Koolblue13 Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 28 minutes ago, Santana_89 said: Laughing at Falcons fans thinking they have a shot at moving up to #2 to get Chase Young. Not even Julio could sweeten the pot enough for me to move off #2 and down to #16. Move to 16, Draft Queen and we'd most likely have their 1rst next year to give us firepower to move to 1 for Lawrence. I wouldn't be that angry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashburn Dave Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 Already got my riggo jersey on. Let's get it on! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 (edited) 6 hours ago, Burgundy Yoda said: Teams calling to trade all the way up to #2 for a non-QB seems pretty rare. It's clear NFL teams see a very rare prospect in Chase Young. I wouldn't move my butt off of the second pick, as all these other teams are just reassuring the team that this guy is special. Yeah the only other recent huge leap like that I can think of is Atlanta for Julio. And holy **** did they fleece the Browns there. All Cleveland got was an extra second and fourth rounder that draft, a first and fourth in the next draft. And they parlayed those picks into the powerhouse of Phil Taylor (after giving up a 3rd to move up to 21), Greg Little, and Owen Marecic in 2011, and in 2012 Brandon Weeden, and used the 4th they got from Atlanta as part of a trade to move up from 4 to 3 and take Trent Richardson. Edited April 23, 2020 by mistertim 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooleyfan1993 Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 Merry chasemas, guys! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 1 minute ago, mistertim said: And they parlayed those picks into the powerhouse of Phil Taylor (after giving up a 3rd to move up to 21), Greg Little, Owen Marecic, Brandon Weeden, and used the 2012 4th they got as part of a trade to move up from 4 to 3 and take Trent Richardson. damn that’s an ugly outcome isn’t it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darrell Green Fan Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 8 minutes ago, mistertim said: Yeah the only other recent huge leap like that I can think of is Atlanta for Julio. And holy **** did they fleece the Browns there. All Cleveland got was an extra second and fourth rounder that draft, a first and fourth in the next draft. And they parlayed those picks into the powerhouse of Phil Taylor (after giving up a 3rd to move up to 21), Greg Little, and Owen Marecic in 2011, and in 2012 Brandon Weeden, and used the 4th they got from Atlanta as part of a trade to move up from 4 to 3 and take Trent Richardson. I liked your post because this is a good example of how a trade back can backfire if you screw up the picks. But like the Rams with RGIII it still doesn't change what was received back, you just have to make the most of it. I don't have the draft value chart but seems to me that going from 6 to 27 while picking up a 2nd, 4th and a future 1 and 4 sounds like pretty good value to me, they just screwed up the picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 3 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said: I liked your post because this is a good example of how a trade back can backfire if you screw up the picks. But like the Rams with RGIII it still doesn't change what was received back, you just have to make the most of it. I don't have the draft value chart but seems to me that going from 6 to 27 while picking up a 2nd, 4th and a future 1 and 4 sounds like pretty good value to me, they just screwed up the picks. I don't have the value chart in front of me either, but I have a feeling that if the Skins had the 6th overall pick and moved down to 27 for what the Browns got, we would all be screaming and/or throwing our televisions out the window. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 10 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said: I liked your post because this is a good example of how a trade back can backfire if you screw up the picks. But like the Rams with RGIII it still doesn't change what was received back, you just have to make the most of it. I don't have the draft value chart but seems to me that going from 6 to 27 while picking up a 2nd, 4th and a future 1 and 4 sounds like pretty good value to me, they just screwed up the picks. No way that is awful value. To move down 21 spots I'd need a lot more then just that. Reading this forum I am so glad 99% of you aren't our GM. We'd be even worse off than the Bruce Allen days. I'll chalk it up to quarantine withering the brains. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darrell Green Fan Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 12 minutes ago, mistertim said: I don't have the value chart in front of me either, but I have a feeling that if the Skins had the 6th overall pick and moved down to 27 for what the Browns got, we would all be screaming and/or throwing our televisions out the window. Boy I don't know about that. Seems to me most fans always want to trade back and accumulate picks. Of course this is a unique situation this year, we've never been in a position to draft a player like Chase Young. But if we were sitting at 6 I have little doubt most fans would be thrilled with that package. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 Trading down is the most overrated thing ever. I've seen us trade down enough times and screw it up every single time to never want to do it again. 6 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darrell Green Fan Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 (edited) 34 minutes ago, Warhead36 said: No way that is awful value. To move down 21 spots I'd need a lot more then just that. Reading this forum I am so glad 99% of you aren't our GM. We'd be even worse off than the Bruce Allen days. I'll chalk it up to quarantine withering the brains. You really should have done your research before making this "withering brain" comment. Pick #6 is valued at 1,600 pts. Atlanta gave up #27 (680 pts) #59 (310 pts) #124 (48 pts) and then in 2012 pick #22 (780 pts) and #118 (58 pts). So Atlanta gave up 1,876 pts and received 1,600. To even make the trade dead even Atlanta should have received a late 2nd, again that's just to break even. Edited April 23, 2020 by Darrell Green Fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 14 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said: Boy I don't know about that. Seems to me most fans always want to trade back and accumulate picks. Of course this is a unique situation this year, we've never been in a position to draft a player like Chase Young. But if we were sitting at 6 I have little doubt most fans would be thrilled with that package. Yeah, plenty of people want to trade back and accumulate picks...but only getting 4 picks for moving back from 6 to 27, including only one 1st...which was the next draft, a 2nd and 4th that draft, and a 4th the following year? I'd never do that. One 2nd, a future 1st (which has less value than a current 1st), and two fourths is a pittance for moving up from 27 into the top 10 (almost top 5). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darrell Green Fan Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 13 minutes ago, mistertim said: Yeah, plenty of people want to trade back and accumulate picks...but only getting 4 picks for moving back from 6 to 27, including only one 1st...which was the next draft, a 2nd and 4th that draft, and a 4th the following year? I'd never do that. One 2nd, a future 1st (which has less value than a current 1st), and two fourths is a pittance for moving up from 27 into the top 10 (almost top 5). See my post above. Cleveland actually got considerably more value than the pick should have gotten them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 The draft value chart is outdated and obsolete. It was made back in like 1990. And yeah Cleveland got so much "value"...meanwhile the Falcons got future HOF-er Julio Jones. Quick, who did the Browns draft? Yeah, nobody knows. Because trading down is stupid. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said: See my post above. Cleveland actually got considerably more value than the pick should have gotten them. I'm not sure your 780 for the future 1st is accurate though. IIRC future picks are valued at lower than same year picks. So you can't say that the 1st rounder in 2012 was equal to the #22 overall pick in 2011. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98ORAKPO98 Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 (edited) If we trade the #2 pick I say boycott the Deadskins because that's what they'll be to me if that happens. Disgusting that this franchise has been around since 1932 and has only two top 100 all-time players. We have the chance to draft a hall of fame level talent, don't screw that up to trade for a bunch of scrubs. https://packers.fandom.com/wiki/The_Top_100:_NFL's_Greatest_Players Edited April 23, 2020 by 98ORAKPO98 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Warhead36 said: The draft value chart is outdated and obsolete. It was made back in like 1990. And yeah Cleveland got so much "value"...meanwhile the Falcons got future HOF-er Julio Jones. Quick, who did the Browns draft? Yeah, nobody knows. Because trading down is stupid. I'm in the RR school of thought on this. Trading down from a top 5 / top 10 pick is ok if you truly think you will be able to get a guy of the same value and caliber with the new pick as you would with the original pick. Going from 6 to 27...there's just no way that qualifies. The only way I'd move back that far is if I'm getting something like 10 mid round picks for it so I can increase my chances of finding a couple of mid round gems. 2 minutes ago, 98ORAKPO98 said: If we trade the #2 pick I say boycott the Deadskins because that's what they'll be to me if that happens. Disgusting that this franchise has been around since 1932 and has only one top 100 all-time player. We have the chance to draft a hall of fame level talent, don't screw that up to trade for a bunch of scrubs. Seriously, dude? C'mon. Edited April 23, 2020 by mistertim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98ORAKPO98 Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 (edited) Yeah seriously, tired of the Redskins fielding scrubs when we could have had greats, now we have the chance to draft a hall of famer, don't F that up or forever be known as the Dumbskins. I would trade #2 maybe for a teams next ten #1 picks. Maybe. Edited April 23, 2020 by 98ORAKPO98 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 13 minutes ago, mistertim said: I'm in the RR school of thought on this. Trading down from a top 5 / top 10 pick is ok if you truly think you will be able to get a guy of the same value and caliber with the new pick as you would with the original pick. Going from 6 to 27...there's just no way that qualifies. The only way I'd move back that far is if I'm getting something like 10 mid round picks for it so I can increase my chances of finding a couple of mid round gems. Again every draft is different. In some drafts yeah there might not be much drop off from 5 to 10, but there is always some drop off. In a draft like this year's though, there appears to be a pretty big drop off after the top 2, and that has to be taken into account. But in general, if you look at the history of draft trades, the team that trades down almost always gets very little in return. I'm only in favor of trading down in the middle rounds where the difference in talent is negligible and you'd rather have more bullets in the chamber, so to speak. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 5 minutes ago, Warhead36 said: Again every draft is different. In some drafts yeah there might not be much drop off from 5 to 10, but there is always some drop off. In a draft like this year's though, there appears to be a pretty big drop off after the top 2, and that has to be taken into account. But in general, if you look at the history of draft trades, the team that trades down almost always gets very little in return. I'm only in favor of trading down in the middle rounds where the difference in talent is negligible and you'd rather have more bullets in the chamber, so to speak. Actually if Chase Young weren't in this draft I think it would be an excellent draft for a trade back from 2 to, say, 5. We'd still almost certainly be able to get an elite prospect in an area of need with either Simmons or Okudah being there at 5. But Chase Young is in this draft. So for me it would take a certifiably insane offer to consider moving back. 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98ORAKPO98 Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 Learn from history, Redskins: Take Chase Young. https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2020/04/22/learn-history-redskins-take-chase-young/?utm_campaign=wp_redskins&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 1 minute ago, 98ORAKPO98 said: Learn from history, Redskins: Take Chase Young. https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2020/04/22/learn-history-redskins-take-chase-young/?utm_campaign=wp_redskins&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter You know the FO isn't reading this thread, right? We all agree with you lol 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 4 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darrell Green Fan Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 (edited) 53 minutes ago, mistertim said: I'm not sure your 780 for the future 1st is accurate though. IIRC future picks are valued at lower than same year picks. So you can't say that the 1st rounder in 2012 was equal to the #22 overall pick in 2011. Yeah that's a good point that I thought of later. So if we devalue those 2012 picks a round that's a drop of 437 pts making the value of that #6 pick of 1,600 worth 1,437. So this is a slight lean for Atlanta but hardly in the "awful value" territoty that @Warhead36 was claiming. 55 minutes ago, Warhead36 said: The draft value chart is outdated and obsolete. It was made back in like 1990. And yeah Cleveland got so much "value"...meanwhile the Falcons got future HOF-er Julio Jones. Quick, who did the Browns draft? Yeah, nobody knows. Because trading down is stupid. Nonsense, the draft chart is still utilized. Again you can't judge the value by who was picked, I can show you many trade backs where it worked for the team who traded back as well as examples where the player teams traded up for didn't work out. There are examples both ways obviously, we are discussing the value of that high pick and I'm just pointing out your claim that this trade wasn't close in terms of value just isn't true.. Edited April 23, 2020 by Darrell Green Fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98ORAKPO98 Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 Everyone wants the most dominant player in this draft. Sorry guys, he's ours. https://247sports.com/Article/nfl-draft-2020-ohio-state-buckeyes-chase-young-trade-jaguars-dolphins-falcons-146375536/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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