Jason Campbell Is Our Starting QB, So Let's Be Optimistic About It...

[HawaiianTime]

Some of that has to be on Zorn. Will he allow JC to become more of a "game leader" as you put it, and take some chances.

I know some of it is on Zorn, but I'm curious as to how Zorn could help Jason achieve the next level. I use to think that Zorn needed to trust Jason and open the playbook more until I saw the clips by Wilcotts. Was it me, or did it seem like Zorn likes to bunch a lot of his receivers togther?

[LizKauai]

I posted a pic of Jason with some dolphins for a reason. I love that pic. Jason looks happy, confident, curious, fascinated and comfortable- not to mention buff. I am visualizing him in that same head space on the football field - seeing - and responding - and making the plays as needed.

I truly believe that an outpouring of good vibes, positive visualizations in our fan support is the greatest thing we can do right now to participate in the SUCCESS of the Redskins this year!

[BigMike619]

I posted a pic of Jason with some dolphins for a reason. I love that pic. Jason looks happy, confident, curious, fascinated and comfortable- not to mention buff. I am visualizing him in that same head space on the football field - seeing - and responding - and making the plays as needed.

I truly believe that an outpouring of good vibes, positive visualizations in our fan support is the greatest thing we can do right now to participate in the SUCCESS of the Redskins this year!

wow, we should sticky this post and give it its own thread just because this is probably the most positive thing I have seen written about JC in a long time.

well said Liz

[LizKauai]

wow, we should sticky this post and give it its own thread just because this is probably the most positive thing I have seen written about JC in a long time.

well said Liz

Actually- it does have its own thread (Jason and the dolphins). Positive captions welcome!

[eljeasel]

I posted a pic of Jason with some dolphins for a reason. I love that pic. Jason looks happy, confident, curious, fascinated and comfortable- not to mention buff. I am visualizing him in that same head space on the football field - seeing - and responding - and making the plays as needed.

I truly believe that an outpouring of good vibes, positive visualizations in our fan support is the greatest thing we can do right now to participate in the SUCCESS of the Redskins this year!

I love the tone of your post and the theme! Heres to Jason taking the leap along with our team!

[Yeen80]

If he can get help from Malcolm Kelly and Devin Thomas this year, he's surely to improve over last season's numbers. Guaranteed.

[KokoMike]

"It's the biggest season of my career coming up," Campbell said. "I'm in the last year of my contract. Look at all the stuff I've gone through. This year could really set the pace for me, for my entire career. Hopefully we ball-out, not just me, but the whole offensive unit."

Jason Campbell, June 2009

Ok, so I don't know what "ball-out" is. So, I looked it up.

According to the Urban Dictionary, it means spending a lot of money, especially at a strip club...or reminding a person about a negative event, often a recent negative event. Works best when used in front of numerous people. The more painful the event, the better the ball out...or to leave (as in I'm bouts to ball-out of this joint.

I hate to say it, but I think what he was saying is that he wants to go to a strip joint with the entire offensive unit, cry the blues to the strippers, and then stiff them on the bill, taking the entire offensive unit down.

We need to watch him very closely this year. Keep an eye on things like towels, footballs, Colt's jock strap, etc.

[LizKauai]

I think Jason meant "balls out"

1. Balls out

To exude tremendous effort, to try extremely hard.

or

2.the state of fearlessness associated with confident testicular exposure in precarious circumstances. With reckless abandon and extreme courage; HEAD-LONG; WITH A FULL HEAD OF STEAM; GIVING IT ONE'S ALL.

[mistertim]

2.the state of fearlessness associated with confident testicular exposure in precarious circumstances. With reckless abandon and extreme courage; HEAD-LONG; WITH A FULL HEAD OF STEAM; GIVING IT ONE'S ALL.

Sorry but that is just too damn funny not to notice. "Precarious circumstances"?

[thedevilhimself]

You mean we were on our way with Portisx until defenses realized that if they elimanted 26 and made JC beat them, it was a better gamble than playing the Lions.

Yeah that was it :doh:

It had nothing to do with the fact we had no offensive line .

When the Rams lost Orlando Pace they went 2-14 . Samuels is just as big of an impact of a player then the offense should not miss a beat ?

Do you watch football at all ?

[LizKauai]

Sorry but that is just too damn funny not to notice. "Precarious circumstances"?

In this case- I think a contract negotiation year would qualify.

:point2sky

[Taylor 36]

Yeah that was it :doh:

It had nothing to do with the fact we had no offensive line .

When the Rams lost Orlando Pace they went 2-14 . Samuels is just as big of an impact of a player then the offense should not miss a beat ?

Do you watch football at all ?

Obviously, I watch more than you which allows me to see for myself, as many others have, beyond the babbling of a few fans and a couple of "experts" that those same fans call idiots all the time until they say one thing that they agree with or helps them make a case, and then they are geniuses. :doh:

It is very amusing the argument that the QB can't do it all by himself, yet you want to argue that the loss of ONE guy brought down an entire offense. Nice try, but horrible failure on your part.

The fact of the matter is, if you care to actually go back and watch games, that when we were on our 6-2 run, JC was still averaging anemic numbers. The passing game never, ever changed. It didn't get worse as the season wore on, it stayed stagnant with MR. CHECKDOWN behind center. What changed was the opponents' defensive schemes.

Portis and our defense were the sole reasons we were winning. When the other defense shut down our running attack, the passing game couldn't do anything to save or help us. It stayed as pathetic as it had been the eight weeks before. JC didn't throw an interception. Big ****ing deal. It means nothing when you can't score points either (which happens to be part of his job description).

Our defense was worn down due to the the lack of offensive production (you know with the leader of the offense, the general, the QB, that guy not getting **** done week after week) and so we were pathetic as a team for the second half of the season.

Try watching actual games and breaking things down with your own eyes, and stop just relying on the same crap that all the apologists have been spitting out for months now. Think for yourself.

[darrelgreenie]

Try watching actual games and breaking things down with your own eyes, and stop just relying on the same crap that all the apologists have been spitting out for months now. Think for yourself.

If you have watched the games as closely as you claim and you don't see how the OL effects the play of the QB then you don't know what you're looking at bro.

In the second half of the season it wasn't just sacks.

JC was getting hit alot.

Even when JC got the ball out on rhythm he was often getting hit on 3 step drops, 3 step drops dude!

That shouldn't happen.

And if you're getting hit on 3 step drop passes there isn't a whole heck of alot you can do offensively.

Zorn even said that the pass protection limited his playcalling.

Maybe you don't understand what you're seeing?

[Voice_of_Reason]

If you have watched the games as closely as you claim and you don't see how the OL effects the play of the QB then you don't know what you're looking at bro.

In the second half of the season it wasn't just sacks.

JC was getting hit alot.

Even when JC got the ball out on rhythm he was often getting hit on 3 step drops, 3 step drops dude!

That shouldn't happen.

And if you're getting hit on 3 step drop passes there isn't a whole heck of alot you can do offensively.

Zorn even said that the pass protection limited his playcalling.

Maybe you don't understand what you're seeing?

I'll agree with Darrellgreenie.

I broke down every play in the second Dallas game, and the summary that I came up with is that of 61 offensive plays, 9 (14%) of the total plays were screen plays, 20 (32%) where running plays, and 6 were 1 option plays. That's half of your offensive plays that take place basically behind the LOS. Mr. Checkdown was Mr. Checkdown because there were no plays called with deep options, for the most part. My eyes and analysis tells me that due to the play calling, there was nothing doing deep. The one time they threw the ball deep, the ball was thrown very accurately, Moss got 2 hands on it, and dropped it.

Here's a link to the post I made about that game, which includes a link to the play chart I created that shows every play, the down and distance, the starting field position, the result and commentary on each play. It took me ~8 hours to complete this because I watched every offensive play over and over in slow motion.

http://www.extremeskins.com/showpost.php?p=6449277&postcount=55

Also, to Darrellgreenies point, JC was getting hit on 5 step drops in under 2.3 seconds. I watched the game with a stopwatch. That's pathetic, no matter what you think of the QB. That's barely enough time to get back and plant your back foot before getting clobbered. Even the comentators commented that JC was taking a complete beating.

Anyway, it really doesn't matter. I'm firmly in the "wait and see" camp. You'll see that I point out what I consider to be 3 pretty horrendous throws from JC. I'm not an appologist or a hater, I just look at what I can see. I don't think JC's ever going to be John Elway, but I think that he can be Matt Hassellbeck, given the right situation.

The other thing that I just don't understand from the ~5-10 fans who seem to want to roast JC at the stake is that they don't seem to understand that people can improve year over year. Zorn was in his first year as a coach, JC and the recievers where in their first year in the offense, and everybody had to learn. So, is there no possibility that they do it better they second time around? Will they improve? Who knows. That's the question. But they're going to get the opportunity to do it. And nothing the fans can do about it one way or the other. So, I for one am just going to hope that they figure it out. And if they don't, they won't be around next year. Shrug. That's life.

EDIT: btw, on a slightly different topic, and not related to Darrellgreenies post, I'm personally getting really tired of all the name calling. JC Haters, JC apologists, and several that I won't type, it's just juvenile and silly. Fans are going to have different opinions on different players. Some people don't think that JC can do the job, others do. It's a disagreement. So what? Why with the name calling and labeling? Just because people do not agree with a point of view doesn't mean that they're not listening or understanding. They can be doing 3 things at the same time, listening, understanding and disagreeing. Just saying. It's silly.

[eljeasel]

I'll agree with Darrellgreenie.

I broke down every play in the second Dallas game, and the summary that I came up with is that of 61 offensive plays, 9 (14%) of the total plays were screen plays, 20 (32%) where running plays, and 6 were 1 option plays. That's half of your offensive plays that take place basically behind the LOS. Mr. Checkdown was Mr. Checkdown because there were no plays called with deep options, for the most part. My eyes and analysis tells me that due to the play calling, there was nothing doing deep. The one time they threw the ball deep, the ball was thrown very accurately, Moss got 2 hands on it, and dropped it.

Thanks for the indepth post. The behind the line bulk of plays is something that I had noticed but didnt have any numbers to really base that off. Must have taken you some time, thanks.

And youre right about the name calling, not really needed here.

[Voice_of_Reason]

Thanks for the indepth post. The behind the line bulk of plays is something that I had noticed but didnt have any numbers to really base that off. Must have taken you some time, thanks.

And youre right about the name calling, not really needed here.

Welcome. Sadly, my tivo crashed, or I was going to do the same for the rest of the games of the season, but I lost all of my recordings, including all of the 'Skins games. And they charged me $149 to replace the damn thing. ****s.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

...(a bunch of other really good analysis)...

Excellent post, thanks for that :applause:...also I checked out your link as well as the thread your linked post appeared, in...both were excellent as well. :thumbsup:

Wish more threads were like this one:

http://www.extremeskins.com/showthread.php?t=288596

[Voice_of_Reason]

Excellent post, thanks for that :applause:...also I checked out your link as well as the thread your linked post appeared, in...both were excellent as well. :thumbsup:

Wish more threads were like this one:

http://www.extremeskins.com/showthread.php?t=288596

I've got to say that was my favorite thread of the off season. Actually digging in and discussing an actual game as objectively as possible with others who shared the same goal. It was neat.

And doing it several months after the season meant that the urge to punch holes in concrete after we lost the game had passed.

[HighOnHendrix]

EDIT: btw, on a slightly different topic, and not related to Darrellgreenies post, I'm personally getting really tired of all the name calling. JC Haters, JC apologists, and several that I won't type, it's just juvenile and silly. Fans are going to have different opinions on different players. Some people don't think that JC can do the job, others do. It's a disagreement. So what? Why with the name calling and labeling? Just because people do not agree with a point of view doesn't mean that they're not listening or understanding. They can be doing 3 things at the same time, listening, understanding and disagreeing. Just saying. It's silly.

I think that happens because some people on both sides are forming their opinions on misremembered or even faulty recollections of what happened during the games last season or even before that. There are also some who seem to have decided that (to paraphrase the Waterboy's mama) JC was the devil long before they saw him play any significant amount of snaps or take the tone that they knew all along he sucked and/or love to prophecy his downfall; the opposite side of that coin is folks who think he's gonna be Joe Montana in a couple years. The truth lies somewhere in between. But the people on the ends of that spectrum are bound to have animosity towards each other.

[mcsluggo]

Yes I certainly did, and I remember wanting to think Jason was the future of the franchise and praying I would see that he just never had a pocket.... This wasn't the case... Stats even prove that this wasn't the case... What the stats show is that, as Clinton's production went down so did the teams... What a shocker, I know the skins have a ridiculous record when Portis rushes for over a 100

uh, ok... and those stats show that when Jason's production went down, so did the teams.

hmmm shocking coincidence!

the O-line went from being good to being banged up and borderline attrocious... and at that point both the running and passing game suffered.

JC is an average QB. plain and simple. He is neither the "chosen one" savior future of the franchise, nor Alan Alda from Paper Lions. If the Redskins get in a situation where they can bag a "franchise QB" without paying through the ass, jump on it. Otherwise, JC is about as serviceable as the other "middle 70%" QBs in the league... just like the dude that will replace him if he is sacked.

[RandyHolt]

@VOR Thanks for that great post and all the work you put in. Jason is but one player in a team game. I think Zorn deserves much of the blame for what happened in the second half of the season. Teams adjusted to stuff Portis, and Zorn never adjusted to it. He kept running the exact same offense. Zorn was a noob but still he needs to adjust his approach at times to cater to the best players strengths. Dont run a reverse to Davis; put Jason in shotgun and buy him time to not have to out backpeddle the rush, see the D better, and go deep a bit more often and make teams pay for boxing us.

[Conn]

Voice of Reason:

Thank you for the in-depth analysis, that was a lot of work. But very interesting information, and very telling. Maybe this coming season, or more likely next off-season, if this is something that you actually enjoy doing when you have the time, you can make a "sticky" thread/threads with analysis such as this on the offense, because I for one find it incredibly good information to know. Either way, I appreciate the work.

[Passizle]

Obviously, I watch more than you which allows me to see for myself, as many others have, beyond the babbling of a few fans and a couple of "experts" that those same fans call idiots all the time until they say one thing that they agree with or helps them make a case, and then they are geniuses. :doh:

It is very amusing the argument that the QB can't do it all by himself, yet you want to argue that the loss of ONE guy brought down an entire offense. Nice try, but horrible failure on your part.

The fact of the matter is, if you care to actually go back and watch games, that when we were on our 6-2 run, JC was still averaging anemic numbers. The passing game never, ever changed. It didn't get worse as the season wore on, it stayed stagnant with MR. CHECKDOWN behind center. What changed was the opponents' defensive schemes.

Portis and our defense were the sole reasons we were winning. When the other defense shut down our running attack, the passing game couldn't do anything to save or help us. It stayed as pathetic as it had been the eight weeks before. JC didn't throw an interception. Big ****ing deal. It means nothing when you can't score points either (which happens to be part of his job description).

Our defense was worn down due to the the lack of offensive production (you know with the leader of the offense, the general, the QB, that guy not getting **** done week after week) and so we were pathetic as a team for the second half of the season.

Try watching actual games and breaking things down with your own eyes, and stop just relying on the same crap that all the apologists have been spitting out for months now. Think for yourself.

You could not be further from the truth. It has been well documented and discussed that the pass game was good during the 6-2 run.

We had major problems on the lines all season. That just got worse ans the season went on. The highpoint of that being the Steelers game.

I watch games. I think I know a thing or two about football. If what you say is true, then please explain away the next few facts about the offense for me...

1. JC had much better stats during the first 8 weeks compared to the last 8 weeks. Things like a 7.6 yards per attempt, 66% completion rate, 219 yards per game, 100 QB rating... etc... the one glaring shortcoming is throwing TD's. But just by the numbers alone, you cant call out JC for not getting the ball across the goal line. Thats takes a team down there...

The last eight weeks, JC numbers fell dramatically. Things like 5.4 yards per attempt, 59% completion rate, 186 yards per game, 72.3 QB rating... etc...

These numbers debunk alot myths about his completion percentage being all bunk because all he did was checking down the latter half as his completion percentage actullay went down... not up, as one would think to a guy who does nothing but check down.

2. Do you really think that Portis is to congratulate for all of JC's success in the first half of the season? Explain this then. Why would JC have more success when defenders were not stacking the box? I mean, you would figure that if they are not stacking the box, this leaves more guys in coverage and when they were stacking, the opposite would be true. The argument does not make sense that JC played worse with the defense tryig to stop Portis. What does make sense here is a theory that the offensive line could no longer pass or run block effectivley wich stalled the offense... not entirely though, as I think t whole offensive unit just played flat toward the latter season.

Lasty, the Rams example has tremendous weight in this comparison. Though, it was not just Pace that faltered. The Rams offense was tremendous for years... with Steven Jackson, Torry Holt and Marc Bulger on every fantasy football dream team list.

What happened to them? They had 3 or 4 season ending injuries on the offensive line in just a few games. The repercussions of those injuries showed as the season went on and that once terrific offesive unit could no longer produce and Bulger and Jackson end that season beat up and injured. Why? By your logic, it would seem that they just sucked all the sudden.

[eljeasel]

2. Do you really think that Portis is to congratulate for all of JC's success in the first half of the season? Explain this then. Why would JC have more success when defenders were not stacking the box? I mean, you would figure that if they are not stacking the box, this leaves more guys in coverage and when they were stacking, the opposite would be true. The argument does not make sense that JC played worse with the defense tryig to stop Portis. What does make sense here is a theory that the offensive line could no longer pass or run block effectivley wich stalled the offense... not entirely though, as I think t whole offensive unit just played flat toward the latter season.

During the 1st half the season check out the difference in 1st and 2nd half stats. Typically you see bigger 1st halves than 2nd from Campbell because we used vertical passing to get chunks of yards frequently. That isnt to say we didnt dink and dunk as well, but you rarely saw attacking in the 2nd half. In the 2nd half we went to a more ball control style of offense. Heres where you see bigger games from Portis. In the 1st half the season, Portis was getting a huge chunk of his yards when we were choking teams to death in the 2nd halves of games. And he was doing it against stacked boxes. A testament to not only Portis, but to the guys up front who were kicking all kinds of ass. Baldinger did a report on how it didnt matter how many you put in the box, Portis was getting to the 2nd level clean and was getting good yards after first contact.

Examples -

NO - CP goes for 52 of his 96 in the 2nd

AZ - CP runs for 42 yards of his 68 in the 2nd half

in Dallas - CP runs for 85 of his 121 in the 2nd half, including a 31 yarder (which was a beauty)

In Philly - CP goes for 100 of his 145 in the 2nd half including a 27 yarder great one

STL - 77 of his 129 in the 2nd half along with a 29 yarder

CLE - 100 of his 175 (jeez) in the 2nd half along with a 24 and a 27 yarder

Even in Detroit - 57 of 126 in the 2nd

Youre talking about 513 of his 860yards he got in the 2nd half. That means he was facing stacked boxes when teams knew we were trying to grind out the clock. That means our guys up front didnt care if it was 4-8 or all 11 in the box, they were going to get positive yards. Now, that didnt happen in the 2nd half of hte season. I just rewatched the Seller's goal line fail from the Cincy game. There were precisely no one from our line who moved more than a foot fowards. Of course, there goes Casey Ryback a full yard BEHIND where he started, and hes the only one who was healthy at that point.

Anyways, 1. huge testament to how good our guys were playing up front, and 2. its hard to gain stats (if thats how we are going to judge how well a qb plays) when all you see if Zorn running power. And I dont fault him for doing that, it was working damn well. 3. Im not in the mood for it, but I have to point out Campbell played pretty well in the 4th in the 1st half the season. Im talking about picking up alot of 3rd downs, evading pressures, preserving drives, keeping the defense off the field, explosive pass plays, and actually, scoring.

[darrelgreenie]

2. Do you really think that Portis is to congratulate for all of JC's success in the first half of the season? Explain this then. Why would JC have more success when defenders were not stacking the box? I mean, you would figure that if they are not stacking the box, this leaves more guys in coverage and when they were stacking, the opposite would be true. The argument does not make sense that JC played worse with the defense tryig to stop Portis. What does make sense here is a theory that the offensive line could no longer pass or run block effectivley wich stalled the offense... not entirely though, as I think t whole offensive unit just played flat toward the latter season.

Its hard to know exactly what defenses were trying to stop.

I think after Moss ate Newmans lunch in the Dallas game teams tried to and foremost to double Moss, like like the Eagles.

Here's part of my view on how defenses played us:

I think team were trying to stop the short WCO passing gaming.

We faced some defense that were designed and experienced in facing the WCO.

Knowing that the design of our passing game favored mostly short drops 3 and 5 steps it invited corners to played press coverage, especially with out receivers who don't get off the line easily.

Then knowing that

a) the design of the passing game is short

the receivers don't get off jams easily

c) the pass protection is weak

the were willing to take their chances and bring the safety into the box

b/c the by the time the receivers get off the jam the pass rush would beat the pass protection before there is a good chance to throw deep

:2cents:

HTTR!