WT: Redskins have some pieces that fit, some that don’t (Haslett quote)

[Lavarleap56]

My guess would be that we are planning to get Meriweather back next week and Shanny wants to see if that has an impact on our play on the field. I could be reaching here...

There is that.. The other one I have heard is Bruce Allens not sure about rolling Raheem out into this mess or not before the offseason. A lot of fans rag on Raheem but Allen thinks he can be a very very good head coach still....

---------- Post added November-10th-2012 at 12:17 AM ----------

For a simplistic hit and run look at this issue:

Haslett average points ranking running 3-4 defenses:

16.5

Haslett average points allowed ranking running 4-3 defenses:

24.6

Maybe Haslett prefers the 4-3 because the 3-4 more readily exposes a coach's lack of creativity and ability to scheme, while a bad 4-3 defense can be blamed on "talent" like he's attempting to do now? Sadly, there's nobody in the media who's been able to break down the utter ineptitude of Has's scheme like posters on here have.

Again, wanna see a 3-4 that's not loaded with talent up and down the roster? Look at the Colts.

I think he was just more up to date and current on the 4-3. Usually NFL changes every 3 years and advances, a lot of changes happen in ten years..

[darrelgreenie]

Exactly what in the OP is digging at Haslett ?

Mahon's might have been refering to the OP, I was refering to the general ES sentiment expressed in these threads.

---------- Post added November-9th-2012 at 09:58 PM ----------

I wasn't high on Kyle either; I considered him to be a product of Johnson/Shaub being stud players, but I also know he is young, and will adjust and learn. Haslett has been around the block with a number of teams, and has a proven track record of failure.

If having stud players makes Haslett look good, then that doesn't make him a good coach, it only places him at the right place at the right time.

Thats not coaching...

You know the difference between this offense and the average to far below average previous Kyle Shanahan Redskin's offenses? Talent spelled: R o b e r t G r i f f i n

---------- Post added November-9th-2012 at 10:00 PM ----------

I wasn't high on Kyle either; I considered him to be a product of Johnson/Shaub being stud players, but I also know he is young, and will adjust and learn. Haslett has been around the block with a number of teams, and has a proven track record of failure.

If having stud players makes Haslett look good, then that doesn't make him a good coach, it only places him at the right place at the right time.

Thats not coaching...

You know the difference between this offense and the average to far below average previous Kyle Shanahan Redskin's offenses? Talent spelled: R o b e r t G r i f f i n

[Bishop Hammer]

What a jerk. When you point a finger three more are pointing back at you.

[MustangSteve]

How in the blue hell can that man say he put's the players into position(s) to win? I see 15 yard cushions on 3rd 5, a 3 man pass rush, soft zone, a cover zero on a crucial 3rd down, etc. etc. etc.

:applause: Thank you Boss Hog! It also sounds to me like Haslett is putting all the blame on the players as well. You give that man a hall of fame defense in their prime, and they would still give up 30 points because of Hasletts 3 man rush, soft cushion and no intensity! I seriously do not see Haslett stopping the Eagles or Cowboys, so lets hope and pray for a lot of points somehow.

[moondog]

"I come to work, I work hard, I do the best I can with what we got and try to put these guys in position to win games and be successful on defense,” “That’s all really I can do.” ............

.

Given your close® interaction with the players, what do you feel is the general mindset of the players right now? Does it seem like they'll come together and finish strong, or is it more along the lines of a "Why the hell is our head coach and coordinator saying this ****" and it's going to continue to suck for fans/team down the stretch for the final 7 games like normal?

[MumboSauce]

I don't like that at all. Changes need to be made unfortunately, smh..again.

[Lavarleap56]

Given your close® interaction with the players, what do you feel is the general mindset of the players right now? Does it seem like they'll come together and finish strong, or is it more along the lines of a "Why the hell is our head coach and coordinator saying this ****" and it's going to continue to suck for fans/team down the stretch for the final 7 games like normal?

Honestly Haslett and some defensive players haven't been on the same page since last season. This year has been much of the same and the losing is compounding the frustrations of everyone involved.

[blitzpackage]

I can't defend what he's saying but I try to look at it in context. All of the big plays, the game-changers, were a result of poor execution. We've all seen it, whether it's Madieu standing flat footed against Cruz(among others), DHall trying to jump a route and leaving Armanti freakin' Edwards wide open for 70+ yards, Josh Wilson taking a horrible angle to the sidelines and allowing a long TD, Richard Crawford getting burnt in the slot, some really poor tackling.....it's too disheartening. That being said, maybe it is time for a coaching or philosophy change.

We've been in every game, even PIT and CAR. You just can't give up big plays and that's been our weakness. What in the hell has happened to our pass rush? Rak wasn't THAT dominant. Where in the hell has Bowen, Cofield and Jenkins been? Carriker is a marginal player. No push whatsoever...nothing like we saw last year or even in the preseason. Why is Perry Riley's name never called, like, ever? London is 5 steps slower than he was last year for some reason. Sometimes, regardless of scheme we all know it's about whooping the guy's ass in front of you and we're simply not up to the task. We knew our secondary was a weakness heading in, now we're down two "starters" and it's been an absolute train wreck. Man up and beat your guy. I keep asking myself on third and long, screaming at the TV...please someone STEP UP. Who wants to make a play? We need it right now! Nobody. Nobody wants to make a play, at least not regularly.

[Chump Bailey]

Carriker is a marginal player.

The difference in the DL play without him is stark. I don't think he is a marginal player at all.

[blitzpackage]

The difference in the DL play without him is stark. I don't think he is a marginal player at all.

When it comes to pass rush he's marginal and we are quite capable of stopping the run without him. Maybe "average" would've been a better word choice?

My broader point is more of an indictment of the rest of the DL than a real knock on Carriker. Do you really think if he wasn't injured we'd.....oh, nevermind - just noticed your avatar.

[MartinC]

When it comes to pass rush he's marginal and we are quite capable of stopping the run without him. Maybe "average" would've been a better word choice?

My broader point is more of an indictment of the rest of the DL than a real knock on Carriker. Do you really think if he wasn't injured we'd.....oh, nevermind - just noticed your avatar.

Adam Carriker had 5.5 sacks last year which is excellent production from a 3-4 DE not called JJ Watt. I would not make a claim he is an All Pro or elite player but he is more than a marginal starter as well.

[Est.1974]

"I come to work, I work hard, I do the best I can with what we got and try to put these guys in position to win games and be successful on defense,” “That’s all really I can do.”

I don't have an issue with that statement. The whole things a mess. The guy may not be very good at his job, but I'm done with giving him a hard time.

This is Mike Shanahans mess. The longer he lets it roll, the more I want to fully lay all blame at his door.

[Wyvern]

From what I see of the games, the defensive front seven lost alot when Carriker and Orakpo went down. That was a signiificant blow to it's ability to generate pressure.

Jenkins hasn't emerged as much of a threat, and Cofield isn't a great fit at NT, and neither Baker nor Wilson compensate for what Orakpo was providing --so the numbers now favor the opponents offensive line. They can double Kerrigan or occasionally double Bowen on plays running his way -- and the front seven pressure is neutralized And since Fletcher seems to be diminishing his range of what he can cover/tackle, sending Riley becomes a real risk -- especially with the porous secondary behind this front seven.

And using DBs to help the front seven generate pressure -- well that puts some folks (usually Hall) on the island. Until we get better play out of the folks replacing Carriker and Orakpo, or the DBs show they can handle their assignments with little or no help-- the Skins defense can either risk giving up the big scoring plays, or give up a long series of short plays and hope to stop the team at the goal-line.

[justice98]

When it comes to pass rush he's marginal and we are quite capable of stopping the run without him. Maybe "average" would've been a better word choice?

My broader point is more of an indictment of the rest of the DL than a real knock on Carriker. Do you really think if he wasn't injured we'd.....oh, nevermind - just noticed your avatar.

I would agree with that assessment.

[RandyHolt]

Maybe its the bad fit guys we converted to 3-4 not doing well in his 4-3 looks we use. Disclaimer, I am not sure how many 4-3 looks or fronts we show this year, if any at all. Are Fletcher and Riley great 3-4 backers??? Are our LB collectively making the grade this year?

The question is how to fix the problem. We are not going to promote a Todd Bowles.

I would start with basics, generate a pass rush by simply blitzing players the offense is not expecting to come. No, not on a delayed blitz exclusively. Stunt in the first clear passing situation next game.

If possible, ease the load on London a little bit. Maybe have him blitz more often to get him out of coverage. Try and feature Riley or others instead.

Smarter play calling. Dont be in man coverage up 4 with 90 seconds left, the offense having to drive 80 yards.

Live dangerously and stop deferring and try to get an early score from RG3 affording the D the luxury to be a bit more aggressive. Put pressure early on the opposition with our best player, as a priority. Not pressuring RG3, who keeps trotting onto the field cold, the team and fans flat, already down a score.

Its not rocket science. But if our coaches do not even try to adjust, its not a lack of talent causing it. It is stubbornness and a refusal to even consider what they are calling is not working.

[LaxinFish29]

You guys do realize every question he is asked is put in the article? If this is on the heels of questions about injuries then I see no problem with it. I know it's easy to jump to conclusions when you don't like someone for whatever reason but didn't we JUST go through this with Mike's presser?

[Chump Bailey]

Maybe its the bad fit guys we converted to 3-4 not doing well in his 4-3 looks we use. Disclaimer, I am not sure how many 4-3 looks or fronts we show this year, if any at all. Are Fletcher and Riley great 3-4 backers??? Are our LB collectively making the grade this year?

I think Mike is and was simply too fixated on the 3-4. IMO, we should abandon it outright immediately. We are much better suited for the 4-3 and with minor tweaks, we could become a dominate defense in a short period of time once again IMO.

If he's fully healthy, Orakpo is an effective weak-side DE. He has the necessary power/speed and IMO flashed excellence when we ran the 4-3.

Adam Carriker IMO could anchor the LDE position very effectively.

Cofield, Bowen, Baker, Jenkins all could be an absolute force in the middle.

Riley, Robinson and Kerrigan all make for an excellent 4-3 LB group.

We would have plenty of quality DL depth better suited for the 4-3. The pressure such an above line could create would allow the LB's and secondary to be in position to make numerous plays. We still nee to add talent to the secondary in the shape of FS & CB, but IMO, making the change back to the 4-3 would solve our problems in a quick and efficient manner.

[moondog]

Honestly Haslett and some defensive players haven't been on the same page since last season. This year has been much of the same and the losing is compounding the frustrations of everyone involved.

Do you get the feeling the players have Shanahan's back and want to turn this thing around, or is the majority of the team just kind of in a funk? I guess what I'm asking is does this team seem to have the heart, desire and chemistry in the locker room to go out on fire this year rolling into next year to right the ship or will they just continue sinking?

[RandyHolt]

I think Mike is and was simply too fixated on the 3-4. IMO, we should abandon it outright immediately. We are much better suited for the 4-3 and with minor tweaks, we could become a dominate defense in a short period of time once again IMO.

If he's fully healthy, Orakpo is an effective weak-side DE.....

I think with his year off, he became committed to it, convinced it was key. But after X number of years, I want him to man up and admit it failed. I won't hold my breath but support a DC change tried before the full abort. Change tried this week... sigh. Did Philly's D tank after going Bowling?

The issue is we committed to converting Rak and Kerrigan. We have to reinvent the wheel to switch back, bulk them up. I am not sure I want Kerrigan a full time 43LB, but he can go hand in dirt in passing downs.

Is it possible that one could be stout enough to be a strong sider, or is there any scheme to make it work? If not, it would encourage teams to run on us in what has become a passing league, so maybe we could pull it off. Have a big ole Sam behind Kerrigan. What do I know, but if neither struggled against the run in college it could work.

Kerrigan Bowen Cofield Rak

Mann and Manley Part II.

[Chump Bailey]

The issue is we committed to converting Rak and Kerrigan. We have to reinvent the wheel to switch back, bulk them up. I am not sure I want Kerrigan a full time 43LB, but he can go hand in dirt in passing downs.

While both are adept in the pass rush aspect, Ryan, IMHO, has the added ability to not be a huge liability in coverage and can make plays in space better than Rak.

[Renegade7]

He's basically saying the same thing Shanny said concerning evaluations. Even though its not what you want to hear the coaches say out loud per say, its true by just watching or re-watching the games for failed execution and lack of speed/talent on defense. We weren't really able to improve out defense in the offseason and have started to go backward mostly impart to injuries and age. What I'm seeing on defense is move to keep teams in front of us, an it has brought down our yardage and points allowed. It just continues to get beat like a dead horse because injuries on offense are starting to slow down our points scored.

As much as people want to continue to pile on about the defense because of the carolina game, you should be beat someone if you hold them to 21 points at home. You aren't going to beat many if any team only scoring 13 yourself. Haslett can't get creative because his blitzes aren't getting home and his secondary can't cover. Now he looks even worse with the offense starting to slow down. Changing one guy isn't going to make enough of a difference, this problem is that complex...

[RandyHolt]

While both are adept in the pass rush aspect, Ryan, IMHO, has the added ability to not be a huge liability in coverage and can make plays in space better than Rak.

Oh I agree, the candidate to be in coverage of the 2 is Kerrigan. But he still looks a little stiff to me and admittedly, is still learning and adjusting. That's the problem with the 34, drafting 43 guys with your number 1 pick, and kind of hoping they excel in pass coverage.

Without over thinking it, drafting the near best collegiate 4-3 DE and making him a 4-3 LB is probably a dumb idea.

What I dont like, is by making those 2 guys lose so much weight they become speed rushers only, which makes them less dynamic rushing the passer. Speed around the outside over and over is great, but only when you get push up the middle. We get none. We could use a Jumpy Geathers pitchforking OL.

[Chump Bailey]

Speed around the outside over and over is great, but only when you get push up the middle. We get none. We could use a Jumpy Geathers pitchforking OL.

I'm with this line of thinking too, which is why I prefer the 4-3. IMO, we have good personnel to get that crucial push in the middle. We would simply create better matchups overall with our DL acting as the catalyst if we were to employ the 4-3 - IMO.

[skins island connection]

Mahon's might have been refering to the OP, I was refering to the general ES sentiment expressed in these threads.

---------- Post added November-9th-2012 at 09:58 PM ----------

You know the difference between this offense and the average to far below average previous Kyle Shanahan Redskin's offenses? Talent spelled: R o b e r t G r i f f i n

---------- Post added November-9th-2012 at 10:00 PM ----------

You know the difference between this offense and the average to far below average previous Kyle Shanahan Redskin's offenses? Talent spelled: R o b e r t G r i f f i n

I can't dispute the issue with Kyle, but he is a young OC, and yes I did question his credentials, but you also have to look at what we had last year at QB; Rex Grossman, who was far below average at his skill.

Haslett's case is different; he's BEEN to numerous teams, and never stuck with one because he never did any good with any of them; and as you see where his schemes are porous, if you can call vanilla a scheme, he doesn't have any creativity to at least partially cover up a weakness.

Kyle is young, and hopefully he will learn; Haslett has been doing this for over a decade, and has failed. Its time to cut him loose...

[cphil006]

The worst years Pittsburgh had on defense were the couple of years Haslett "coached" them...