SkinInsite Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 good lord, youre tough. thats a jail break. almost as if there was no O line at all. He's got to anticipate the throw otherwise he'll be blitzed to oblivion. But if 2nd half is anything to go by there's a great deal of improvement on both the play calling and execution by RG3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinInsite Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 Eh, I dunno about this one. From what I could tell by where Griff was looking after the snap Roberts wasn't the first read. Add to that that by the time Roberts was even in a position to start his break, Griffin had 3 guys in his face from the left side as well as up the middle so he had no pocket to step up into. I really don't think there is much he could have done there outside of an audible to a slant or something. He got to know where the hot reads are when blitz is coming and react faster. Here's he's probably half a sec to late from a completion and maybe a TD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 2nd sack which i think is worse the first, i think Roberts was open on the out and RG3 should have anticipated the throw. I seen Manning/Brady/Rodgers make that throw before the WR makes his cut. Griffin mistake here was pre-snap. And depending on how much time is left on the play clock he needs to ALERT BLITZ to the OL and WRs or call a timeout. Ideally post snap he's got to get the ball out quick, and if the WRs aren't running hot routes throw it at someones feet. But on the whole I don't put a lot of blame on Griffin post snap because he didn't have a place to step up and escape and the pressure was on him as soon as he plants his back foot at the end of his drop. Griffin needs a quick 360 spin move Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grego Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 But if 2nd half is anything to go by there's a great deal of improvement on both the play calling and execution by RG3. im with you on that. just listened to kevin sheehan on 980. he basically said the same thing as for as first half compared to second half for griffin. said that upon a second look, griffin played much better than he thought and did what was asked of him very well overall. interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Do you have a clip of this play... 2-6-WAS 24 (:43) (Shotgun) R.Griffin pass short right to P.Garcon pushed ob at WAS 33 for 9 yards (B.Reed). IIRC Griffin steps up in the pocket and completes this pass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinInsite Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Do you have a clip of this play... 2-6-WAS 24 (:43) (Shotgun) R.Griffin pass short right to P.Garcon pushed ob at WAS 33 for 9 yards (B.Reed). IIRC Griffin steps up in the pocket and completes this pass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyHolt Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 Who are the best QBs at burning unblocked blitzers? It seems like wave after wave of them coming after RG3. Perhaps it is a new trend in the NFL, don't bother blocking. #Frist! That last gif throwing towards DJax, he could have thrown it sooner, but everything he is doing is under a microscope. QBs miss open guys, alter throws because they are about to get whacked, very frequently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 good lord, youre tough. thats a jail break. almost as if there was no O line at all. Look who got beat. Helu and Paulsen to the left and Polumbus has Watt blocked up until Chester gives him a two handed shove, thus giving him a turbo boost passed Polumbus and to Griffin. Here's Bad RG3 rolling out and getting sacked notice how it's a two men route and both were double covered, should have threw it away This is a tough one. First, it was a pa boot. But we booted left. To throw you have to get your shoulders around. By the time he saw his reads covered, a free rusher came through. Our OL was selling OZ to the right. That's one where I think you can make minor tweaks but in the end the defense just won that play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 Thanks SkinsInsite Hmmnn....Griffin looks quite comfortable here. Steps up into a collapsing pocket and escapes to find a receiver. Lets examine the elements.... o Griffin keeps himself in a throwing position, he doesn't drop his arm (which has long since been a pet peeve of mine) o Empty formation, Spread...kinda like...Baylor? The next step imho is hurry-up.. I'm sure the offensive staff are taking copius notes and are making adjustments. I hope to see more spread coming to stadium near you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thekyle1591 Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 Where is everyone getting this "2 seconds and killed" line? And what are they attributing it to? The lines (and griffins) inability to diagnose and pick up the blitz was killing us Sunday. 2 seconds might be an exaduration, but griffin holding the ball longer than 2.5 seconds almost always seemed to result in a pressure. When you get beat to the tune of 2 sacks 12 hits and 12 hurries, you're not going to have much time to throw the ball deep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rufus T Firefly Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 This is a tough one. First, it was a pa boot. But we booted left. To throw you have to get your shoulders around. By the time he saw his reads covered, a free rusher came through. Our OL was selling OZ to the right. That's one where I think you can make minor tweaks but in the end the defense just won that play. Yeah, what he said. Also, Swearinger is kind of shielded until he breaks thru. I don't think Griffin really saw him until it was kinda too late. The 2nd sack is more of a bad play by Griffin. He needs to read that blitz and be prepared to throw the ball right away. That play in the red zone I'm not sure on. It almost looks like Jackson is the hot read but Griffin is waiting for him to look back for the ball. Seems like Jackson watched the rusher go by him but didn't adjust his route accordingly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyHolt Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 PFF has RG3 with 2.93 seconds to throw. 3rd longest this week. I assume this has to include his scrambles, the bogus call on Roberts OOB, the pass to Garcon from spread. Or is it time in the pocket only? Watch that spread throw to Garcon, and look at Kory. I cannot recall seeing a center running almost straight back like that, but he stayed on his man and paved the road for an easy step up for RG3. RG3 appeared under duress any time we didn't have a short play dialed up. The free guy pass to DJax that was late / high aside, I cannot recall many times he clearly held the ball too long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 The lines (and griffins) inability to diagnose and pick up the blitz was killing us Sunday. 2 seconds might be an exaduration, but griffin holding the ball longer than 2.5 seconds almost always seemed to result in a pressure. When you get beat to the tune of 2 sacks 12 hits and 12 hurries, you're not going to have much time to throw the ball deep. Griffin held the ball for a little too long at times, so the constant two second and hit idea is a bit off. Now take off at least four times where we booted naked backside and Griffin got hit, by design, by the way. Let's account for the RBs and TEs missing assignments, which they did. I hate when people say "the lines" as if they're the only problem when it comes to pass pro. They aren't. Our pass protection was scary, and our line didn't play outstanding, but you have to account for other positions and playcalling issues accounting for some of the hits, pressures and sacks as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter_R Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I hate when people say "the lines" as if they're the only problem when it comes to pass pro. They aren't. Our pass protection was scary, and our line didn't play outstanding, but you have to account for other positions and playcalling issues accounting for some of the hits, pressures and sacks as well.It's funny you mention that, as PFF graded the center #5/30 and Polumbus #5 out of 60. The guards have average scores. Surely, nobody is going to argue against PFF. http://www.reddit.com/r/Redskins/comments/2ftth1/some_pff_notes_on_the_texans_game_positives/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grego Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 It's funny you mention that, as PFF graded the center #5/30 and Polumbus #5 out of 60. The guards have average scores. Surely, nobody is going to argue against PFF. http://www.reddit.com/r/Redskins/comments/2ftth1/some_pff_notes_on_the_texans_game_positives/ ya i used to really like pff. sometimes i dont know what the heck they are looking at. i swear, sometimes it seems like they just make numbers up, cuz my eyes almost never see what they say. what does football outsiders say about our guys? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I love PFF but you have to take their metrics, like any metric, with a grain of salt and understand its flaws. Once you compare there grades with your own (if you chart) you notice their tendencies. For example they don't grade a play where an OL like Tyler gets pushed back in pass protection BUT doesn't get flat out beat as a negative. Any time a tackler doesn't secure a tackle it graded as a miss for example if Clark tackle attempt makes Foster go down but he didn't secure the tackler they likely grade that as a miss even though the ball carrier goes down. I am certain they graded a couple plays where Foster goes down because of Clark as misses becauses Foster action to avoid being tackled by Clark caused him to go down. If that makes sense, I'm really tired right now. So for me Clark had a better game then they grade but Tyler had a worse game then they grade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JesseNeckred Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I wonder what the people who constantly blast Griffin will say if he does become elite. If one says they know for a fact that he will not be elite, then they're not very bright. How can anyone possibly know this early in his career? I bring up Drew Brees again, who knew by week 1 of his 3rd starting season how he'd turn out? He actually missed more time than Griffin, up to this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rufus T Firefly Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 ya i used to really like pff. sometimes i dont know what the heck they are looking at. i swear, sometimes it seems like they just make numbers up, cuz my eyes almost never see what they say. I always treated them as a decent data point, one thing to look at but far from the be-all/end-all some used it as. But at this point, I'm close to getting to the point where I don't bother with them at all. I mean, they thought the problem for us this week was all the times Griffin stood unmolested in the pocket for too long waiting for receivers to come open? Really? I know statistics are supposed to tell us things our lyin' eyes don't see, but their stats like this are more like observations anyway and they just seem to be seeing things that clearly defy reality. Meanwhile, they say Griffin had the third most time to throw and are telling us how wonderful all the blockers were, and yet have us rated 28th overall in "pass block efficiency"? This just seems like number salad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogofWar1 Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I have no idea how PFF can think Griffin had throwing time. Anyone who watched the game could see plain as day that he was running for his life constantly. I suppose they're counting all the time he was evading unblocked defenders as unmolested time, but that's just incorrect to do. Griffin took, what? 15 QB hits? And 3 sacks? He threw 37 times, which means on almost 50% of passing downs, Griffin was getting hit. When your QB is getting hit on 50% of passing downs, I have no idea how anyone could, with a straight face, say he had lots of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyHolt Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 We heard the grades for Kory and Tyler. What were the grades for the rest of the OL? On a rewatch last night I saw Trent averted a sack on a illegal contact call late in the first half. Someone had a bad day to drag us down to 28th in the PFF salad shooter pass block efficiency scale with 2 out of the 5 grading very well. Gruden has to consider blocking that backside on boots / reverses, or scrapping those plays altogether. On that Jackson reverse, Reed was ALL over him, and there was another defender 10 yards behind the line as well. We think Haslett did ok but Crennel gets a big shout out. Facing a new offense can be a daunting task, but I think Gruden made it easy for him for largely running Kyle's / the Cincy offense. Crennel dictated to us what we could do, something I want to see Haslett do more often. Even though he had pressure from Watt / clean front, he still brought the blitz and had free guys almost at every chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Rufus and Dog, Lets not throw the baby out with the bath water when it comes to PFF. First on PFF time on the pocket they count the entire snap so if Griffin creates time, like Russell Wilson last year, that factors in to the overall time. AND PFF doesn't mix opinion with their stats. The posted link is some guy from reddit mixing his opinion/assumptions with their stats. The OL didn't play well. PFF is not saying it did. PFF gave the average time in the pocket at 2.93 and in 50% of the snaps Griffin got the ball out in 2.5s. Keep in mind that scrambles and sacks take longer. PFF is still the only place to get individual game grades and "designer" stats like time in pocket or missed tackles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyHolt Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Something that belongs in a general post game discussion thread perhaps Remember all the discussions about how some of us wanted the shiny new toy Seastrunk to stick around, even though he couldn't pass block? The discussion evolved to RBs have to be able to pass block as a priority to make the team. I thought Gruden believed in that. But then, maybe not. Look at what Gruden was doing in week 1 already. He had Aldrick lined up in the backfield, before Helu even got a single snap. DJax was lined up in the backfield. Of course Houston blitzed straight at him. There were probably more instances. At least with a RB in there that cannot block, the defense has to respect that we may try to run inside. With a speed WR lined up as a RB, it is simply telegraphing what we will do less than sticking Seastrunk to the wolves back there. The D knows we are not running the ball. One reason I wanted Seastrunk retained was because he makes our offense more dynamic. Game 1, our offense looked plain jane vanilla. White Bread dipped in water for dunking. Yes we fumbled should have won special teams whatever. But this team and largely the same offense has lost 8 straight. It really looked an awful lot like Kyle's offense to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grego Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Meanwhile, they say Griffin had the third most time to throw and are telling us how wonderful all the blockers were, and yet have us rated 28th overall in "pass block efficiency"? This just seems like number salad. now, that ranking, i believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amm0409 Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 FYI Barry Cofield is not coming back till week 11 I'd rate that in-between BAD and Ugly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted September 10, 2014 Author Share Posted September 10, 2014 FYI Barry Cofield is not coming back till week 11 I'd rate that in-between BAD and Ugly Nah, that's just ugly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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