RGIII. Peyton Manning's rookie year. And what we can all learn and take from the comparison.

[Boss_Hogg]

Like most rookie QBs, RG3 is going to struggle. I just hope our fellow fans and mediots realize this and grind with him as learns and develops.

[Mursilis]

Like most rookie QBs, RG3 is going to struggle. I just hope our fellow fans and mediots realize this and grind with him as learns and develops.

Every QB struggles sometimes - even Peyton had bad games well into his career. But there's a huge gulf between that and Blaine Gabbert-level struggling. I hope it doesn't get that bad, and I don't expect that it will.

[IrepDC]

I appreciate posts like these, but I am certain our fanbase will not learn from it. It's very unfortunate, but I already know that fans won't have patience if Griffin has a rocky start like that.

[Hazel-Ra]

Great post... I have no illusions about rookie hiccups. Even though a 5-1 start would RULE, it's not likely. Anyway... who is under more pressure:

Andrew Luck- #1 pick and following an icon?

Robert Griffin III- #2 pick whose franchise made a deal with the devil after 4 lustra of losing and plays for a notoriously fickle fan base?

Cam Newton- #1 pick who excelled all expectations his rookie year and now faces the "sophomore slump"?

---------- Post added August-22nd-2012 at 10:43 AM ----------

Every QB struggles sometimes - even Peyton had bad games well into his career. But there's a huge gulf between that and Blaine Gabbert-level struggling. I hope it doesn't get that bad, and I don't expect that it will.

What little I've seen of Gabbert this preseason has looked good so maybe he's turning the corner as well and we should keep that in mind.

[CapnRedskins]

*Claps* Probably the best thread I've read regarding our rookie QB and putting it all in perspective.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

*Claps* Probably the best thread I've read regarding our rookie QB and putting it all in perspective.

Greatly appreciated man, but save yourself any trouble and edit the quote down before a mod takes you to task for quoting too big a post.

Hail.

[kleese]

It was also the first year for the coaching staff as well and they had a horrendous defense--- ranked second to last in the league. If you told me this was Shanny's first year AND we were going to have the worst defense in the league, I'd fully expect a 3-4 win season under RG3.

And because you mentioned my thread, I will say that I did not say Shanny should get fired for a bad year this year--- merely that it should put him on the hot seat and make 2013 a very important year in terms of finally winning games. To that end, I will grant Shanny another year, even at 3-13 or 4-12 this year (but id lose almost all faith). I'd then fully expect 12-4 or 13-3 in 2013 which is only fair if we are going to stick to the Manning script.

[Mursilis]

To that end, I will grant Shanny another year, even at 3-13 or 4-12 this year (but id lose almost all faith). I'd then fully expect 12-4 or 13-3 in 2013 which is only fair if we are going to stick to the Manning script.

I'd really have a hard time accepting 3-13 or 4-12 from a coach with a rep like Shanahan's. Spurrier looked like he gave up in 2004, and he still won 5 games. Zorn won 4 before he was let go. I can't think of a single coach generally considered good or great who won only 3-4 games in a single season. If Grossman won 5 games last year, this team has to do at least as well under RG3, rookie mistakes or not. I think there's enough talent here to equal last year, and probably do better.

[kleese]

I'd really have a hard time accepting 3-13 or 4-12 from a coach with a rep like Shanahan's. Spurrier looked like he gave up in 2004, and he still won 5 games. Zorn won 4 before he was let go. I can't think of a single coach generally considered good or great who won only 3-4 games in a single season. If Grossman won 5 games last year, this team has to do at least as well under RG3, rookie mistakes or not. I think there's enough talent here to equal last year, and probably do better.

There are examples of great coaches with lousy records... Jimmy Johnson going 1-15 being one of them.

However, finding a great coach getting 3 or 4 wins in his third year? That's harder to find.

[Mursilis]

There are examples of great coaches with lousy records... Jimmy Johnson going 1-15 being one of them.

However, finding a great coach getting 3 or 4 wins in his third year? That's harder to find.

Forgot about Johnson - good one. Still, that was in his first year ever head coaching at the NFL level, so he got a pass on that, deservedly so. He added 6 wins in his second year and 5 more the year after that. Clearly, he got better.

[Cliffmark1]

Good thread to help us keep our expectations in-line with reality. I think Cam Newton and other rookies getting in their first year and lighting it up has set the expectations high.

It will be interesting to see how those who light it up the first year compare over three years to someone like Peyton.

[wholee]

When we have "put it together", the Offense will do things that we have rarely/never seen before. There won't be any comparisons. I get it though, I'm desperate to see Robert play well just like everyone else and that's where a lot of these comparisons come from. The system is proven and once we master the basics and begin to have a few wrinkles here and there... I'm really trying to contain myself. Hail!

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

You will learn nothing from the comparison.

That is all.

[Est.1974]

It was also the first year for the coaching staff as well and they had a horrendous defense--- ranked second to last in the league. If you told me this was Shanny's first year AND we were going to have the worst defense in the league, I'd fully expect a 3-4 win season under RG3.

Agreed, pretty much my first thought as well.

We have invested big-time on D, both via the draft & FA, this added to the investment in RG3 has me looking at 6-8 wins minimum.

I agree RG3 needs time, and I think it is impossible to judge his preseason that well - fact is Shanny is keeping alot under wraps plus he's putting RG3 in various situations that don't equate to immediate success in the preseason. Its all about learning.

But I'm expecting production from the kid. No excuses. Or not that many, anyway.

[Hooper]

Whatever RG3 does this year is okay with me. I would like to see improvement as the season goes forward, but I will not be calling for the benching of RG3 ever.

I'm with you. I'm expecting some major growing pains with the guy. Most folks just don't seem to realize how much he has to learn about playing QB. The system at Baylor is hardly the best training for a NFL QB. I just hope he learns to get rid of the ball quick because despite his listed weight, he doesn't look a guy who can withstand much punishment. Hell, he looks downright tiny under center at times. At least compared to guys like Tannehill and especially Luck, who looks like a damn linebacker under center.

---------- Post added August-22nd-2012 at 09:09 PM ----------

Andrew Luck is considered the best prospect since Peyton Manning.

Peyton Manning is one of the greatest QBs in the NFL, and his rookie season was the bench mark.

Cam Newton broke Peyton Mannings rookie records.

Yet, many consider Robert Griffin a better prospect then Newton.

And Luck is still considered to be a better prospect then both Griffin and Newton.

Newton had some real question marks coming in. Mostly about his passing ability. Character concerns too -- maybe legit, but definitely flamed by middle-aged sportswriters who got pretty ugly when writing about him. What he proved in his rookie season is that he is a flat-out man among boys, even in the NFL. The guy is a physical freak. If he develops into a consistently dangerous passer... I mean, he's probably the best QB in the league then, right?

Luck just makes things look so damn easy you're almost not impressed by him on first glance. Then you notice he is absolutely carving up your defense. He's also an amazing athlete -- something some don't seem to realize because I don't know, they just don't expect it from him or something. I think he's going to be a very good, if not great NFL QB from day one.

I think it's going to be a bit of a struggle for RG3 all rookie season. Will be real surprised if he has a better rookie year than Luck this year, or Newton last year. Hope I'm wrong and man, I can't wait to see how Shanny uses him.

[bird_1972]

I'm with you. I'm expecting some major growing pains with the guy. Most folks just don't seem to realize how much he has to learn about playing QB. The system at Baylor is hardly the best training for a NFL QB. I just hope he learns to get rid of the ball quick because despite his listed weight, he doesn't look a guy who can withstand much punishment. Hell, he looks downright tiny under center at times. At least compared to guys like Tannehill and especially Luck, who looks like a damn linebacker under center.

Unfortunately, his size is unlikely to change no matter how long he's on the team. If that was a concern of the team (not saying it is/was), then we shouldn't have taken him.

[RedBeast]

I was going to do the same thing but I was thinking Colt Brennan. For some reason he did not have a lot of stats for me to compare to? Glad RG3 is our QB and not the "next Tom Brady."

Great post, but RG3 is not Peyton Manning, and Peyton Manning is not RG3. Lets take a look at this after the first 4 games and use it as some sort of weather vane to compare to. I hope that RG3 does a little better because of what Shanny is doing, and the pieces we had in place prior to him getting here. Too bad our O-Line is not an area of strength. Being able to run fairly well as well as protect him would greatly enhance his chances of success. We do have strength in our TE's/WR's and I think the RB's will do ok due to the versatility, if the O-line...Hopefully our D-backs don't get shredded, because our D should be able to help Griff succeed as well.

My two uneducated sense (cents)...

[darrelgreenie]

Luck just makes things look so damn easy you're almost not impressed by him on first glance. Then you notice he is absolutely carving up your defense. He's also an amazing athlete -- something some don't seem to realize because I don't know, they just don't expect it from him or something. I think he's going to be a very good, if not great NFL QB from day one.

Its interesting watching the changing perceptions of the QBs.

I agree that Luck is an above average athlete at the QB position.

But, I think the tide has turned on underrating Luck's athleticism that its has now become overrated imo. (e.g. its been parroted ad nausem that Luck put up the same 40 time/combine numbers as Cam, even though they're comparing Luck's unofficial (faster) to Cam's official numbers (slower) to make the comparison stick.

When it comes to individual physical skillset ,completely removed from the team production, I would rate the QBs Cam, Griffin then Luck.

I think Luck is set up pretty well to have a statistically productive season.

And I agree with you that he'll probably be more productive(stats not w/l) then Griff this season.

What's funny is that I posed that question a couple of months ago and people were certain Griffin would have a more productive season but I believe their answers would be different now.

I think it's going to be a bit of a struggle for RG3 all rookie season. Will be real surprised if he has a better rookie year than Luck this year, or Newton last year.

Imo Griffin shouldn't struggle.

Mainly because I look at Rex.

And if Rex can be productive in the is offense then there is no reason Griffin shouldn't be.

I know you are worried about the whole 'spread' offense transition.

But, given a talented, smart, and eager prospect ready to learn the onus falls on the coaching staff to teach.

Plenty of spread QBs have come in and been productive in their rookie seasons: Flacco, Bradford, McCoy, Newton, Dalton.

Heck TCU runs a very similar offense as Baylor and Griffin was more efficient then Dalton executing it.

At the end of the day I don't think Luck nor Griffin will be as productive as Newton was last year.

He was a tour de force with his 35 TDs which was more then 12 teams.

But, that won't stop the media continuing Luck's coronation as the best prospect since Manning/Elway.

...I can't wait to see how Shanny uses him

+1

[PerryMason]

So yes, If this was 1998 and RG3 was a rookie?

Then yes, having a year like P. Manning's rookie year, would definitely be acceptable here.

But now...2012?

I'm thinking it would be quite a disappointment, if RG3 doesn't at least put up similar numbers as Andy Dalton last year.

Yeah its definitely a different standard now. Now, you have guys like Big Ben, Flacco, and Matt Ryan who have have stellar rookie seasons. I expect him to perform much better than Peyton in his first year.

[Riggo'sRangers]

Patience has never been a 'Skins fan virtue, or really that of any fans I know of other teams. It's a shame and a necessity for us this year. Good things will come..... Patience: "A minor form of despair disguised as a virtue." ~Ambrose Bierce

[Hooper]

Imo Griffin shouldn't struggle.

Mainly because I look at Rex.

And if Rex can be productive in the is offense then there is no reason Griffin shouldn't be.

The game had slowed down for Rex and he knew the offense. For a slow and fat guy playing behind a very suspect line, he didn't take a lot of sacks. Because he generally knew where he was going pre-snap and got rid of the ball quick. Now sometimes he didn't and disaster happened with a sack and a fumble. And sometimes disaster happened when he quickly threw the ball right to a linebacker. But for better and worse, he was decisive. Compare that to Beck against Buffalo.

I think it will take a while for the game to slow down for RG3.

But I will agree with you in that I believe the scheme of this offense is so darn good any QB worth a darn should eventually do darn well in it. Kyle and Mike know how to get receivers open.

[longball]

The game had slowed down for Rex and he knew the offense. For a slow and fat guy playing behind a very suspect line, he didn't take a lot of sacks. Because he generally knew where he was going pre-snap and got rid of the ball quick. Now sometimes he didn't and disaster happened with a sack and a fumble. And sometimes disaster happened when he quickly threw the ball right to a linebacker. But for better and worse, he was decisive. Compare that to Beck against Buffalo.

I think it will take a while for the game to slow down for RG3.

But I will agree with you in that I believe the scheme of this offense is so darn good any QB worth a darn should eventually do darn well in it. Kyle and Mike know how to get receivers open.

I hear you. But what do open recievers mean when a QB is under pressure with an inexperienced QB? Hope they give him protection.

[darrelgreenie]

The game had slowed down for Rex and he knew the offense. For a slow and fat guy playing behind a very suspect line, he didn't take a lot of sacks. Because he generally knew where he was going pre-snap and got rid of the ball quick.

I don't think getting rid of the ball quickly is because of the game slowing down.

It comes from having a solid pre-snap read/pre-snap plan and that imo comes from coaching.

Again, if other QBs from similar offense can do then there's no reason why Griff can't.

Now sometimes he didn't and disaster happened with a sack and a fumble. And sometimes disaster happened when he quickly threw the ball right to a linebacker. But for better and worse, he was decisive. Compare that to Beck against Buffalo.

A lot of Rex's negative plays are a result of his crippling inability to handle avoid/escape/handle pressure.

Griff's ability to avoid/escape/handle pressure is a major hallmark of his skillset and will limit if not erase the cause of most of Rex's negative plays.

You know me Hoop, I try to be 100% football honest.

And if you tell me the Bills game was lost because Beck was indecisive I might believe you if I didn't watch the Eagles and the Panthers game that preceded the Bills game.

You can almost never single a loss of a football game down to 1 factor but if you're saying Beck's indecision was the reason then I'm gonna say the complete lack of effort made to run the ball was the reason for the loss.

I think it will take a while for the game to slow down for RG3.

If it didn't take awhile for the game to slow down for those other rookie QBs (Flacco, Bradford, McCoy, Newton, Dalton) then it don't see why it would take awhile for Griff.

[Skins4Life6388]

I'm bookmarking this for all the **** head Skins haters I know if/when they tell me how much RG3 sucks if he has a "bad" season. Thanks for doing this GHH.

[BleedBNG]

But the key for EVERYONE is NOT to panic!

After all... we have Kirk Cousins.