SWFLSkins Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Posted in Bubba's BN by Hap, I thought this article addressed alot of the discussions presently going on and thought number four was particularly interesting. I must say following The Examiner lately there stories tend to have meat and potatoes. Maybe they read ES???haha. There list should spur some good discourse. Myth One deals with trading up for a franchise QB. http://www.examiner.com/sports-in-washington-dc/robert-griffin-iii-peyton-manning-rex-grossman-and-5-myths-about-the-redskins Mike Frandsen, DC Sports Examiner January 6, 2012 - Like this? Subscribe to get instant updates. Myth 4: Once they were eliminated from playoff contention, the Redskins should have lost on purpose to improve their draft position. This idea of losing on purpose is so distasteful and disrespectful to the game and to those who play sports, that any people who advocate it should have their fan cards revoked or sports talk blathering positions taken away immediately. The marginal difference between drafting a few positions higher in each round is clearly not worth perpetuating a losing attitude. Losing breeds losing and winning breeds winning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Great article. The writer hit on all points, especially myth 4 about tanking and how losing perpetuates itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HogNose Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I agree 100% with what the writer said in regards to trading up for a potential franchise QB. Great read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gorebd82 Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Rare, intelligent article from a local writer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 The Examiner is always good at putting out solid articles about the Redskins. They may be critical at times, but they are always fair, and will speak up for the team when it counts. I don't ask for people to lavish praise upon my football team. All I ask is that when they're being critical, to be fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 The Examiner is always good at putting out solid articles about the Redskins. They may be critical at times, but they are always fair, and will speak up for the team when it counts.I don't ask for people to lavish praise upon my football team. All I ask is that when they're being critical, to be fair. Yes, If only so many of the braindead posters who habitually pull some version of "oh, if it's a critical piece you guys just hate on the messenger even though we really do suck" routine every time some of us chastise yet another in the endless series of crap journalism, mindlessly repetitive, unreasoning nonsense, articles/broadcasts that proliferate the DC market (yes, the Redskins generally suck as a competitive franchise to make the obvious disclaimer for the idiots) would get that, and just treat each on it's own merits (assuming they have any discernment, solid football knowledge, and a modicum of media savvy to begin with) it would be welcome. But then that would be way too smart and way outside their reflex box. The Examiner is consistently and notably more solid and thoughtful (as in actually thinking) in its coverage than much of the competition. And yes, the "hope-to-lose for draft positions/angry with a win" dip****s remain the biggest "suckass" demographic I have ever seen in the stadium, and in 50 years of being a fan it's rather new to me (as it manifested here) just in general. Truly sad-ass pathetic. Zero respect and next-to-zero tolerance for that position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8181 Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I don't think it's wrong for fans to hope that a bad team like the Redskins lose to improve their chances of bettering their position, especially when they are mathematically out of contention I think it'd be wrong for coaches or players to lose on purpose though, or for fans to wish they would tank on purpose I agree with all points except the last one. Especially when chances of postseason are gone, I think young players should be evaluated or given experience. Heck the Giants put in Eli when the Giants were 4-2 or 4-3, despite Kurt Warner defniitely beinga better QB at that point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boss_Hogg Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 So wait, you mean to say that winning against SEA and the NYG, didn't set this team back 5 years?? Myth 4 is spot-on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8181 Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 but vooskin, would you want the coaches or players or both to tank on purpose? i wouldn't. I personally wish they lost out once Grossman came back and couldn't beat the Dolphins, but I would never hope they do i ton purpoes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vooskin Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Great article. The writer hit on all points, especially myth 4 about tanking and how losing perpetuates itself. Jus wait till we miss out on getting our QB this year and end up having to go with some free agent. #4 is at best an opinion if you base it on the success breeds success theory. The truth, factual evidence, is that the higher the draft pick the better the chance you have of getting the best players at their respective position or the less it will cost to trade up. See if we lost those Seahawks and Giants game and with a softer SoS than the Vikings we would be picking at #3. As of right now most analysts, bloggers, etc seem to think its going to cost us at least next years 1st round draft pick just for trading up from sixth to where we would be had we not won those games. Not to mention any bidding war we may end up with say Cleveland or another team that is ready to throws a load of picks away for a QB. Success breeds success if you have the tools to be successful in the first place. We likely cost our teams 1st round draft pick in 2013 for winning games that didn't matter and STILL ended up with us having a worse record then the year prior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rufus T Firefly Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I think #4 is a bit of a strawman and I don't really agree with #5, but the rest was very well done, imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewCliche21 Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Really great article, and thanks for putting it in here to discuss. I don't like trading for Manning at all, though. Not one bit. If we're gonna trade picks, then you trade them for someone who will be here and contribute more than whoever you would choose with said picks. Trade up for Griffin? Sure, because he has a ten-, fifteen-year potential and is on an upward trajectory. Manning, though, is coming off of a couple of neck surgeries and has four or five years left. It depends on the price, but when your first, second, third (ish), fourth, fifth, sixths, and two sevenths look like ours did this year and are all looking to be on the right path, you don't give up maybe 50-60 combined years of great play for five years of something that will only get worse. I'd sign him as a free agent, but I wouldn't trade for him. I was one who hoped for a better draft pick, but let's not pretend that all of us were actively hoping to lose. There were some, yeah, but a lot of us weren't. When we lost, it took the edge off, and that's it. It was an attempt to salvage some perspective and hope. I hated losing to the Cowboys and Eagles specifically just as I always did, but it made Mondays easier. And, ultimately, a loss that could build us is better than a loss that is just a loss. I don't want either, but the former was a hell of a lot better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewCliche21 Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Jus wait till we miss out on getting our QB this year and end up having to go with some free agent.#4 is at best an opinion if you base it on the success breeds success theory. The truth, factual evidence, is that the higher the draft pick the better the chance you have of getting the best players at their respective position or the less it will cost to trade up. See if we lost those Seahawks and Giants game and with a softer SoS than the Vikings we would be picking at #3. As of right now most analysts, bloggers, etc seem to think its going to cost us at least next years 1st round draft pick just for trading up from sixth to where we would be had we not won those games. Not to mention any bidding war we may end up with say Cleveland or another team that is ready to throws a load of picks away for a QB. Success breeds success if you have the tools to be successful in the first place. We likely cost our teams 1st round draft pick in 2013 for winning games that didn't matter and STILL ended up with us having a worse record then the year prior. This topic is the Roe v. Wade of Redskins Nation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingGibbs Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Been saying for years now that the WEx is by far the best media outlet in regards to unbiased and professional journalism when it comes to the Redskins. John Keim is my favorite "Redskins' reorter. His studs and duds columns are something I always look forward to and he gives you explainations as to why that player is a stud or dud. In regards to myth 4? Losing breeds losing? Um, what have we been doing the majority of the last 20 years? When I knew the season was a loss cause the losses didn't bother me like they have in years past because I knew it would get us a step closer to possibly getting a franchise QB. But, I'm one of those fans that believe in individuality when it comes to fans. I concentrate on what really matters to me and that's the team, coaches, wins, losses etc. If another fan is hoping that their team loses for what could possibly be for the betterment of the team and their future? Who gives a flying ****? I never understood why some fans put so much emphasis on other fans "fanhood" when they should be channeling that energy to where it matters most.......the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoVaSkins21 Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 So wait, you mean to say that winning against SEA and the NYG, didn't set this team back 5 years?? Seriously I hated that thread the moment it was started after the Seattle win. People started crying about Matt Barkley and he went back to school. However, I am very cautious about myth #1. They need to still be sensible when considering trading up for Luck, RG3 or even Peyton Manning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#98QBKiller Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I stopped reading when it said that we should trade for Manning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSO Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 This is so going to fly over the proponents of "tank" ideology's head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCS Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 And yes, the "hope-to-lose for draft positions/angry with a win" dip****s remain the biggest "suckass" demographic I have ever seen in the stadium, and in 50 years of being a fan it's rather new to me (as it manifested here) just in general. Truly sad-ass pathetic. Zero respect and next-to-zero tolerance for that position. I've heard the talk before in my years. Usually done in whispered conversation amongst a few fans. I've seen the very same "discussions" on other teams boards about the same thing. Every bit as cantankerous as the ones here have been. I usually just shook my head and said glad they're fans of some other team. Then this past season started and those discussions became a common thing here. :mad: Embarrassing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmchairRedskin Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I don't think anybody wanted the team to lose on purpose. People just preferred we lose naturally. There's a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chachie Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Myth 4: Once they were eliminated from playoff contention, the Redskins should have lost on purpose to improve their draft position. This idea of losing on purpose is so distasteful and disrespectful to the game and to those who play sports, that any people who advocate it should have their fan cards revoked or sports talk blathering positions taken away immediately. The marginal difference between drafting a few positions higher in each round is clearly not worth perpetuating a losing attitude. Losing breeds losing and winning breeds winning. Exactly my input on the matter when these threads began to pop up. Let's not create 10 losers for 1 guy who can't win without them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingGibbs Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I don't think anybody wanted the team to lose on purpose. People just preferred we lose naturally. There's a difference. Meaning, the season was a loss cause and each loss was less painful and subsequently led to a higher pick that could've possibly landed us a potential franchise QB, but Matt Barkley decided to muck that up and instead of thinking of Redskins fans he did the commendable thing and went back for his senior year. What a selfish jackass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmchairRedskin Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Meaning, the season was a loss cause and each loss was less painful and subsequently led to a higher pick that could've possibly landed us a potential franchise QB, but Matt Barkley decided to muck that up and instead of thinking of Redskins fans he did the commendable thing and went back for his senior year. What a selfish jackass. What the hell are you babbling about? Ever hear the names Luck or RG3? Nothing wrong with wanting a high pick to have the largest field available to select from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingGibbs Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I guess it is. My bad. I'll get that thing checked out ASAP Check my previous edited post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingGibbs Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I've heard the talk before in my years. Usually done in whispered conversation amongst a few fans. I've seen the very same "discussions" on other teams boards about the same thing. Every bit as cantankerous as the ones here have been. I usually just shook my head and said glad they're fans of some other team. Then this past season started and those discussions became a common thing here. :mad: Embarrassing. Only a fool would believe that a fan roots for their team to lose come kickoff regardless of how they feel about draft status. All bets are off for those three hours. I let it be known that if the losses piled up (which was inevitable) that it wouldn't affect me as in years past, but for those aforementioned three hours I found myself cussing at the turnovers and penalties and being jubilant when we got a first down, scored a TD or made a stop on defense. Unfortunately there wasn't more of the latter. ---------- Post added January-7th-2012 at 05:02 PM ---------- What the hell are you babbling about? Ever hear the names Luck or RG3? Nothing wrong with wanting a high pick to have the largest field available to select from. Is your sarcasm meter broke? Barkley entering the draft would've increased our chances of landing him or RGIII. Luck isn't happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmchairRedskin Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Only a fool would believe that a fan roots for their team to lose come kickoff regardless of how they feel about draft status. All bets are off for those three hours. I let it be known that if the losses piled up (which was inevitable) that it wouldn't affect me as in years past, but for those aforementioned three hours I found myself cussing at the turnovers and penalties and being jubilant when we got a first down, scored a TD or made a stop on defense. Unfortunately there wasn't more of the latter.---------- Post added January-7th-2012 at 05:02 PM ---------- Is your sarcasm meter broke? I guess it is. My bad. I'll get that thing checked out ASAP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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