Art Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 It has come to my attention there are people in this world who expect rabid fans of a football team who manage a message board for that football team to be dispassionate observers. Reading this I can appreciate how many would wonder how that can be. We are, as fans, strong supporters of the team we love. Typically as you've seen we don't agree with every aspect of every move the team makes. We've said so here when we have those views and we've fostered an atmosphere where others can share their disagreement as openly as they wish. So openly, in fact, to this day comments about the reaction of this board to some offseason considerations by the team this year is cited by the media as possibly altering the team's determination. It is so openly allowed to disagree with something here, we are often surprised by the pure lack of intelligence in individuals who charge us with limiting disagreement here. I'm sure when I was on Redskins Radio telling Larry how much we didn't like Fassel and how much we'd prefer just about anyone else that I was somehow planted by Snyder, given how some apparently think he has us on speed dial. We do, however, have to apply the rules when there is disagreement. We do have to slow the pace of similar thoughts to allow more thoughts to be considered by all those who love this team. In the end, though, we love the Redskins, even when we hate them. That common bond is what makes us Redskins fans together. We neither seek, nor should you expect, us to not want positive things for our team. Most fans here do understand the difference between a reasoned disagreement and the type of blithering, repetitive spamming that captures some at such times. As much leash as we give, we sometimes have to pull the chain tight. I write this because it should serve as a permanent reminder that all things are not created equally here. Redskins fans are better. It's our house. If you seek to leave it for your disagreement, then leave. We'll have a light on for you when you return. We do not get paid for the work we do on this site. We are provided great liberty in how the site is maintained and administered. In the time we've been with the team, exactly TWO threads have been moved by request OF the team. One was a rather ugly evaluation of Derrick Frost's wife, and another was a legal concern about providing links to merchandise the team could not validate as approved. In the end though, as some of you build in anger at whatever topic there is, if you must lash out that this board does not allow people to disagree with the Redskins, consider how that is entirely disproven in recent weeks, as it has been thousands of times in the past. And know if you still can't figure it out for yourself, we will mock you, because that's too much fun NOT to do in such situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jethrodsp Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 agreed. people should read this so Im taking it back to the top of the page. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iheartskins Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 What the Redskins have become, that is, a money making cash machine focused, I'd argue, more on making money than on winning, is a far cry from the team that we remember from the 80s and the early 90s. With that change comes a different approach for a lot of fans. How do you view something that's become so thorougly a business and so little a team, in the same way you viewed a franchise that was a solid team? Can you still care about it in the same way? Probably not. Part of that probably comes from free agency and the salary cap. But a lot of it's $1000 gamer jerseys (where the prices doubled! year over year) and $9 beers, and the ridiculous barage of advertisements, and obstructed view seats, and the seemingly overriding plan to wring out every last dollar from a devoted fanbase. That team starts to look a lot less like a team and a lot more like just another corporation. And it's hard to love a corporation. http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4824721&postcount=136 No question Jason.But I think that's the most difficult piece--coming to grips with the new NFL paradigm: taking advantage of fans for as much as their willing to spend for purposes of making the most money. That's what parity's about, that's what free agency is about, that's what corporate sponsorships of nearly everything NFL relate (i.e., official adult undergarment of the NFL--coming soon from Depends!), larger, less intimate stadiums, and on and on. I don't doubt that professional football has always been about making money for the owners. I get that. But it seems like the interests of the owners and the interests of the fans used to be a little more closely alligned. Now it seems like the owners are in large part taking advantage of the fans goodwill and deep pockets to collect the largest windfalls possible. I guess I don't necessarily have a problem with that. It's capitalism after all. Then again, don't expect me to love something that treats me like a fungible consuming unit. http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4824963&postcount=146 I agree. While I enjoy Riggo and his crew, Larry Michael is a different story. I'm convinced that Redskins Park could be engulfed in flames, burning to the ground and Larry would report on the radio that "Mr. Snyder arranged for a team-building bonfire event for the players. I think I saw Cornelius Griffin and Demetric Evans making smores! All is well." Hard to disagree with this. I don't even get the sense that Larry really even likes the Redskins so much as he's been hired to put the best spin "plausible" on anything and everything Redskins related. http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4796388&postcount=35 See also: http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showthread.php?t=235070 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stew Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Definite bump to the top. Good piece Art. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted February 5, 2008 Author Share Posted February 5, 2008 No problem with any of that Sol. I will say there's a disconnect between the view that the Redskins are out to make as much money as possible and maximize every dollar it can while at the same time being true Snyder so irrationally spends as to be remarkably carefree about the cost of doing business. The amount he spends and guarantees to players or coaches that he remains on the hook for as he changes the market for players and coaches alike flies in the face of a guy purely there to generate as much revenue as possible. Doubtless he is trying to do that, but, he could do it with less money coming in and less spending too, at least as far as a profit goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isle-hawg Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Nice post, even though you are just stating the obvious, which is why so many of us consider this the best site on the internets:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Man, that iheartskins guy is a jerk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted February 5, 2008 Author Share Posted February 5, 2008 Man, that iheartskins guy is a jerk. That, I thought, was a given. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
33 Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Worthwhile thoughts, Art. When do we get to go back to yelling and screaming at each other.:yikes: iheartskins, while everything you say is something I find true and battle with on a constant basis, I find it necessary to sweep it under the rug because a win is no less sweeter and my life would be sadly less fulfilling if I couldn't enjoy those wins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iheartskins Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Fair points Art. Though I'm sure you already realized why I linked to those posts, for those for whom my intent was less clear, the point is essentially that (i) the Staff tolerates a very broad array of views and pretty relentless criticism of the Redskins, the players, the owner, the front office, the personnel moves, etc. (ii) there are members of the Staff that take a relatively pessimistic/critical view of the above mentioned persons and entities. And whether I'm right or wrong--the POV is tolerated. Period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iheartskins Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Man, that iheartskins guy is a jerk. I actually prefer the term "dick" or "*******" but thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 I think the guy that created this sig pretty much summed up the board the other week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted February 5, 2008 Author Share Posted February 5, 2008 Fair points Art.Though I'm sure you already realized why I linked to those posts, for those for whom my intent was less clear, the point is essentially that (i) the Staff tolerates a very broad array of views and pretty relentless criticism of the Redskins, the players, the owner, the front office, the personnel moves, etc. (ii) there are members of the Staff that take a relatively pessimistic/critical view of the above mentioned persons and entities. And whether I'm right or wrong--the POV is tolerated. Period. Wait. You didn't get the termination of your contract letter? Dammit. Om. You said you sent it out. But, seriously, he's right. We're hardly in lock step and we don't have to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rook Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 In the end, though, we love the Redskins, even when we hate them. So true ... so true. :helmet: The Rook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingGibbs Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 No doubt in my mind that our leash is long considering the Snyder is a this, Snyder is a that threads or comments that have been a mainstay here and other boards for a while now. I don't see how one could dispute that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 I actually prefer the term "dick" or "*******" but thanks. I've you told that channeling Tony or myself wasn't for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tastes Like Chicken Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 I think the guy that created this sig pretty much summed up the board the other week. And what about that dude that said Gibbs was done? He's not around here anymore, Kt or w/e his name was. ****. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubba9497 Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 I'm telling Mr. Snyder :nana: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 And what about that dude that said Gibbs was done? He's not around here anymore, Kt or w/e his name was. ****. That guy could be mean & say "Where's Joe?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoony Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 I would disagree, but I don't want to get banned. .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 I would disagree, but I don't want to get banned. .... Then you should go all ninja posting. Duh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suze109 Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Outstanding, eloquent post. Having the opportunity to discuss, learn, argue, flame, fight, and celebrate with other fans on this site is a very cool opportunity and one which we should try not to take for granted. We have a lot of freedom and many prove that fact daily. Thanks ES, members and mods alike, for a place that is sure to make me smile, scratch my head, laugh and curse, all in a matter of minutes. Now if only we could lose this ****ing profanity filter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veretax Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Amen, best Skins forum anywhere! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDALERT Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Art, What have you been hearing from Redskin Park about the board? I mean, do the players that log on here sometime take some of the threads here personal or have you and some of the Mods been getting feed back about how the boards being conducted lately? Because I think you guys do a helluva job in keeping everything and everybody at an even keel. But where did all of this come from or were you just harboring these thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pedro Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Whatever viewpoint you have regarding anything Redskins there will be a bunch of people on ES who are right with you. There will also be a bunch of people who are the polar opposite of your viewpoint and think you're a complete numpty. EVERY point raised has at least one person who disagrees with it. This cannot be the case if the board is run to manage viewpoints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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