The Evil Genius Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 Why the heck is that word (the n-word) not censored here? Seems odd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 The problem is its acceptance is trying to be changed by a very small portion of NAs and some rich politicians that clearly don't have anything better to do with their time. There is nothing wrong with our name. Who are plenty of others? Some members of the 1%, a few NA tribes and a bunch of knuckle head followers who believe what they are told? The vast majority of people couldn't care less about the name. Native Americans and organizations opposed[edit]The following groups have passed resolutions or issued statements regarding their opposition to the name of the Washington NFL team: Tribes[edit]Affiliated Tribes of Northwest Indians[155] Cherokee Nation of Oklahoma[155] Comanche Nation of Oklahoma[155] The Confederated Tribes of the Colville Reservation (Washington)[155] Grand Traverse Band of Ottawa and Chippewa Indians (Michigan) Hoh Indian Tribe[156] Inter Tribal Council of Arizona[157] Inter-Tribal Council of the Five Civilized Tribes[158] Juaneño Band of Mission Indians (California)[155] Little River Band of Ottawa Indians (Michigan) Match-E-Be-Nash-She-Wish Band of Pottawatomi Indians, Gun Lake Tribe (Michigan)[159] Menominee Tribe of Indians (Wisconsin)[155] Oneida Indian Nation (New York)[160] Oneida Tribe of Indians of Wisconsin[155] Navajo Nation Council[98] Penobscot Nation[161] Poarch Band of Creek Indians[162] Samish Indian Nation (Washington)[163] Sault Ste. Marie Tribe of Chippewa Indians (Michigan)[164] Shoshone-Bannock Tribes (Idaho)[165] Standing Rock Sioux Tribe (North Dakota) The Three Affiliated Tribes of the Fort Berthold Indian Reservation (North Dakota)[166] United South and Eastern Tribes (USET)[167] Organizations[edit]Advocates for American Indian Children (California) American Indian Mental Health Association (Minnesota) American Indian Movement[168] American Indian Opportunities Industrialization Center of San Bernardino County American Indian Student Services at the Ohio State University American Indian High Education Consortium American Indian College Fund Americans for Indian Opportunity Association on American Indian Affairs Buncombe County Native American Inter-tribal Association (North Carolina) Capitol Area Indian Resources (Sacramento, CA) Concerned American Indian Parents (Minnesota) Council for Indigenous North Americans (University of Southern Maine) Eagle and Condor Indigenous Peoples’ Alliance First Peoples Worldwide Fontana Native American Indian Center, Inc. (California) Governor’s Interstate Indian Council Greater Tulsa Area Indian Affairs Commission Great Lakes Inter-Tribal Council (Wisconsin) HONOR – Honor Our Neighbors Origins and Rights Kansas Association for Native American Education Maryland Commission on Indian Affairs Medicine Wheel Inter-tribal Association (Louisiana) Minnesota Indian Education Association National Congress of American Indians (NCAI) National Indian Child Welfare Association National Indian Education Association National Indian Youth Council National Native American Law Student Association Native American Caucus of the California Democratic Party Native American Finance Officers Association (NAFOA)[169] Native American Journalists Association[170] Native American Indian Center of Central Ohio Native American Journalists Association Native American Rights Fund (NARF) Native Voice Network Nebraska Commission on Indian Affairs Nottawaseppi Huron Band of Potawatomi (Michigan) North Carolina Commission of Indian Affairs North Dakota Indian Education Association Office of Native American Ministry, Diocese of Grand Rapids (Michigan) Ohio Center for Native American Affairs San Bernardino/Riverside Counties Native American Community Council Seminole Nation of Oklahoma Society of Indian Psychologists of the Americas Southern California Indian Center St. Cloud State University – American Indian Center Tennessee Chapter of the National Coalition for the Preservation of Indigenous Cultures Tennessee Commission of Indian Affairs Tennessee Native Veterans Society Tulsa Indian Coalition Against Racism[171] The Confederated Tribes of the Colville Reservation Unified Coalition for American Indian Concerns, Virginia The United Indian Nations of Oklahoma Virginia American Indian Cultural Resource Center Wisconsin Indian Education Association WIEA “Indian” Mascot and Logo Taskforce (Wisconsin) Woodland Indian Community Center-Lansing (Michigan) Youth “Indian” Mascot and Logo Task force (Wisconsin) It's as obvious as the nose on your face, bro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DM72 Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 I said this a while back. Do you really want this issue to tarnish a SuperBowl run? For two weeks straight we'd hear of boycotts among other things. Talk of sponsors pulling SuperBowl ads. It's not a matter of if any of this will happen. It WILL happen. What Dan Snyder needs to do is sit down with Native American leaders to ask them what's acceptable. Ask why Braves, Blackhawks and Indians are acceptable and why Redskins is not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilMonkeyBoy Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 Man when I intentionally Godwinned the thread yesterday I thought that would be as outrageous as the argument could get. Now we have posters trying to defend or justify Sambo/Pickaninny imagery? Bravo, ES. Bravo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RFKFedEx Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 Why not just retire the Native theme and move on to building a winner? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 Individuals[edit] These prominent Native Americans have put their opposition to the Redskins' name on the public record: Sherman Alexie (author, Spokane)[172] Notah Begay (Navajo, PGA pro golfer) called the Redskins' name "a very clear example of institutionalized degradation of an ethnic minority."[173] Clyde Bellecourt (Ojibwe, co-founder of the American Indian Movement)[174] Bob Burns (Blackfeet elder)[175] Vine Deloria, Jr. (Sioux, historian/author)[176] Ben Nighthorse Campbell (Northern Cheyenne, U.S. Senator)[177] Kevin Gover (Pawnee, director of The Smithsonian Institution's National Museum of the American Indian)[178] Suzan Shown Harjo (Cheyenne/Hodulgee Muscogee, author/activist)[179] Litefoot (Cherokee/Chichimeca, rapper) ironically celebrates Native American team names as "recreational genocide" on the track 'Stereotipik'.[180] Russell Means (Oglala Lakota, activist/actor)[181] Billy Mills (Sioux, Olympic gold medal winner)[182] Ted Nolan (First Nations Ojibway, NHL player and coach)[183] Buford Rolin (Creek tribal chairman)[184] Shoni Schimmel (Umatilla, Louisville Cardinals guard, class of 2015)[185] Charlene Teters (Spokane, artist/lecturer)[186] W. Richard West Jr. (Cheyenne) - President of the Autry National Center in Los Angeles: Redskin is "an openly derogatory term. It always is and it always has been.” West also characterizes the Original American's Foundation as an "attempt to divert attention from the fact that his team’s nickname is coming under increasing heat from people who think it’s an offensive racial term."[187] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Paint Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 Native Americans and organizations opposed[edit] The following groups have passed resolutions or issued statements regarding their opposition to the name of the Washington NFL team: Tribes[edit]Affiliated Tribes of Northwest Indians[155] Cherokee Nation of Oklahoma[155] Comanche Nation of Oklahoma[155] The Confederated Tribes of the Colville Reservation (Washington)[155] Grand Traverse Band of Ottawa and Chippewa Indians (Michigan) Hoh Indian Tribe[156] Navajo Nation Council[98] Penobscot Nation[161] Poarch Band of Creek Indians[162] Samish Indian Nation (Washington)[163] Sault Ste. Marie Tribe of Chippewa Indians (Michigan)[164] Shoshone-Bannock Tribes (Idaho)[165] Standing Rock Sioux Tribe (North Dakota) The Three Affiliated Tribes of the Fort Berthold Indian Reservation (North Dakota)[166] United South and Eastern Tribes (USET)[167] Organizations[edit]Advocates for American Indian Children (California) American Indian Mental Health Association (Minnesota) American Indian Movement[168] American Indian Opportunities Industrialization Center of San Bernardino County American Indian Student Services at the Ohio State University American Indian High Education Consortium American Indian College Fund Americans for Indian Opportunity Association on American Indian Affairs Buncombe County Native American Inter-tribal Association (North Carolina) Capitol Area Indian Resources (Sacramento, CA) Concerned American Indian Parents (Minnesota) Council for Indigenous North Americans (University of Southern Maine) Eagle and Condor Indigenous Peoples’ Alliance First Peoples Worldwide Fontana Native American Indian Center, Inc. (California) Governor’s Interstate Indian Council Greater Tulsa Area Indian Affairs Commission Great Lakes Inter-Tribal Council (Wisconsin) HONOR – Honor Our Neighbors Origins and Rights Kansas Association for Native American Education Maryland Commission on Indian Affairs Medicine Wheel Inter-tribal Association (Louisiana) National Native American Law Student Association Native American Caucus of the California Democratic Party Native American Finance Officers Association (NAFOA)[169] Native American Journalists Association[170] Native American Indian Center of Central Ohio Native American Journalists Association Native American Rights Fund (NARF) Native Voice Network Nebraska Commission on Indian Affairs Nottawaseppi Huron Band of Potawatomi (Michigan) North Carolina Commission of Indian Affairs North Dakota Indian Education Association Office of Native American Ministry, Diocese of Grand Rapids (Michigan) Ohio Center for Native American Affairs San Bernardino/Riverside Counties Native American Community Council Seminole Nation of Oklahoma Society of Indian Psychologists of the Americas Southern California Indian Center St. Cloud State University – American Indian Center Tennessee Chapter of the National Coalition for the Preservation of Indigenous Cultures Tennessee Commission of Indian Affairs Tennessee Native Veterans Society It's as obvious as the nose on your face, bro. These organizations probably represent all NAs like Boehner, Pelosi, etc.....represent me. Why not just retire the Native theme and move on to building a winner? Why not keep our NA theme and build a winner? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont Taze Me Bro Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 LKB posted this link to a 1972 letter from then-owner Edward Bennett Williams to Pete Rozelle, relating that a group of Native American leaders had contacted him about changing the name: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-sports-bog/wp/2014/06/18/edward-bennett-williamss-1972-letter-to-pete-rozelle-about-the-redskins-name So regardless of what side you come down on in debating this issue, let's get rid of the notion that this has only cropped up recently. Thanks for linking that Dan, I didn't see that post. I had known about the name controversy being around the past 15 years or so, never knew they tried to take action back in the 70s. Again, my reply was to the one poster who said eventually the Seminoles would no longer do the spear ceremony and the Braves tomahawk chops, etc. would be eventually gone in the future. My response to him was that it wouldn't surprise me because everyone is more sensitive today and there is always someone offended by something. To reiterate, I said this is my view looking at the big picture (not just this one issue). "Everything in this world offends someone in today's society (again, some justified, some not - this is big picture, not just the team name debate). Everyone can't be happy, so where do we draw the line? Or can a line be drawn? What do we do about it? " Again, thanks for linking that article. But the same questions are left unanswered. To me this is one of those rulings that could change a lot more than just a team name. What happens when the flood gates are opened? Maybe I'm overreacting or over thinking things, I have a tendency to do that at times, I will admit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveakl Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 You realize some of those groups have like 4 members total (not saying they all do but research some of them) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 These organizations probably represent all NAs like Boehner, Pelosi, etc.....represent me. Why not keep our NA theme and build a winner? Bringing up Boehner and Pelosi does not help your argument and makes you look kinda silly, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 I found an example - I saw a few others and am trying to find them. The Daily Republican newspaper in Winona, Minnesota from Sept. 24, 1863 It doesn't say that 'red skin' refers to the "bloody scalps", though, as is being mentioned ad nauseam. It uses "red-skin" as another name for Indian, which everyone agrees to. It also uses the word "Indian" on that document but that word is not being seen as a racial slur and no claims are being made that the word "Indian" is rooted in this act. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DM72 Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 Bringing up Boehner and Pelosi does not help your argument and make you look rather foolish, IMO. These guys are reaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilMonkeyBoy Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 These organizations probably represent all NAs like Boehner, Pelosi, etc.....represent me.So the "but those aren't REAL AMERICANS" of the early 2000s has now morphed into "yeah those aren't REAL NATIVE AMERICANS." for this issue?You're on a roll dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont Taze Me Bro Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 1. This is a silly overstatement. 2. A society is not stagnant. Yes, the battles of today may seem to be of smaller stakes than the battles of the 1770s or 1780s or 1850s or 1890 or 1910s or 1930s or 1950s or 1960s, but I like to believe that's beacuse the arc of the universe does, in fact, bend towards justice. But, regardless, that line is always moving. Standing on it yelling "Stop" is rarely a position that wins. I get where you are coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 You realize some of those groups have like 4 members total (not saying they all do but research some of them) The Cherokee Nation of Oklaholma..the second group on the list…has 189,000 members. How many more do I need to research to obliterate your point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 I have seen this in a lot of posts (often in conjunction with a bounty for scalps that refers to NAs as "Indians" and contains no reference to "redskins". I would argue that the terms "Indian" and "red-skin" are used interchangeably in this example, and that the racism is in the policy described, not the name used. Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Paint Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 Bringing up Boehner and Pelosi does not help your argument and makes you look kinda silly, IMO. mboyd, maybe I could take you more seriously if you didn't use double standards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 I would be incredibly surprised if going into the 2021 season the team is still named the Washington Redskins I would be incredibly surprised if going into the 2099 season the team is NOT named the Washington Redskins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Paint Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 So the "but those aren't REAL AMERICANS" of the early 2000s has now morphed into "yeah those aren't REAL NATIVE AMERICANS." for this issue? You're on a roll dude. EvilMonkeyBoy, how in the hell can anyone here take you seriously after saying the use of "hail" in our fight song is like Nazis? Then you go on today and say people are defending Smokin' Sambo when I didn't see one post that did. Liberals are effing idiots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo#44 Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 Ok, now this is a serious issue--the 1st of the sponsors to take issue: http://www.trilliuminvest.com/news-articles-category/thinking-capital/shareholders-say-washington-dc-nfl-team-name-presents-heightened-reputational-risks-to-stadium-sponsor-fedex/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 If you change the name you CAN NOT stick with any native American themes or imagery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corcaigh Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 Nobody is arguing about what SHOULD be offensive, or should not. But rather about what IS offensive. Show me someone that is Irish and is (seriously) claiming to be offended , Here's one. As someone who regularly experienced anti-Irish hostility from the British in the 70s and 80s I am amazed that Notre Dame adopted a mascot that looks like this. But an example of a white caricature has absolutely no bearing on whether the Washington team's name is now considered offensive by a sufficient number of people to warrant a name change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 mboyd, maybe I could take you more seriously if you didn't use double standards. I do not wish to be taken seriously by you. No double standard right there, bro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DM72 Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 Ok, now this is a serious issue--the 1st of the sponsors to take issue: http://www.trilliuminvest.com/news-articles-category/thinking-capital/shareholders-say-washington-dc-nfl-team-name-presents-heightened-reputational-risks-to-stadium-sponsor-fedex/ The name is gonna change whether these guys like it or not. This issue IS NOT going away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Paint Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 I do not wish to be taken seriously by you. No double standard right there, bro. You are applying a double standard. Seriously, explain to me how the Cleveland Indian logo is offensive, yet the Leprechaun isn't? Is it because Irish people are white? That my friend is a double standard. You and Lombardi made the stretch to compare the Indian logo to Sambo. That, is being silly. Good thing though. Your wish is granted because I don't take you seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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