The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[Warhead36]

2 minutes ago, Dah-Dee said:

 

You just reminded me of a weird stat chart I saw recently, not sure if it was here or elsewhere, but it showed the 2023 pressure-to-sack rates for top 6 QBs, and The Big Three had the highest rates, quite a bit higher than the others. Daniels was at 20.2% for last year (not good, like you said), but Maye was pretty much just as bad, at 19.6%. Not sure what all that means, but it was surprising to see Maye with a ratio that high.

That's different from what I saw, which had Maye at roughly average pressure to sack

[Dah-Dee]

2 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

That's different from what I saw, which had Maye at roughly average pressure to sack

 

PFF also shows it at 19.6 for Maye:

 

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2024-nfl-draft-north-carolina-qb-drake-mayes-scouting-report

 

Again, I don't know what to make of it, but others seem concerned about it with Daniels, so I'm not sure if it's also an issue for Maye (and Williams).

[Skinsinparadise]

Breer

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/2024/03/18/takeaways-aaron-donald-rams-fields-bears-steelers

 

That Vikings trade gives us all a window into where J.J. McCarthy now stands in the eyes of NFL teams. And that’s not to say that they all love him. It is to say that, assuming the Bears, Commanders and Patriots stay put and draft quarterbacks—zero of the three have shown an appetite for trading one of those picks—McCarthy is not just worthy of being, at worst, the fourth QB off the board, but maybe someone worth moving up for.

For now, what we know is Williams will almost certainly be a Bear. We also know that North Carolina’s Drake Maye and LSU’s Jayden Daniels are likely to go at No. 2 and 3, in some order.

Maybe Washington or New England pulls a shocker and takes McCarthy over one or both, but, for now, any team investigating a trade up to No. 4 or 5 with the Cardinals or Chargers has to be comfortable with McCarthy, as well as the other two, since there’s no guarantee of anything past the likelihood Williams won’t be there.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

Can someone conduct an investigation and explain to me how it's possible that new people are joining this board in 2024?

 

"I want to communicate like its 2003 on a platform that the team seems actively embarrassed to own."

[Warhead36]

1 minute ago, Lombardi's_kid_brother said:

Can someone conduct an investigation and explain to me how it's possible that new people are joining this board in 2024?

 

"I want to communicate like its 2003 on a platform that the team seems actively embarrassed to own."

I mean it certainly beats our subreddit. Good lord is that place garbage.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

5 hours ago, Going Commando said:

 

Paying a future Hall of Famer in his prime is worth whatever contract they end up getting.  Jefferson is a far more valuable asset at any price point because he's one of the best players in the league.  Guys like that usually don't hit free agency.  The contracts that are problematic are the ones for guys who set the market and they're like the 12th best player at their position, which is who usually hits free agency.  Kirk Cousins for 40 million a year.

 

Every now and then, you are right about things.

 

Fans don't get how the salary cap works. If the Chiefs traded us Mahomes, people would freak out about the cap hit. It's weird.

 

The discussion around trading all our D-linemen last year was fairly screwy because fans have gotten conditioned to never wanting to pay anyone a second contract under any circumstances. No one is really "worth" what the crazy contractual numbers are with a few rare exceptions. But some guys have to make that money, and it doesn't cripple your team to pay a few guys big second contracts. 

 

Even the Kirk contract is utimately fine, because that's pretty much what a competent veteran costs.

 

People are totally going to lose their minds when the Steelers agree to Fields option year even though it's crazy money, and he's penciled in as the backup. But once they do it, thier QB room is still going to cost under $30 millon in total with, which is a bargain.

[Warhead36]

Elite players are worth every penny.

 

The problem is when you pay good players elite money, particularly QB, because it really hamstrings your team. That's what often happens in FA, but thankfully our FO didn't fall into that trap.

 

I'd pay Jefferson whatever he wants because he's worth it. Guy completely changes your offense.

[The Consigliere]

43 minutes ago, Dah-Dee said:

 

You just reminded me of a weird stat chart I saw recently, not sure if it was here or elsewhere, but it showed the 2023 pressure-to-sack rates for top 6 QBs, and The Big Three had the highest rates, quite a bit higher than the others. Daniels was at 20.2% for last year (not good, like you said), but Maye was pretty much just as bad, at 19.6%. Not sure what all that means, but it was surprising to see Maye with a ratio that high.

Last year was Daniels best year. I believe he was in the mid 30's in '22, that's the alarm bells for Daniels, Daniels was generally horrible throughout his career at that stat while Maye was below average to bad. Not great for Maye either, no doubt, but Maye is in the disappointing tier of the stat in his college career (and with a consistently horrible OL at that), while Daniels was contending with Fields for the worst #'s anyone has ever seen until last year when he climbed to just "bad" amd that was with vastly superior talent around him to Maye. Maye had to wait forever to have any hope in hell of getting a completion, Daniels options were always open, and he was still strugglebussing, that's for me the alarm bell. Dude simply should have been confident enough to let his WR's win when under pressure because they would, Maye knew no such thing was possible with his crap surrounding talent and awful OL. 

43 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

That's different from what I saw, which had Maye at roughly average pressure to sack

I think he's right, what I saw was Maye was bad as well, but Daniels career numbers give Fields record setting horror show #'s a run for their money. Maye is below average to bad, Daniels historically is god awful and one of the worst ever, again, until his senior season. Again, I would love to see what Maye could do WITH ANOTHER 3 YEARS TO LEARN and TWO TOP 5-15 Draft Pick WR'S ON HIS ROSTER AND A COMPETENT OL. 

 

Sometimes the Daniels talk just makes me think the media and everyone everywhere is just on crazy pills as the meme goes. Its ridiculous how unnuanced it is (btw, to steel man, I thought Daniels was good everywhere, always, but only great his last year, Maye was always great, period, and while playing with dog ----, Daniels had elite talent around him his entire college career, dude played with what, 3 or 4 1st round draft pick WR's?!?!?!). 

Edited March 18 by The Consigliere

[The Consigliere]

17 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

Elite players are worth every penny.

 

The problem is when you pay good players elite money, particularly QB, because it really hamstrings your team. That's what often happens in FA, but thankfully our FO didn't fall into that trap.

 

I'd pay Jefferson whatever he wants because he's worth it. Guy completely changes your offense.

I'd pay him as a FA, when I knew I had a franchise QB, and not before. Also worth noting, the '20 and '22 WR classes were fantastic, so tons of potential WR's could be out on the market the next two years, the '21 class was more hit and miss, but also had some guys. I'm fine with dipping in for guys when they are free agents, I do not want to pay trade comp, like our 2nd round pick, or anything else, AND pay them out a huge contract to boot. No thank you. 

[seantaylor=god]

Just now, The Consigliere said:

I'd pay him as a FA, when I knew I had a franchise QB, and not before. Also worth noting, the '20 and '22 WR classes were fantastic, so tons of potential WR's could be out on the market the next two years, the '21 class was more hit and miss, but also had some guys. I'm fine with dipping in for guys when they are free agents, I do not want to pay trade comp, like our 2nd round pick, or anything else, AND pay them out a huge contract to boot. No thank you. 

Agree, he’s awesome no doubt but big time #1 WRs can be huge pains in the ass and if our rookie struggles initially we don’t need that WR in his ear or getting disgruntled. If the rookie QB hits big then a lot of FA WRs will want to come here and we can sign whoever we want or try and trade for a guy.

[The Consigliere]

21 minutes ago, Lombardi's_kid_brother said:

 

Every now and then, you are right about things.

 

Fans don't get how the salary cap works. If the Chiefs traded us Mahomes, people would freak out about the cap hit. It's weird.

 

The discussion around trading all our D-linemen last year was fairly screwy because fans have gotten conditioned to never wanting to pay anyone a second contract under any circumstances. No one is really "worth" what the crazy contractual numbers are with a few rare exceptions. But some guys have to make that money, and it doesn't cripple your team to pay a few guys big second contracts. 

 

Even the Kirk contract is utimately fine, because that's pretty much what a competent veteran costs.

 

People are totally going to lose their minds when the Steelers agree to Fields option year even though it's crazy money, and he's penciled in as the backup. But once they do it, thier QB room is still going to cost under $30 millon in total with, which is a bargain.

That wasn't my argument, my argument was I'd rather have a cost controlled, young, high upside stud in Addison, under cost control for four years than trade draft capital AND pay through the nose for that contract. Jefferson is one guy, you also have Garrett Wilson, Chris Olave, De'Vonta Smith, Jamarr Chase, Jaylen Waddle, Drake London, Amon-Ra, Nico Collins in the coming years, Lamb and Aiyuk are '20 class guys too, same with Pittman, who i think just took on the franchise tag. There are a ton of guys. Much better to keep the draft capital, and acquire a vet stud strictly via FA cap money, rather than draft capital+huge extension. It wouldn't be the end of the world if we got a trade like the AJ Brown one with the Titans done, but I'd still just rather sign the guy on a free. 

 

 

[Redskin21502]

 

need to make that exclamation point an E

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[The Consigliere]

So weird. Like a week earlier it was: New England is dead set on Daniels and if he goes 2, they'd be quite open to trading down. Definitely ready for this to be over, if we take Maye....

[Koolblue13]

[88Comrade2000]

Tomlin’s seat while not hot is warm. Don’t think he’s gotten an extension yet but I could be wrong on that.

 

If there’s not a playoff win; Steelers maybe looking for their 4th coach since 1970.

[clskinsfan]

9 minutes ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

If there’s not a playoff win; Steelers maybe looking for their 4th coach since 1970.

I agree. And it is the reason he hitched his future to Wilson instead of Pickett imo. At least WIlson has been there and done it before. 

[SoCalSkins]

The Eli/Elway move is gaining ‘momentum. RG3 doubled down and Albert Breer chimed in. It’s going to start picking up more momentum. Caleb’s dad probably is watching this with more than a little curiosity.

 

 

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

57 minutes ago, The Consigliere said:

That wasn't my argument, my argument was I'd rather have a cost controlled, young, high upside stud in Addison, under cost control for four years than trade draft capital AND pay through the nose for that contract. Jefferson is one guy, you also have Garrett Wilson, Chris Olave, De'Vonta Smith, Jamarr Chase, Jaylen Waddle, Drake London, Amon-Ra, Nico Collins in the coming years, Lamb and Aiyuk are '20 class guys too, same with Pittman, who i think just took on the franchise tag. There are a ton of guys. Much better to keep the draft capital, and acquire a vet stud strictly via FA cap money, rather than draft capital+huge extension. It wouldn't be the end of the world if we got a trade like the AJ Brown one with the Titans done, but I'd still just rather sign the guy on a free. 

 

 

 

I got bored halfway through that and stopped reading but you're wrong.

[Est.1974]

50 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

Oh well, flip picks with NE and ask them to throw in their pick #34

 

They get Maye guaranteed, we get Daniels and have 34,36,40 in the bank as 2nd rounders.

[Chump Bailey]

Happy to see some familiar faces come back from out of the shadows

[Conn]

12 minutes ago, SoCalSkins said:

The Eli/Elway move is gaining ‘momentum. RG3 doubled down and Albert Breer chimed in. It’s going to start picking up more momentum. Caleb’s dad probably is watching this with more than a little curiosity.

 

 

Most people (and most talking heads) are making fun of Griffin’s original segment, and rebutting that it’s one of the best situations a #1 overall pick has ever fallen into. I don’t think it’s gaining momentum at all aside from the people who are enjoying massive confirmation bias. 

[Skinsinparadise]

6 minutes ago, Est.1974 said:

Oh well, flip picks with NE and ask them to throw in their pick #34

 

They get Maye guaranteed, we get Daniels and have 34,36,40 in the bank as 2nd rounders.

 

Only if they feel both QBs are equally good. Otherwise take the better QB.  Our opinions on these QBs are of course meaningless.

 

I'd love to know what they are thinking. 😎.  But I think either we will never know what they think until they make their pick or maybe it gets leaked some after their prodays - team visits.

[Est.1974]

The value of the #2 pick is going up with every report of another team loving Maye.

[Dah-Dee]

3 minutes ago, Conn said:

I don’t think it’s gaining momentum at all aside from the people who are enjoying massive confirmation bias. 

 

Agree, it's just media/etc filling time before the draft. Going to be super surprised at this point if top 2 picks are not Williams to Bears and then Maye to us.