The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randal 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariota and Fromm battle for QB2

[Koolblue13]

5 minutes ago, @DCGoldPants said:

 

Not attacking you. For now decades, we've gotten good at mostly, the title.... a few paragraphs and then a "click here to read more" type deal. 

 

appreciate it. 

I appreciate what he posts and if I don't feel like reading it, I scroll past. It's really easy to do and this isn't the ES of 10 years ago that couldn't handle walls of text.

[@DCGoldPants]

7 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

I appreciate what he posts and if I don't feel like reading it, I scroll past. It's really easy to do and this isn't the ES of 10 years ago that couldn't handle walls of text.

 

I wasn't trying to be a dick. Just following rule 10. That's all. 

 

Quote

 

10. Adhere to ES policies on using headlines/content from other websites to start a new thread or to add to an existing thread.
When posting anything concerning news articles from outside sources or using any website as part of the topic please include a direct link (i.e., URL) to the original page/site. Paste the URL directly atop the post, above a small portion of the article's text (for example, the lead paragraph or a particular sentence or two). Such a practice provides credibility and attribution to the source of the information, and allows visitors the option to visit the respective websites. You are responsible for the content you post.

If you are posting a published article from a news source, please title your thread in the following format: "SOURCE SHORTFORM: HEADLINE" (Ex. WP: Commanders Name Mike Shanahan New Head Coach). If the source is a blog or a chain e-mail, put "blog" or "chain e-mail" at the beginning of the thread title.

 

 

Have a blessed day.

[method man]

58 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

My in-laws are Giants fans as is my wife, next to this team I've watched more Giants games so I don't need the manual on Daniel Jones.  I probably wrote an encylopedia's worth about him as a college player in the draft thread so I am very famliar.

 

Do I think Jones is good?  Nope.  Do I think he's better than Taylor?  Yes.  In short he's more accurate, is MUCH more mobile and has a stronger arm.  Both put the ball in harm's way albiet Daniel seems to have conquered this demon to some extent this year and Heinicke has not.  I like Heinicke better in the clutch and I like his personality more.  They are both going to be FA's i'd wager that Daniel gets twice the money that Heinicke does.

I’d wager more than twice the money Heinicke gets. Assuming Jones isn’t the major reason for falling apart, he gets $20M-$30M a year from the Giants unless Schoen/Daboll decide they want to tank next year to draft a guy, which I don’t see them doing. 
 

Jones has been fairly impressive this year under Daboll with being used as more of a run threat. He has Saquon but his OL feels sketchy outside of Andrew Thomas and his only respectable weapon in the passing game this year has been Slayton (with Sheppard getting hurt early on). 
 

If I am the Giants, I take the bet that he will produce at a higher level with more weapons

10 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

Maybe.  We’ll see. 
 

I hope so.  Pickett has the benefit of really playing in a pro style offense and was considered the most pro ready but far. 

This. He was a 5 year guy who played in a pro style Mark Whipple offense. He has no elite physical tools, which cap his upside, but he is mobile enough and has an average NFL arm

[Zim489]

 

[Zim489]

Not surprised. Wonder what it would be if it was only taylor 

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, Thinking Skins said:

That's interesting. I just haven't seen it from Jones. All the areas that I mentioned earlier where Heinicke improved, he's better than Jones at, taking less sacks, throwing for more first downs, higher TD percentage, same ypa but with sacks Taylor is better. 

 

I'm not saying Heinicke is a beast but I think he's undervalued. 

 

Recalling your takes on QBs, you have a wide net of QBs that are undervalued -- Case Keenum, Colt McCoy, Nick Mullen, etc.  I am if anything considered a Daniel Jones hater, I am not a fan of the dude but IMO he's still a distinctly better QB than Heinicke.   Among other things while Heinicke has mobility in the pocket, he's more or less a pocket QB in most ways, he poses no threat with his legs.  Zero.  Mariota gave us some problems with his running -- Jones IMO is similar caliber on that front.  Do I think Heinicke can outduel Jones in a game.  Sure, why not considering IMO either QB isn't that good but either one of them can get hot on a given day -- alas some of Jones' best days seem to come against us, hopefully that ends. 

 

Daniel Jones over Heinicke

 

Better completion percentage

Better TD-INT ratio

He throws for more yards, he runs for many more yards.

 

Diving deeper with PFF metrics the gap in some things is a mile long.  Taylor's adjustment completion rating is abysmal, it makes his 60% completion rate actually look good in comparison, also he throws according to their metrics a really high number of interceptable passes.  Jones beats him by a mile on some of those metrics.

 

QB Rankings

 

QBR:  Daniel Jones ranked 12th,  Heinicke ranked 23

PFF:  Daniel Jones ranked 22nd, Heinicke ranked 38 

QB Rating.  Daniel Jones ranked 18.  Heinicke ranked 28

 

But I'll say from a personality coolness factor -- Daniel Jones is the nerd-dork outcast whereas Taylor's coolness factor is through the roof.

 

Edited November 29, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

39 minutes ago, method man said:

I’d wager more than twice the money Heinicke gets. Assuming Jones isn’t the major reason for falling apart, he gets $20M-$30M a year from the Giants

Jones will definitely get more than Heinicke, but man - I hope like hell the Giants tie their ship to Daniel Jones to the tune of $20-$30M per. 
 

As for Heinicke, his value is here or wherever Scott Turner is.  I could see a marginal raise for him to stay on but anything greater than $3M per and Id let him test the market and find out.

[Thinking Skins]

4 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Recalling your takes on QBs, you have a wide net of QBs that are undervalued -- Case Keenum, Colt McCoy, Nick Mullen, etc.  I am if anything considered a Daniel Jones hater, I am not a fan of the dude but IMO he's still a distinctly better QB than Heinicke.   Among other things while Heinicke has mobility in the pocket, he's more or less a pocket QB in most ways, he poses no threat with his legs.  Zero.  Mariota gave us some problems with his running -- Jones IMO is similar caliber on that front.  Do I think Heinicke can outduel Jones in a game.  Sure, why not considering IMO either QB isn't that good but either one of them can get hot on a given day -- alas some of Jones' best days seem to come against us, hopefully that ends. 

 

Daniel Jones over Heinicke

 

Better completion percentage

Better TD-INT ratio

He throws for more yards, he runs for many more yards.

 

QB Rankings

 

QBR:  Daniel Jones ranked 12th,  Heinicke ranked 23

PFF:  Daniel Jones ranked 22nd, Heinicke ranked 38 

QB Rating.  Daniel Jones ranked 18.  Heinicke ranked 28

 

Yeah, I think lower drafted QBs get less opportunities. 

 

But onto the Jones Heinicke thing, it's not just about these ratings (but I will acknowledge they exist). I'm just saying that there's an argument in the opposite. I pointed out she stats where Heinicke is better. Even if Jones is better, I don't think it's a true tier difference. They're similar QBs. I think Heinicke is just as much of a threat as Jones. This year though, teams are trying to take away that run so he's throwing the outlet pass more. That's a good decision. That sack against Philly where he gets the roughing penalty. That's smarts (before the penalty). That snap over his head that he threw out of bounds, that's smarts. I haven't seen those type of things from Jones. Maybe he's gotten better this year but his sack percent is near 10, double Heinicke. 

 

I just think people are sleeping on Heinicke. It's similar to how I thought people were sleeping on Keenum, Mullins, Minshew, etc. Good whatever reason fans and coaches are ready to move on from them rather quickly so they don't get a chance to grow as starters. It's a win now thing whereas Jones as looked like boo boo for 3 years before a meh season. 

[Skinsinparadise]

9 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Jones will definitely get more than Heinicke, but man - I hope like hell the Giants tie their ship to Daniel Jones to the tune of $20-$30M per. 
 

As for Heinicke, his value is here or wherever Scott Turner is.  I could see a marginal raise for him to stay on but anything greater than $3M per and Id let him test the market and find out.

 

Me too.  Jones puts a ceiling on that team, granted a bigger ceiling IMO than Heinicke puts on ours -- but still no way IMO the Giants are a threat in the playoffs with Jones at the helm.

[Skinsinparadise]

32 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

Yeah, I think lower drafted QBs get less opportunities. 

 

But onto the Jones Heinicke thing, it's not just about these ratings (but I will acknowledge they exist). I'm just saying that there's an argument in the opposite. I

 

The ratings which favor Jones greatly isn't even my main argument.  Finding small micro arguments that favor one QB over another -- heck I can probably find ones that sell Heinicke over Brady if I look hard enough.  But on most micro arguments and every macro argument I can find favor Jones and its not really that close.

 

Still, the main reason why I think Jones > Heinicke has zero to do with those metrics.  I saw some outfit that studies the money players will likely get at FA and put Jones at 20 million.  Now I doubt he gets that personally but I wouldn't be surprised if he got 10-12 million versus Heinicke I'd guess at 5-7 million.  Why?

 

It's not just Jones' better stats.  It's that Jones has real NFL size, a real NFL arm, real NFL accuracy.  He's not a good player IMO.  But he at least meets the minimum thresholds of the basics. 

 

But if I had to pick 3 reasons why Jones is better than Heinicke, just three it would be this.

 

A.  He can run and adds that element to the game.  I guess we are learning that Heinicke cannot or is unwilliing to do it.  So Jones is a dual threat, Heinicke is not.

 

B.  His accuracy isn't hot but its still better than Taylor by a clear peg

 

C.  Jones doesn't have a rocket but has an average NFL arm.  Heinicke simply doesn't have average NFL arm strength.

 

lol, on the draft thread in particular I was seen as the biggest Jones hater, it actually became a joke.  And no I haven't warmed up to him much since.  But yeah i do think we'd have a better shot to win games if we had Jones versus Heinicke as cringe worthy as it feels to say.   Giants defense ranked 28th in DVOA.   The defense isn't carrying that team like it is for this team.   Barkley having a big year but it helps that Jones poses a threat on the ground, too.  We saw what Atlanta can do with a running game supplemented by a run threat from the QB.  Jones would provide that here, Heinicke does not. 

 

32 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

It's similar to how I thought people were sleeping on Keenum, Mullins, Minshew, etc. 

 

It's not like these guys got the last laugh.

Edited November 29, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

Small sample size but if White keeps playing well, wonder what the Jets do with him hitting FA?

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ODU AGGIE]

18 hours ago, @DCGoldPants said:

This is why I'm in on the sit and prepare Sam Howell option. 

 

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/sam-howell-nfl-draft-2022/d5bzace3f5rafuzzek5lwpk0

 

Why Sam Howell went from No. 1 overall favorite to likely Day 2 pick in 2022 NFL Draft

 

A few snippets 

 

 

 

Young QB with a few years of starting at UNC. Some adversity. Perhaps unfairly drops many rounds. Now he gets at least a season of class room work. Probably running scout teams. Finally second string snaps for at least a month in practice. Then a full offseason? Give me that over a QB who might be available in the middle of the 1st round next year. Or over a now 3 years removed from really playing Trey Lance, a benched Zack Wilson. 

 

I'd roll with TH4 and Howell next year and use the draft and FA to rebuild the OL and ILB. 

 

Rookie QBs used to sit. Now (and not comparing) Mahomes sat his rookie year. Rodgers sat like 3 or 4 years. That **** can be valuable if the young player takes advantage of the opportunity to learn and practice. 

 

Heinicke's college statistics.

                         ATT      COMP   %        YARDS  AVG  TDS

Career[22]	1,238	1,829	67.7	14,959	8.2	132

Edited November 29, 2022 by ODU AGGIE

[Die Hard]

When your strategy is ride the hot hand…. you don’t have one. You’ve let circumstances dictate.

 

If Ron knew this team could/would win with Heinicke, he would have started him. The fact that his post-game pressers suggest he doesn’t have an explanation for the current turn of events and is non-commital to him, suggests he doesn’t think it’s sustainable long-term. Which implies it’s not really his choice. But he’s content with winning more than his preferred approach.

 

You hear any coaches/players giving credit to Rivera during this turnaround? Nope.

 

Now we hear…. “Oh, well, if Carson had the same offensive game planning… running more…. He’d accomplish the same results.”

 

Except we have a coaching staff that didn’t know or believe that…. which is why they had a completely different offence for him.

 

But sure, let’s give this coaching staff all the credit now. Just like their brilliant decision to draft a WR and make him a bell cow, or now we’re blaming previous defensive failures on 1 guy (WJ3)… a player who was misevaulated himself… but we can’t give Heinicke credit for the team’s turnaround??? I mean Cooper Rush was an MVP candidate on his run and a national hero… his numbers weren’t gaudy.

 

The defense got better when they had a QB that could sustain long drives and maintain ball possession. An offence that can score and keep the team in games. Unlike Wentz’s continual 3-and-outs… killing any momentum. The defense would get tired and demoralized. And the Wentz would get some late-game stars to make the score competitive than the game actually was.

Ron’s got a long track record that stand on its own. This little run of success defies a lot of metrics…. and it’s not by Ron’s choice or doing. 
 

You know how I know? Absolutely no one is talking about going into next year with Heinicke as the starter. 
 

This is a solid team…. with the biggest question mark remains at QB. And our HC/GM seems to be incapable of picking a good one or developing one. I mean, I’d love to hear any comment on Howell’s progress.

 

 

 

 

[srtman04]

3 minutes ago, Die Hard said:

This is a solid team…. with the biggest question mark remains at QB. And our HC/GM seems to be incapable of picking a good one or developing one. I mean, I’d love to hear any comment on Howell’s progress.

 

 

 

 

 

I wasn't expect Howell to play any meaningful games this year.  There is plenty of time left to develop him, but yeah it would be nice to at least hear that it's going with him...

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

48 minutes ago, Die Hard said:

 

You hear any coaches/players giving credit to Rivera during this turnaround? Nope.

Except for the fact that his teams never pack it in when they have every reason to, and the numerous quotes over the years from players professing nothing but positive thoughts on Ron as a man and a coach.  Anyone that follows the team seven days a week has seen and heard this stuff. 
 

By no means is Ron near the top of my list for head coach, and I don’t even have a list of guys I’d want both coaching and GMing.  But I think it’s abundantly clear that he’s a players coach who has the respect of his team.

 

Its interesting to me that someone who wants to pass all the credit to Heinicke because “players play for him” - something that cannot be quantified and is merely just opinion from a 10,000 foot view, can’t see how a head coach that’s fought cancer and every organizational debacle head on, might also very well resonate with the players he coaches.

 

 

 

 

42 minutes ago, srtman04 said:

 

I wasn't expect Howell to play any meaningful games this year.  There is plenty of time left to develop him, but yeah it would be nice to at least hear that it's going with him...

He literally spoke on him last week saying he’s focused on technique and footwork.  Saying things he got away with in college wont happen in the NFL and he’s been working with Zampese in those areas.  He was also abundantly clear when they drafted Sam that the intent was for him to sit and learn the pro game.

Edited November 29, 2022 by BatteredFanSyndrome

[Skinsinparadise]

3 hours ago, method man said:

I’d wager more than twice the money Heinicke gets. Assuming Jones isn’t the major reason for falling apart, he gets $20M-$30M a year from the Giants unless Schoen/Daboll decide they want to tank next year to draft a guy, which I don’t see them doing. 
 

Jones has been fairly impressive this year under Daboll with being used as more of a run threat. He has Saquon but his OL feels sketchy outside of Andrew Thomas and his only respectable weapon in the passing game this year has been Slayton (with Sheppard getting hurt early on). 
 

If I am the Giants, I take the bet that he will produce at a higher level with more weapons

This. He was a 5 year guy who played in a pro style Mark Whipple offense. He has no elite physical tools, which cap his upside, but he is mobile enough and has an average NFL arm

 

It's possible For Jones.   He's on pace to run for 700 yards give or take and 6 yards per attempt so I do think he does wonders to help the Giants running game.  I listened to Ron Rivera talk about it in a Finlay interview today.

 

Compared to Taylor who i think would be lucky to run 100 yards for the season at this pace, averaging under 3 yards per attempt and is really more neck and neck with stationary QBs like Kirk than QBs with wheels who use their wheels like Jones.  Heck I'd love it if this verson of Taylor could even match some of Kirk's better seasons as far as taking off and running the ball. 

 

I am focused a lot on the running because Daniel Jones and Heinicke are on different planets on that front -- and that really seperates the two in a big way IMO.

 

But to your point, it wouldn't surpirse me if the Giants paid up for Jones.  I wouldn't in their case but I still could see it happen. 

Edited November 29, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

I will say the one area with Taylor that is perplexing to me is how often he chooses to make a throw rather than take the green grass in front of him with his legs.  Several times over the past few weeks, he’s scampered only to fire an inaccurate ball when he had an easy first down if he just kept running.  I’ve just given up on that entire aspect of his game.  It’s odd that the same dude known for pylon dives is giving up on opportunities to move the chains with his feet.  I’m not sure if it’s conscious or what, but it would be a lift to this offense if he’d run as opposed to pass in these scenarios.

[Skinsinparadise]

8 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I will say the one area with Taylor that is perplexing to me is how often he chooses to make a throw rather than take the green grass in front of him with his legs.  Several times over the past few weeks, he’s scampered only to fire an inaccurate ball when he had an easy first down if he just kept running.  I’ve just given up on that entire aspect of his game.  It’s odd that the same dude known for pylon dives is giving up on opportunities to move the chains with his feet.  I’m not sure if it’s conscious or what, but it would be a lift to this offense if he’d run as opposed to pass in these scenarios.

 

Big time.  It's cool that he can dodge pressure in the pocket.  But this year he runs as much as name that pocket QB.  He's in the Kirk or Jimmy G conversation as far as using his wheels, meaning its very rare.  

 

I can swallow it easier if like you said I didn't see it manifest in critical points in the game where he can run for a key first down easily but instead he misses a pass.  The day of him scampering around the field like he did in the Tampa playoff game seems long gone. 

 

I'd warm up a lot more to Taylor if that version of him came back but the deeper the season goes, it seems like he wants to bury that part of his game.

Edited November 29, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I'd warm up a lot more to Taylor if that version of him came back but the deeper the season goes, it seems like he wants to bury that part of his game.

Same.

 

I’ve seen folks make mention that he’s making business decisions, ie: doesn’t want to risk injury.    That’s hard for me to discern but yeah of late particularly, he’s made some questionable decisions to throw.  That added element to the offense seems worth the risk.

[Skinsinparadise]

Had someone told Geno Smith and Jimmy Garoppolo at the start of training camp that they would enter December primed to be the most lucrative free agent passers available in 2023, it’s fair to wonder whether the veteran quarterbacks would have believed it themselves.

 

 

...Now, both are poised to cash in, significantly, atop a tepid free agent market at the most important position in pro sports. And plenty of plugged-in agents and executives around the league anticipate those quarterbacks staying right where they are.

 

Lamar Jackson is a lock for a franchise tag in Baltimore. Tom Brady might hang around and play another year somewhere, though he did “retire” for a few months just this year. Outside of that, the upcoming quarterback market includes the likes of Jacoby Brissett (who performed admirably for the Browns before making way this week for Deshaun Watson); Daniel Jones (whom the Giants probably want to keep around on a short-term deal); Taylor Heinicke (ditto for the Commanders); and, well, Mike White. Slim pickings compared to past years, leaving two NFC West quarterbacks who had become afterthoughts suddenly very much top of mind for franchises that covet a seasoned quarterback.

 

I probed a handful of executives and established agents who have negotiated all manner of quarterback deals over the years to get a sense of the upcoming market. Most anticipated the Seahawks making a concerted effort to keep Smith, 32, after getting a haul of draft picks for Wilson and still ending up with the superior quarterback in 2022, already surpassing expectations at 6-5. They should be in position to take a quarterback high in the first round — Denver (3-8) relinquished its top pick and much more in the Wilson swap — but Pete Carroll is the oldest coach in the NFL and having a proven commodity at QB while the rookie learns is more his style.

 

“Can’t you see them keeping Geno, using those [early] picks on blue chip players and taking a quarterback on Day 2 [of the draft]?” proposed one NFL general manager, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because he isn’t permitted to speak about pending free agents.

 

A different longtime NFL personnel executive said he thinks Smith is a better fit in Seattle than he would be in many other places, and that his arrest on suspicion of driving under the influence last January could be a deterrent for some franchises.

The general manager suggested Derek Carr of the Raiders as a potential financial comparable for the top of Smith’s market: roughly $40 million a year. The personnel executive projected him to command closer to $30 million a year if he continues his current play, perhaps more if the season ends with a solid playoff showing. Both officials agreed that the market for Smith is likely to be limited by how long it took him to finally cement himself as a solid starter — nine years — as well as questions about his decision-making raised in the scouting community over the years.

 

...The agent, who has extensively evaluated the upcoming quarterback market, put Smith and Garoppolo at the top of this class and in the second tier of NFL starters overall — ranked somewhere from 7-15. If top-tier guys make $45 or $50 million, “the guys in the second tier are generally around 75 percent of that,” he said. “That where I see Geno and Jimmy. Is it $35 million a year? Maybe closer to $30 million?”

 

And so barring Smith’s play dramatically falling off, or Garoppolo suffering yet another injury, anticipate both quarterbacks staying put. As for which other teams will be exploring free agent quarterbacks this offseason, the Panthers, Texans, Colts, Saints, Buccaneers, Commanders and Lions are the teams most chattered about — although at least some of them will address the need in the draft — while the Giants, Jets, Raiders, Falcons and perhaps even Packers could find themselves in need of a veteran or a bridge quarterback of some sort.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2022/11/29/free-agent-quarterbacks-jimmy-garoppolo-geno-smith/

 

Edited November 29, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Conn]

7 hours ago, @DCGoldPants said:

 

Not attacking you. For now decades, we've gotten good at mostly, the title.... a few paragraphs and then a "click here to read more" type deal. 

 

appreciate it. 

 

The problem for me is I will almost never be clicking there to read more, and I assume I’m not alone. I keep these big mega threads open to glance at throughout the day at work, and it’s nice having it all in one place. Most articles are trash and I appreciate that SIP does the filtering lol. Same with his local radio summaries. I’m not listening to those clowns, I appreciate that he summarizes the takeaways.
 

I’m not saying you’re wrong or anything btw, just using this as a jumping off point to thank @Skinsinparadise! I can only speak for me but I appreciate the chunks of articles being posted, the recaps, etc. I can scroll on by if I’m not interested. 

Edited November 29, 2022 by Conn

[zCommander]

2 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I will say the one area with Taylor that is perplexing to me is how often he chooses to make a throw rather than take the green grass in front of him with his legs.  Several times over the past few weeks, he’s scampered only to fire an inaccurate ball when he had an easy first down if he just kept running.  I’ve just given up on that entire aspect of his game.  It’s odd that the same dude known for pylon dives is giving up on opportunities to move the chains with his feet.  I’m not sure if it’s conscious or what, but it would be a lift to this offense if he’d run as opposed to pass in these scenarios.

 

He was playing hurt on Sunday. I questioned that as well in game day thread. After the game I saw on nfl.com that he was listed on the injury report for back issue. 

 

But, when he did come in after Wentz went down he did run a little but not the same way he did in the playoff game. The reason is a playoff game is pretty much do or get eliminated. 

 

Last year he ran in spurts and being cautious not to get hurt seriously. He did do a pylon dive last year as well.

 

I don't expect him to run at all in the Giants game if still having back issues.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

1 minute ago, zCommander said:

 

He was playing hurt on Sunday. I questioned that as well in game day thread. After the game I saw on nfl.com that he was listed on the injury report for back issue. 

 

But, when he did come in after Wentz went down he did run a little but not the same way he did in the playoff game. The reason is a playoff game is pretty much do or get eliminated. 

 

Last year he ran in spurts and being cautious not to get hurt seriously. He did do a pylon dive last year as well.

 

I don't expect him to run at all in the Giants game if still having back issues.

If he can take off and evade the pocket and throw a pass just before the LOS, why can’t he just keep running?  And this isn’t new, he hasn’t been running really at all even prior to that.

[mh86]

5 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

If he can take off and evade the pocket and throw a pass just before the LOS, why can’t he just keep running?  And this isn’t new, he hasn’t been running really at all even prior to that.

Because back or someone told him to not run or he’s conserving his body so he doesn’t get injured or because he’s trying to prove something or…. There’s no excuse to be honest. He just isn’t who t people thought he was back when they initially fought for him and claimed he could be a dual threat. He doesn’t take off and run for [insert reason]. If it was any other QB it would be because they’re holding onto the ball waiting for something to happen, which is exactly what he’s doing. There’s nothing wrong with that, but he’s not Allen, Watson, Jackson, or whichever QB we want to use as an example. If he would just stop overthinking plays and use his legs more, we would be a much more efficient offense. Unfortunately he doesn’t and that’s ultimately on him.

[NeverSurrender]

1 minute ago, mh86 said:

Because back or someone told him to not run or he’s conserving his body so he doesn’t get injured or because he’s trying to prove something or…. There’s no excuse to be honest. He just isn’t who t people thought he was back when they initially fought for him and claimed he could be a dual threat. He doesn’t take off and run for [insert reason]. If it was any other QB it would be because they’re holding onto the ball waiting for something to happen, which is exactly what he’s doing. There’s nothing wrong with that, but he’s not Allen, Watson, Jackson, or whichever QB we want to use as an example. If he would just stop overthinking plays and use his legs more, we would be a much more efficient offense. Unfortunately he doesn’t and that’s ultimately on him.

Troy Aikman talked about this last night a bit during the Monday night game as Pickett was having a pretty nice night.  He was basically saying that the more reps a QB gets, the more the game slows down and qbs that dont have as much playing time just take off much quicker because there not sure about what they are seeing and every thing is a blur.  Aikman even brought up that fans seem to want qbs to keep running because it was effective however, its good for the development of the qb for the game to slow down.