visionary Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sacks 'n' Stuff Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 44 minutes ago, Larry said: I assume that the folks in the Pentagon's biggest fear is of being caught without a plan. And therefore, between wars, they make plans for everything. Anything that the CINC might order, they've got a plan for it. I assume that we have plans for invading Iran, and for invading Canada. (I assume that one of them gets updated more often than the other.) 100% chance. If we had to go to war in 6 hours against, oh let's say Portugal, the plan is already in place. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozo the kKklown Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Just now, Riggo-toni said: Well, you could blame Japan for laying the groundwork. Are you saying you would have preferred if the US had abstained and let the Soviets take all of it? What I am saying is that we should let these countries decide their destinies themselves. After WW2, let the Koreans do as they please. Instead we went into a dick measuring contest with the Soviets, and thats what happened. The same story has happened all over the world. The day an American President, if we still have those, ever decides to apologize to these nations we have harmed and work with them to improve is the day we will probably start seeing peace. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Just now, BenningRoadSkin said: What I am saying is that we should let these countries decide their destinies themselves. After WW2, let the Koreans do as they please. Instead we went into a dick measuring contest with the Soviets, and thats what happened. The same story has happened all over the world. The day an American President, if we still have those, ever decides to apologize to these nations we have harmed and work with them to improve is the day we will probably start seeing peace. I think we'd all be a lot worse off today if South Korea had been allowed to be taken over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozo the kKklown Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Just now, visionary said: I think we'd all be a lot worse off today if South Korea had been allowed to be taken over. im talking about post world war, not the Korean War. We were stuck in a position that we created at that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo-toni Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 The Soviets were already getting ready to take over Korea. The area had been a prize fought for between Russia and Japan going back over four decades. Not getting involved would have meant the whole Peninsula suffered the same fate as the north...not that I really give a damn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 5 minutes ago, BenningRoadSkin said: im talking about post world war, not the Korean War. We were stuck in a position that we created at that point. The choices in the Cold War were to let the soviets expand unchecked or not. There was never a choice to simply have these nations go unbothered. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Interesting how we now have a President who sounds more like North Korea than North Korea does. This moronathon between the two is off the hook. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 When the Russians say your rhetoric against another country is over the top you know you done ****ed up. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogofWar1 Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 At least China is saying that NK is on their own if they commit first strike. Now we just need Congress to stop the orange clown from attacking first, at the very least. I get the allure of an overwhelming pre-emptive strike, but if we drag China into it...that would be bad. Unless of course we think China is bluffing. I suggest we not play that game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 20 hours ago, mistertim said: When the Russians say your rhetoric against another country is over the top you know you done ****ed up. Or they just have an adversarial relationship with the US and can't resist swiping at the US every chance they get. Russia would absolutely love for us to get hit by a nuclear missile, but they'll gladly accept simply having us distracted by a long term nuclear threat. I'd be more concerned that we ****ed up if Russia suddenly loved our plans. None of this is to say that Trump is any less of a clown than he's always been. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 40 minutes ago, DogofWar1 said: At least China is saying that NK is on their own if they commit first strike. Now we just need Congress to stop the orange clown from attacking first, at the very least. I get the allure of an overwhelming pre-emptive strike, but if we drag China into it...that would be bad. Unless of course we think China is bluffing. I suggest we not play that game. China's stance is unacceptable to us but reasonable for them. I'm not going to fault them for not wanting a nuclear war on their border, but at the same time they're essentially saying that we have to absorb a nuclear attack. If our intelligence says a nuclear attack is coming I want my government blowing **** up before it gets a chance to kill millions of Americans. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogofWar1 Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Oh, I don't disagree, push comes to shove you call the bluff, but my problem is that such a situation needs to be well planned and thought out and a first strike by Trump would definitely not be that. It'd be messy and unplanned and China would be forced to potentially abandon its redline in the face of a manchild, which is a bad look. Abandoning redline in face of US force with strong Pres and well thought out military strategy behind him? Not too embarassing. Abandoning redline because of Trump tweets starting a war? Embarassing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 1 hour ago, DogofWar1 said: At least China is saying that NK is on their own if they commit first strike. Now we just need Congress to stop the orange clown from attacking first, at the very least. I get the allure of an overwhelming pre-emptive strike, but if we drag China into it...that would be bad. Unless of course we think China is bluffing. I suggest we not play that game. What are you talking about? The more the merrier! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2017/08/11/trump-predicts-tourism-spike-for-guam-in-wake-of-n-korea-threat-reassures-islands-governor/?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_pp-guam-1150pm%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.d43fa95ce39e "Trump predicts ‘tenfold’ boost in tourism for Guam amid threats by North Korea" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 (edited) I had this thought last night, I apologize if it's not novel: What if... they point nukes at SK, Japan, Guam, then say they are re-starting the Korean War (which never really ended) and that any outside influence would result in launching the nukes. If there is no outside influence, they will not be launched. How will the rest of the world react? Will the US specifically remain supportive of South Korea? Does South Korea stand a chance in a conventional war against North Korea on its own? Obviously there's the issue of NK launching them anyways if they get to a point where losing is inevitable. I also realize you could potentially answer some questions two ways - what would trump do, what would any other us president in history do. Edited August 12, 2017 by tshile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 I have no feeling of assurance when trump speaks about north korea If anything, my "omg he's an idiot" bell just dings nonstop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 5 hours ago, tshile said: I had this thought last night, I apologize if it's not novel: What if... they point nukes at SK, Japan, Guam, then say they are re-starting the Korean War (which never really ended) and that any outside influence would result in launching the nukes. If there is no outside influence, they will not be launched. How will the rest of the world react? Will the US specifically remain supportive of South Korea? Does South Korea stand a chance in a conventional war against North Korea on its own? Obviously there's the issue of NK launching them anyways if they get to a point where losing is inevitable. I also realize you could potentially answer some questions two ways - what would trump do, what would any other us president in history do. I think they send Pence to stare across the DMZ and show his "resolve" face again. NK would have no choice but to relent. (What a putz) But seriously, I'm guessing they already have nuclear stuff pointed that way. But by "restarting" the war do you mean they'd also initiate conventional actions against those countries? I think SK would certainly stand a chance conventionally but there would be horrifying amounts casualties on both sides especially since NK doesn't give two ****s about how many of their own people they lose. I think traditionally we've always said we would stand with SK but with this lunatic in the WH who knows. I'm guessing he would act but not because he gives an actual crap about SK or our alliances, but because he'd feel personally insulted by NK doing it...that or he'd see it as a good way to make himself look powerful. Any other president in history would immediately be in a war room with his NSC people, military generals and go through a process of the possible responses as well as the pros and cons and possible outcomes of each and eventually decide on the most tenable strategy. This president's staff would most likely do that but he can't even pay attention or follow a full page of bullet points, let alone sit through hours of intense military and policy discussion that involved heavily weighing and mentally planning options and making decisions based on that. So the answer is "nobody in hell knows what he would do, and probably not even Trump would know until an impulse came to him" which is ****ing terrifying. The BEST option possible is that his intellectual vapidness, inability to concentrate for more than 5 minutes, and the obvious and overwhelming fear that we all know truly lurks behind that orange mug would finally get the better of him and he'd simply bow out and follow whatever recommendations his staff came up with. ...until Kim Jong-un publicly called him a scared poop-face and then he would rage tweet and tell them to fire nukes immediately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 https://www.google.com/maps/place/Magnolia+House+Restaurant/@39.0214915,125.7219505,17z/data=!4m7!3m6!1s0x0:0xbfb8d03bd13cc0c6!8m2!3d39.0214926!4d125.724138!9m1!1b1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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