24/7: Ten Companies Paying Americans the Least

[The 12th Commandment]

who's table,chairs,building and cookies are they?

did the CEO provide the oven,ingredients,utilities,insurance ect that were used to make them?

 

 

what you bring to the table matters

Labor made the chairs, the building and baked the cookies.  They turned the oven on and connected the electric service in such a way as to let the CEO turn on the lights.  I'll grant you that labor doesn't have much to do with the insurance.

[twa]

Labor made the chairs, the building and baked the cookies.  They turned the oven on and connected the electric service in such a way as to let the CEO turn on the lights.  I'll grant you that labor doesn't have much to do with the insurance.

 

for pay or for cookies?

[Mad Mike]

spoken like someone not bringing anything to the table but hot air and a appetite.

 

How did you come up with BETTER?

 

How about this...

 

Republicans and corporations often give all of the credit to a companies success to CEOs at the expense of workers. Corporations receive corporate welfare, rely on national and state infrastructure, pay very little to nothing in taxes to develop or maintain the infrastructure, forcing the cost on workers and individual taxpayers while paying them the absolute minimum and forcing their employees rely on public assistance to survive, in order to maximize profits and take the most cookies.

 

Does that clear things up for you?

 

How McDonald's and Wal-Mart Became Welfare Queens - Bloomberg

[The 12th Commandment]

for pay or for cookies?

For a commensurately low, in terms of the importance of their contribution, percentage of the ensuing revenues.  

 

How can the concept of unions, people using the power of their numbers which is the only power they have, be seen as bad?  It can certainly be misapplied but that isn't a foregone conclusion.  Management takes advantage of any strength they have and no one would ever suggest they shouldn't.  You can't hamstring one party to the negotiation and count on a fair resolution.

[Kilmer17]

If only the Republicans werent in charge and the Dems could change these things.

[Mad Mike]

NM. DBL post

[The 12th Commandment]

If only the Republicans werent in charge and the Dems could change these things.

The corporate citizen is in charge.  His campaign contributions at least.

[Tulane Skins Fan]

who's table,chairs,building and cookies are they?

did the CEO provide the oven,ingredients,utilities,insurance ect that were used to make them?

 

 

what you bring to the table matters

 

This is poignant.  You presume that the CEO made the cookies.  First of all, we all know the CEO didn't make the cookies.  CEO's don't make things.  You also presume that he brought EVERYTHING to the table, which is not how it works in real life anyway.

 

How apropos that you answered the way you did.

[twa]

This is poignant.  You presume that the CEO made the cookies.  First of all, we all know the CEO didn't make the cookies.  CEO's don't make things.  You also presume that he brought EVERYTHING to the table, which is not how it works in real life anyway.

 

How apropos that you answered the way you did.

 

Would the cookies be made w/o what he brings and represents?

 

actually I asked who brought them or enabled them.......fwiw this CEO makes things  

[twa]

For a commensurately low, in terms of the importance of their contribution, percentage of the ensuing revenues.  

 

How can the concept of unions, people using the power of their numbers which is the only power they have, be seen as bad?  It can certainly be misapplied but that isn't a foregone conclusion.  Management takes advantage of any strength they have and no one would ever suggest they shouldn't.  You can't hamstring one party to the negotiation and count on a fair resolution.

The people have more power than numbers,most are not willing to accept the risks to use it though.

[Kindred]

Even in the worst depths of our "great recession" there was still a vast shortage of skilled labor. The answer medium and long term does not lie in massive increases in welfare outlays and minimum wage hikes. Nor should one be so naive/ideologically devout to believe market forces on their own will ameliorate all socio-economic ills. The wage gap is going to continue to grow between the skilled and the unskilled. It is the inevitable consequence of the exponential advances in technology that began during the latter half of the 20th century. The genie is already out of the bottle. What our country needs to do is drop its ridiculous stigma against manual labor and train the unskilled portion of its workforce in marketable skills. Unfortunately, the federal gov't's record of training programs is absolutely dismal. More should be done at the state level, and/or the federal govt should look at subsidizing employers for taking on and training new workers for certain occupations/skills.

For those who lament the loss of union power in this country...try living in a country like Italy where unions basically run everything. I wasn't a diehard economic conservative until I lived overseas. Just a couple if times of being left stranded at a station in the middle of nowhere because someone decided to call a random strike, or dealing with the worst service of your life because the most rude insolent SOB knows he can't be touched, and you might change your mind.

 

 

Well perhaps the conservative stance shouldnt always be "Well if you dont like your low paying job, then quit and get a better one"

[skinsmarydu]

I get a little miffed when I hear agricultural workers spoken of as "unskilled".  (I know I can't pick a hundred tomatoes a minute without bruising any.)  That takes some serious manual dexterity, which is also known as a "skill", imho. 

[Kilmer17]

Well perhaps the conservative stance shouldnt always be "Well if you dont like your low paying job, then quit and get a better one"

 

Actually my stance is, if you dont like your low paying job, take the initiative and work hard to get a better one.  Go to school, learn a trade, dont just **** about your current state of affairs, do something about it.

[rictus58]

Actually my stance is, if you dont like your low paying job, take the initiative and work hard to get a better one.  Go to school, learn a trade, dont just **** about your current state of affairs, do something about it.

 

That's great in theory. But not at all possible when you don't make enough to even feed yourself.

And then the argument becomes, get a 2nd job. But then there's no time for school. Because you're working at the mercy of shift schedulers for 2 different jobs.

 

The Right seems to think that CEO's and their companies are successful in a vacuum. Don't give credit to the thousands of people on the front lines who make your company a success. No. It's all the CEO.

[twa]

That's great in theory. But not at all possible when you don't make enough to even feed yourself.

 

True, but asking yourself how you got to that point and how you can change it is a good place to start.

opportunity exists here, though I certainly think it can be expanded.

 

poor choices,bad luck or circumstances certainly have impacts

[Kilmer17]

That's great in theory. But not at all possible when you don't make enough to even feed yourself.

Again, I think that's an extreme example.  Im sure it's occuring, and those people certainly need a safety net.

 

I believe the overwhelming majority of workers at those companies are there because 1- its a part time gig or 2- they made poor choices earlier in their lives.

 

I dont believe the majority lack the ability to advance and better themselves, they lack the drive.

 

Nobody goes to work at McDs and thinks a year later "holy cow the pay here sucks"  They knew that up front.

[rictus58]

Again, I think that's an extreme example.  Im sure it's occuring, and those people certainly need a safety net.

 

I believe the overwhelming majority of workers at those companies are there because 1- its a part time gig or 2- they made poor choices earlier in their lives.

 

I dont believe the majority lack the ability to advance and better themselves, they lack the drive.

 

Nobody goes to work at McDs and thinks a year later "holy cow the pay here sucks"  They knew that up front.

That's just a way to justify paying people little. They knew it up front. Yes. They did. But they also knew they had to have income to live. They may have made serious mistakes in the past that led them to that point. But with the current status quo, there isn't much to help them get to a better point. Let's not pretend that these are typically people who, if given every opportunity to go to even Community college, would turn out to be world beaters. Most of them aren't. Even slightly better paying jobs, let us use a call center as an example, are even harder to get. Why? because CEOs would rather ship those jobs overseas to make stock holders happy...which increases their already huge compenation.

[Kilmer17]

I dont want to switch gears, but I do have related thought.

 

I know and accept as fact that income disparity is increasing (I dont think it's a bad thing fwiw).  My question is, how much has the lower brackets standard of living changed over the last 20-30 years? 

 

Is "barely scraping by" meaning completely different than decades ago? 

[The Evil Genius]

As an aside..I think this is where our secondary education system appears to fail compared to other countries.

 

Perhaps it's time to really look inward at our secondary education system and start sending some kids to trade/vocational schools vs college like a lot of other first world countries do.

 

It's no panacea for this..but it makes more sense and watching kids drop out of community college or fail to graduate high school and then spend a decade or two before learning any type of craft.

[Kilmer17]

As an aside..I think this is where our secondary education system appears to fail compared to other countries.

 

Perhaps it's time to really look inward at our secondary education system and start sending some kids to trade/vocational schools vs college like a lot of other first world countries do.

 

It's no panacea for this..but it makes more sense and watching kids drop out of community college or fail to graduate high school and then spend a decade or two before learning any type of craft.

One of my best friends in high school took 1/2 day at the vocational school in the county studying plumbing.  He endured good natured as well as venomous remarks.

 

Today, his plumbing business is amazing. 

 

We have a stigma that EVERYONE has to go to college.  And if we dont scam the systems to make that happen, then we're failing. 

 

I agree with you TEG.  It starts no only with education, but the realization and embrace that every kid doesnt need to sit in a philosophy 101 class to make it in the world.

[skinsmarydu]

who's table,chairs,building and cookies are they?

did the CEO provide the oven,ingredients,utilities,insurance ect that were used to make them?

 

 

what you bring to the table matters

No, the CEO brought nothing to the table.  The idea for the party wasn't even his. (Remember...he doesn't BAKE...he THINKS about it.)   He just gets the credit & the slap on the back in the form of a room full of hundred-dollar bills. 

[skinsmarydu]

poor choices,bad luck or circumstances certainly have impacts

Thanks for that. And if you don't think people lie awake at night thinking of how they could've made their lives better, you're extremely naïve. And that lack of sleep could contribute to why my order keeps getting screwed up.  

Again, I think that's an extreme example.  Im sure it's occuring, and those people certainly need a safety net.

Thanks for that, too. Now quit complaining.

*edit* Meant no disrespect to either poster. But stop contradicting yourselves.

This **** is extreme. The current economy is so unstable that what I've always had for sure is now in jeopardy...because I did manage to recover from the ****ty choices I made.

[dfitzo53]

I know we're starting down a different path here, but I couldn't resist, since people brought up college vs. trade school vs. other options.

 

Some of you know I'm a middle school teacher.

 

We once received booklets from The College Board promoting SATs and related practice materials.  Never mind that our students are at least two and generally three or more years away from taking their SATs and having serious conversations about college.

 

The back of the booklet had a series of "Myths" about college.  The first myth on the list was, "College is not for everyone."  The booklet went on to explain how college is the right choice for everyone and everyone can succeed in college.

 

There are powerful forces at work in all facets of this.

[chipwhich]

No, the CEO brought nothing to the table.  The idea for the party wasn't even his. (Remember...he doesn't BAKE...he THINKS about it.)   He just gets the credit & the slap on the back in the form of a room full of hundred-dollar bills. 

 

You are too focused on CEO of McDonalds.

CEO's create and run business and hire people to do what they create.

You are too focused on CEO of McDonalds.

CEO's create and run business daily and hire people to do what they create.

[Riggo-toni]

As an aside..I think this is where our secondary education system appears to fail compared to other countries.

Perhaps it's time to really look inward at our secondary education system and start sending some kids to trade/vocational schools vs college like a lot of other first world countries do.

This! This is essentially the point I was trying to make earlier in the thread - thank you for presenting it in a more lucid manner. Our society glorifies lawyers and doctors, and somehow stigmatizes engineers, mechanics,welders. Consequently we have litigation, bloated healthcare, and a shortage of skilled labor in manufacturing and other areas. Everything is set up to work in a 1950s environment when a college degree was a sure ticket to success, and high school graduates could still work assembly lines. In today's global economy people with only 3rd world skills will seldom earn 1st world wages, and we've squandered so much federal credit over the last 15 years I don't believe there is any sustainable model for massively subsidizing low wages, even if our politicians were ever to find the courage to cut off corporate welfare. Upward mobility for those born to poverty has been stymied by the pathetic state of inner city public schools coupled with the nearly absolute absence of a complementary system of training for those not headed for college.