Disappointed in Orakpo's Play

[ReMaDE]

I dont think the op meant to write this up to show hes some master gm or something, hes pointing criticism where criticism is due...

True, I get off on tangents sometime after a loss.

[moondog]

This is why I cannot STAND many of the people on here. You think because Orakpo doesn't lead the league in sacks or because Carolina ran toward him today that he isn't an outstanding player. If you feel that way you, quite simply, are wrong. Ask anyone of your friends that aren't Redskins fans about guys on our team like Orakpo or Landry and they will tell you how much they wish they had that guy on their team or how good they are. Many on this board strongly undervalue or underrate several of our players and consistently say there is no talent on this team or this team sucks.

For anyone who wants to talk **** about Orakpo not being the type of player that DeMarcus Ware is, here's a little STAT for you! Over Orakpo's first 37 games of his career he has 24 sacks. Anybody want to know how many sacks Ware had over his first 37 games? I'll tell you. Ware had exactly 24 sacks in his first 37 games. If you want to complain about the fumbles, that's a little more acceptable because Orakpo has only forced 4 fumbles in those 37 games/24 sacks whereas Ware had forced 9. That's fine - I was a little frustrated that Orakpo simply tried to spear through Cam rather than go for the ball as well. But you know what, out of 4.5 sacks this year, Orakpo has forced 2 fumbles. That's showing improvement if you ask me.

Hey, guess what Extremeskins, guess who else has played in exactly 37 games in their career? CLAY MATTHEWS. Want to know how many sacks he's had in his first 37 games? I'll tell you. Clay Matthews has had exactly 25.5 sacks. That's 1.5 sacks more than Orakpo. Anyone still want to ***** about forced fumbles? Matthews has forced an astounding 3 fumbles in his 37 games! Shocking, I know.

And for all of those of you that want to ***** that he doesn't show up in big games or clutch moments, you are out of your minds. Think about last year - he was KILLING Dallas in week 1 and drew I think 3 holding penalties in that game which was ridiculous, including the one that ended the game. He should/would have had about 4 sacks in that game. How about a few weeks later against the Packers (aka the team that went on to win the Super Bowl)? Orakpo had 2 sacks in that game!

If you want to continue to ***** about a player who is one of the best on our roster, at least do the research or understand the game before you pull some bull**** out of your ass. Orakpo has made the Pro-Bowl each of his first two years in the league. He has dominated games and shown a propensity to put teams away when we are playing with the lead - a situation many pass-rushers find themselves in much more often than Orakpo. His run defense is not his strength and yet he's still pretty damn good at it. He was brought in to be an elite pass-rusher and that's exactly what he is. Kerrigan is more fluid in his hips and a better run defender - shocker, but everyone knew he was a little stronger in that area coming in. And before you want to ***** too much about Orakpo's run defense or the fact that some teams have run more to the left, consider a few novel ideas:

Most teams put their best blockers/tackle on the left side to protect their quarterback. Typically, these guys are a little better at pass-blocking AND run-blocking. That's WHY they play on the left side. You don't draft tackles in the 1st round to play the right side. You may have heard of this guy named Jordan Gross - he's one of the best LT's in the game and is compensated monetarily as such. A couple years ago when he was a FA before we drafted Trent Williams, we REALLY wanted him. Maybe that has a LITTLE something to do with why the Panthers ran to the left.

Just a few things to think about for the incredibly ignorant.

[jthor99]

Have to say it...this guy is shaping up to be a very one dimensional player.

Two examples come to mind:

Play vs. the Eagles where he is unblocked...and comes free, then proceeds to get completely juked by Vick. There were scrambles where Vick was able to dodge defenders and get upfield by going to where Orakpo vacated. On the opposite end, when he stayed at home on the Atogwe blitz, Vick had no lane and had to go down.

Today he just appeared to be useless if he isn't rushing the QB. Weak supporting the run, propensity to over pursue, and terrible in coverage. You just have to be able to cover a back out of the flats, there's no way around it.

And the most infuriating thing is that he still only has ONE damn pass rush move.

On the other hand, Kerrigan is shaping up to be everything you want out of an OLB. Stout against the run, not looking completely lost in coverage, as well as doing what it takes to get to the QB. He even has an INT, and a TD, two things Orakpo lacks in year 3 in the league.

I'm not implying that Orakpo is a wasted pick...but maybe he wasn't the steal of that draft in retrospect. Possibly the teams drafting ahead of us recognized weaknesses we didn't?

I hope he gets it together, because we need for him to take that step towards being a more well rounded player. I know I'm tired of teams running right at him and seeing him either: getting sealed easily, or running himself out of the play.

Could not agree more. Great post. Supporters will point to his 2 Pro Bowls and his performance against the Rams (they are one of the worst football teams I've watched in years), but to me he's overrated at this point in his career.

[tiger187126]

rabble, rabble, rabble, etc.

i'm not saying orakpo is some bum, but he has been a liability when asked to do things other than speed rush an OT. just because he's one of our best players doesn't mean that he doesn't do anything wrong.

and the reality that is ryan kerrigan's play this year has kind of shown that orakpo still has a long way to go to be a complete linebacker.

[DM72]

I agree with many on this thread. Orakpo needs to get better, but the talk of trading him is a little ridiculous.

[CjSuAvE22]

This is why I cannot STAND many of the people on here. You think because Orakpo doesn't lead the league in sacks or because Carolina ran toward him today that he isn't an outstanding player. If you feel that way you, quite simply, are wrong. Ask anyone of your friends that aren't Redskins fans about guys on our team like Orakpo or Landry and they will tell you how much they wish they had that guy on their team or how good they are. Many on this board strongly undervalue or underrate several of our players and consistently say there is no talent on this team or this team sucks.

For anyone who wants to talk **** about Orakpo not being the type of player that DeMarcus Ware is, here's a little STAT for you! Over Orakpo's first 37 games of his career he has 24 sacks. Anybody want to know how many sacks Ware had over his first 37 games? I'll tell you. Ware had exactly 24 sacks in his first 37 games. If you want to complain about the fumbles, that's a little more acceptable because Orakpo has only forced 4 fumbles in those 37 games/24 sacks whereas Ware had forced 9. That's fine - I was a little frustrated that Orakpo simply tried to spear through Cam rather than go for the ball as well. But you know what, out of 4.5 sacks this year, Orakpo has forced 2 fumbles. That's showing improvement if you ask me.

Hey, guess what Extremeskins, guess who else has played in exactly 37 games in their career? CLAY MATTHEWS. Want to know how many sacks he's had in his first 37 games? I'll tell you. Clay Matthews has had exactly 25.5 sacks. That's 1.5 sacks more than Orakpo. Anyone still want to ***** about forced fumbles? Matthews has forced an astounding 3 fumbles in his 37 games! Shocking, I know.

And for all of those of you that want to ***** that he doesn't show up in big games or clutch moments, you are out of your minds. Think about last year - he was KILLING Dallas in week 1 and drew I think 3 holding penalties in that game which was ridiculous, including the one that ended the game. He should/would have had about 4 sacks in that game. How about a few weeks later against the Packers (aka the team that went on to win the Super Bowl)? Orakpo had 2 sacks in that game!

If you want to continue to ***** about a player who is one of the best on our roster, at least do the research or understand the game before you pull some bull**** out of your ass. Orakpo has made the Pro-Bowl each of his first two years in the league. He has dominated games and shown a propensity to put teams away when we are playing with the lead - a situation many pass-rushers find themselves in much more often than Orakpo. His run defense is not his strength and yet he's still pretty damn good at it. He was brought in to be an elite pass-rusher and that's exactly what he is. Kerrigan is more fluid in his hips and a better run defender - shocker, but everyone knew he was a little stronger in that area coming in. And before you want to ***** too much about Orakpo's run defense or the fact that some teams have run more to the left, consider a few novel ideas:

Most teams put their best blockers/tackle on the left side to protect their quarterback. Typically, these guys are a little better at pass-blocking AND run-blocking. That's WHY they play on the left side. You don't draft tackles in the 1st round to play the right side. You may have heard of this guy named Jordan Gross - he's one of the best LT's in the game and is compensated monetarily as such. A couple years ago when he was a FA before we drafted Trent Williams, we REALLY wanted him. Maybe that has a LITTLE something to do with why the Panthers ran to the left.

Just a few things to think about for the incredibly ignorant.

Im sorry but id take ware and matthews over orakpo on my team anyday they are way more complete then Rak is thus far in his career. As far as him being good against the run?? when was the last time Orakpo had a tackle for a loss on a running play, everytime they run down his way hes never able to shed his blocker or completely over pursues not saying he sucks or anything but I expect more from him then what ive seen thus far this season.

[clskinsfan]

It would be the perfect time to trade him. We waited too long on Cooley and are now stuck with him. If he could net a 2nd round pick then Id pull the trigger.

So you are going to trade arguably our best player for a 2nd round pick. Unbelievable.

[Slateman]

So who replaces Orakpo? Who comes in to support our secondary? Who replaces Fletcher? .....If you follow your thought pattern we will be right back here next year saying "Damn our D Sucks", but its okay cause we have a good QB, right? Well maybe considering our OL pretty much needs an extensive makeover, and we are lacking a deep threat and solid number 1 receiver. But your right lets trade Kerrigan too, that way at least we can pretty much just make Luck a lock.

The draft and free agency. That's how you improve. Draft more pass rushers. There are always undersized, pass rushing ends coming out of.college.

[moondog]

i'm not saying orakpo is some bum, but he has been a liability when asked to do things other than speed rush an OT. just because he's one of our best players doesn't mean that he doesn't do anything wrong.

and the reality that is ryan kerrigan's play this year has kind of shown that orakpo still has a long way to go to be a complete linebacker.

Incredible. Rabble, rabble, rabble? Half the people in this thread want to compare Orakpo to Ware to say what he isn't. When in reality he has actually matched Ware's performance through the beginning of their careers. Rak has been one of the best homegrown players we've had on offense or defense in a LONG time. He's been exactly as productive as Clay Matthews through the same amount of games despite the fact that the Packers almost always play with the lead forcing the other team to become one-dimensional on offense. We've seen what Orakpo does when given that opportunity in games against Oakland (4 sacks) and St. Louis (2.5 sacks) for example.

Orakpo is an elite pass-rusher and an average run defender. Many of the best pass-rushers in the league are not great in coverage or against the run. Just because he's not the most complete and dominant linebacker in the league some people are calling for his head or want to trade him? Get a clue. This team has been begging for a pass-rush since the mid to early 90's, we finally have two great pass-rushers and people are complaining because Orakpo isn't Phillip Daniels against the run and Kerrigan is a better run-defender? I just don't get it.

If you want to complain, complain about the fact that their are only 2 players the Panthers have on offense - Steve Smith and Cam Newton. We failed to cover or even slow Steve Smith down all day. That's what lost us the game.

[fordranger76]

People need to come off of the ledge. I have seen a lot of things said about Orakpo in this thread that just have me questioning folks sanity. Let me ask this. Would you guys say that Orakpo is a top 12 linebacker in this league. Take all of the linebackers in this league and rank him. I would say he is top 10 at least. With that being said some of you are willing to trade him for something as little as a 2nd round pick. Think about that. Top ten guy going for a 2nd round pick. If any team did that we all would laugh our rear ends off at that team. So the suggestion is that while Orakpo may not be the most complete linebacker in the WHOLE LEAGUE that he simply must be traded. I know a lot of you guys are upset about this loss but honestly if you really think that trading a top ten player at his respective position is the best course of success I would check myself into a mental health facility as soon as I possibly could because if you really believe in getting rid of this guy as being a good thing then I can't even imagine what you would do in a real life situation with anything of importance to it.

[MumboSauce]

He certainly could be better..and I hoped for better. I think he is a good player just not great or elite. I hope he proves that wrong. I like his attitude, character, personality, etc. Good dude..but We need more results/beasting on the field. and he only partially delivers. I still think the defense needs improving overall, and that will come.

[Mocountyskins]

I dont understand why people want to trade Orakpo?? He is one of our Best players on the defense, you could make an argument that he IS the best player on the Redskins Defense? the other thing i dont understand is why people are so pressed over Luck? Ya Luck is a good prospect but he is nothing more than a good Prospect.

Its crazy talk to want to trade away your best passrusher and a couple of 1st round picks and 2 round picks for a QB when a QB wouldent even fix this team. The team has way to many holes. We are not 1 QB away from the playoffs. We are a QB, RB, 2 WR, 2 OL, 1 ILB away from ebing playoff contenders.

If We trade away like 5 or 6 picks and a good player for a higher draft pick we will go nowhere Luck will have no one to toss it to he will get his face pounded in with bad protection it would just be a bad bad bad trade not to mention the fact that he could turn out to be a bust.

[CjSuAvE22]

Incredible. Rabble, rabble, rabble? Half the people in this thread want to compare Orakpo to Ware to say what he isn't. When in reality he has actually matched Ware's performance through the beginning of their careers. Rak has been one of the best homegrown players we've had on offense or defense in a LONG time. He's been exactly as productive as Clay Matthews through the same amount of games despite the fact that the Packers almost always play with the lead forcing the other team to become one-dimensional on offense. We've seen what Orakpo does when given that opportunity in games against Oakland (4 sacks) and St. Louis (2.5 sacks) for example.

Orakpo is an elite pass-rusher and an average run defender. Many of the best pass-rushers in the league are not great in coverage or against the run. Just because he's not the most complete and dominant linebacker in the league some people are calling for his head or want to trade him? Get a clue. This team has been begging for a pass-rush since the mid to early 90's, we finally have two great pass-rushers and people are complaining because Orakpo isn't Phillip Daniels against the run and Kerrigan is a better run-defender? I just don't get it.

If you want to complain, complain about the fact that their are only 2 players the Panthers have on offense - Steve Smith and Cam Newton. We failed to cover or even slow Steve Smith down all day. That's what lost us the game.

Dude nobody is saying he ISNT good at getting sacks we're saying thats ALL he can do and so far with his play hes proven just that.

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

I love Rak and he's a natural at 3-4 OLB but he needs to make more plays.

Personally, I think he's natural 4-3 DE. :2cents:

[Bubble Screen]

What are you talking about? #98 got to Cam Newton today for a sack. He did fine today.

Pretty easy to do when you're not blocked.:doh:

[The Sean and Laron show]

The fact that you can even compare Orakpo to Ware (a likely hall of famer) should let you know Orakpo doesn't suck. He's a very good player he just isn't elite at this point in his young career. You don't trade a player who's gone to the probowl every year they've been in the league.

[moondog]

Dude nobody is saying he ISNT good at getting sacks we're saying thats ALL he can do and so far with his play hes proven just that.

He's an average run defender. So be it. The fact that people would actually consider trading a player or complaining so much about a linebacker who is a top 10 pass-rusher in the entire league because he's not the best run defender is insane. Again, many of the other best pass-rushers in the league are also not the greatest run-defenders. I tried to show that Orakpo compares favorably to some of the best players at his position in the league. Dwight Freeney (I know he's a DE) has been a one-trick pony his whole career. Do you think Colts fans have ever wanted to get rid of him? He has 4.5 sacks and 2 FF this year, same as Orakpo.

Celebrate what he is, understand that he's exactly what we thought that he would be. The same as you take a player like DHall because even though you know he's a not a great cover guy, he can have a great impact on a game and so can Orakpo. The pressure that he puts on other teams QB's that frees up other D-linemen or Kerrigan is worth his aver run defense.

Whoever said trade Orakpo and build through the draft is laughable. Orakpo IS our build through the draft! Someone also said that they would take Ware or Clay Matthews. Yes, at this point no one is going to argue that Orakpo is better, but Ware is in the prime of his career and Rak isn't there yet. But I promise you that if any of you watched every single snap of every Packers games the way we do the Skins game, you would see some serious deficiencies in some of these guys' game as well.

Recognize the type of players we have, celebrate what they do and what allow others to do and stop expecting every player to be the best player ever at their position. Players and coaches have recognized Orakpo each of his 2 full seasons in this league and we should be happy to have him.

[megared]

Incredible. Rabble, rabble, rabble? Half the people in this thread want to compare Orakpo to Ware to say what he isn't. When in reality he has actually matched Ware's performance through the beginning of their careers. Rak has been one of the best homegrown players we've had on offense or defense in a LONG time. He's been exactly as productive as Clay Matthews through the same amount of games despite the fact that the Packers almost always play with the lead forcing the other team to become one-dimensional on offense. We've seen what Orakpo does when given that opportunity in games against Oakland (4 sacks) and St. Louis (2.5 sacks) for example.

Orakpo is an elite pass-rusher and an average run defender. Many of the best pass-rushers in the league are not great in coverage or against the run. Just because he's not the most complete and dominant linebacker in the league some people are calling for his head or want to trade him? Get a clue. This team has been begging for a pass-rush since the mid to early 90's, we finally have two great pass-rushers and people are complaining because Orakpo isn't Phillip Daniels against the run and Kerrigan is a better run-defender? I just don't get it.

If you want to complain, complain about the fact that their are only 2 players the Panthers have on offense - Steve Smith and Cam Newton. We failed to cover or even slow Steve Smith down all day. That's what lost us the game.

It's almost like we watch the game differently. Stats are great...but do they really tell you that Ware is heads and shoulders better at:

generating turnovers?

stopping the run?

playing coverage?

No one is saying that Orakpo sucks at rushing the passer. But for what he is touted as, he should be able to make plays in almost any situation. He should be able to diagnose a play and chase it down when it's a run away from him. I've seen Kerrigan do more of this in 6 games, than I have in 3 years of watching Rak.

Rak isn't near the best player on our team...let's be honest, in our LB corps, he may soon be the 3rd best. And let's end the talk about him being one of the 'best' in the NFC East. There's Ware, Spencer, Cole, Umenyiora (4.5 sacks in 3 games), Pierre-Paul who's having a monster season thus far, and Jason Babin who has also been great. There's a bunch of guys in there, that right now are doing what Orakpo does best, better than him. And out of all of them, Orakpo may be the weakest against the run. And he is also in the lowest tier of coverage.

I'm glad none of you enablers coach him...my goodness, why would he ever try to improve if everyone feels that he's arrived, and shields him from criticism? I'm not on board with trading him, but I definitely couldn't see making him one of the highest paid OLBs either.

[bigjumbo1971]

i remember hearing a stat during one of the games this year that orakpo only has one or two of his sacks against nfc east opponents. he does not show up in the big games, plain and simple.

I remember hearing this as well on 980...however, the person talking failed to mention how many holding calls he's caused...In fact, if not for him being held against Dallas last year we would have lost that game

[tiger187126]

Incredible. Rabble, rabble, rabble? Half the people in this thread want to compare Orakpo to Ware to say what he isn't. When in reality he has actually matched Ware's performance through the beginning of their careers. Rak has been one of the best homegrown players we've had on offense or defense in a LONG time. He's been exactly as productive as Clay Matthews through the same amount of games despite the fact that the Packers almost always play with the lead forcing the other team to become one-dimensional on offense. We've seen what Orakpo does when given that opportunity in games against Oakland (4 sacks) and St. Louis (2.5 sacks) for example.

Orakpo is an elite pass-rusher and an average run defender. Many of the best pass-rushers in the league are not great in coverage or against the run. Just because he's not the most complete and dominant linebacker in the league some people are calling for his head or want to trade him? Get a clue. This team has been begging for a pass-rush since the mid to early 90's, we finally have two great pass-rushers and people are complaining because Orakpo isn't Phillip Daniels against the run and Kerrigan is a better run-defender? I just don't get it.

If you want to complain, complain about the fact that their are only 2 players the Panthers have on offense - Steve Smith and Cam Newton. We failed to cover or even slow Steve Smith down all day. That's what lost us the game.

you quoted me, were outraged by my response, and then went on to not refute anything i said.

you just restated your first diatribe while telling me to get a clue.

i would recommend you grab one yourself and read what i wrote.

[gamecokskins703]

Good topic OP, i have been saying this since the beginning of the season. People need to realize he is SO one-dimensional. And he's not even the best at what he does, pass-rushing.

On the Cam Newton running touchdown, Orakpo bit SO hard and cam ran RIGHT by him. Kerrigan is seriously shaping up to be a great OLB, while Orakpo is still between average-good.

Orakpo needs to shape up and start learning how to read plays and stop them in the backfield. He needs to not only get sacks, but stop rushers in the backfield. DISRUPT plays at the line of scrimmage. Clay Matthews for example, is the type of OLB i would want in my 3-4. i would say Kerrigan could be a Clay Matthews type, maybe better.

[tiger187126]

I remember hearing this as well on 980...however, the person talking failed to mention how many holding calls he's caused...In fact, if not for him being held against Dallas last year we would have lost that game

he had 6.5 sacks between the raiders game two years ago and the rams game this year. i think that's kind of what they're talking about. he shows up big against inferior talent and then gets harder to find against better talent.

[tds]

On the other hand, Kerrigan is shaping up to be everything you want out of an OLB. Stout against the run, not looking completely lost in coverage, as well as doing what it takes to get to the QB. He even has an INT, and a TD, two things Orakpo lacks in year 3 in the league.

I didn't hear Kerrigan's name mentioned once today.

[megared]

He's an average run defender. So be it. The fact that people would actually consider trading a player or complaining so much about a linebacker who is a top 10 pass-rusher in the entire league because he's not the best run defender is insane. Again, many of the other best pass-rushers in the league are also not the greatest run-defenders. I tried to show that Orakpo compares favorably to some of the best players at his position in the league. Dwight Freeney (I know he's a DE) has been a one-trick pony his whole career. Do you think Colts fans have ever wanted to get rid of him? He has 4.5 sacks and 2 FF this year, same as Orakpo.

Celebrate what he is, understand that he's exactly what we thought that he would be. The same as you take a player like DHall because even though you know he's a not a great cover guy, he can have a great impact on a game and so can Orakpo. The pressure that he puts on other teams QB's that frees up other D-linemen or Kerrigan is worth his aver run defense.

Whoever said trade Orakpo and build through the draft is laughable. Orakpo IS our build through the draft! Someone also said that they would take Ware or Clay Matthews. Yes, at this point no one is going to argue that Orakpo is better, but Ware is in the prime of his career and Rak isn't there yet. But I promise you that if any of you watched every single snap of every Packers games the way we do the Skins game, you would see some serious deficiencies in some of these guys' game as well.

Recognize the type of players we have, celebrate what they do and what allow others to do and stop expecting every player to be the best player ever at their position. Players and coaches have recognized Orakpo each of his 2 full seasons in this league and we should be happy to have him.

He's not average. He's our worst run stopping LB. Our worst LB in coverage as well. If all you're interested in is 'sacks n stuff' I guess that's great. But at most he'll get 4 sacks in a game. There's still around 50-60 more plays where he isn't making an impact. Where he has to at least not be a liability.

I don't care about him making the Pro Bowl, when teams can just run directly at him on 3rd and short. As a matter of fact, I'd prefer he not make the Pro Bowl until he becomes more well rounded. Maybe the first two have prevented him from being what we hope he's capable of. Right now, If I was Haz, I'd be pulling him on short yardage situations, even blitzing him less, and challenging him to be better. We don't need a superstar, we need someone that's going to do whatever it takes to get a stop.

[Skins81a]

Some of you guys need to step back a bit after a loss. Rak has always been overrated by Skins fans but he is a big piece of the puzzle. He has got to concentrate on sealing the edge and getting better at it and great players dont fall for the same play 3 times but pass rushers dont grow on trees. By the way Ware sucks at coverage also!