NY Times: Price Rise Sparks Concern for Allergy Sufferers

[HOF44]

 

[TheGreatBuzz]

The REAL problem, like so many other issues discussed on ES, is society as a whole.  Helping someone out is so far down the list of whats important, it's not even considered.  The all mighty dollar is all that matters.  And that's all anyone is ever taught.

 

Doing the right thing?  Meh, it's for suckers. 

[lovetoaster]

I experienced this recently. I am extremely allergic to bee stings and got swarmed by yellow jackets a few weeks ago when mowing my lawn. I used my Epipen, drove to the hospital, and spent most of the day there. They wrote me a prescription for new Epipens, because in some cases, I may need them to live. And I think that's pretty important. 

Over the last three years, my Epipens have gone from $40, to $80, and this time it was $540. I was stunned. I told CVS to keep them; that's not an expense I can have just totally unplanned.

I understand this is a complex issue, but to me it basically comes down to greed. That's a terrible game to play when you have a product that people's lives depend on. Do it with a ****ing car, do it with a ****ing TV, but don't do it with a product that people need to survive. Bunch of soulless assholes. 

[Popeman38]

5 hours ago, HOF44 said:

This is what happens with pure capitalism with no federal over site. Same thing happens in the banking industry, but the victimization isn't as dramatic or emotional so it does not garner the attention. 

This, by definition, is not free market forces at work. The government has the industry regulated and created a monopoly for the manufacturer of the "EpiPen".  If free market forces were allowed to work there would be a vast number of competitors trying to eat into the market share that this one pharma company has, creating competition, which in turn would result in a price drop down to an equilibrium point.

But why let facts get in the way of the torches and pitchforks.  The government offered a ginormous assist to this company's monopoly. That is NOT a free market...

[HOF44]

4 minutes ago, Popeman38 said:

This, by definition, is not free market forces at work. The government has the industry regulated and created a monopoly for the manufacturer of the "EpiPen".  If free market forces were allowed to work there would be a vast number of competitors trying to eat into the market share that this one pharma company has, creating competition, which in turn would result in a price drop down to an equilibrium point.

But why let facts get in the way of the torches and pitchforks.  The government

I should rephrase, it's not unregulated, but a case of the fox guarding the henhouse. It is regulated the way the pharmaceutical  companies have written the laws.  They have congress bought and paid for to such an extent that the industry is usually the ones who actually write the bills.  

[Popeman38]

Just now, HOF44 said:

I should rephrase, it's not unregulated, but a case of the fox guarding the henhouse. It is regulated the way the pharmaceutical  companies have written the laws.  They have congress bought and paid for to such an extent that the industry is usually the ones who actually write the bills.  

I am all about killing (not really, just limiting in dollar amount and size) the lobby industry.  Just because you have billions shouldn't equate to you sitting in on the bills creation...

Also, let's scale back the marketing to just people with a serious allergy and not to everyone who has an allergy. I am allergic to Robitussin, I don't need to have epi in my house. Peanut allergy? Sure. Bees? after a certain point, sure. 

And if the government has decided everyone needs epi at school, work, and home, why isn't it 100% covered by insurance? I thought healthcare reform was supposed to mandate fair access...

[KingGibbs]

I used to suffer terrible allergies. So bad that my eyes would be swollen shut and I would get nose bleeds. Simply changing my diet to eating healthy the majority of the time has eradicated the issue. No bull.

[lovetoaster]

3 minutes ago, KingGibbs said:

I used to suffer terrible allergies. So bad that my eyes would be swollen shut and I would get nose bleeds. Simply changing my diet to eating healthy the majority of the time has eradicated the issue. No bull.

Yeah, I had been meaning to go to an allergist to see if I was still as allergic as I used to be because I hadn't been stung in about 20 years. But after the yellow jackets made up for lost time a few weeks ago, I mentioned that to the people at the hospital and they responded with a very affirmative "yeah, you still need it."

[Springfield]

So how long does the epinephrine last?  I have an epipen that is at least 5 years old or so.  I'm not buying a new one for half a grand.  If I use the old one would it still work?

 

Suppose I will just keep hoping I don't have an allergic reaction the next time I get stung by a bee.  If I do have a reaction, hope the fire and rescue gets to me before I stop breathing.

[Elessar78]

im sure you believe that diet cured your allergies, but you were probably eating something you were allergic to. Fixing your diet eliminated that. what you thought were seasonal allergies were just food allergies.

[skinsmarydu]

Finding out it was Joe Manchin's daughter as CEO bent me.  I may not recover from this political allergy.

And Springy, my doctor told me everything's pretty much OK within a year of expiration, but any further may not deliver a total dose and/or not be effective.  Vitamins are ok, but lose potency only after 2 years.

[lovetoaster]

Just now, Springfield said:

So how long does the epinephrine last?  I have an epipen that is at least 5 years old or so.  I'm not buying a new one for half a grand.  If I use the old one would it still work?

Suppose I will just keep hoping I don't have an allergic reaction the next time I get stung by a bee.  If I do have a reaction, hope the fire and rescue gets to me before I stop breathing.

They supposedly are only good for a year. Apparently if the liquid is still clear, it is still fine. The newer ones have a window that you can see whether it is discolored or not. I think that has more to do with how it is stored. 

I had a friend that needs an Epipen ask a doctor about how long they are really good after news of these price hikes started going around. Apparently the doctor said that it does not necessarily go bad after a year, but it will become less effective. 

[KingGibbs]

8 minutes ago, Elessar78 said:

im sure you believe that diet cured your allergies, but you were probably eating something you were allergic to. Fixing your diet eliminated that. what you thought were seasonal allergies were just food allergies.

Than why did my allergies only occur in the spring and fall?

15 minutes ago, lovetoaster said:

Yeah, I had been meaning to go to an allergist to see if I was still as allergic as I used to be because I hadn't been stung in about 20 years. But after the yellow jackets made up for lost time a few weeks ago, I mentioned that to the people at the hospital and they responded with a very affirmative "yeah, you still need it."

Yikes. I should have clarified that I was referring to seasonal allergies.

[Springfield]

22 minutes ago, lovetoaster said:

They supposedly are only good for a year. Apparently if the liquid is still clear, it is still fine. The newer ones have a window that you can see whether it is discolored or not. I think that has more to do with how it is stored. 

I had a friend that needs an Epipen ask a doctor about how long they are really good after news of these price hikes started going around. Apparently the doctor said that it does not necessarily go bad after a year, but it will become less effective. 

 

I think I recall hearing that they will get less effective after a year as well.

 

Only time will tell.

[TheGreatBuzz]

So from what I'm hearing, epipen patent is about to expire and they won't be making money on it any more.  That's why they jacked up the price for one final push.  I'm hearing this is standand practice in the pharmacy world when your patent is about to expire and it's only news because of how popular the product is.  Anyone in that world that can confirm this?

[PokerPacker]

44 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

So from what I'm hearing, epipen patent is about to expire and they won't be making money on it any more.  That's why they jacked up the price for one final push.  I'm hearing this is standand practice in the pharmacy world when your patent is about to expire and it's only news because of how popular the product is.  Anyone in that world that can confirm this?

I would replace the word 'popular' with 'necessary for not dying'

[TheGreatBuzz]

Whatever.  I would say the latter causes the former.  Care to address my actual point?

[Springfield]

32 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

Whatever.  I would say the latter causes the former.  Care to address my actual point?

 

This is the first I've heard of a patent expiration. The delivery device for the epinephrine is where the patent is important.

 

Apparently, there is a generic version in the works but unsurprisingly the FDA has delayed it significantly. Seems to happen to any possible epipen replacements.

http://www.fiercepharma.com/sales-and-marketing/fda-swats-down-teva-s-epipen-copy-putting-mylan-cruise-control

[TheGreatBuzz]

Well I do know drug patents expire.  Not sure about the Epipen one though.

[Springfield]

17 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

Well I do know drug patents expire.  Not sure about the Epipen one though.

I don't think the drug is patented.

 

The delivery system (aka the injector) is patented.  Seems like the FDA has problems when similar delivery systems come about.

[Popeman38]

2 hours ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

So from what I'm hearing, epipen patent is about to expire and they won't be making money on it any more.  That's why they jacked up the price for one final push.  I'm hearing this is standand practice in the pharmacy world when your patent is about to expire and it's only news because of how popular the product is.  Anyone in that world that can confirm this?

It already expired. Competition tried to get FDA approval but their option failed trial. They won't be able to reapply until 2027. There just isn't any competition and the government created a monopoly for them. To hear the government whine about it now is rich. YOU ****ed this up. Now un**** it. 

[lovetoaster]

31 minutes ago, Popeman38 said:

It already expired. Competition tried to get FDA approval but their option failed trial. They won't be able to reapply until 2027. There just isn't any competition and the government created a monopoly for them. To hear the government whine about it now is rich. YOU ****ed this up. Now un**** it. 

Yep. It expired a while back. There was a minor competitor from Sanofi, the Auvi-Q, but they had some dosage issues, and they recalled and shuttered the product earlier this year. But even before that recall, Mylan was aggressively advertising everywhere, and it was such an uphill battle since doctors and pharmacists just shelled out the Epipen on instinct. 

The FDA also rejected a generic version from Teva earlier this year, so with nothing on the table for potential approval, it will be a long time before there will be a viable competitor. 

So while jacking up the prices may have been a last ditch cash grab strategy for Mylan, 2016 has been an even more profitable year than could have been expected, with much higher prices and two potential competitors going by the wayside. 

 

 

 

[Corcaigh]

13 hours ago, zoony said:

Free markets dude. Let's let it fly what could go wrong

 

You can buy Epipens in the UK in a pharmacy over the counter without insurance for $60. 

Obviously it's a lot more expensive to serve the US market even thought it's five times larger.

[skinsmarydu]

Looking at some other stats, I noticed that Viagra & Cialis are in the same boat, so to speak.  They're somewhere in the $40-$60 range...PER PILL. 

Seriously?  That's charging a serious amount of money to have sex...otherwise known as prostitution.  (By the FDA, who won't let the patent expire, because there's too much money involved.) 

Which leads me to a comment I read in the AJC years ago:  Real men cut their Viagra pills in half.

[Riggo-toni]

I have a dog who gets sildenafil citrate (viagra) for his lungs. I did notice the price went up a bit in the last year. He's been neutered a long time, but since he started getting pills, I notice him humping air a lot more in the late afternoon.