Fergasun Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 The following was submitted into the Congressional Record by Bill Richardson: WHY OUR SOCIETY IS RAPE-PRONE -- (BY JANE C. HOOD) (Extension of Remarks - May 17, 1989) Albuquerque, NM: Why did eight teen-agers beat and rape a jogger in Central Park? Mostly missing from the analyses of `wilding,' and lost among the suggestions for preventing similar tragedies is one crucial issue: gender. In a society that equates masculinity with dominance and sex with violence, gang rape becomes one way for adolescents to prove their masculinity both to themselves and to each other. With the exception of prison assaults, gang rape is a crime committed almost exclusively by males against females. Yet, few commentators have focused on gender and what it means to be raised male in America. Like the proverbial fish who cannot describe water, Americans see everything but gender at work in the April 19 assault. Given more than 30 years of research on rape, our myopia is hard to explain. In a classic 1971 study of 646 Philadelphia rapes--almost half of which were pair or group rapes--Menachem Amir, a criminologist, described the prototype for the Central Park assault.* * * * *The April 19 incident also shares some characteristics of `gang bangs' in fraternity houses and random violence against women on college campuses. To understand this form of male bonding, we must understand the difference between rape-prone societies and those that are rape-free. In a study of 150 subsistance societies, Peggy Sanday, an anthropologist, found high incidences of rape to be associated with militarism, interpersonal violence in general, an ideology of male toughness and distant father-child relationships. Rape-free societies, on the other hand, encourage female participation in the economy and political system and male involvement in child-rearing. Despite recent moves toward gender equality, our society is still very much rape-prone. Surveys of U.S. and Canadian college students, for example, find that one of three men say that if they could get away with it, they would be at least `somewhat likely' to rape a woman. Similarly, several recent surveys of high school students found 40 to 50 percent of both boys and girls agreed with statements such as `If a girl goes to a guy's apartment after a date, it's O.K. for him to force her to have sex .' Even jurors in rape trials have found it hard to believe that an attractive man would rape a woman if he could just as easily have seduced her. As many of these studies point out, in rape-prone societies rape is confused with sex . Thus, an effective national campaign to prevent assaults on women by bands of young men should target not `criminals' but rather advertisements portraying women as sex objects, sexual harassment and gender inequality in the workplace, resistance to paternity-leave policies and Rambo dolls and other violent games and toys. Prevention campaigns might also include attempts to bring more fathers into day care and kindergarten classrooms to show that `real men' are nurturing people. Community groups could support sex education programs that teach that rape is not sex but violence and that good sex takes place in the context of love and respect. We should encourage co-ed sports at the elementary and middle school levels so that boys can learn that girls are not `the other' to be made fun of and put down. In an otherwise excellent column in the New York Times, Tom Wicker described the Central Park rape as `a chance event that could have happened to anyone.' In a way it was. On the other hand, when was the last time you heard about a gang of teenage girls raping and beating a man in Central Park? To get to the roots of this particular brand of violence, we need to long beyond race and class to look at gender relations in the United States. So 20+ years later; what do you guys think? Are we still a "rape prone" society? I was just browsing through the Congressional Record and thought this was an interesting article. Perhaps some of the "pussification of America" people might complain about has actually made some positive impact to some of the attitudes in this article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IONTOP Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 several recent surveys of high school students found 40 to 50 percent of both boys and girls agreed with statements such as `If a girl goes to a guy's apartment after a date, it's O.K. for him to force her to have sex .' Damn... That's not right... I guess I'm in the 50-60%.... I just want to cuddle... I still think we're a rape prone society, but I think that being raped isn't "the girls fault" nowadays as it was earlier which made the girl less likely to tell anyone... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighOnHendrix Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 One thing that's ironic to me in reading all of that is that the case they are referring to, the Central Park jogger rape, was not committed by several individuals. It was one dude who got away scot free while those five young men got railroaded on false confessions and circumstantial evidence. Hooray for the shambles of our justice system! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighOnHendrix Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 I still think we're a rape prone society, but I think that being raped isn't "the girls fault" nowadays as it was earlier which made the girl less likely to tell anyone... That is true. OTOH, since the shoe is now on the other foot with the female's claim of rape now being likely to be easily accepted, we have created a situation ripe for crying wolf. If enough of those cases happen, things may swing back the other way which I think would not be a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubbs Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 Damn... That's not right... I guess I'm in the 50-60%.... I just want to cuddle...I still think we're a rape prone society, but I think that being raped isn't "the girls fault" nowadays as it was earlier which made the girl less likely to tell anyone... Yeah, that stat is messed up. There shouldn't be any situation in which it's "okay" to force someone to have sex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighOnHendrix Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 Yeah, that stat is messed up. There shouldn't be any situation in which it's "okay" to force someone to have sex. No, it's not. But (there's always a but, isn't there?) if a person puts themselves in a situation like that why are they surprised when something bad happens to them? Imagine you're a chick. Imagine that you've been invited to Mike Tyson's hotel room. Why do you think he wants you to go there with him? To trade recipes? Come on, now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubbs Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 No, it's not. But (there's always a but, isn't there?) if a person puts themselves in a situation like that why are they surprised when something bad happens to them? Imagine you're a chick. Imagine that you've been invited to Mike Tyson's hotel room. Why do you think he wants you to go there with him? To trade recipes? Come on, now. Oh, believe me, I totally agree with you when it comes to girls needing to properly assess the situation. But that doesn't make forced sex "okay." That's the word that bugs me. Is there too much naivete when it comes to sex? Of course. Does that mean half the population should say forced sex is "okay"? Absolutely not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighOnHendrix Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 Oh, believe me, I totally agree with you when it comes to girls needing to properly assess the situation. But that doesn't make forced sex "okay." That's the word that bugs me. Is there too much naivete when it comes to sex? Of course. Does that mean half the population should say forced sex is "okay"? Absolutely not. We're on the same page. :thumbsup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bliz Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 That is true. OTOH, since the shoe is now on the other foot with the female's claim of rape now being likely to be easily accepted, we have created a situation ripe for crying wolf. If enough of those cases happen, things may swing back the other way which I think would not be a good thing. Duke lacrosse, basically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky21 Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 I found this disturbing. Surveys of U.S. and Canadian college students, for example, find that one of three men say that if they could get away with it, they would be at least `somewhat likely' to rape a woman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rdskn4Lyf21 Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 I found this disturbing. Surveys of U.S. and Canadian college students, for example, find that one of three men say that if they could get away with it, they would be at least `somewhat likely' to rape a woman. That's not only disturbing but it's completely ****ed up and awful to think about. If I ever have a daughter she's going to college and will be a black belt, carry mace on her at all times, and keep a few large knives in her dorm room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighOnHendrix Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 I found this disturbing. Surveys of U.S. and Canadian college students, for example, find that one of three men say that if they could get away with it, they would be at least `somewhat likely' to rape a woman. When you get right down to it, you can apply that to virtually any crime. Many people would also commit murder if they could get away with it. The main reason we have laws against acts that are destructive to society is because there are people who want to commit them. Which is why it's also illegal for an adult to have sex with a minor: because lots of guys want to do that. (See: Mix, Anthony; Kelly, R.) If no one wanted to do it, there wouldn't necessarily be a law against it. Another reason I'm not surprised by that is that there is a decent sized sub-culture centered around simulated rape/abuse, etc. Go to one of those xxx sites that has streaming videos and type in rape. I bet a ton of stuff comes up. Since so many enjoy watching those, it stands to reason those same people would consider making that a reality. I find it disturbing, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 Yeah HOH, remove the limits and anarchy results. Self respect and valuing/respecting others takes a back seat to self gratification in too many cases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACW Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 Yeah HOH, remove the limits and anarchy results.Self respect and valuing/respecting others takes a back seat to self gratification in too many cases. Actually, self-gratification wouldn't be a bad thing in many cases :jerk: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjah Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 So 20+ years later; what do you guys think? Are we still a "rape prone" society? Until it is no longer true that 1 in 4 college age women are survivors of rape or attempted rape, we'll still be a "rape prone" society. Let's get that number down to 1 in 10, then 1 in 50, and then 1 in 200. Even that is too much, but it would be a drastic improvement and show that the citizens of the wealthiest nation in history are capable of exercising basic civility when we think nobody's looking. Perhaps some of the "pussification of America" people might complain about has actually made some positive impact to some of the attitudes in this article.Perhaps. On the other hand, commercial sexuality is at an all-time high. Even if the cult of unmitigated macho has abated slightly, we've more than "made up for it" with the constant stream of more sexually-unhealthy commercial messages we send to our children.The type of kid-oriented sexuality I see today -- particularly the stuff aimed at preteen girls -- makes some of Madonna's most controversial work look downright purposeful. Sad to say. Gender-oversubscription carries a heavy price for American society, in the form of violent crime and other incredibly damaging behavior. When a drunk 19 year old hyper-broseph douchebag on a dare crushes his classic Mustang against a bridge abutment at 110 mph and they collect enough of him to bury in an Altoids tin, that's unfortunate. When he and some bros decide to gang-rape a woman and end up ruining her life and (quite possibly) long-term physical and mental health, that's a tragedy. Gang-rape isn't the biggest rape-related problem though. Acquiaintance rape accounts for over 4/5 of all rape situations, and committing it only requires one person. Of course, our macho-vs-meek gender roles enable that too. :mad: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buenosdiaz Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 touchy subject... I read this book called "the ***** in the house" that talks about some of these socially constructed gender roles yall should check it out or make your SO's read it and summarize that **** for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Brave Little Toaster Oven Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 I blame the porn industry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 I blame the porn industry I blame drinking,dancing and rock music But that may my fundamentalist Baptist side speaking. I do think many forms of porn devalues women,but look at it as a symptom,rather than a cause. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zguy28 Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 I blame drinking,dancing and rock music But that may my fundamentalist Baptist side speaking. I do think many forms of porn devalues women,but look at it as a symptom,rather than a cause. Its funny (not Haha funny), but us Baptists get haranged and laughed at for strict behavior standards, and yet the same people can't seem to understand how the 3 out of 4 secular college men would likely rape a girl if they could get away with it. I wonder how gender segregated colleges match up statistically against co-ed colleges with regard to members of the student body who have been raped? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Mike Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 Peggy Sanday, an anthropologist, found high incidences of rape to be associated with militarism, interpersonal violence in general, an ideology of male toughness and distant father-child relationships. Rape-free societies, on the other hand, encourage female participation in the economy and political system and male involvement in child-rearing. What the hell is a "rape prone" society? Hell, show me one that isnt. Come on Peggy, show us that "rape free" society. Sorry but this whole thing is stupid. It's about people using sad issue to push an agenda. The bottom line is that humans are still animals and under the wrong conditions those base animal urges can take over. It's the same in every society. To point at America and suggest that we are somehow more "rape prone" than anyone else is just absurd. :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaxBuddy21 Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 Its funny (not Haha funny), but us Baptists get haranged and laughed at for strict behavior standards, and yet the same people can't seem to understand how the 3 out of 4 secular college men would likely rape a girl if they could get away with it. I wonder how gender segregated colleges match up statistically against co-ed colleges with regard to members of the student body who have been raped? So rather than teach responsibility you think its better to just expect that people cannot control themselves and not allow them to make their own choices? That makes sense. This situation is no different than making people not want to steal. How many people would steal something they really wanted if they could get away with it? Its about taking something you want (in this case sex). Just because people have those thoughts does not make them bad people. The people who act on those thoughts are bad people. I know I have though before about stealing. I would never do it though not only because of the legal ramifications but also I would not want someone to steal something from me and I am a firm believer in the golden rule. This type of behavior has happened for centuries and I dont think as a society we can do anything more than increase the punishment for those who choose to act. Better parenting helps as well but we cannot force that upon people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 Its funny (not Haha funny), but us Baptists get haranged and laughed at for strict behavior standards, and yet the same people can't seem to understand how the 3 out of 4 secular college men would likely rape a girl if they could get away with it. I wonder how gender segregated colleges match up statistically against co-ed colleges with regard to members of the student body who have been raped? Bigot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Never4get#21 Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 Rape is a growing problem because of the lack of punishment: A study made by the U.S. Department of Justice of prison releases in 1992, involving about 80 percent of the prison population, found that the average sentence for convicted rapists was 11.8 years, while the actual time served was 5.4 years. This follows the typical pattern for violent crimes in the US, where those convicted typically serve no more than half of their sentence. I see this all the time. Google sex offenders in your area. Your saturated with them. Simple solution: Maxium sentencing to include death OR at the least "chemical castration" which has been proven effective in the early 80's. It will make someone think twice before having sex if the consequence of your actions were held to a high standard. IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forehead Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 Simple solution: Maxium sentencing to include death OR at the least "chemical castration" which has been proven effective in the early 80's. It will make someone think twice before having sex if the consequence of your actions were held to a high standard. IMO. The "he said, she said" thing someone referred to earlier makes it hard to include death as a punishment for rape...especially in cases like the Central Park or Duke Lacrosse thing. However, in cut and dried, beyond a shadow of a doubt rape convictions, I'm all for the perp having to swallow a bullet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaxBuddy21 Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 However, in cut and dried, beyond a shadow of a doubt rape convictions, I'm all for the perp having to swallow a bullet. In those situations, Im more for the chemical castration! Death is over instantly but imagine having to live with no captain winky for the rest of your life. Bet that would be a deterrent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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