BleedinBurgNGold Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Zorn talked a bit about this in his presser after the game. He said something along the lines of he wanted to push DET kicker, who's a very good one, out of field goal range. And that he had confidence in our defense that they could hold them on a third and long.Pretty much everyone's thinking I must say. I don't think you can fault Zorn there. That's very logical thinking, imo... Bad call IMO. Thats twice in the game where we left 3 points on the board pro and con. That decision to go for it on 4th and goal from the 1 instead of putting guranteed points up was a killer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mudhog Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 When Zorn accepted the penalty, I thought "well that's gutsy", but when we didn't defend the 3rd down and they went on to score, it was quite obvious to me and everyone that it was a turning point in the game momentum-wise. A wise coach knows these scenarios and gets his defense off the field. Zorn is not stupid but often shows his inexperience. As far as the 'going for it' on 4th and goal at the 1yd line, I did not feel it was a bad call. I just wish Zorn would call a different play like a 'pitch' or 'option' play once in a while. Detroit ran that play on us once today that ended up with quite s significant gain if not a score if I remember right. We as fans, know when something smells fishy. Call it 20/20 hindsight all you want but we should have given up the long field goal try and gotten our D off the field. Hail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHALEN Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 double post sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHALEN Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 The play that sticks out in my mind that came back to bite us was on our first drive where we elected to try and punch it in the endzone instead of kicking a sure field goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G1 Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 When you lose to Detroit you deserve to have your calls second guessed and scrutinized and the call to accept the penalty rather than take the 4th down was a bad one, a real bad one. ...as was the decision to run left on 4th and 1, or go for it at all. Yes, we wouldn't be discussing this if we'd gone and won but we didn't. We lost. When the teams is whiffing the place up like we are there is little margin for error from the man at the top and he keeps making them and he keeps refusing to accept the blame for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scruffylookin Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 This was an awful coaching decision. If Detroit wants to kick a 51-yard field goal, let them. That is a low percentage kick. You also have to consider that this defense has been awful on third downs all year. I'm willing to bet that Jason Hanson's percentage on 50 yard kicks is higher than the Detroit Lions' 3rd down conversion rate coming into this game. Zorn made the right call, Blaaaaaah's defense let him down and let a rookie QB convert a third and long. Same thing with the 4th and goal decision. Good decision (though perhaps questionable play call again). It's not Zorn's fault that Blaaaaaah's defense let a team with a rookie QB and a horrible 3rd down offense methodically drive the field and score on a 99 yard drive. Both were goood decisions that were made to be second guessed only because the failure of Greg Blache's defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobie-k Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 We shouldn't have even been in a place where that was a decision. But that was stupid. What was more disturbing though was that on 3rd and 14 our D lets a rookie QB run for 21 and pick up the 1st down. #4 D? Sure doesnt look it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiingspadee Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Sorry but you have to think about what IF they get the 1st down then what Horrible call and after all of my defending zorn and saying he will be great I am done with him and will be happy when he is gone. Good riddance. He has turned this team into a joke him and blache Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DisgruntledLionFan#54,927 Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 I'm willing to bet that Jason Hanson's percentage on 50 yard kicks is higher than the Detroit Lions' 3rd down conversion rate coming into this game. IIRC, he's made his last 9 or 10 50+ FGs. The guy is a machine and gets overlooked because of the team he plays on. 3rd and 13 with a rookie QB who's been prone to force the ball early in his career? I thought it was the right call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rdskn4Lyf21 Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 My dad and I looked at each other when we declined it and simultaneously said "We are screwed." The way our defense has been playing on 3rd downs this year you get off the field every opportunity you can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sugarbear326 Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Bad Call, I immediately told all of the guys that I was watching the game with, accept the penalty and force them to kick. They have a big play receiver who is capable to do more than enought to get a first down. This team has no emotions, from the head coach to the players playing like they don't care, something needs to be done to shake this organization up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Brown #43 Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 If the lions get 5-10 yards on the play the kick is still only 5 yards deeper, that is worth the risk of it turning into 7? You dont need to take some stupid risk like that for 3 points. Actually, if the Lions only pick up 5 yards on the play, it's no longer a FG situation but rather a punting situation. That's what Zorn was going for. I'm not a Billick fan whatsoever, but for what it's worth, Billick supported the decision on the broadcast. It's strange to me that there may be some major issues with Zorn (for example, has he lost the locker room?), yet people continue to harp on individual decisions where a very reasonable argument could be made to support a given decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sugarbear326 Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 I'm willing to bet that Jason Hanson's percentage on 50 yard kicks is higher than the Detroit Lions' 3rd down conversion rate coming into this game.Zorn made the right call, Blaaaaaah's defense let him down and let a rookie QB convert a third and long. Same thing with the 4th and goal decision. Good decision (though perhaps questionable play call again). It's not Zorn's fault that Blaaaaaah's defense let a team with a rookie QB and a horrible 3rd down offense methodically drive the field and score on a 99 yard drive. Both were goood decisions that were made to be second guessed only because the failure of Greg Blache's defense. If you believe the defense let zorn down, that's more of the reason to have Detroit kick the FG, they just drove down the field, so get your tired defense of the field and let the offense get back to work... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Look back over 3 games? how many 3rd downs do we give up? they are huge numbers.. this is not hindsight.. this is learning from history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scruffylookin Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 IIRC, he's made his last 9 or 10 50+ FGs. The guy is a machine and gets overlooked because of the team he plays on.3rd and 13 with a rookie QB who's been prone to force the ball early in his career? I thought it was the right call. Thank You. Zorn was right to force them back, Blache's defense is what failed and let him down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scruffylookin Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 If you believe the defense let zorn down, that's more of the reason to have Detroit kick the FG, they just drove down the field, so get your tired defense of the field and let the offense get back to work... I guess me, like Zorn, is giving Blache's defense too much credit that it would be able to stop an offense with a rookie QB that converted something like 25 percent of it's third downs coming into this game. You're right, what was Zorn thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 I'm willing to bet that Jason Hanson's percentage on 50 yard kicks is higher than the Detroit Lions' 3rd down conversion rate coming into this game.Zorn made the right call, Blaaaaaah's defense let him down and let a rookie QB convert a third and long. Same thing with the 4th and goal decision. Good decision (though perhaps questionable play call again). It's not Zorn's fault that Blaaaaaah's defense let a team with a rookie QB and a horrible 3rd down offense methodically drive the field and score on a 99 yard drive. Both were goood decisions that were made to be second guessed only because the failure of Greg Blache's defense. Thats true and I basically agreed with the 4th down call. However on the 3rd down penalty as bad as we are on 3rd down defense I did think the safer call would have been to decline and risk giving up the 3. If we were playing good defene on 3rd down its the correct call .......but we are not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Mike Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 I don't have a single problem with not conceding points. Not one. You play to win the game. And you are not going to win many games by conceding points. Ever. I have a problem with not taking the points you have in front of you on your first drive. That, to me, seemed like desperation. That's one of those times you have to put your frustration aside and make the safe call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Mike Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Originally Posted by scruffylookin:Zorn made the right call, Blaaaaaah's defense let him down and let a rookie QB convert a third and long. Love how the guy who took one of the worst pass rushes in the NFL and made us the #4 defense last year is suddenly a moron because the players on the field let him down and the lions (who were desperate for a win) played great. :doh: Maybe you should ask yourself how a QB with a bigger arm and 5 years experience got out-played by a rookie with a grand total of two games under his belt. (For the record: I recorded the game. I've already confirmed two plays that would have extended drives where Campbell missed seeing wide open receivers and instead threw it into triple coverage.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tone_dubbz Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Let him kick the 3. Don't take the penalty. Their rookie end up tossing a TD. Rational thinking and Zorn don't belong in the same sentence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UK Redskins Fan Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 I think it was a reasonable call, the chances of the Lions converting 3rd & 13 should have been low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaxBuddy21 Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Im sorry but this is the one call in the game where I couldnt believe what he was doing. I believe in our defense too but the Lions offense had just marched the ball down there from the 1 yd line and had a lot of momentum. If you let them kick the field goal, you get them off the field and get time to make defensive adjustments. Instead, we give up a big first down and subsequently a touchdown. The NFL is all about chances (ask Brett Favre) and we simply gave the Lions another one. That is a big risk, small reward proposition. Instead of giving up 3, you risk giving it up anyway but you also risk giving up 7 (which we did). Your offense just marched the ball down the field the last drive. You give them the ball back and let them do it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wysknz1 Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Drives of 99 and 93 yards....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 I think it was a reasonable call, the chances of the Lions converting 3rd & 13 should have been low. Your basing that off of what exactly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 That's a 50/50 call, I think. The problem I have with Zorn is that he makes every decision based on what he wants to happen - not on what the percentages would say. Yes, a TD in the first quarter is nice. But 3-0 against a team that has not won since 2007 is nothing to sneeze at anyway. At 3-0, maybe they say, "Well, we're losing again...." Take the points early in a game. Get a lead. Etc. I go back and forth on the FG call, but it's the same kind of thing. Do you give a bad team another chance at life. Or make them try a long field goal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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