The Mess going on at Penn state Thread

[88Comrade2000]

Joe Pa should be fired immediately. He should've went to the Police but he didn't. He should kept at it until the man paid for it. Time to go Joe. Penn St: Pedophile U!

[ixcuincle]

Joe Pa should be fired immediately. He should've went to the Police but he didn't. He should kept at it until the man paid for it. Time to go Joe. Penn St: Pedophile U!

No one argues that he shouldn't have

In fact I think he should have done more

But firing him seems like a reach as I said. Go after the AD and the offender. He reported it to his bosses.

[88Comrade2000]

No one argues that he shouldn't have

In fact I think he should have done more

But firing him seems like a reach as I said. Go after the AD and the offender. He reported it to his bosses.

you hear something like that; you go to the police. People like that need to be locked up.

Joe Pa's time is up and he needs to go also. He is part of the coverup.

[mjah]

Also, to be serious for a sec, what happened was deplorable, and Joe Pa should have done more other than report the incident and move on, but should he really be fired?

Yes. He should be.

Again, what happened is unforgivable and sick. But isn't it a reach to fire him?

Given his unforgivably bad judgment in critical situations, it's a reach to consider keeping him around.

[ixcuincle]

Yes. He should be.

Given his unforgivably bad judgment in critical situations, it's a reach to consider keeping him around.

Was watching news report and he was called a "Man of Ethics"

Just like the former Jim Tressel, the "Senator", a "good guy"

If what is alleged is true and Joe Pa didn't tell the cops, he's just like Tressel

Lot of these coaches who are "ethical" or "good people" just end up being scum

[SWFLSkins]

No one argues that he shouldn't have

In fact I think he should have done more

But firing him seems like a reach as I said. Go after the AD and the offender. He reported it to his bosses.

I mean this is children your talking about. Well I told my boss about it. BS, would you just go to your boss if a felony is being committed? I wouldn't, I would call 911, right then, and in this case if I actually saw someone in a shower with a child, lord forgive me.

________________________________________________

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice/2011/1107/Did-Penn-State-officials-ignore-sexual-abuse-allegations

For example, in 2002, in one of the most graphic of the charges, a graduate student allegedly saw Sandusky having sex with a young boy. He reported the event to Mr. Paterno who then passed the information on to Tim Curley, the athletic director. Mr. Curley informed Gary Schultz, a senior vice president at the university who had responsibility for the campus police.

It wasn't until two weeks later that Curley and Mr. Schultz spoke with the graduate student about the claims. Only then did they go to the president of the university, Graham Spanier, and tell him it was an incident involving horseplay, according to the indictment.

“They kind of bent things, said it was not sexual assault but horseplay,” says Mr. Keneally after reading the indictment. “So, the president of the university is being told by Mr. Curley and Mr. Schultz that it is horseplay and he is being led to believe nothing else is necessary.”

Mr. Noonan of the state police says he has never seen anything like that before. “I don’t think I have ever been associated with a case where that kind of eyewitness identification of sex acts where the police were not called,” he said.

Both Curley and Schultz were indicted by the grand jury for perjury after testifying that they were not told by the graduate student about the sexual assault.

According to the grand jury report, the alleged assault should have been reported to the police or Pennsylvania Department of Welfare. A failure to do so is a violation of the law.

[Special K]

Jeezo whizzo. Just glanced through the Grand Jury's report. This is absolutely sickening. My heart goes out to these poor boys

Clearly, everyone involved should be fired and charged. Paterno should be ashamed of himself for not following up on this as far as I'm concerned.

[Elessar78]

I heard that Gov. Tom Corbett is driving down to State College tomorrow to meet with the Board of Trustees. I heard he has the authority to fire Univ. Graham Spanier and Paterno. Additionally, when he was Attorney General of Allegheny County his major "focus" of enforcement was, you guessed it, child predators. I think, haven't confirmed it, but as State Attorney General the Sandusky investigations were under his purview<---I need to double check that this last one is factual.

[DC9]

Agreed, but is Joe responsible for who comes and goes on the campus? I think the AD would be more responsible and negligent for who comes and goes on campus. I'm not trying to absolve Joe of everthing, but everyone is calling for his head. I think that might be an overreaction at this point.

LKB said it, he runs that school. If he wanted something, he got it.... which is what truly scares me as we see this cover up unfold. It's sad because Joe is not a bad dude, obviously, but this is looking very bad for him and this school.

[SWFLSkins]

I heard that Gov. Tom Corbett is driving down to State College tomorrow to meet with the Board of Trustees. I heard he has the authority to fire Univ. Graham Spanier and Paterno. Additionally, when he was Attorney General of Allegheny County his major "focus" of enforcement was, you guessed it, child predators. I think, haven't confirmed it, but as State Attorney General the Sandusky investigations were under his purview<---I need to double check that this last one is factual.

Wow, he is going to fire someone I bet. He is not going down there to just have a meeting, IMO. Can't imagine him not putting them threw the wringer and then requesting all parties with knowledge be removed. Joe Pa should have reported this immediately to police, this is not something he should have handed off. Even if the accusations were baseless reporting it gets it off your hands and shows no impropriety oh his part. I bet this gets ugly.

According to the grand jury report, the alleged assault should have been reported to the police or Pennsylvania Department of Welfare. A failure to do so is a violation of the law.

[Elessar78]

The part in red is inaccurate. What the grand jury report says that the assault should have been reported to either University Park Police or the PA State Police.

---------- Post added November-7th-2011 at 07:28 PM ----------

LKB said it, he runs that school. If he wanted something, he got it.... which is what truly scares me as we see this cover up unfold. It's sad because Joe is not a bad dude, obviously, but this is looking very bad for him and this school.

I think the perception that Joe was this all powerful being at the university is blown a bit out of proportion by people who have not spent time State College/University Park. Joe exists in service to the university. He has never wielded a sense of entitlement about what the university owes him. The dude gave money to modernize the library. He has a paltry salary for a head coach, so his assistants can have bigger salaries. Heck, when he was in his 70s I'd see him regularly walking down the street to his $13 barber shop.

The man doesn't "run" the school like some shadowy power-broker.

[twa]

Not going to the police or following up was enabling the ****

[Slacky McSlackAss]

So I've kept pretty quiet about this whole thing today, and thought about the situation a lot. I can no longer defend JoePa in this situation, it's just not possible. It's heartbreaking to see the man who I looked up to and idolized, who did so much for the school I love and the surrounding area, who built a legacy and put PSU on the map, and now he is a farce and a fraud. It's extremely tough for me to deal with, and I really hope that the Board of Trustees cleans house completely. I'm deeply disturbed and saddened by the events that perspired and I harbor complete hatred towards Jerry Sandusky, Tim Curley, Gary Schultz, and President Spanier. Their actions have sullied the great name that is Penn State University and brought shame upon every alum and fan in the world.

---------- Post added November-7th-2011 at 08:00 PM ----------

]According to the grand jury report, the alleged assault should have been reported to the police or Pennsylvania Department of Welfare. A failure to do so is a violation of the law.

He went to Gary Schultz, whose responsibilities at the time included being head of the university police department.

[DC9]

The part in red is inaccurate. What the grand jury report says that the assault should have been reported to either University Park Police or the PA State Police.

---------- Post added November-7th-2011 at 07:28 PM ----------

I think the perception that Joe was this all powerful being at the university is blown a bit out of proportion by people who have not spent time State College/University Park. Joe exists in service to the university. He has never wielded a sense of entitlement about what the university owes him. The dude gave money to modernize the library. He has a paltry salary for a head coach, so his assistants can have bigger salaries. Heck, when he was in his 70s I'd see him regularly walking down the street to his $13 barber shop.

The man doesn't "run" the school like some shadowy power-broker.

A lot of good that would've done (reporting it to the College Police). They seemed to handle the 1998 investigation with high marks.

Now, I am not saying he was like an entitled Godfather figure, but there are a lot of questions that haven't been answered here. I think that it's obvious the guy new about it, and it's obvious he did nothing about it. It's obvious someone there (probably one of the two, if not both of the officials in trouble right now) and he bought into it one way or the other.

This was all done in defense of him. Let's see what other details come out.

Like I said, I don't think he was a czar, but he probably has more power than most would think if not just to keep him on. I mean, let's be honest, they've tricked this guy into thinking he was coaching the team the last 5 years (at least) just to keep recruits coming.

[ixcuincle]

Joe Pa holding a teleconference tomorrow. However he won't address the allegations or the scandal.

Is this a good idea for him to keep low or not?

Should at least open up, make some comments. I ain't done nothing, et cetera.

[Busch1724]

Joe Pa holding a teleconference tomorrow. However he won't address the allegations or the scandal.

Is this a good idea for him to keep low or not?

Should at least open up, make some comments. I ain't done nothing, et cetera.

Well he probably can't legally open up since this is all ongoing. He'll refer to the statement that was released earlier. There will be a time and place to talk, but it won't be until later in the process.

[DC9]

Well he probably can't legally open up since this is all ongoing. He'll refer to the statement that was released earlier. There will be a time and place to talk, but it won't be until later in the process.

Yeah there is no way JoePa should say anything. There's no way he doesn't have a lawyer present waiting to cite the 5th ammendment.

---------- Post added November-7th-2011 at 08:38 PM ----------

The part in red is inaccurate. What the grand jury report says that the assault should have been reported to either University Park Police or the PA State Police.

And I could be wrong, but I don't think it says this. I think that it says "that it wasn't even reported to these guys." I think it says that the state statute requires an oral and/or written report is required within 48 hours. You might be right, though.

[Bostic Hog]

So I've kept pretty quiet about this whole thing today, and thought about the situation a lot. I can no longer defend JoePa in this situation, it's just not possible.

He went to Gary Schultz, whose responsibilities at the time included being head of the university police department.

Slacky, althought I didn't go to Penn State, I grew up in NE Pa worshipping Penn State football, and in particular what the program stood for -- even during rough seasons, I always had the fall-back position that at least we "were clean". So I know how you feel. But keep the faith, brother, there's more to life than college football. Look back at your days there, be proud of the school and your accomplishment, no matter what. Don't let some bad apples spoil your memories.

By the way, Schultz was responsible for the PD, but he wasn't the HEAD of the PD -- big difference.

[Elessar78]

A lot of good that would've done (reporting it to the College Police). They seemed to handle the 1998 investigation with high marks.

Now, I am not saying he was like an entitled Godfather figure, but there are a lot of questions that haven't been answered here. I think that it's obvious the guy new about it, and it's obvious he did nothing about it. It's obvious someone there (probably one of the two, if not both of the officials in trouble right now) and he bought into it one way or the other.

This was all done in defense of him. Let's see what other details come out.

Like I said, I don't think he was a czar, but he probably has more power than most would think if not just to keep him on. I mean, let's be honest, they've tricked this guy into thinking he was coaching the team the last 5 years (at least) just to keep recruits coming.

The 1998 investigation was not handled by University Park Police. It was handled by TWO entities: State College Police dept. AND PA Dept of Public Welfare. So essentially three organizations, two independent of the University, had a crack at this.

I urge you to read the grand jury presentation.

[Slacky McSlackAss]

Slacky, althought I didn't go to Penn State, I grew up in NE Pa worshipping Penn State football, and in particular what the program stood for -- even during rough seasons, I always had the fall-back position that at least we "were clean". So I know how you feel. But keep the faith, brother, there's more to life than college football. Look back at your days there, be proud of the school and your accomplishment, no matter what. Don't let some bad apples spoil your memories.

By the way, Schultz was responsible for the PD, but he wasn't the HEAD of the PD -- big difference.

Yes, that's my mistake.

And I will, some of my fondest memories come from my time there. And I will cherish them forever.

[DC9]

23 Pa.C.S. 6311 (Child Protective Services Law) and provides that when a staff member reports abuse, pursuant to statute, the person in charge of the school or institution has the responsibility and legal obligation to report or cause such a report to be made by telephone and in writing within 48 hours to the Department of Public Welfare of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. An oral report should have been made to Centre County Children and Youth Services, but non was made.

Well, there you go.... looks like it was the president's job to do, not JoePa. But if this guy was "force retired" as some have implied in 1999 for some of the same reasons, and it happened again in 2002, then why don't you just go straight for the phone to call the police?

That is the real question I have for Paterno and that's the question that the Governor is going to ask him tomorrow, I am sure.

---------- Post added November-7th-2011 at 08:51 PM ----------

The 1998 investigation was not handled by University Park Police. It was handled by TWO entities: State College Police dept. AND PA Dept of Public Welfare. So essentially three organizations, two independent of the University, had a crack at this.

I urge you to read the grand jury presentation.

I've read it three times. I urge you to re-read the indictment. Specifically the part were the Chief of Police (from the University Police) called the ADA assigned the case in 1998 and told him to "close the case." Also see the parts that state how big "the 1998 file" was.

You've been wrong twice already. Don't skim it.

[Forehead]

Someone mentioned this earlier, but not a lot of people know that Paterno wasn't just talk when it came to education. Not only is the main library named after him, he practically built him with something like 4 million dollars of his own money donated over time. Even aside from the wins record, I had hoped he would be remembered for his charity and his devotion to education.

Instead, it will be this...

[PleaseBlitz]

Someone mentioned this earlier, but not a lot of people know that Paterno wasn't just talk when it came to education. Not only is the main library named after him, he practically built him with something like 4 million dollars of his own money donated over time. Even aside from the wins record, I had hoped he would be remembered for his charity and his devotion to education.

Instead, it will be this...

And pooping himself on the sidelines.

[Elessar78]

Has anyone read Paterno's grand jury testimony? I haven't been able to find a link.

[Elessar78]

I've read it three times. I urge you to re-read the indictment. Specifically the part were the Chief of Police (from the University Police) called the ADA assigned the case in 1998 and told him to "close the case." Also see the parts that state how big "the 1998 file" was.

You've been wrong twice already. Don't skim it.

Victim 6 (pages 19 and 20)

"When Victim 6 was dropped off at home, his hair was wet and his mother immediately questioned him about this and was upset to learn the boy had showered with Sandusky.She reported the incident to University Police who investigated.. After a lengthy investigation by University Police Detective Ronald Shreffler, the investigation was closed after then-Centre County District Attorney Ray Gricar decided there would be no criminal charges. Shreffler testified that he was told to close the investigation by the director of the campus police, Thomas Harmon..."

"Detective Shreffler testified that he AND State College Police Department Detective Ralph Ralston, with the consent of the mother of Victim 6, eavesdropped on two conversations the mother had with Sandusky on May 13, 1998 and May 19, 1998..."

"Jerry Lauro, an investigator with the Pennsylvania Department of Public Welfare, testified that during the 1998 investigation, Sandusky was interviewed on June 1, 1998, by Lauro and Detective Shreffler."

OK, I got the fact that UP police did not investigate wrong, but still correct that SCPD and PADPW investigated the matter. However, the director of University Park police, Harmon, told the investigating detective to close the case NOT Ray Gricar, the District Attorney. The DA decided that there would be no criminal charges. Where does it say that the chief of police told the ADA to "close the case"?