The Official ES All Things Redskins Name Change Thread (Reboot Edition---Read New OP)

[grhqofb5]

I can't help but think that there's a tinge of "I dislike the Redskins for reasons other than their name," involved in the media that is driving this. We all know that Snyder is not the most popular figure in Washington or elsewhere, and we know that the franchise has had "issues" with the media since he took control of the team. I could have sworn that UnWise Mike was going to do a jig when Gregg Williams was taken down during the whole bounty scandal, like there was some real history there between them.

 

A lot of the guys in the media are former players, coaches, etc., and are probably close to someone who got hosed by Snyder over the years.  But I strongly suspect that the subset sportswriter fraternity dislikes Snyder (and the team, for that matter) enough that its members see this as an opportunity to make him look like an ass.  After all, he's been at war with his critics for years. Some of it may be subconscious, some of it not. There's nothing like a little payback, even if we all refuse to admit it. Certainly makes it easier.

[cphil006]

http://files.redskins.com/pdf/Letter-from-Dan-Snyder.pdf

 

This is an awesome open letter from Dan Snyder today...

[#98QBKiller]

 

For some laughs

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Was tempted to post this in the Stadium as a new thread but I didn't want to get tarred & feathered by the mods after all my years here 

http://files.redskins.com/pdf/Letter-from-Dan-Snyder.pdf

 

This is an awesome open letter from Dan Snyder today...

 

I got a text from Redskins.com about that earlier, great letter IMO.

[DC9]

The legend is that they were the Braves and wanted a little more synergy with the Boston baseball team (Red Sox) so they became the Redskins. If that decision was for marketing, I'd like to know factors that went into naming the team the Braves ("...we wanted to honor the bravery and proud heritage of Native American tribes..."). Since Braves and Redskins were obvious synonymous during that time, it would be apt.

 

The two I've heard:

 

1)  The Boston Tea Party bit about the colonists who dressed up like Indians and dumped the tea in the Basstin Haa-bah.  (Which I believe)

 

2)  The Boston Braves were also a baseball team, and football tickets didn't sell well back then, so if you had a "sucker" come up and ask for tickets to see the "Braves game" or the "Giants game" you gave him the football tickets and he was none the wiser until the day of the event.  (Which I also believe).

 

Eventually (like after one year) the Bostononians got pissed and said they needed to do something about it, so the name was changed to Redskins.  That may have a close resemblence to the Red Sox, but that's about it.  Not sure if it was done on purpose or what.

 

But if both of these are true, that is the coldest name in sports this side of the Vancouver Canucks.  I think Canucks is better only because it was a deragtory name used for Canadiens, and Vancouver is kind of giving the world an "**** you" by naming their hockey team after it and rallying around it.  But having a team named after the Boston Tea Party is right up there in it's awesomeness.

 

I think the "official story" has changed several times to appease the DMV fans and disconnect from the roots in Boston, though.

 

Just my take on the whole thing.  But this is what I tell my kids.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

Nice post, DC. I've heard a few different tales too which is why I think it would benefit the team to put out an official "origin story" of the name Redskins. Even if they combine a few stories and slightly re-write it a bit, it would be nice to have one thing from the organization to reference when these things come up.

 

If it refers to painted skin, Native American heritage, whatever doesn't really matter. They should have something that paints in a positive light the term and the original reasons for using it.

[Predicto]

 

For some laughs

 

 

 

 

 

ok, that was funny

[TK]

http://newsandletters.org/Announce/Stop%20Oneida%20Nation%20evictions.htm

Stop Oneida Nation evictions!

Oneida Nation Territory in Central New York (August 22, 2002)--My name is Danielle Schenandoah Patterson, I reside on the Onyota'a:ka Oneida Indian Territory all native community with my three small Oneida children. My children and I are Oneida citizens of the Six Nations Iroquois Confederacy in upstate New York. I am requesting for immediate supporters and legal observers to come to the Oneida Indian Territory. Although private home owners, residents of this long-standing community are facing eviction and the destruction of their houses at the order of the illegitimate government of Arthur Ray Halbritter. Halbritter's 'leadership' was imposed upon the Oneida people, against their will, by the BIA, the federal Department of the Interior's Bureau of Indian Affairs. He has since created a dictatorship and established the "Oneida Indian Nation of New York", an INCORPORATION disguised as a nation.

Halbritter wields power only though this federal recognition. The Iroquois Six Nations Confederacy (Oneida, Onondoga, Mohawk, Seneca, Tuscorora, Cayuga) has continously notified the BIA that Halbritter does not represent the Onieda people, as he does not follow elective nor traditional forms and there is NO PROCESS THROUGH WHICH THE PEOPLE CAN REMOVE HIM FROM THIS APPOINTED FEDERAL POSITION. A men's council government (unheard of amongst the Iroquois) was established by Halbritter, on his payroll to validate all his decisions. Halbritter created an all non-native Paramilitant squad (AKA ONEIDA NATION POLICE) under his direct command to harass, intimidate, physically abuse, and install fear in the people, forcing them to submit to the Halbitter regime. It has also been publicly exposed that "The Oneida Nation Bureau of Investigation Spy Network" exists to perform covert operations against natives and non-natives who do not go along with his plans.

In May 1995, a peaceful March for Democracy was held on Oneida homelands. The participants in the March were exercising their rights to choose their own leadership and government, opposing the federal imposition of Halbritter and BIA treaty violations. In retaliation, Halbritter took tribal membership away from over 200 Oneida participants, stripping them of their tribal benefits, including employment and education benefits, and right to participate in tribal affairs. He also closed down our food bank that serviced 280 native people. Halbritter then locked our longhouse (traditional religious building and center of the community) and banned all traditional activity and ceremonies. He threatened that any Onieda found entering any tribally owned buildings would be arrested.

None of the Halbritter establishments, newly built Nation court, casino, or government buildings are located on the Oneida Indigenous territory, and none of his paramilitants or administration officials reside on the Oneida Indian Territory. The Territory residents learned from the local media that the Halbritter administration had announced a "Beautification Project, 2001" where our homes would now be inspected, condemned, and demolished under the guise of health and safety. The territory families homes were destroyed although some of those homes were 1990 models or newer. In one year, eleven Iroquois families were evicted and their homes demolished against their will. The only option these homeless, displaced families were given was to pay rent to the Halbritter administration for homes outside of this community. The remaining residents rejected the Halbritter-sanctioned inspections because they only lead to eviction. The local media was present when this announcement was made by the territory residents.

I was called on the telephone yesterday by media and asked for a statement on the August 8th decision of an appeal of the eviction of my family and destruction of our home. Halbritter's tribal court ordered the demolition of my home to be executed by no later than September 15th, 2002. I was shocked as I was unaware of this decision. I immediately went to Halbritter's legal office to obtain my paperwork on this order. I was denied the demolition order, even though it's publicly accessible.

My three children's & my inherited birthrights of this country are being violated. Although my home meets and exceeds all New York State safety and housing codes, we are going to be made homeless with no financial means as we have to seek all future accomodations at our own expense. I have been a prisoner, unable to leave my home unattended in fear of when the demolition & eviction will occur. There is no justice in this tribal court since Halbritter has final decision over any and all appeals. Because I do not recognise this illegal dictatorship under Ray Halbritter, “whatever it takes” measures are being used against me and the remaining families to remove us from our inherited birthrights to live as Haudenosaunee free people upon our indigenous land.

I ask for anyone who opposes violators of civil, constitutional, religious, and human rights to please aid us in our stand to exercise our right to fight with the truth and save my home as well as the homes of the other remaining residents who all face the same fate. We are in need of financial assistance and legal observers to come to the Oneida Territory. Help us to record inhumane and cruel treatment and actions forced upon Indian people by the hired non-native paramilitants -right here in central New York.

Rules: NO WEAPONS, NO DRUGS, NO ALCOHOL We are maintaining our peaceful presence, our community rejects any violence to be used as the excuse for Halbritter to execute every last one of us here fighting for our rights.

All statements are true and have been documented by video, legal documents, audio, pictures, affidavits. We extend an open invitation for all to come and see the truth for yourselves.

Ny;Wah ~thanks to all who are willing to aid us as we face these illegal actions taken against an all traditional native community close to destruction.

Directions: Off New York State Thruway exit 33, make left onto Rt. 365 follow to end to Rt. 5, make right and at the intersection of Friendly's restaurant make left onto RT. 46 s, 3 1/2 miles make left at intersection of blinking light, check-in point is last home on the left side at end of road. Please bring tents, any and all recording devices, walkie- talkies, supplies, and food. At any given moment the paramillitants will be here to evict and demolish.

For more information:

http://www.Oneidasfordemocracy.org

http://www.Nativenewsonline.org found at Oneida Backgrounder

http://www.mytwobeadsworth.com

http://www.angelfire.com/indie/oneidas Oneida Action News

Contact or to send donations:

Onyota'a:ka Oneidas for Democracy, a non-profit organization

PO Box 450

Oneida, New York 13421

or send emergency housing & legal defense funding to:

Danielle Schenandoah Patterson

Box 48 Oneida Indian Territory

Oneida, New York 13421

email:

denschen@yahoo.com, lwolf7665@hotmail.com, Rain143@msn.com, OneidaIroquios@aol.com, deerskinz@aol.com, lizobom@juno.com

UPDATE FOLLOWS:

Friends,

The situation has gotten worse. Danielle's lawyers have advised her she has no legal ability to fight Halbritter's fascist regime. She and her children will be in great danger is she is arrested again. She needs as much support as possible:

Contact your elected representative and senators and demand they get involved in support of the traditional Oneida government.

Donations of food money and supplies are needed.

Getting information out to people groups and organizations is very important. Making as many people as possible aware of this is one of the highest priorities.

MOST IMPORTANTLY we need you to come to the Territory and stay here as long as you can (whether it's a couple hours or a couple weeks). The more people here, the less likely Halbritter will be to do something dangerous.

Also, those who are willing to be arrested are especially needed. The more people we have who are willing to stand up against this dictatorship with direct action, the more attention we can raise to Halbritter and the Federal Government's actions.

Danielle -along with her mother Masie (Oneida Wolf Clan Mother) and sister Diane (Oneida Faith Keeper)- has lead the opposition against Halbritter. Once her house is demolished, the remaining families can be removed with greater ease. And the Halbritter can build whatever he wants.

This is GENOCIDE we're dealing with here. It's the attempted eradication of native culture and the displacement of native people. It's the same thing that's been happening since 1492. As fellow human beings we can not allow this to happen. As US citizens we must stop our elected officials from allowing this. And as a united front of Natives and NonNatives, we will help preserve traditional Oneida culture, and stop genocide from occurring in Central New York.

When you come please bring materials in order to be self sufficient: Tents, sleeping bags, food, toiletries etc. Please also bring still and video cameras, and anything else you might consider useful. Come even if you lack some of these materials. While our resources are limited, we do have extra room in tents, etc. and need you here.

THERE ARE NO WEAPONS, DRUGS OR ALCOHOL ALLOWED HERE AT ALL!

Please come and stay as long as possible. Hope to see you soon.

--Schmeel.

[grhqofb5]

http://newsandletters.org/Announce/Stop%20Oneida%20Nation%20evictions.htm

Stop Oneida Nation evictions!

Oneida Nation Territory in Central New York (August 22, 2002)--My name is Danielle Schenandoah Patterson, I reside on the Onyota'a:ka Oneida Indian Territory all native community with my three small Oneida children. My children and I are Oneida citizens of the Six Nations Iroquois Confederacy in upstate New York. I am requesting for immediate supporters and legal observers to come to the Oneida Indian Territory.

For more information:

http://www.Oneidasfordemocracy.org

http://www.Nativenewsonline.org found at Oneida Backgrounder

http://www.mytwobeadsworth.com

http://www.angelfire.com/indie/oneidas Oneida Action News

Contact or to send donations:

Onyota'a:ka Oneidas for Democracy, a non-profit organization

PO Box 450

Oneida, New York 13421

or send emergency housing & legal defense funding to:

Danielle Schenandoah Patterson

Box 48 Oneida Indian Territory

Oneida, New York 13421

email:

denschen@yahoo.com, lwolf7665@hotmail.com, Rain143@msn.com, OneidaIroquios@aol.com, deerskinz@aol.com, lizobom@juno.com

UPDATE FOLLOWS:

Friends,

The situation has gotten worse. Danielle's lawyers have advised her she has no legal ability to fight Halbritter's fascist regime. She and her children will be in great danger is she is arrested again. She needs as much support as possible:

Contact your elected representative and senators and demand they get involved in support of the traditional Oneida government.

Donations of food money and supplies are needed.

 

 

FYI, I would be very cautious when donating to any non-profit charity that purports to serve the interest of native americans without thoroughly vetting the organization and its use of revenues.  These groups are notorious for using this subject matter to extract money from good intentioned people, and ultimately funneling very little to the actual native American population they claim to represent. 

[Big Weirdo]

 

For some laughs

 

 

 

 

The Onion is so ****ing perfect sometimes.

[Spearfeather]

The woman in the letter above is the same woman from the story a couple of pages back, that I posted following TK's post.

 

That was 11 years ago. here's a story from a couple of years later.

 

In November 2001, one of the remaining Oneidas, Danielle Schenandoah Patterson, a single mother of three, tried to refuse entry to the armed inspectors who came to her trailer. Tribal police arrested her, reportedly for second-degree criminal contempt and resisting arrest. In October 2002, Halbritter's agents flew Schenandoah Patterson in a casino-owned jet to a Cambria, Pennsylvania prison for failing to show up for tribal court. Five days later she was back in Central New York, free on a plea bargain, in time to watch as bulldozers demolished her trailer.

 

 

http://newstandardnews.net/content/index.cfm/items/866

[elkabong82]

The two I've heard:

 

2)  The Boston Braves were also a baseball team, and football tickets didn't sell well back then, so if you had a "sucker" come up and ask for tickets to see the "Braves game" or the "Giants game" you gave him the football tickets and he was none the wiser until the day of the event.  (Which I also believe).

 

Eventually (like after one year) the Bostononians got pissed and said they needed to do something about it, so the name was changed to Redskins.  That may have a close resemblence to the Red Sox, but that's about it.  Not sure if it was done on purpose or what.

 

But if both of these are true, that is the coldest name in sports this side of the Vancouver Canucks. 

 

I think the "official story" has changed several times to appease the DMV fans and disconnect from the roots in Boston, though.

 

Just my take on the whole thing.  But this is what I tell my kids.

 

I've researched it before as part of our team's origin plays a significant role in why the NFL was able to maintain operations during the Great Depression and WWII, which was my college thesis.

 

Consolidation to large cities and using baseball parks helped popularity and helped curb costs, plus baseball teams appreciated the rent. Teams were able to maintain operations through the large cities and the league became consistent with teams instead of having ones fold and new ones op up constantly. Commissioner Carr was a big part of the constriction to 12 teams so the NFL could survive, and 10 of those teams, including us, are still around today.

 

We started as the Boston Braves because we shared the same stadium as the Boston Braves baseball team. Various football teams named themselves after baseball teams that they shared stadiums with, baseball being the #1 sport at the time. The goal was to save money by renting a field already used by a Pro team and to also get more fans not by duping people, but by attaching themselves to the city and the popular baseball team. This is where the NY Giants came from. 

 

Marshall had a dispute over rent costs with the Braves baseball team, so he moved the team to Fenway Park with the Redsox. In fact, we shared Griffith Stadium with the Senators when we moved to Washington. We also hired Dietz as HC very shortly after the move. Marshall wanted to keep the Native American theme to be loyal to the team fanbase (he made lots of innovations to make the game entertaining for the fans) and so Dietz could recruit Native American players easier (theory was he wanted to find the next Jim Thorpe). So the team became the Boston Redskins. That's it. That is why we have the name, from a simple desire to keep a Native American theme but also have a name similar to Redsox. 

[44aDieselGirl]

Thank you Dan, for your letter!!

[Commander PK]

so let me get this straight.  

 

It's ok to tell Native Americans how they should feel, as long as they are feeling the same way that you are?  

[Woofer]

In 17th century New England, the derogatory term John Cheese was often used by the English colonists to describe Dutch settlers, who were popular for their cheese production. The Dutch translation for John Cheese would be Jan Kaas; with the "J" being pronounced as "Y". 

 

Another version of the story reverses the use: the Dutch used "Jan Kaas" (pronounced "Yan Kees") which meant John Cheese or "Cheese Head" to insult the conquering British.

 

This derogatory term evolved into our modern word "Yankee".

 

Either way, we have a word which started life as an insult and slur.  Now it is a source of pride, proudly used by many Americans to describe themselves.  

 

Even before the American Revolution, British soldiers used the term Yankee to mock American soldiers. It was combined with the word “Doodle”, which was a derogatory term that meant “fool” or “simpleton,” to create the song Yankee Doodle which today ironically is a symbol of American pride.

 

So let's start a campaign to rename the New York baseball team.  That would be equality at its finest.

[TheGoodBits]

Yankee doesn't contain the word "skin," which is taboo and universally causes people with no clue about the origin or past usage of the word to assume that it is derogatory.

[Commander PK]

I can't help but think that there's a tinge of "I dislike the Redskins for reasons other than their name," involved in the media that is driving this. We all know that Snyder is not the most popular figure in Washington or elsewhere, and we know that the franchise has had "issues" with the media since he took control of the team. I could have sworn that UnWise Mike was going to do a jig when Gregg Williams was taken down during the whole bounty scandal, like there was some real history there between them.

 

A lot of the guys in the media are former players, coaches, etc., and are probably close to someone who got hosed by Snyder over the years.  But I strongly suspect that the subset sportswriter fraternity dislikes Snyder (and the team, for that matter) enough that its members see this as an opportunity to make him look like an ass.  After all, he's been at war with his critics for years. Some of it may be subconscious, some of it not. There's nothing like a little payback, even if we all refuse to admit it. Certainly makes it easier.

 

I think you hit the nail on the head.  People seem to hate this franchise, their owner, and their fans with a passion.  

 

It has nothing to do with standing up for the "honor" of Native Americans, and EVERYTHING to do with their hate for other reasons.  I know this because I have seen it on Facebook.  Nothing would make many non-fans happier than to see a situation where our devoted fan base was forced (at least officially anyway) to have to root for a team that could no longer be called the Redskins.

[44aDieselGirl]

so let me get this straight.  

 

It's ok to tell Native Americans how they should feel, as long as they are feeling the same way that you are?  

  I am not sure to whom you are commenting. Do you mean Snyder's letter was directed to Native Americans to tell them how they should feel about the "Washington Redskins"? I didn't get that from what I read. He gave his opinion on the subject and let everyone know he is 'listening' to all sides.  

[Commander PK]

  I am not sure to whom you are commenting. Do you mean Snyder's letter was directed to Native Americans to tell them how they should feel about the "Washington Redskins"? I didn't get that from what I read. He gave his opinion on the subject and let everyone know he is 'listening' to all sides.  

No, sorry for not being clear.  What I meant was that as long as somebody finds a Native that agrees with many in the media that the name is offensive, it's ok.  If you find polls and evidence to the contrary, that's not ok.  I'm referring to the media reaction at large to Snyder's letter.

[grego]

I think you hit the nail on the head.  People seem to hate this franchise, their owner, and their fans with a passion.  

 

It has nothing to do with standing up for the "honor" of Native Americans, and EVERYTHING to do with their hate for other reasons.  I know this because I have seen it on Facebook.  Nothing would make many non-fans happier than to see a situation where our devoted fan base was forced (at least officially anyway) to have to root for a team that could no longer be called the Redskins.

 

 

this is very true. 

 

i heard john feinstien on the radio a month or two ago. one of the hosts started to defend the redskins name, of which hes an opponent, do you know how he responded?

 

he said 'why would you defend dan snyder'??? (hes on record as hating snyder)

 

seriously. the redskins name debate, one question and about 5 seconds into it, became about dan snyder, not the name. 

 

dan snyder and the redskins are not sympathetic figures. every blogger has an axe to grind and links that need clicking. 

 

deposed native american casino bosses who long ago sold their people out to the US government- and now claim to speak for them againt their wishes- have an axe to grind. 

 

 

are we getting what this is about? or, no?

[War Paint]

Wow.  Cowboyszone now uses an * in the name Redskins, so when you type Redskins, the filter treats it like a bad word lol.  It's now Redsk*ns over there.  How effing pathetic.  Shame on you Cowboyszone.  Even some of their posters are calling out the mods. Ridiculous.

 

http://cowboyszone.com/forums/fan-zone.59/

[Buck812]

Just heard Snyder agreed to change the name to the Marryland Redskins 

[Bang]

Shame on CowboysZone.

 

that's a let-down.

 

~Bang

[Spearfeather]

Wow.  Cowboyszone now uses an * in the name Redskins, so when you type Redskins, the filter treats it like a bad word lol.  It's now Redsk*ns over there.  How effing pathetic.  Shame on you Cowboyszone.  Even some of their posters are calling out the mods. Ridiculous.

 

http://cowboyszone.com/forums/fan-zone.59/

 

Wonder what they would think of us using Cow***s.  You know that word is offensive.

[Springfield]

Got the Snyder letter in an email today.

Good for him. Say what you will about him (and I've probably said it too) but he believes in the team, the tradition and the honor that it is to be a Washington Redskin. He won't bend over and let the media pressure him into doing something that would detract from the legacy that is the Redskins.

Kudos to the man, if only for this.

[44aDieselGirl]

No, sorry for not being clear.  What I meant was that as long as somebody finds a Native that agrees with many in the media that the name is offensive, it's ok.  If you find polls and evidence to the contrary, that's not ok.  I'm referring to the media reaction at large to Snyder's letter.

Nah....my error. My sarcasm meter must be broken.