists. Is this an excuse, no, I guess I could tone down my caloric intake to the point of making it dangerous for my health, I could attempt the surgery on my knee and maybe I can eventually have the ability to run again, then again, I may make it worse and it would keep me from even being able to walk. Not everything is as simple as putting things in a little list, and I am not attempting to put you down for your opinion, just providing you with certain facts that may add to your list or slightly give you more understanding of other parts of this situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 What about a D? I am fat, but at the same time, I don't eat a lot of unhealthy foods, my caloric intake is between 2000-2500 per day. . Sounds like my brother , I eat two or three times that. The guy is a ignorant jerk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Symbol, I don't mean this in an offensive way at all, so please don't take it as such. Are you able to walk? Could you take walks totaling 1-2 hours per day? I think as we get older and more rickety, we have to find more creative ways to stay active. Not all of us can keep up the activity level we were used to. I went from playing 3 sports through high school, to jogging 4 miles per day 5-6 times per week, to now jumping rope/doing the elliptical a couple times per week. The reason is a combination of time commitments, my body slowing down as I age, and other priorities. So, my point is, I understand that you can't jog or run. But if you can walk you can burn some calories. My mom has never jogged or done anything other than go on walks outside. She walks during her lunch hour and again in the evenings. She's in fantastic shape for someone over 60 years old. I think we just need to evolve. I know there are guys out there who do marathons in their 40s...but for every one of those there are probably 10 guys who stay in shape just fitting in some activity when they can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissU28 Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Why do we have to do anything at all?? Why do people need to find a cure for everything? People who are fat know it's unhealthy. Why do people feel the need to try and make everyone not fat? Educate them, but let people live how they want to live. Why are people so engrossed with other peoples' lives? I understand if it's your own family member, but fat-shaming people just to make yourself feel like you did your good deed for the day is stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Why do we have to do anything at all?? Why do people need to find a cure for everything? People who are fat know it's unhealthy. Why do people feel the need to try and make everyone not fat? Educate them, but let people live how they want to live. Why are people so engrossed with other peoples' lives? I understand if it's your own family member, but fat-shaming people just to make yourself feel like you did your good deed for the day is stupid. I want to let you know I don't think shaming them is the correct way to go about this. But to answer the questions in order: 1) Because people are stupid and sometime need to be told what to do for their own good. Like seatbelts. 2) Because people die and we don't want them to? 3) Because healthcare costs have quintupled or more as our weight as a country goes up. Agree on the educate. 4) Because for every person that smokes, takes drugs or is obese, my health insurance premiums go up on my paycheck. I'm paying for other people to "live the way they want." Again, 100% agree this guy is a nut and there is a better way to help people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special K Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Why do we have to do anything at all?? Why do people need to find a cure for everything? People who are fat know it's unhealthy. Why do people feel the need to try and make everyone not fat? Educate them, but let people live how they want to live. Why are people so engrossed with other peoples' lives? I understand if it's your own family member, but fat-shaming people just to make yourself feel like you did your good deed for the day is stupid. Why obesity has become such a concern is the impact it has on the health of our nation. Obese people are placing an immense burden on our health care system and costing taxpayers an unbelievable amount of money in treating diseases that are largely preventable. We are seeing an epidemic of overweight and obese children presenting with chronic diseases usually manifesting in adulthood (40's & 50's) are now occurring more regularly in young children. As far as the comparison to smokers made in this report: many of the diseases they suffer from are a result of smoking and thus, preventable. I believe the nation's (and even worldwide) public approach to decreasing tobacco use (massive campaigns on billboards, cigarette packs, awareness days, and on and on) is where this bioethicist is drawing a large part of his strategy from. Which is a headscratcher for me since I think the underlying psychological factors of obesity make it a very different issue than that of tobacco use and one has to be devoid of common sense to so closely relate the two. Anyway, bottom line of why people care is the impact that it has been proven to have on our health care system. It affects all of us whether we are obese or not... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corcaigh Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Not to forget, they are not an aesthetically pleasing sight as I look out the window. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Why do we have to do anything at all?? Why do people need to find a cure for everything? People who are fat know it's unhealthy. Why do people feel the need to try and make everyone not fat? Educate them, but let people live how they want to live. Why are people so engrossed with other peoples' lives? I understand if it's your own family member, but fat-shaming people just to make yourself feel like you did your good deed for the day is stupid. Another fair and valid perspective. As I noted earlier, one (not the only) primary diver for such "bashing" or "judging" is simply to serve one's own self-identity/ego "needs" (via posturing as "better than" a "lesser" in some category of "measurement"). When in operation, it is an immature (in the developmental sense) form of self-validation, and it's noted existence in an individual is usually met with fierce denial and protests of how "secure" they are and how they're just "stating facts." It's a particularly powerful drive among young to middle-age males, in our culture, and not unrelated to "competition" in general. In more benign manifestations, it is a normal for us to define ourselves by as much in opposition to something we see in others, as it is to make positive declarations about ourselves. But that can still be internalized like an intelligent grown-up and in useful fashion: "I prefer being as fit as I can" or "I work on staying fit even when it's hard" or "I don't like being too overweight" versus "Ewww---fatties. They suck and should get it together." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissU28 Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 I want to let you know I don't think shaming them is the correct way to go about this. But to answer the questions in order:1) Because people are stupid and sometime need to be told what to do for their own good. Like seatbelts. 2) Because people die and we don't want them to? 3) Because healthcare costs have quintupled or more as our weight as a country goes up. Agree on the educate. 4) Because for every person that smokes, takes drugs or is obese, my health insurance premiums go up on my paycheck. I'm paying for other people to "live the way they want." Again, 100% agree this guy is a nut and there is a better way to help people. 1 and 2) I guess I am not that empathetic towards people. If someone is smoking when they know it's deadly, or tanning when they know it's deadly, or racking up the pounds when they know it's deadly, sorry, I don't feel the same sort of empathy towards them that I would someone who got sick after living a healthier life. I used to tan a lot in college- if I found out I had melanoma now, I would blame myself for being an idiot. Back then I knew it was bad, yet I still did it. I don't agree with laws that are preventative. If someone wants to be an idiot, let them. If they die because of it, it sucks, but they knew the risk. Obviously, this is the libertarian in me. I know that sounds harsh, but I am a huge believer in personal responsibility. 3-4) That can be an argument, if our premiums are truly going up because of other people. I don't want to subsidize other people. Their insurance bills should be higher. ---------- Post added January-24th-2013 at 05:02 PM ---------- I can understand the health insurance argument. But maybe the problem isn't whether we should change these people, it's how to change the health insurance mandates so they are fair for people based on their lifestyles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special K Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 3-4) That can be an argument, if our premiums are truly going up because of other people. I don't want to subsidize other people. Their insurance bills should be higher I definitely understand your frustration and I agree with changing insurance rules. However, what do you think about patients not paying private insurance premiums, like those on Medicaid and Medicare? What do you think should be done with that. Please don't take this as a sarcastic question, I'm genuinely curious as to your thoughts on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 And I completely agree with this from Special K: Why obesity has become such a concern is the impact it has on the health of our nation. Obese people are placing an immense burden on our health care system and costing taxpayers an unbelievable amount of money in treating diseases that are largely preventable. We are seeing an epidemic of overweight and obese children presenting with chronic diseases usually manifesting in adulthood (40's & 50's) are now occurring more regularly in young children. But I will add that dietary/exercise related issues of much of the "non-fat" population, that are at least as much behaviorally related as the "fatties", are not getting the same highlighting as they are (or as tobacco or alcohol abuse). Sadly, to my informed speculation, this is at least partly because they do not trigger certain aspects of our "cultural personality" to "object to them" and identify them as a demographic. I.E. they are not "fatties" (or drunks or smokers) but have diets and lack of exercise that make them a demographically significant user of health systems, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissU28 Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 I definitely understand your frustration and I agree with changing insurance rules. However, what do you think about patients not paying private insurance premiums, like those on Medicaid and Medicare? What do you think should be done with that.Please don't take this as a sarcastic question, I'm genuinely curious as to your thoughts on this. I don't know, I haven't thought it through. I'm not even sure how those programs work, to be honest with you. I just know that a chunk of my money gets paid to Medicare each month. Maybe your medicare/medicaid contribution can be dependent on your own health? If you're a smoker, you have to pay a certain extra percentage or something. I don't know how people would monitor that and I"m sure people would lie, but I don't want to pay for other people. Or privatize medicare? I don't know enough about either program to make a valid argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special K Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 But I will add that dietary/exercise related issues of much of the "non-fat" population, that are at least as much behaviorally related as the "fatties", are not getting the same highlighting as they are (or as tobacco or alcohol abuse). Sadly, to my informed speculation, this is at least partly because they do not trigger certain aspects of our "cultural personality" to "object to them" and identify them as a demographic. I.E. they are not "fatties" (or drunks or smokers) but have diets and lack of exercise that make them a demographically significant user of health systems, too. That's interesting that you bring that up. I absolutely agree with this as people can look "normal," but have terrible nutrition/exercise habits that greatly increase their risk of insulin resistance that helps lead to chronic diseases obese people routinely suffer from. And yes, sadly this demographic is largely ignored (until someone suffers a massive MI) in the nutrition and exercise discussion and educational outreach. One of the most prominent quotes I have taken away from the book I'm currently reading about insomnia (self-help so I can stop being a complete vampire ) written by an esteemed sleep expert from Harvard is that "exercise is the closest to a 'magic bullet,' healthwise, that there is." When I started reading, I didn't think there would be as big of an emphasis on nutrition and exercise in an insomnia book (don't really know why, they are obviously closely tied to many sleep disorders :dunce: ). My experience, as well as my opinions stemming from reading research and what the real experts have to say about health and wellness, is that national discussion and outreach regarding exercise and nutrition is SEVERELY lacking among ALL demographics. We really are doing a disservice to our population, and particularly the youngest ones by tying exercise and nutrition so closely to obesity and "weight issues," when this is a subject that needs to be extended to the population as a whole, whether you appear "healthy" or morbidly obese. I don't know, I haven't thought it through. I'm not even sure how those programs work, to be honest with you. I just know that a chunk of my money gets paid to Medicare each month. Maybe your medicare/medicaid contribution can be dependent on your own health? If you're a smoker, you have to pay a certain extra percentage or something. I don't know how people would monitor that and I"m sure people would lie, but I don't want to pay for other people. Or privatize medicare? I don't know enough about either program to make a valid argument. I just ask, not because I have any solid evidence at my fingertips at the moment, because I think a large portion of preventable diseases reside in this insurance demographic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 ]I can understand the health insurance argument. But maybe the problem isn't whether we should change these people, it's how to change the health insurance mandates so they are fair for people based on their lifestyles. why not charge them for how much they use it? I want a rebate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 why not charge them for how much they use it?I want a rebate Because some people can't afford to pay for how much they use it, and many of them are the same people that have issues with making good decisions to their diet/exercise regimes (which is almost certainly partly cultural and societal). And for various reasons (partly moral and partly because of the larger public health issues related to things like infectious diseases) we want a robust healthcare system that the vast majority of the population can access. If your fat and you can't pay your fat "fee", what happens when you can't afford regular antibiotics and you end up growing antibiotic resistant TB? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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