Why Mike Shanahan may start Grossman over Beck

[MartinC]

I was impressed with him too, but was he playing against soft coverage.

But he never came close to throwing a pick and was making excellent reads.

Don't see how he was playing soft coverage. The Eagles blitzed him quite a bit, more than they did Rex.

[Hooper]

Don't see how he was playing soft coverage. The Eagles blitzed him quite a bit, more than they did Rex.

For a lot of Beck's action, the corners were playing way off the receivers and trying not to give up the big play since they were up two scores.

Again, I was impressed by Beck. Not being critical and think he should be the guy on Sunday.

[diehardskinpsoup]

I am for Rex starting on sunday. Tell him that this is his last shot to keep his job. If he plays horrible and keeps us from winning, then you bench him the rest of the year. It's too early for big changes yet, like a qb change when a win this sunday puts us back in first place in the east.

ITA. I think he can rebound. Shanahan's change at QB now also would make him appear to not know what he is doing. He would appear to be a bad decision maker (By starting Rex in the first place). You have to let him redeem himself and give him one last shot. Only this time, if he starts choking in the first half, Beck gets the nod and you sit Rex for good. Make him #2.

Starting Beck will kill the morale in the locker roon as well. While we as fans are leaning towards a change, if we want our team to stay above .500, we have to keep things steady. So letting Rex start against Carolina is the BEST idea for thea team, in terms of trying to win.

HTTR

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

Am i the only one who was absolutely impressed by Beck's performance?

I have already stated that I'm indifferent about who starts on Sunday. Again, I understand why Rex is being crucified, but why is Beck being so overblown?

Am I the only one that cringed every time the ball came out of Beck's hand? That throw on the deep in to Gaffney looked like it was shot down by somebody sitting in the first row. And that wasn't the only duck he threw...there were plenty.

And what about the fumble that he had when he was playing pigskin patty-cake outside the pocket with nobody near him? That play was missing as many chromosomes as Rex's fourth pick. Why does he get a pass on that? Because it bounced right back to him? Again, I get the Rex venom...but let's not overlook these floaters.

[XEL]

Am i the only one who was absolutely impressed by Beck's performance?

I have already stated that I'm indifferent about who starts on Sunday. Again, I understand why Rex is being crucified, but why is Beck being so overblown?

Am I the only one that cringed every time the ball came out of Beck's hand? That throw on the deep in to Gaffney looked like it was shot down by somebody sitting in the first row. And that wasn't the only duck he threw...there were plenty.

And what about the fumble that he had when he was playing pigskin patty-cake outside the pocket with nobody near him? That play was missing as many chromosomes as Rex's fourth pick. Why does he get a pass on that? Because it bounced right back to him? Again, I get the Rex venom...but let's not overlook these floaters.

But you also realize Beck most likely hasn't taken a single snap with the first team offense since the season began, right? Instead, he's been running the scout team offense. And in spite of that, he was able to come in and march the team down the field for a touchdown.

[CrypticVillain]

I did not want to start another Grossman thread, so I think my post is closet to this thread

Here are some excerpts from an article written by Ryan O'halloran from CSN:

Playing Redskins' INT guessing game

Full article

INT No. 1: First drive of game, third-and-16 from Eagles’ 38 thanks in part to Trent Williams’ holding penalty. Formation was 4WR-0RB-1TE (Helu motioned out of backfield). Four-man rush vs. five-man protection. Grossman threw 36 yards to TE Fred Davis on a deep post. Grossman was pressured when Jason Babin and Trevor Laws stunted and Laws rushed free. Release time was 2.44 seconds.

INT No. 2: Third drive, trailing 17-0, first-and-10 from own 15-yard line. Formation was a 2 WR/1RB/2TE. Four-man rush vs. seven or eight-man rush. (I guess he meant protection) It was clearly a deep shot opportunity thanks to the two-man route and heavy protection. Grossman had Gaffney open on a deep post 35 yards downfield but underthrew him and was intercepted by Nate Allen.

INT No. 3: Eighth drive, the Redskins trailed 21-6 and face a second-and-12 at the Eagles’ 21-yard line. Formation was 4WR-ORB-1WR. Four-man rush vs. five-man protection. Grossman again looked for Davis on deep post but the tape intimates that Davis hesitated on breaking off his route, which allowed Coleman to make his second interception.

INT No. 4: On the next drive, still down 20-6, the Redskins had a third-and-10 from their own 37. Formation was 4WR/1RB/0TE (Davis in WR spot). Four-man rush vs. five-man protection. Grossman was in trouble at 2.10 seconds. Maybe a product of new OL, Locklear looked inside (even though his help – Helu – was on the left side) and was late to block Tapp. Montgomery got away with a hold on Jenkins. Grossman scrambled and his pass intended for Gaffney was intercepted by Coleman 9 yards downfield.

On all four of the interceptions, Grossman only faced a four-man rush. I am thinking that teams will not be able to do this too much against Beck. We seen on Sunday that he is capable of extending a play with his mobility. I am not saying he is Vick, but he is better than Grossman as far as that aspect goes.

I am not the first person to say this, but Grossman is how he is. We all know that. What we don't know is exactly who is Beck. People can bring up his time in Miami and Baltimore all they want, but anybody could see that both situations was Beck being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

We still need a QB next year, but I am much more comfortable seeing what Beck could be than seeing what Grossman is.

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

I do realize that Beck has been running the scout team. I also realize that he's been running the scout team everywhere he has been. I further realize that he was benched for Cleo Lemon. What I don't realize is why people continue to say that we "don't know who Beck is". He's the guy that couldn't beat out Rex, even though he was given a chance to do so.

Again, I'm not a Rex apologist. I just think the "we don't know what we have in Beck" thing is overblown. If he starts on Sunday, I will root for him like I do any other guy that's out there spilling their B&G guts. Hail.

[BADKCLARK]

Complete speculation here .... Beck is a bit of a self-promoter. ("John" shirt latest example.) If he's been waging a locker-room campaign to start, that would go over poorly.

The backup QB is not supposed to hint that he might be a better starter than the starter. In past years, Grossman and Collins mastered that art of being invisible until being called into a game.

The starting QB is sort of like a presidential election. The campaign is supposed to end with the election. If the loser continues to campaign, that's very poor form.

Absolutely! Complete speculation. He's a self-promoter because he wears a shirt with his name on it? Earth to ASF, every player has their name on their shirt out on the field! Wouldn't that be self-promotion, too? Or should they be such team players that they all remove their names.

Also, I highly doubt that JB is walking around the locker-room handing out pamphlets on why he should be the starter. He's a confident guy, but he is a total team player. He was the one organizing off-season practices during the lockout. He was the one walking rookies thru the playbook and introducing them to the system. Where was Grossman? Pure speculation, but probably sitting on his couch at home eating tater-chips.

Good gravy. If you're looking to get a rise, well done. That speculation is about as worthless as my saying Grossman sits on his butt all off-season eating chips.

[fifthorkid88]

I think Grossman gets another game. Too many players have come out in the media in support of Rex. Shanny wouldn't risk losing the locker room while the season is still young.

[Ryko]

I think Grossman gets another game. Too many players have come out in the media in support of Rex. Shanny wouldn't risk losing the locker room while the season is still young.

I wish Moss hadn't said that (unless he was just doing the PR thing and wasn't 100% truthful) because I REALLY would rather see Beck, we know Rex's ceiling.. which is barely average/serviceable... just horrible to watch the defense set up the offense for nothing.. over.. and over .. and over.

BTW Just saw on ESPN's Around the Horn (yeah weird show to hear something on I know) That shanny will announce the Starting QB tomorrow (Wed) Everyone be ready!

[greenspandan]

how many ints does a guy have to throw to get benched? jeez. 4 ints in a key division matchup should be enough for the other guy to get a shot.

[tiger187126]

and now ASF has turned confidence from Beck into a bad thing, even though he promoted Grossman's confidence as vital to his makeup.

it never ceases to amaze me. especially considering this accusation comes on the heels of the guy wearing a shirt with his name on it.

for those who haven't seen it:

that shirt is what leads ASF to believe that beck is a self promoter and could be poisoning the locker room.

[Newera]

Beck is going to be the man starting this Sunday or some Sunday in the near future. Guaranteed. Why delay the inevitable. He's the immediate future until are "Franchise" quarterback we pick in 2012 is ready. Plus, John is signed through next year. Rex isn't. I personally think if he plays and we are patient with him, he's going to surprise and just get better and better. I think Mike see's some poor man's Steve Young in him. (Go BYU). He just seems to me someone that wants to be good, and really see's this as his shot and has been working hard for this opportunity.

---------- Post added October-18th-2011 at 06:18 PM ----------

What's ASF stand for Always Speculate First. Grossman is entirely too inconsistent. Beck will ultimately be much more difficult to defend. And, crushes Grossman in the measurables. Beck will win in the end. He needs reps. Grossman was the safe choice early and deserved the job. Now, not so much. Plus, the Shanny's really want to see what they have in John Brown Noser Beck. LOL. I guarantee you dollar to donuts Andy Reid was watching Beck and going "Damn, glad that dude didn't play the whole game." He gives the offense a completely different tempo.

---------- Post added October-18th-2011 at 06:33 PM ----------

Am i the only one who was absolutely impressed by Beck's performance?

With or without the INT's Sunday, the game was going nowhere. We were terrible in the red zone. Im one of the most team supporting guys you'll meet. The guys in the gameday thread make me sick, and my entire family is the same way on gameday. Throw one INT and everyone is on the "WE SUCK!" wagon and the game is over, we already lost. I didn't want to believe in Rex, but since Shanahan did, I gave him the benefit of a doubt, and i have defended him all season, but i just can't defend him after Sunday. Rex has shown all year he can drive the field but can't get points. He continuously underthrows and overthrows his receivers deep. And much like Campbell during his time here, Rex throws almost everything HIGH. Throwing high gets your receivers killed. When the pressure comes, Rex folds. Watching him in the pocket makes me want to vomit. I feel like on any given play that ball is going to be fumbled. The last play of ours in the Cowboys game is what appears to be about to happen every time he scrambles (if you can call it scrambling). He makes absolute terrible decisions. Shanahan is not an idiot, in his interview he said "I know a pretty good QB who threw 4 INT's in a game". The difference is Brady's INTs were tips and good plays by the Bills. Rex's INTs were thrown into triple/double coverage bad decisions, or just his overall lack of accuracy. Shanahan knows this, he just cant go in an interview and say "Well, he made terrible decisions. He sucks, we're switching to Beck." The summary of his play at QB was the last INT he threw. Throw the ball away! It's simple.

Beck on the other hand, came in and shined. He stepped up in the pocket and made the throws he needed to make. That's something i haven't seen on the Skins in a long time. When pressure came, he used his protection, or he scrambled for positive yards when the pass just wasn't there (turns out Davis was open i believe, but hey, he made a mistake, he didn't see it. So he ran. Rex would have forced it to the other guy who is double covered). Beck's deep balls were fantastic. Two dropped big plays by receivers was the difference in the game, even though we had screwed up the entire game already. Had those two balls been held on to, we still tie or win. Beck underthrew a few, guess what? He isn't the starter. He came in cold. Timing is very important, and he doesn't know what to expect from some of the receivers. You know one receiver he probably HAS been working with in practice? AUSTIN. You see how that worked out? If you want to utilize Austin, Beck has shown that those two have a great connection. What really hit me was Beck scored the SECOND TD of his NFL CAREER while having 4 starts and on his second drive of his first game as a Redskin. Rex couldnt throw a TD in 3 quarters and he's been to the SB and is the Skins starter! Is this really even an argument? Rex has failed us, and the fans have a right to want blood.

Take the statistics and do what you wish with them. Statistics are for losers. The SD Chargers had the number 1 offense and defense last year, where did that get them? Anyone with eyes knows that Rex was outperformed.

I was too after I watched it again on Youtube. During the game you're so amped. But in retrospect he really had two scoring drives. We messed up on the field goal attempt on the first one. And, he did have that one fumble recovery. I really wanted to see what he could do with one more possession down by seven, but the defense could not get the stop. Also, was it just me, but didn't Orakpo get played to death all game with the up and under play calling. They totally took advantage of his aggressiveness. All their runs to end the game was to his side. Even McCoy's TD run was to his side. Just a thought.

[NattyBo]

Unfortunately, I think Rex gets one mor chance this weekend. Ah well, it'll be one more game towards a higher draft pick this year.

[SKINS'n'Spurs]

Unfortunately, I think Rex gets one mor chance this weekend. Ah well, it'll be one more game towards a higher draft pick this year.

Hopefully it won't be unfortunate,

yestarday i wanted Beck to start. Now I'm leaning back towards Rex just b/c its carolina and they had a decent DEF last yr; (they just couldn't hang with everyone else on Offense) Rex probably does give us the best shotand he will definitely want to bounce back, I say give him the bounce back game and if he can't get something going by HT...bench him

[Robbynice]

I don't know I still trust Rex than Beck...Oh well we will see who the Shanahans trust.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

I don't know I still trust Rex than Beck...Oh well we will see who the Shanahans trust.

I hope this just comes down to our definition of the term trust. I could understand the argument that one believes Rex can make more plays. I don't see how one could trust Rex more with the ball. It has gotten to the point that I was more nervous when our QB dropped back than I was when their QB did. That isn't normal. Though I hope this isn't the case, I could buy someone believing that Beck won't run or understand the offense as well. That's possible.

[Atlanta Skins Fan]

and now ASF has turned confidence from Beck into a bad thing, even though he promoted Grossman's confidence as vital to his makeup.

it never ceases to amaze me. especially considering this accusation comes on the heels of the guy wearing a shirt with his name on it.

for those who haven't seen it:

that shirt is what leads ASF to believe that beck is a self promoter and could be poisoning the locker room.

Calm down, I'm just channeling the interwebs.

Dan Graziano chat today

The Hurricane of Einstein (DC)

I thought we were answering my Beck questions here? What gives?Sexy has 13 turnovers in the last 4 games. Do you think the WRs coming out in defense of Rex is real or a Shanny move? Do they really feel Beck will average more than 4 a game?

Dan Graziano (12:36 PM)

I have a sneaking suspicion they don't like Beck, those WRs.

Tim (columbia, md)

What's not to like about Beck? He's certainly more charismatic than sexy rexy. As for talent, Shanny said that Rex barely beat out Beck for the starting job.

Dan Graziano (12:39 PM)

I like him. But I have a suspicion that his teammates don't. That's all.

Tory (DC)

Comment only (no question) ... Some of the Skins players do like Beck and like the spark he brought to the game. He was out there all summer working with them while Rexy was an unsigned FA. I think the WRs in general know Rex's throwing better (esp Gaffney college team mate) than Becks, thus Santana's company man statement.

Dan Graziano (12:49 PM)

This is a true and worthwhile point. My earlier comment was based on some conversations I've had in that locker room, is all. Totally unscientific.

PFT channeling Dan Steinberg

Beck wants to be the starter in D.C.

Posted by Mike Florio on October 17, 2011, 10:40 AM EDT

On one hand, it’s not much of a surprise that a football player actually wants to play football. On the other hand, it’s not every day that a backup quarterback makes a public pitch for the job.

That’s precisely what John Beck did after Sunday’s loss to the Eagles, during which he replaced Rex Grossman after Grossman threw four interceptions.

“I want to play,” Beck told Kelli Johnson of CSN Washington. “I want to be the quarterback. But I’m not the one that makes that decision, it’s coach, and they’ll make the best decision for the team. . . . What’s gonna happen next, I don’t know. But I’ll just do everything I can to be prepared if my number is called.”

...

Beck also gets some style points for his choice of post-game attire. He wore what looked like an old-school mechanic’s shirt, complete with a name tag that said “John.”

In the past, folks in D.C. may have needed that extra help to recognize a guy who looks a little like Brad Johnson mixed with Will Forte. Once he gets the job, they’ll know who he is.

He was just called out nationally for self-promotion. I read that and Graziano's quotes and wondered if there was a connection.

If you have a better theory why some in the Redskins locker room don't like Beck (per Graziano), feel free to offer it. It's not my opinion about whether Beck is disliked by some, I'm just passing on reporting by Graziano and connecting it to what I've seen about Beck at various times this year, last Sunday notably.

I have a feeling that Moss and possibly Gaffney may be some of the grumblers. I noticed in preseason that they hardly ever appeared on the field at the same time as Beck, even when Beck started. It struck me as odd. I think there's something to this, but the exact reasons would be speculation ... which I acknowleged in my post.

Something about Beck rubs some Redskin players the wrong way, enough to draw the attention and reporting of Graziano.

[TheRookie]

There have been some posts critical of the coaching staff for the QB situation and have a "I'm freaking out" tone to them over this whole thing...

Let us remind ourselves where we were last season and before this one started. Simply put, expectations for this season were, to put it mildly, measured. We acknowledged and praised the coaching staff for its refreshing "build for the future" approach to the draft and free agency. Our team didn't go out and overpay for the "band-aid" QB or the overpriced, over-the-hill, stop-gap free agent. And, by in large, I think we liked the approach because we acknowledged that this team is still rebuilding and no one player would put us over the top.

With the fast start, however, it's like we forgot about the fact that this team is building, not built. Our early record has lead some of us to forget this fact and become upset by the fact that we don't have a bonified franchise QB. We should be looking for improvement as a whole, whether that translates into wins or not. It is possible to for the rebuild to continue successfully without "our Tom Brady" on the roster.

[tiger187126]

He was just called out nationally for self-promotion. I read that and Graziano's quotes and wondered if there was a connection.

If you have a better theory why some in the Redskins locker room don't like Beck (per Graziano), feel free to offer it. It's not my opinion about whether Beck is disliked by some, I'm just passing on reporting by Graziano and connecting it to what I've seen about Beck at various times this year, last Sunday notably.

I have a feeling that Moss and possibly Gaffney may be some of the grumblers. I noticed in preseason that they hardly ever appeared on the field at the same time as Beck, even when Beck started. It struck me as odd. I think there's something to this, but the exact reasons would be speculation ... which I acknowleged in my post.

Something about Beck rubs some Redskin players the wrong way, enough to draw the attention and reporting of Graziano.

we haven't heard anything from beck this season, thus making him a good backup. he was put into a game and there is an open space next to starting qb for next week and he said he wants it. i just don't get the problem with that. he was very proactive with the beck for starter campaign all offseason while rex ate ice cream, but once the decision to start rex was made he said the right stuff and became a ghost. i just don't get the negative spin you put on it.

and i don't believe espn's nfc east blogger, who see's the team every once in a blue moon. i'll trust local insiders over national bloggers anyday and i haven't seen an article that shows unrest with beck's attitude. i remember a lot of preseason articles saying the exact opposite.

perhaps this quote:

“His little swag, his little swag that he has,” Gaffney said, via 106.7 The Fan. “And a lot of quarterbacks don’t do that, they just like to sit back and be mellow, but he likes to get amped up and get it going, and I like that in a QB.”

which says that you're forcing your argument where it doesn't fit.

again, you're creating things instead of looking at the reality.

[Son of Gadsden]

I do realize that Beck has been running the scout team. I also realize that he's been running the scout team everywhere he has been. I further realize that he was benched for Cleo Lemon. What I don't realize is why people continue to say that we "don't know who Beck is". He's the guy that couldn't beat out Rex, even though he was given a chance to do so.

Again, I'm not a Rex apologist. I just think the "we don't know what we have in Beck" thing is overblown. If he starts on Sunday, I will root for him like I do any other guy that's out there spilling their B&G guts. Hail.

Beating someone out in practice and preseason is not the same as beating someone out in a regular season game. Rex has always flourished in practice. He looks fantastic until he's put in a real situation, then he goes right to "releasing the dragon" and getting chased down for fumbles on the last play of the game. I'm desperately trying not to use the Brady cliche, but Brady got beat out by Bledsoe in practice and preseason. Which would you rather have? Beck was benched by a terrible Miami team whom obviously were not exactly personnel geniuses. If they were, they wouldnt have been at the bottom of the league for so long. Most would argue that Cutler is a very good QB, but he is not doing so hot in Chicago because of other factors. There are so many factors in the NFL, that any given day a new starter could arise from the bench. Some players don't look that great in practice, but have the charisma to lead a scoring drive when it matters.

Beck brought a sense of urgency to the game that i had not seen before he took the field. I was watching the game just so i could finish a couple more beers. The chances of winning had all but evaporated from watching Rex just destroy our chances and once again drag our team through the mud. He turned us into the laughing stock of the day, and made sure that the only thing we would dominate would be the highlight reels on "C'mon man!". He made Philly's garbage safety Coleman look like Troy Polamalu. When Beck took the field it had me sitting up in my seat eyes wide open thinking okay, lets see what this kid has. The first play was stepping up in the pocket and a first down gain of 11 or so. The second play Davis was open, but he didn't see him. Rather than forcing a pass into where he was looking, he backed off and ran for 12 yards. That built the confidence up we needed. It was a "calm down, look, we're still in this". It had us all beginning to watch the clock and do our math. The players looked energized. Seeing the blitzes coming to an inexperienced quarterback that the media LOVES to pick on and seeing him STEP UP in the pocket with confidence and make those throws gave me chills. The first Washington QB i saw was Ramsey, he got hurt i think the second game i saw, and Brunell threw the Monday night miracle. Since then its been Campbell, Collins, McNabb, and Grossman, and i have NEVER seen a QB bring me so much hope. I wasnt in the "cult of colt", hell i believed in Grossman after taking us 3-1, but Grossman had not been performing well, and the meltdown made me realize what a fairy tale i was living in. Grossman is not our savior, maybe Beck isnt either, but he was giving our D a break, and our offense a chance to catch some balls. He was giving everyone a SHOT to step up. He played with receivers he may not have ever thrown to. It's easy to simplify it to throwing a football, but this is the NFL, its not that easy. His cadence is completely new, and he doesnt know what to expect from the starters. We saw someone he KNEW what to expect from though, Terrence "TERROR SQUAD" Austin. They connected on one of the biggest plays of the game, which set us up for the late TD. I have no doubt Shanahan sent Austin out because of him being a familiar receiver. Shanahan is no fool. He knows when a cold QB is throwing to new receivers. Expect better passes next week from Beck. Hey, after all, count how many passes Beck threw to the dirt. They're likely pretty close to the amount of Grossmans that hit Coleman's hands. Dirt throw or INT? Make your choice.

[ncr2h]

Calm down, I'm just channeling the interwebs.

Dan Graziano chat today

PFT channeling Dan Steinberg

He was just called out nationally for self-promotion. I read that and Graziano's quotes and wondered if there was a connection.

If you have a better theory why some in the Redskins locker room don't like Beck (per Graziano), feel free to offer it. It's not my opinion about whether Beck is disliked by some, I'm just passing on reporting by Graziano and connecting it to what I've seen about Beck at various times this year, last Sunday notably.

I have a feeling that Moss and possibly Gaffney may be some of the grumblers. I noticed in preseason that they hardly ever appeared on the field at the same time as Beck, even when Beck started. It struck me as odd. I think there's something to this, but the exact reasons would be speculation ... which I acknowleged in my post.

Something about Beck rubs some Redskin players the wrong way, enough to draw the attention and reporting of Graziano.

My theory -

Beck symbolizes the positional, and at times racial, inequities in the NFL. Here is a guy that got drafted in the 2nd round, came in and absolutely stunk the place up. Horrid play. Yet he has stuck around in this league for years and years. Making matters worse is his boy scout attitude that makes it appear that he learned how to play QB from a textbook rather than from possessing some innate natural abilities. He's Kyle Boller. He's Patrick Ramsey. He's Joey Harrington. He's been given every single chance in the world to succeed, and IMO they just don't see the natural talent there to back up that level of commitment.

Rex is different. Rex is a QB they can relate to, whose treatment by the media most resembles what a highly-touted black QB would have received. He's been absolutely curb-stomped by the media ever since he stepped into the league. He's Vince Young. He's Michael Vick. He doesn't prep the boy scout answers for his interviews, it's not always pretty on the field, but he's had a knack for winning games. And even Rex's detractors acknowledge that he has talent - after all, there's "good" Rex and "bad" Rex...not just bad Rex. That 4th & 3 turned 18 yard TD to put us in place to win the game - that's natural talent. John Beck won't find that pass anywhere in his textbook. Rex has those moments - however interspersed they have been as of late - that make you say, "holy ****...I just witnessed something that very few other QBs could have done." And once they see it they don't forget it. They haven't seen that from Beck yet.

I mean the fact that Redskins fans were saying that Rex should be OUT OF THE LEAGUE after that performance last week...let's think about that. Patrick Ramsey still has a job. Sage Rosenfels has a job. John Beck still has a job.

[RemoveSnyder]

If you have a better theory why some in the Redskins locker room don't like Beck

It goes beyond the God Squad, because even the bible thumping Baptist has reservations for mormons, any mormon. But it probably relates in some way. I could imagine scenarios where any overtures of Beck's leadership talk, constructive criticism or demonstrative efforts at charging from the "pulpit," are misconstrued as egotistical or in some ways perceived by the starters as some uber attempt to emasculate the guy in-front of him on the depth chart.

Beck wants to play, that much is known. But for the starters, unless proven otherwise, you're a scrub until to do something legit during a real game. Beck's attempt to get on the field is probably seen as sophomoric exuberance.

But if you couple that with the biography of a guy who's probably felt slighted and passed over, never given much a chance - someone who likewise doesn't dull the edge of his convictions and/or whatever skills he has with booze and loose women, you've got a guy that doesn't exist in the modern NFL. That guy disappeared from the vast majority of NFL locker rooms before the internet was invented.

Beck probably just annoys people since he's probably singularly focused on being an NFL starter.

But none of that means jack when a guy suits up to play. I don't care about someone's religion or politics, if he's gonna fight and he's on my team, I'll fight right along side him. And, just my opinion, I think he should play. If for no other reason than to help shape the next offseason. But also because Beck has shown the ability to move and wing the ball. It's worth some cultivation.

[SKINS'n'Spurs]

There have been some posts critical of the coaching staff for the QB situation and have a "I'm freaking out" tone to them over this whole thing...

Let us remind ourselves where we were last season and before this one started. Simply put, expectations for this season were, to put it mildly, measured. We acknowledged and praised the coaching staff for its refreshing "build for the future" approach to the draft and free agency. Our team didn't go out and overpay for the "band-aid" QB or the overpriced, over-the-hill, stop-gap free agent. And, by in large, I think we liked the approach because we acknowledged that this team is still rebuilding and no one player would put us over the top.

With the fast start, however, it's like we forgot about the fact that this team is building, not built. Our early record has lead some of us to forget this fact and become upset by the fact that we don't have a bonified franchise QB. We should be looking for improvement as a whole, whether that translates into wins or not. It is possible to for the rebuild to continue successfully without "our Tom Brady" on the roster.

Amen to that, I am 110% happy with drafting Kerrigan and picking up all those other guys by passing on a 1st round QB. We knew we weren't going to have an all star QB, our expectations for this season should be just around where we are now...I expected a win against DAL and a loss against PHI pre-preseason.....damn Romo sits to pee and Dez! The lockerroom is behind Rex for a reason and I'm pretty sure if Santana is speaking up about it, well then its probably real and not just for PR purposes. Beck had his chance to win the game our DEF played lights out in the 2nd half may I remind you holding PHI to ZERO scoring. Im hoping we start Rex, let him bounce back if he can, turn some doubters minds; if not, so be it, replace him at half or 3rd qtr with Beck and make him the new starter. I get the feeling Shanahan isn't going to play it exactly like that though. He is going to prepare for every game differently and choose the QB he has available and thinks gives us the best opportunity to win (he's said that like a million times already, I'm pretty sure he believes it). I know fellow mormon Steve Young thinks Beck should start, but Beck is no Young and that's painfully obvious.

[War Paint]

I think the theory that teammates don't like Beck is BS. However, if some of our WRs are annoyed with Beck, it could be that Beck chews them out in a huddle if they run the wrong route. Then the WR thinks to himself, "who in the heck does this guy think he is? He hasn't done nothing and he has the nerve to criticize me". It could be something like that. Also, we've probably had dopey and mellow QBs in the huddle for several years, like Campbell and Grossman. Beck is probably more fiery and critical in the huddle, so some might not be used to it.