Classic example of Cerrato's ineptness

[terpskins10]

I admittedly know nothing about this Jones guy. If he is a DE like you said though, how is he going to take Haynesworth's spot?

He's a DE but he's about 6'5, 280 with room to grow. He replaced Haynesworth in the lineup when he was injured and was named defensive player of the week, IIRC.

[GIBBS LIVES]

Wow, what an imaginative thread. Same old Redskins spending, Vinny made bad draft picks, all Snyder cares about is money. Since you obviously wasted time by creating the the thread I figured I'd contribute by wasting mine too.

Funny,

When people can't debate the points, they attack the messenger. So child like.

[MumboSauce]

uhmmm winning brings even more money so I highly doubt Snyder doesn't care about winning. Certainly making plenty of money while losing however. I agree that our FO makes some really bad moves with FA's and draft picks, either bad picks or throwing them away.

[GIBBS LIVES]

I know the truth hurts ladies, but it is what it is.

Cerrato is Danny's boy. And Cerrato/Snyder drafted a WR that they KNEW had degenerative knees.

LIke buying condoms when you know they have holes in them.

[Thinking Skins]

I know the truth hurts ladies, but it is what it is.

Cerrato is Danny's boy. And Cerrato/Snyder drafted a WR that they KNEW had degenerative knees.

LIke buying condoms when you know they have holes in them.

So whats new about your argument? Where's the innovative nature that shows it deserves a new thread? Were you just tired of not hearing enough fans angry at the Redskins front office?

[Redskins:Victory_or_Death]

Were you just tired of not hearing enough fans angry at the Redskins front office?

[Oldskool]

Are we really still kvetching about this pick? About Jason Jones?? Jones will have a drop off because Haynesworth isn't on that line. And how soon we forget his scouting report, which highlights exactly why we didn't select him:

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2008/profiles/jason-jones?id=1340#player-profile-tab-set-1:player-profile-tab-analysis

Compares To: MICHAEL MYERS-Cincinnati...Like Myers, Jones is a bit of a 'tweener, as he lacks bulk and ideal lower body strength to play inside and is too inconsistent with his pass rush moves to be an impact edge rusher. He is very good at run containment, but you would think a player with his incredibly long arms could get more pass break-ups than he has. He lacks pass rush moves, relying more on a clean release from the outside or squeezing through the gaps to impact the pocket. Still, he has been productive vs. the ground game, and later in the draft he is worth a pick to see if he can develop into a starter at end or tackle. At worst, he will provide decent back-up depth.

[Shilsu]

Are we really still kvetching about this pick? About Jason Jones?? Jones will have a drop off because Haynesworth isn't on that line. And how soon we forget his scouting report, which highlights exactly why we didn't select him:

Jason Jones was Haynesworth's backup, so his production wasn't coming from playing beside Big Al.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2008/profiles/jason-jones?id=1340#player-profile-tab-set-1:player-profile-tab-analysis

Compares To: MICHAEL MYERS-Cincinnati...Like Myers, Jones is a bit of a 'tweener, as he lacks bulk and ideal lower body strength to play inside and is too inconsistent with his pass rush moves to be an impact edge rusher. He is very good at run containment, but you would think a player with his incredibly long arms could get more pass break-ups than he has. He lacks pass rush moves, relying more on a clean release from the outside or squeezing through the gaps to impact the pocket. Still, he has been productive vs. the ground game, and later in the draft he is worth a pick to see if he can develop into a starter at end or tackle. At worst, he will provide decent back-up depth.

He's good at run containment and at worst he will provide decent back-up depth.

Hmm... Isn't that exactly what we're looking for at the LDE spot?

[THE HAMMER'IN HOG]

That is a VERY false statement. Danny has made some stupid moves, but his dedication to winning is absolutely unquestionable. He's slowly learning how to make the right moves, taking two step forward and one back, but slowly making it. But he wants to win SO badly. He doesn't need to bring in these players with high price tags every year and eke out every last dime he can out of that cap. Did you see him after we beat Philly at their place? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o85N2piJPyM

I love how he wants to win. That's the best part about him besides his money.

I have to agree with GL, the second Snyder didn't get his way he fired Schottenheimer, and that's after Marty in 1 season took us out of cap hell and straightened out Danny boys mess.

Does Danny want to win? Of coarse, but he only wants to win if it's he who's pulling the strings when it comes to personnel, and the fact is he doesn't qualify as an average fan when it comes to football savvy, he's more like some chick cheering for a team so she can spend more time with her boy friend, unfortunately that chick is making personal decisions for us.

[Oldskool]

Jason Jones was Haynesworth's backup, so his production wasn't coming from playing beside Big Al.

http://www.nfl.com/teams/tennesseetitans/depthchart?team=TEN

Jones is a DE, Haynesworth is a DT. No way Jones could have been Fat Albert's backup.

He's good at run containment and at worst he will provide decent back-up depth.

Hmm... Isn't that exactly what we're looking for at the LDE spot?

Run containment? Sure but as others point out, there is more to being a DE than one facet of the game. With little pass rush, questionable motor and not showing the ability to deflect passes, we would be getting a younger, less savvy version of Daniels.

[turbodiesel#44]

OK, I'm going to defend Vinny. This hurts.

Everything during JG2 I'm giving Vinny a pass on. I was so glad to get away from the "King of All I Survey FO Structure" and divide the duties to younger, driven professionals familiar with and devoted to their individual tasks and the modern game. I was disappointed in the GM selection, but Vinny went and hired Zorn. I thought Zorn should be a candidate before GW's first interview. Vinny hired, then promoted him. So he gets a wash there.

We had more picks last year that I can recall in recent history. Boy, Vinny screwed the pooch on that deal. ONE Starter, and that was a blind luck 6th rounder. Stacking the bench with TE, blowing a pick on a punter, WR on crutches...WTF Vinny? JG built one of the better lines in football and you run it like a kid who inherited his fathers prize Corvette but never changes the oil. WTF? Every skill player in the NFL needs a little freeboard to do his thing. Fundamental football. Right now, if any ONE lineman goes down, we are on the ropes. Most of them being AARP members I don't have a problem with. It's the depth that keeps killing us, and no development. Vinny is totally wasting the talents of one of the better line coaches ever. Ever ever. You think Bugel has to teach those guys anything? They are all at the end of their careers. Including JB. What a waste. And what is the deal with Vinny's inability to select WR talent? TO is his only claim to fame? WTF? I would leave that off my resume. The guy wrecked 3 locker rooms. Who the hell else has he ever picked...Wait, I'm defending Vinny here...

I can't change the FO, and we have to play this Sept. Honestly, I like all the moves we have made so far this year except letting Evans go so cheap. SO FAR. I give Vinny a pass on JT because of the injury, Blache likely being the one switching his side, the fact it was last years spilt milk and hindsight is 20/20. If Vinny can draft 2 OL who see the field this year (I don't care if they are always on their ass) and maybe a LB or DE, then I will not only start to believe he might actually be learning, I will take back all the bad, bad things I have said about him and eat some crow. Except drafting a freaking punter. WTF?

There it is, my defense of Vinny.

[The Sisko]

Jones and Kendall Langford were the two DE prospects I had my eye on last year prior to the draft. However in fairness to Vinny I thought at least one of them would be available for us in the third round.

OTOH, what was I thinking? We all know Snyderatto doesn't believe in drafting DL any higher than the sixth round.

[chipwhich]

JG built one of the better lines in football and you run it like a kid who inherited his fathers prize Corvette but never changes the oil. WTF?

I always wonder about posts like this.

He left us with an old line. No depth. He inherited the offensive tackles. In 4 years he couldn't build an offensive line, just used the 2 key parts he had and build a middle line which was "ok".

He left us with no #1 receivers.

No linebackers.

No defensive lineman.

Questions at QB.

Questions by some at running back.

Questions by some at corner.

Questions at Punter.

Questions at Kicker.

I love Gibbs I as much as the next guy, but the bashing and ignorance to the facts are just silly.

Gibbs II left us much like Gibbs I did. With more questions than answers. I am not sure where that Corvette is you are referring to. Gibbs II left us with an empty tank of gas, and lots of refueling needed.

[turbodiesel#44]

I always wonder about posts like this.

He left us with an old line. No depth. He inherited the offensive tackles. In 4 years he couldn't build an offensive line, just used the 2 key parts he had and build a middle line which was "ok".

He left us with no #1 receivers.

No linebackers.

No defensive lineman.

Questions at QB.

Questions by some at running back.

Questions by some at corner.

Questions at Punter.

Questions at Kicker.

I love Gibbs I as much as the next guy, but the bashing and ignorance to the facts are just silly.

Gibbs II left us much like Gibbs I did. With more questions than answers. I am not sure where that Corvette is you are referring to. Gibbs II left us with an empty tank of gas, and lots of refueling needed.

I was talking about the OL that has produced consistently for our running game until they ran out of gas. You think CP got all those yards on his own? A running game is all we've had in a decade. You see what happens when you don't maintain your lines. Samuels and Thomas were some of the best at their positions during their prime. Even Jansen was good. I don't know where you dreamed up all that other crap you think I said.

[PROSCOUT]

I admittedly know nothing about this Jones guy. If he is a DE like you said though, how is he going to take Haynesworth's spot?

Maybe because Haynesworth plays that position...as well as DT.

Do some homework

[PROSCOUT]

I don't know who was available or who we could have had last year in the 2nd round, hindsight is 20/20 but I do know its absolutely S-T-U-P-I-D to take a tight end with a 2nd round pick when you need a pass rusher and you ALREADY have a pro bowl tight end signed to a 6 year deal.

Did I mention that it was stupid.

[drowland]

Are we really still kvetching about this pick? About Jason Jones?? Jones will have a drop off because Haynesworth isn't on that line. And how soon we forget his scouting report, which highlights exactly why we didn't select him:

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2008/profiles/jason-jones?id=1340#player-profile-tab-set-1:player-profile-tab-analysis

Compares To: MICHAEL MYERS-Cincinnati...Like Myers, Jones is a bit of a 'tweener, as he lacks bulk and ideal lower body strength to play inside and is too inconsistent with his pass rush moves to be an impact edge rusher. He is very good at run containment, but you would think a player with his incredibly long arms could get more pass break-ups than he has. He lacks pass rush moves, relying more on a clean release from the outside or squeezing through the gaps to impact the pocket. Still, he has been productive vs. the ground game, and later in the draft he is worth a pick to see if he can develop into a starter at end or tackle. At worst, he will provide decent back-up depth.

Actually Jones' production came with Haynesworth out. Last January I remember hearing Vinny on the radio talking about need. He brought up the Skins needing a "Justin Tuck" on the DL who can line over center or line up at end. Jason Jones is that type of talent. Jones was considered a little raw coming into the draft, but with three 2nd rd picks, the Skins were in position to take a shot with him intead of drafting a 3rd pass catcher.

[veteranskinsfan]

Vinny did inherit some old veterans but every general manager inherits a less than perfect roster even when your team wins the Super Bowl. In the off-season even the Super Bowl winner loses players. So how has Vinny positioned us to begin the 2009 season? ES members are concerned about this year. They see many holes on the defense and special teams. Still have questions about offensive line too and third wide receiver spot. We do not have a strong bench of players pushing the starters too. One example is losing Evans to the 49ers which was unnecessary. Every year for the past 10years we lose players to other teams. The following year with a new team these ex-Skins do just fine with their new teams. The 2009 Redskins need to get the job done this year on the playing field and make the playoffs. No more excuses for the front office or for the players.

[Shilsu]

http://www.nfl.com/teams/tennesseetitans/depthchart?team=TEN

Jones is a DE, Haynesworth is a DT. No way Jones could have been Fat Albert's backup.

Not sure what that chart is supposed to prove. Jason Jones is listed as the #2 DT on that chart and #3 RDE. Not to mention that chart isn't very accurate.

Anyway, either watch some of the Titans games or go to a Titans message board and ask. You'll see how and when Jason Jones was used. He was rarely used alongside Haynesworth so any "Haynesworth effect" is minimal when talking about his production.

Run containment? Sure but as others point out, there is more to being a DE than one facet of the game. With little pass rush, questionable motor and not showing the ability to deflect passes, we would be getting a younger, less savvy version of Daniels.

And despite the scouting report, the Titans took him, and are very pleased with him. Had we taken him, we most likely wouldn't have burned a 2nd and 6th round pick on Jason Taylor. Had we taken him, we wouldn't be figuring out who we want from the elite group of Evans, Wynn, and Daniels. Had we taken him, we wouldn't be considering LDE as big of a weakness as we do now.

[aREDSKIN]

Amazing, 11 years of incompetence that have created A 48 Per cent winning stat and people on this site still defend this ownership and call those of us who are questioning, critical, and flat out pissed HATERS.

Lapdog loyalty is a funny thing. Same ol DS. Make a splash in the offseason via coaching, FA and/or the draft, get the lapdog constituency riled up to buy tickets, merchandise etc. and talk up potential. When said season ends repeat and go to the bank. Pretty sweet gig if you can get one. The product on the field speaks volumes of the Skins FO competency. DS and VC have been HORRIBLE for the skins nation.

[Chump Bailey]

I'm with you regarding Jones. He clearly should have been on our radar and VC whiffed badly on that one.

[Thinking Skins]

OK, I'm going to defend Vinny. This hurts.

...

[too many praises for Vinny to quote]

...

There it is, my defense of Vinny.

man, you need to calm that down a bit. People are gonna start thinking you're a Vinny fan, and you wouldn't want rumors like that going around would you?

[Thirtyfive2seven]

Jason Jones is so impressive that the Titans have him tabbed to take Haynesworth place. And..in the game that he took Haynesworth place last season, he had 3 sacks against the Steelers! That's the type of talent this kid has. If we had drafted him, would we have had to trade a 2nd round pick to the Dolphins for Jason Taylor?? Most likely not.

I'm with you 100% except for one part. The Steelers offensive line pretty much blew last year. Even the Redskins had multiple sacks against them and the Skins can't rush a passer hardly at all.

The rest of the post was spot on!

[Thinking Skins]

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2008/profiles/jason-jones?id=1340#player-profile-tab-set-1:player-profile-tab-analysis

Compares To: MICHAEL MYERS-Cincinnati...Like Myers, Jones is a bit of a 'tweener, as he lacks bulk and ideal lower body strength to play inside and is too inconsistent with his pass rush moves to be an impact edge rusher. He is very good at run containment, but you would think a player with his incredibly long arms could get more pass break-ups than he has. He lacks pass rush moves, relying more on a clean release from the outside or squeezing through the gaps to impact the pocket. Still, he has been productive vs. the ground game, and later in the draft he is worth a pick to see if he can develop into a starter at end or tackle. At worst, he will provide decent back-up depth.

I understand what you're saying here. Every year, there are some picks that we can look back on and say "this guy woulda been better than our guy", but I guess the set of questions around Jones were more than we wanted to take on.

But I don't think you can judge the entire draft on one of those picks. We didn't get Jones, but I hadn't heard Jones's name from anybody before the draft as a guy we should be looking at. I heard Merling, Campbell, and Laws. And given the unproductive rookie years of these three, and about every other second round lineman and big WR, I'd like to believe that we'd have gotten lucky and gotten Jones if we did indeed pick DL last year, but I find that hard to believe.

So we'd probably still be having this conversation because we took somebody like Merling, Laws, or Campbell instead of Jones. (The same way we had this conversation when we took Jacobs instead of Boldin and Gardner instead of Moss.

[Ernie5]

This is a fairly typical bogus Cerrato attack. First off, last April called -- it wants its news back. Second -- and more to the point -- this a typical 20/20 hindsight post. If the team knew X then, you might have a point. No one knew anything. We can all disagree or agree about the players the team took, but none of that means either (1) the team plays fantasy football (they haven't since 2000) or (2) they don't know 1000X more than you do (b/c they likely do).

I don't recall people here clamoring about Jason Jones. If you recall, the noise was all about Calais Campbell. He, who did ZERO for the Cardinals last year. If you're ready to judge an entire draft class after one season -- which only proves you don't know squat about football -- then you have to apply to same measuring stick to the people everyone was on the Skins for not taking last season: Laws, Merling, Campbell.

What it really looks like is that you're a classic Cerrato/Snyder hater who wanted an excuse to type up an inflammatory and conclusory topic thread. Good work. We need more of this.