The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[Redskins 2021]

7 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Where I am coming from is I think really ANY of the veteran QBs are long shots mainly because of the competition for the spot.  Lot of bidders. So many teams want QBs.   All these guys though have different stories and a different context behind their situations.  And I've tried to pay attention to that and not be stuck with my original preconception.  The stories haven't changed at all relating to Rodgers outside of he might stay in GB after all.  The stories haven't changed about Watson -- if anything its gotten worse as for him coming here -- I thought he was the longest of long shots anyway, so no surprise from me.  As for Wilson from my observation its changed a little.   

 

Garafolo to me was the kicker for me to change my perception about Wilson.  He was one in a series of things I've read/heard which I talked about in another post.  I find Garafolo the most plugged in reporter aside from Schefter.  His colleage Ian Rappoport pulls more gossip than Garafolo but Ian can be wrong too much for my taste, Garafolo like Schefter is rarely wrong.  It's not that he spilled much specifics about Wilson.  But I know from other takes of his, he's similar to Keim in that he talks to a lot of people and they steer him in a direction.  For example Keim asking around found out that Watson wouldn't waive his no trade clause to come here.

 

Anyway, add Garafolo to the pile who has heard good things about Turner (I know some here think he's a moron but with an exception or two, nationally he seems to be highly regarded) and adds that Rivera is also highly regard.  The team is considered talented.  He can see some players being turned off to the off field stuff here, his vibe is Russell Wilson wouldn't be one of those players.   He also said if he were Russell the would want to come here.  And vice versa.   Now he could be dead wrong.  And that clearly wasn't a report.   But I can tell he's fishing around Wilson among the other potential QBs and clearly Wilson's people at a minimum hasn't steered him away from this place as a destination spot.  

 

As for Wilson my original take:

 

A.  The dude wants out of Seattle.  He's going to be trade, no doubt

B.  He wants like Rodgers to go to a SB potential winner

C.  He's a stickler to the top teams he wants to go to

 

My current take of Wilson

 

A.   Wilson might be willing to stay after all in Seattle

B.  It's not SB or bust with him.

C.  He might not be a stickler as for where he goes

 

While I agree that Wilson is a long shot.  I don't agree that Rivera isn't willing to be a really high bidder.  It's come out later that the first and third round offer for Stafford was an opening bid, not a take it or leave it offer.  Also and I said so last off season, Keim said he flat out heard Rivera (and Rivera later echoed the same) that he wasn't willing to big really high for a QB.  He wanted that off season to build the roster.  But all bets would be off next off season (this one) if they didn't land a QB and he would be willing to be aggressive.  So I suspect the conservative 2021 version of Rivera will be supplanted by the more aggressive one.

 

You aren't saying otherwise but my thinking is Rivera isn't stupid.  It's year 3.   it's clear from his interviews that Rivera pays attention to what is said about him.  So if we know it he knows it.  And as much as national love Rivera gets, he also has a disclaimer which is that he had botching things via missed opportunities at QB and if he doesn't overcome that his regime will end up a dude.  Every interview where Rivera has talked about the QB spot he comes off acutely away that its a Code Red spot.  I think he's going to be VERY aggressive to chase down their top targets.

 

 

I think he will try as hard as he can but alot teams need qb this year.

Edited January 8, 2022 by Redskins 2021

[skinny21]

I know there’s a major question of the cap hit (for Atlanta), but what are the chances Matt Ryan is a target?

[Redskins 2021]

4 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

I know there’s a major question of the cap hit (for Atlanta), but what are the chances Matt Ryan is a target?

I doubt it he is starting to slow down and is 37 years old.  I think everyone is in agreement we will do something. I think one of the keys to all this is what are defensive linemen worth  compared to picks.

Edited January 8, 2022 by Redskins 2021

[skinny21]

Just now, Redskins 2021 said:

I doubt it he is starting to slow down and is 37 years old. 

Personally, I don’t want to go for a vet (and I don’t think Ryan is worth the trade compensation at his age), I’d much rather take the chance on a rookie (or 2).  But… if this staff really wants a vet that can produce (someone more proven that a Trubisky/Mariota), it seems to me Ryan should be on their short list, especially if they can retain their 1st rounder this year to also draft a guy.

 

Not sure it would make sense (or even be doable for Atlanta), but I wonder about something like our 2nd this year and a conditional pick next year - a 3rd that could bump to a 1st if we make the playoffs or Super Bowl or whatever.  Again, not saying this is what I would do…

[DWinzit]

1 minute ago, skinny21 said:

I know there’s a major question of the cap hit (for Atlanta), but what are the chances Matt Ryan is a target?

Their other QB's are Rosen, Franks and McCarron.

I doubt Atlanta would want any one them as their future starter

They see one or two of them as stopgaps if they look to the draft.

That would also work well with their CAP moving forward.

They would be losing a long time well respected leader, would be interesting.

 

As for WFT, it would cost a lot of cap space, some draft capital and be a short term solution going after another overaged vet.

If short term is what they want, Ryan>Mariota and Trubisky

[Skinsinparadise]

Some other random stuff I've heard on podcasts.

 

Garafolo isn't intrigued from a WFT standpoint about any of the impending FA QBs.  Jay Gruden has been grilled in his 980 weekly appearances on QBs.  He's been an interesting listen.  He's talked some about how he evaluates them, what he looks for among other things.  Jay wasn't the hottest HC but IMO he was a decent evaluator.   I know some think he's a moron (not me) so for those people just ignore this obviously.

 

He's a big Derek Carr guy.  He thinks he's really good.  He was really nice about how he said it but its clear he doesn't think Heinicke is the answer.  One of his issues with Heinicke is accuracy for the same reason he's not a Trubisky guy, he doesn't care for his ball placement and is not sure he'd be an upgrade over Taylor.  As for this team, he likes the idea of getting a veteran QB over a rookie.  He likes the idea of skipping the growing pains and uncertainity that surrounds younger QBs everything being equal.

 

He's almost a zealot about how QBs are everything.  He goes from a coaching stand point, it has to be unbelievable to go into games with QBs who always give you a chance.  He joked about how many times were Brady's teams underdogs?  You got the QB, you are expected to win.   

 

If I had to pick up a theme that both Jay and Vinny Cerrato (Portis to some extent, too) share about this organization's lack of success.  It's QB, QB.  And also?  QB.  It was funny to hear Cerrato in an interview talk about this years back because he typically had a self serving excuse for what went wrong but this time he just said simply we can never find that QB.  And you need that QB to win.

Edited January 8, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[skinny21]

2 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

Their other QB's are Rosen, Franks and McCarron.

I doubt Atlanta would want any one them as their future starter

They see one or two of them as stopgaps if they look to the draft.

That would also work well with their CAP moving forward.

They would be losing a long time well respected leader, would be interesting.

 

As for WFT, it would cost a lot of cap space, some draft capital and be a short term solution going after another overaged vet.

If short term is what they want, Ryan>Mariota and Trubisky

I’ll admit, I’m not 100% on how it works, but I believe a team trading for Ryan would only be accountable for his base pay and Atlanta would have to pay his bonuses.  If I’m right, he’d have a cap hit just over 16 for us, which is pretty darn reasonable.  On the flip side, unless I’m missing something, Atlanta would be on the hook for something like 32mil for him (ouch).  Of course, they also get the 16mil off the books…

[Skinsinparadise]

26 minutes ago, Redskins 2021 said:

I think he will try as hard as he can but alot teams need qb this year.

 

Agree.  Yep, we all know a lot of teams want QBs it was said in that same post you quoted. 

[DWinzit]

4 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

I’ll admit, I’m not 100% on how it works, but I believe a team trading for Ryan would only be accountable for his base pay and Atlanta would have to pay his bonuses.  If I’m right, he’d have a cap hit just over 16 for us, which is pretty darn reasonable.  On the flip side, unless I’m missing something, Atlanta would be on the hook for something like 32mil for him (ouch).  Of course, they also get the 16mil off the books…

Yeah I am certain of the cap numbers either. I would imagine some of that could be worked out in the trade agreement. Perhaps a WFT player (DL) involved in the trade would help too?

[skinny21]

12 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

Yeah I am certain of the cap numbers either. I would imagine some of that could be worked out in the trade agreement. Perhaps a WFT player (DL) involved in the trade would help too?

I was going to just ‘like’ your post, but I do not like the idea itself.  It does make a certain amount of sense though.  Wonder if Atlanta would ask for Heinicke as well - ala the Stafford trade.  He did put up 30 on them after all…

 

Edit: damn, the more I think about it, the more possible it seems… can someone talk me off the ledge?  Lol

Edited January 8, 2022 by skinny21

[Skinsinparadise]

18 hours ago, Rdskns2000 said:

You all are dreaming. You think a team owned by Dan Snyder is capable of luring the best qbs in the nfl to come here? You think he’s capable Of drafting a franchise qb? We have over 22 years of failure and I don’t expect that to change because Ron is running things now.

 

I get your pessimism about Dan.

 

19 hours ago, Rdskns2000 said:

 

I have said, I don’t trust Ron and his Gm crew to get that qb. Just look at how pathetic our offense has mostly been under Ron/Scott. You think any qb would want to come here. Even if we get Mitch/ Marcus; they will have a disappointing tenure here. If we draft a qb; it will be the next in the long line of qb busts.

 

Ron’s destiny is to be the next Washington coach fired and that will happen in the next year or two.

 

Judging by the national media talking about what they've heard.  I don't think you got many who share your down views about Rivera and Scott Turner though more so Rivera than Scott.    If I could get a dollar for every time I've heard that Rivera is respected around the league and big time so, I'd be a rich man, includung from even dudes who hate this franchise like Mike Florio.   Heck Kyle Shanny who openly talks about his distaste about this franchise, sung Rivera's praises and talked up the new regime.

 

Their offense is ranked 22nd according to PFF.  That's playing one of the toughest schedules in the NFL.  They had a long phase where they played on the aggregate best passing defenses in the NFL.

 

They did this mostly with an undrafted FA QB running the ship.  An undrafted FA as their #2 WR.  And undrafted FA as their top TE.  Some hypebole from me to make a point: I just don't see NFL teams saying look if you can't win with Heinicke, Seals-Jones and Dandre Carter who could you win with?

 

 

Edited January 8, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[DWinzit]

9 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

If I had to pick up a theme that both Jay and Vinny Cerrato (Portis to some extent, too) share about this organization's lack of success.  It's QB, QB.  And also?  QB.  It was funny to hear Cerrato in an interview talk about this years back because he typically had a self serving excuse for what went wrong but this time he just said simply we can never find that QB.  And you need that QB to win.

Sorry SIP but I have a hard time taking much serious from Jay and especially Vinny the clown.

One thing any moron can see is...you need a QB to win and we haven't had one in forever.

I think they effort on some vets like Wilson, Watson and perhaps Carr who all have years ahead of them. Do they also deep their toes in on Rodgers and Ryan? 

[DWinzit]

5 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

I was going to just ‘like’ your post, but I do not like the idea itself.  It does make a certain amount of sense though.  Wonder if Atlanta would ask for Heinicke as well - ala the Stafford trade.  He did put up 30 on them after all…

 

Edit: damn, the more I think about it, the more possible it seems… can someone talk me off the ledge?  Lol

That could work.....oh wait, I am not supposed to be pushing you off the ledge 

[Skinsinparadise]

18 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

Sorry SIP but I have a hard time taking much serious from Jay and especially Vinny the clown.

One thing any moron can see is...you need a QB to win and we haven't had one in forever.

I think they effort on some vets like Wilson, Watson and perhaps Carr who all have years ahead of them. Do they also deep their toes in on Rodgers and Ryan? 

 

To each their own on that.  It's interesting how a HC job going bad can change perceptions about that coach's niche before they got here.   And Jay is far from the most infamous hires here, sadly he's the only coach to have back to back winning seasons under Dan, granted by just a hair.   Jim Zorn was considered when we hired him a QB guru.  A ton of articles talking that up.  Hasselback thought he was a genius among others.  I was one of Zorn's loudest critics as a HC but I don't think that just wipes out his whole career where the QB expertise never happened.  Some are just better at playing a niche than being a leader of men.  Norv Turner a prime example of that.

 

The irony is when Jay came here.  He was seen as the QB guru.  He played QB in his career.   He supposedly took a lesser talent in Dalton and helped make him good and did so fast.  And lol, some me included wondered how much Zampese played a role in that at Cincy.  Now I see some have no trust in Zampese.

 

I am not saying this is your point but I noticed some think Jay now is a dumb as a pile of rocks about football.  But if you listen to some of his segments on 980, speaking for myself, he knows miles more about what makes a QB a good QB than what i would ever know.   Having said, no one has figured out the perfect formula to dicipher who is a franchise QB or not including Jay of course.   So its all just opinion still.  But I do think Jay knows more about QBs than name any random poster here and its not even close.

4 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

I'm probably higher on Hurts here than most, but he's had a pretty good second half of a year. It would be very eagles to not use those 3 firsts to build the team and invest around Hurts.

 

I admit I am still digesting Hurts.  Sometimes my takes are overly influenced by what games I happen to watch.  Ditto for college prospects so I try to watch at least 5 games for them.    Where i just so happen the right games or wrong games.  For Hurts I gather I happened to watch some of his worst ones including their loss against the Giants a month ago, he was brutal in that one. 

Edited January 8, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[DWinzit]

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

To each their own on that.  It's interesting how a HC job going bad can change perceptions about that coache's niche before they got here.   And Jay is far from the most infamous hires here, sadly he's the only coach to have back to back winning seasons under Dan, granted by just a hair.   Jim Zorn was considered when we hired him a QB guru.  A ton of articles talking that up.  Hasselback thought he was a genius among others.  I was one of Zorn's loudest critics as a HC but I don't think that just wipes out his whole career where the QB expertise never happened.  Some are just better of playing a niche than being a leader of men.  Norv Turner a prime example of that.

 

The irony is when Jay came here.  He was seen as the QB guru.  He played QB in his career.   He supposedly took a lesser talent in Dalton and helped make him good and did so fast.  And lol, some me included wondered how much Zampese played a role in that at Cincy.  Now I see some have no trust in Zampese.

 

I am not saying this is your point but I noticed some think Jay now is a dumb as a pile of rocks about football.  But if you listen to some of his segments on 980, speaking for myself, he knows miles more about what makes a QB a good QB than what i would ever know.   Having said, no one has figured out the perfect formula to dicipher who is a franchise QB or not including Jay of course.   So its all just opinion still.  But I do think Jay knows more about QBs than name any random poster here and its not even close.

I fully think Jay, Zorn, Zampese, Norv and all the others have a lot of knowledge about football, offenses and the QB position. I am pretty certain they know more that all the random posters too. At least I would hope so. That does not mean I agree with all any of them have to say. Like you said, to each their own. And I do think Vinny is horse arse and pretty certain that will never change.

My posts have agreed with the on the idea that a competent vet can be the quickest and more sure fire way of getting a good QB. Sadly the guys mentioned were handed or involved in selecting highly touted QB's via draft, trades, and free agency but we are still empty after all the years and attempts.

Ron needs to hit this year by trade, FA or draft. Heck I hope he hits with a vet and a draft selection. Here's to at least one 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

8 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

I fully think Jay, Zorn, Zampese, Norv and all the others have a lot of knowledge about football, offenses and the QB position. I am pretty certain they know more that all the random posters too. At least I would hope so. That does not mean I agree with all any of them have to say. Like you said, to each their own. And I do think Vinny is horse arse and pretty certain that will never change.

My posts have agreed with the on the idea that a competent vet can be the quickest and more sure fire way of getting a good QB. Sadly the guys mentioned were handed or involved in selecting highly touted QB's via draft, trades, and free agency but we are still empty after all the years and attempts.

Ron needs to hit this year by trade, FA or draft. Heck I hope he hits with a vet and a draft selection. Here's to at least one 

 

 

 

OK, cool. I'll say my point in a different way:  I am interested in anyone's opinion about QB, here included, but I am especially interested in any dude who has played the position before as what they think.  John Beck was a crap QB.  But lol he's maybe regarded right now as the best college QB prep guru in the league.    Hated Zorn as a HC but I'd listen to him if he were on the radio explaining what works at that spot.  Part of the reason why I like listening to Jay on this is his point often centers on how many variables it takes to make a good QB.    And he explains those variables very well.      

 

Back to the QB spot.  I think this article from the Athletic from months back I think brings home the value some.  Last year, there was a loud minority of people on the QB thread who thought the QB spot was a bit overplayed.  I noticed that's almost gone from this years QB thread.  But I can't help adding a little more on the subject/pile. 

 

 

Edited January 8, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Rex Tomb]

1 hour ago, Redskins 2021 said:

I doubt it he is starting to slow down and is 37 years old.  I think everyone is in agreement we will do something. I think one of the keys to all this is what are defensive linemen worth  compared to picks.

I'm a fan of unloading a Payne or Sweat plus a first rounder for Wilson. Might give us a decent shot to land him.  Seattle is in desperate need of a rebuild in the defensive side of the ball and one of those two would be a great piece to start with.

[Zim489]

In regards to Carr. Does it not open some eyes that one of the few equally as bad Franchises in the league over the past 20 years is willing to enter the QB wilderness when they have a decent one already under contract at 31 years old?

 

Personally I don't want him. I think hes in that tier of QBs that keeps you in the fighting for playoff spots and doesnt ultimately win you anything. 

[Koolblue13]

11 minutes ago, Zim489 said:

In regards to Carr. Does it not open some eyes that one of the few equally as bad Franchises in the league over the past 20 years is willing to enter the QB wilderness when they have a decent one already under contract at 31 years old?

 

Personally I don't want him. I think hes in that tier of QBs that keeps you in the fighting for playoff spots and doesnt ultimately win you anything. 

The Raiders have allowed more points to be scored on them then any other team since Carr has been there, he has lost both solid WRs that he's had and yet they are still in the playoff hunt after losing his coach. I'd say that's pretty impressive.

[Zim489]

7 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

The Raiders have allowed more points to be scored on them then any other team since Carr has been there, he has lost both solid WRs that he's had and yet they are still in the playoff hunt after losing his coach. I'd say that's pretty impressive.

So why would they want to be moving on if thats the case?

[88Comrade2000]

18 minutes ago, Zim489 said:

So why would they want to be moving on if thats the case?

New coach and possible new gm.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

19 minutes ago, Zim489 said:

So why would they want to be moving on if thats the case?

We don’t know that they will.

 

The only hope is that a new head coach and potentially new GM will want to start from scratch.

[mistertim]

2 hours ago, Rex Tomb said:

I'm a fan of unloading a Payne or Sweat plus a first rounder for Wilson. Might give us a decent shot to land him.  Seattle is in desperate need of a rebuild in the defensive side of the ball and one of those two would be a great piece to start with.

 

That wouldn't be anywhere near enough to land Wilson. In this scenario it would probably be two 1st round picks plus Payne/Sweat at the very minimum. He's an elite SB winning future HoF QB. He's not young, but he just turned 33 not long ago, and in QB years nowadays that's not old; he probably has a good 5 years left at least. There's no way a 1st plus one decent player would seal that trade. Seattle would be like:

 

[88Comrade2000]

I did this once last year in my QB threat over at ATN.

 

Commanders??? -  We have one backup under contract for 22: Heinicke and could always bring back the other backup: Allen.  Ron & his GM crew will be looking to upgrade the position in 22. They have to, or else their tenures will likely end sooner than later.  They have to be aggressive when it comes to QB this year. Thing is, probably half the league could be in competition with us for that QB.

 

A Look at who our competition for QBs will be in 2022 

Giants -  They have publicly said they plan to bring back Jones but they could be in the market for a new QB.  They do have draft capital to make it happen.  They could draft a QB or dangle picks to trade for a veteran. Reports say Russ Let Me Cook wants to be a Giant.  They could also trade Jones, along with picks.

 

Eagles - Do they stay with Hurts or try to upgrade with Rodgers, Wilson or Watson?  Or do they draft someone?  Even though their picks will be in the lower half of the first round, they have 3 first rounds picks to dangle.  That could be enticing someone plus they could also trade Hurts in addition to picks. 

 

Vikings - A big cap hit if they trade Kirk. They would have to pay some of his salary and probably offer picks for someone to take them off their hands in 22.  If they decide to bite the bullet and find a willing partner; they will be in market for a new QB either in the draft or through trade or free agency.

 

Lions -  They have Golf but he sucks.  Detroit most likely would draft a replacement but do they do it this year or not?

 

*Packers -  This is only conditional if they move on from Rodgers.  Rodgers now seems likely to come back but he will want Mahomes money and a 4-5 year new deal.  Will the Packers do that?  If they don't and they move on from Rodgers; they got Jordan Love. He's not answer so, they would use the Rodgers trade to get a new QB via trade or draft.

 

Saints - Despite their cap hell, they will be in the market for a new QB.  The cap can be massaged to make room for a QB. They seem more likely to be in the veteran market than drafting a qb.

 

Falcons -  If they move on from Ryan, they will be in the market for QB.  They will take a big hit from moving on from Ryan, so if they need a new QB; it will have to be in the draft.

 

Panthers-  They definitely will be the market for a new QB.  Whether that's one of the veterans or thru the draft; that will be the owner: Tepper's #1 priority. As they showed this year, they will throw away money at the QB position until they get it right.

 

Buccaneers -  Does Tom retire?  If he does, the Bucs will need a replacement.

 

*Seahawks - This is another conditional QB; only if Wilson moves on.  If they trade Wilson, they will need a new QB.  My guess, they will favor draft picks to get that new QB over a veteran. Especially, if they also move on from Peter Carroll.

 

Raiders -  They have Carr for one more year.  They could have a new coach, if the interim guy doesn't get it and maybe a new coach.  Will they new team want to keep Carr?  I think unless they make a trade for Watson, Wilson or Rodgers; they reup with Carr.

 

Broncos -  They definitely need a new QB.  They will be a key destination if those big names actually move.  

 

Texans - Do they ride with Mills or do they draft a new qb?  They will have a bounty load of picks; when they are finally able to trade Watson.  

 

Browns -  Do they move on from Mayfield?  If they do, they will be in the market for a new QB.  Definitely, a spot for veteran qbs but they may also look to the draft.

 

Steelers -  The Big Ben era is over.  Time to get a replacement.  A prime spot for veteran qbs. Probably more so than drafting one but they could just draft Ben's replacement instead.

 

Dolphins - They probably move on from Tua.  Seems like the #1 destination for Watson.

 

While not likely, half the league could have new QBs this fall. The Commanders?? will be the near bottom destination for any QB.  We are going to have to be very aggressive to get that QB. We will have to overpay, if we lure a veteran here.  My guess, our best bet is to draft a QB.  If that drafted QB does work out, draft again.   

 

Edited January 8, 2022 by Rdskns2000

[mistertim]

4 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Where I am coming from is I think really ANY of the veteran QBs are long shots mainly because of the competition for the spot.  Lot of bidders. So many teams want QBs.   All these guys though have different stories and a different context behind their situations.  And I've tried to pay attention to that and not be stuck with my original preconception.  The stories haven't changed at all relating to Rodgers outside of he might stay in GB after all.  The stories haven't changed about Watson -- if anything its gotten worse as for him coming here -- I thought he was the longest of long shots anyway, so no surprise from me.  As for Wilson from my observation its changed a little.   

 

Garafolo to me was the kicker for me to change my perception about Wilson.  He was one in a series of things I've read/heard which I talked about in another post.  I find Garafolo the most plugged in reporter aside from Schefter.  His colleage Ian Rappoport pulls more gossip than Garafolo but Ian can be wrong too much for my taste, Garafolo like Schefter is rarely wrong.  It's not that he spilled much specifics about Wilson.  But I know from other takes of his, he's similar to Keim in that he talks to a lot of people and they steer him in a direction.  For example Keim asking around found out that Watson wouldn't waive his no trade clause to come here.

 

Anyway, add Garafolo to the pile who has heard good things about Turner (I know some here think he's a moron but with an exception or two, nationally he seems to be highly regarded) and adds that Rivera is also highly regard.  The team is considered talented.  He can see some players being turned off to the off field stuff here, his vibe is Russell Wilson wouldn't be one of those players.   He also said if he were Russell he would want to come here.  And vice versa.  He likes the fit both ways.   Now he could be dead wrong.  And that clearly wasn't a report.   But I can tell he's fishing around Wilson among the other potential QBs and clearly Wilson's people at a minimum hasn't steered him away from this place as a destination spot at least not just yet.  

 

As for Wilson my original take:

 

A.  The dude wants out of Seattle.  He's going to be traded, no doubt

B.  He wants like Rodgers to go to a SB potential winner

C.  He's a stickler to the top teams he wants to go to

 

My current take of Wilson

 

A.   Wilson might be willing to stay after all in Seattle

B.  It's not SB or bust with him.

C.  He might not be a stickler as for where he goes

 

While I agree that Wilson is a long shot.  I don't agree that Rivera isn't willing to be a really high bidder.  It's come out later that the first and third round offer for Stafford was an opening bid, not a take it or leave it offer.  Also and I said so last off season, Keim said he flat out heard Rivera (and Rivera later echoed the same) that he wasn't willing to bid really high for a QB.  He wanted that off season to build the roster.  But all bets would be off next off season (this one) if they didn't land a QB and he would be willing to be aggressive.  So I suspect the conservative 2021 version of Rivera will be supplanted by the more aggressive one.

 

You aren't saying otherwise but my thinking is Rivera isn't stupid.  It's year 3.   it's clear from his interviews that Rivera pays attention to what is said about him.  So if we know it he knows it.  And as much national love Rivera gets, he also has a loud disclaimer now attached to it which is that he has botching things via missed opportunities at QB and if he doesn't overcome that his regime will end up a dud.  Every interview where Rivera has talked about the QB spot he comes off acutely away that its a Code Red spot.  I think he's going to be VERY aggressive to chase down their top targets.

 

With regards to Wilson, I'm fine with moving him from "impossible" to "possible, but extremely unlikely", but like I said I don't want us to get into a place where over time we're increasingly convincing ourselves (without any tangible evidence) that Wilson could come here and then we end up downtrodden when it doesn't happen. That's why I tend to focus more on realistic scenarios.

 

As far as Garafolo, I agree that he's usually a pretty solid source. But as you noted, this isn't something where he's getting actual information from people and passing it on. He's basically just talking about his instincts on the matter. Which shouldn't be discounted, but IMO also shouldn't be given the same weight as actual information ("I talked to a source close to Wilson and his agent, and WFT has been added as a possibility", or something like that).

 

As others have noted, I think the biggest sticking point to players coming here now is Dan and the team reputation in general. I agree that Rivera and the new FO/coaching staff have way more appeal and respect around the league than our coaches/FO in times past. But that also can't change the fact that around the league we're still regarded as having the worst owner in the NFL, the worst facilities in the NFL, and are just sort of regarded as a joke.

Edited January 8, 2022 by mistertim