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The case for Brandon Banks., the 'Mike Nelms' of the new millennium.

Gibbs Hog Heaven

By Gibbs Hog Heaven
in The Stadium

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Lavarleap56

Lavarleap56

Posted
Posted
I'm hoping that he could find a way to at LEAST be productive in the screen game/misdirection (though the fact that he is even in the game would alert the defenders to be on the lookout for plays like that). But yeah, I'm hot expecting too much on offense from him either.

A defense will be on alert for gadget plays when/if Banks comes into the game on offense. Banks just is not effective as a WR to warrant a defense respecting him as a actual WR. Aldrick Robinson has the same speed as Banks but is a better WR so he would be the more logical choice for gadget plays.

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brasi

brasi

Posted
Posted
Yeah because a aging tight end whose slow as molasses and a number three at best has more value than a potentially elite return guy who can flip field position in a heartbeat, and has a chance to score whenever he touches the ball. Did I mention he is fast? Like super fast? And much younger than Cooley?

Point is he beat out all the people that have been cut for his roster spot, at least in the coaches mind, not yours maybe but coach is the only opinion that matters. He has more value than T. Austin, AA, Cooley etc. He deserves his spot. Stop hating. Sit back and let the fireworks begin. HTTR.

I know you are right. I was just angry. LOL

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hoosandskinsMUSTwin

hoosandskinsMUSTwin

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Couldn't agree with OP more. Dude's a playmaker that would be scooped up, possibly inside the division, the second we dropped him. Field position is huge. And don't give me this "oh you never get a chance to return anymore" crap. Sure punters get better at kicking away, but the percentage of shanks and poor punts skyrocket at the same time as they try to place the ball. (Amazed that Skins fans haven't noticed how often this happens with Brandon back there) In two seasons, he has 9 returns of 40+ yards. That's obviously not counting all the returns he has called back, including at least two more TD's in which the infraction had no impact whatsoever on his return. By the way he also has 3 preseason TD's. He has not lost a single fumble in regular season. He is a threat to score every time he touches the ball - and he is worth a roster spot for field position if nothing else.

He will always teeter the line. If he can't stay healthy or if he makes a few bonehead plays than he will be gone. He can also break a game wide open for you. The reward outweighs the risk. Certainly more value than a 6th WR that may contribute 15 catches or something this season. I think the Shanahans and the front office made the right call, and continue to make the back end of our roster the best its been since before Danny boy took over.

Do your thing Banks. Hate On Haters. That's all the website has become anyways.

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Morneblade

Morneblade

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Two things I see wrong with the OP

1. Banks is not Mike Nelms.

2. Return Specialists are not as important as they used to be when the majority of kickoffs are out of the endzone.

This leaves Punt Returns as the only reliable way a return specialist like Brandon can make a impact. Touchbacks went from 21% to over 50% in 2011, therefore making "good" kickoff returns few and far between. "Good" being not taking the ball 5-9 yards deep in the endzone, which in the past was a absolute no-no but last year you saw happen alot more.

As much as we all like to see Brandon Banks taking returns to the house, the new rules limit the impact guys like him have on the game. I dont know if I would kept him on the roster taking that into consideration.

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Jumbo

Jumbo

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Do your thing Banks. Hate On Haters. That's all the website has become anyways.

If you really believe that, then unless you are a very disturbed individual, you should leave. And if it should be that you actually are a very disturbed individual, then you should leave. :)

If, on the other hand, like so many people who are opining on Banks lately (pro or con) you have simply (hopefully temporarily) placed what sense you may have behind wanting to just peel off some really dumbass remark and stick in a thread, then just enjoy fitting in with so many others. :)

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Murphs56

Murphs56

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Posted
So is Banks making the team really a bad thing? Really?

The team is/was SERIOUSLY devoid of playmakers...say what you will about Banks, but he definitely has genuine playmaking ability. He has good speed and vision, as well as the ability to get behind defenses.

Nope, the crime before was...Ahhhhh shucks this Banks is going to deprive us of Briscoe or Robinson. BOO HOO. In the end it did NOT as both made the team and now they are fishing...White, Kehl etc. Even though we ended up with 52 and could've kept one of them

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KCClybun

KCClybun

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So is Banks making the team really a bad thing? Really?

The team is/was SERIOUSLY devoid of playmakers...say what you will about Banks, but he definitely has genuine playmaking ability. He has good speed and vision, as well as the ability to get behind defenses.

It's not devoid of playmakers anymore.

That's what I don't friggin' get. People act like Banks is the only way we can possibly score points. In 2010, you'd have an argument. Now? We've got a quarterback with a strong arm and big time whees, we have a tight end that should've been in the Pro Bowl (<insert your obligatory "one puff away" comment here, I know it's coming from somewhere>), a wide receiver who somehow managed to perform with Dan Orlovsky and Curtis Painter throwing him the ball who had an instant chemistry, good running backs, talented guys opposite Garçon in Morgan and Hank, a lighter and hopefully faster Santana Moss. We are not devoid of playmakers.

People act like we're trotting Santana Moss out there to be double covered with James Thrash or Antwaan Randle El on the field, and maybe we'll get lucky and Devin Thomas will run one of the two routes his knows and break tackle for a big play, and Randle El is either going to fair catch or desperately dance sideline to sideline praying for a whole. Or Devin Thomas is just going to charge headlong into a pile of 20 dudes.

Most of our guys run sub 4.5 forties, and one of the receivers we have ran the exact same speed at Banks did at the Combine. All of our receivers can get behind a defense. We've got guys who can return kicks.

"He's a threat to take it back every time he touches the ball." Including punt returns, kick returns, receptions, and rushing attempts, and the reverse TD pass, Brandon Banks has touched the ball 178 times in two years. He's scored 2 touchdowns. 178 touches. 2 touchdowns. And yes, I know about the touchdowns he's gotten called back. Facts are facts. 178 touches. 2 touchdowns to show for it.

In 188 touches, Pierre Garcon has 16 touchdowns.

When Santana was in NY, by the time Santana got to that number of touches just on offense, Santana had 19 touchdowns.

Josh Morgan has 146 touches and 9 touchdowns.

By the end of Devin Hester's third season, just returning kicks and punts, he'd scored 11 touchdowns in 215 touches, just on special teams. In '07 he also scored 2 touchdowns on offense.

Patrick Peterson was a rookie last season, and he's already got four touchdowns.

And I'm sure those guys had some bad luck and had a touchdown or two called back at some point.

178 touches. 2 touchdowns. Come on, man.

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Lavarleap56

Lavarleap56

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http://bloggingthebeast.com/2012/07/06/film-breakdown-brandon-banks-fumbled-on-7-kickpunt-returns-last-year-didnt-lose-any/

Im tired of the fumbles.. Your only lucky for so long until it comes back to bite you.

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Im also tired of hearing he is a playmaker when he really has not done much of note since 2010. Yes he had some explosive plays this preseason but we all know Banks is fast and he should be out running 3rd and 4th team guys. Playmakers don't give you 1 TD in 2 seasons. Playmakers don't have stats like these http://www.footballoutsiders.com/player/25755/brandon-banks..

Then we have people throwing around the term "elite" and Banks around in the same sentence when he is not a elite returner. Yes Banks lead the league in kick return yards but he also lead the league in number of kick returns so naturally when you return more you will have more yards..http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BankBr00.htm.

All that being said I would not mind him on the roster at all if he was more secure with the football and didn't stall at times trying to make something out of nothing then create a negative play. My other issue is we have people on the roster who can return so part of me thinks its a waste of a roster spot that could be filled by another player. End of the day I don't think any skins fan once the season gets going will cheer against Banks but for right now there are valid reasons to think the skins should have moved on from Banks. Some people think hes a mirage some think hes the best returner ever apparently. Everyone will have a opinion but to me throwing out all the glowing praise and over the top comments are not warranted. Just for the record I would love for Banks to clean up his game and be a force for us but in my gut I just don't see it happening.

Mike Nelms really.. that's disrespectful to Mr.Nelms. Brandon has a long way to go until he is in that category.

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TSO

TSO

Posted
Posted
The person that uses this term more than anyone is Mike Shanahan....

lol, I was just about to say that.

Oh well, I told myself I would not touch this debate, but I do want to say this. Banks does make plays and he looks as fast as he looked back in 2010. I can't stress that enough. A lot of the negativity thrown towards Banks by guys like LL, DC9, GHH and NLC (haters :pfft: ) is based on what he did in 2011 more than anything else. I totally understand that and respect their opinion because he really wasn't much of a factor. In 2010, teams were scared of him and we would automatically get good field position off of punts... I think a lot of that is forgotten. I remember being annoyed like 10 times at the opposing team's punter for kicking it out of bounds or away from Banks. He was NOT the same guy last season, and it was obvious his knee was an issue almost the entire time. How anyone can look at him now and say he's not any different, I don't know. To me, it really is that simple. He looks like the Banks of 2010 except slightly improved in terms of what he can do at WR and even at tailback. I know, I know... he still stinks at being able to catch the ball consistently since DBs can just run through him but, hey, at least he can run more routes now. He basically had two routes before and that was the go route and maybe an intermediate hitch/curl. Plus, he really tried everything he possibly could do this offseason to make the team. I'm surprised at how annoyed so many are by him making the roster.

Seriously, can anyone question how bad he wanted to make this team and how hard he tried to improve at WR? As Redskins fans, isn't that alone pretty endearing? Yes, I know everyone wanted to make the team as well, but I honestly think few tried harder than Banks. He was even open about it the entire time which takes a lot of swallowing pride. How would you feel if people were constantly asking you about how you're going about improving a certain aspect of your work? Remember Orakpo even got annoyed after the first few times people asked him about adding some moves to his repertoire.

I don't know... I think it's pretty neat he ended up making the team. He clearly put everything he had in being a Redskin.

That's all I'm going to say on this, though. I really don't want this to keep being an ongoing issue. Heck, Banks might be a guy we cut during the season depending on the development of other guys. By no means has Shanahan ever shown that he's just going to stick to a guy no matter what. That alone renders this debate silly, in my mind. :)

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Skinsfan4life83

Skinsfan4life83

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Posted

I couldn't agree more or have said it better myself. And your last statement is the truest of the bunch. Shanahan could end up cutting banks during the season if he does not perform.

Maybe I have come off a little harsh in this debate and for that I apologize. There are many posters on here whom I respect a great deal. That being said it just irritates me that a guy who is such a explosive weapon and who tried as hard as he did recieve such hate and dislike on this board.

If he wouldn't have made the team the people so vehemetlly against wouldn't have let us Banks supporters forget how wrong we were.

But it happened to work out in his favor and it seems to me like people against him will come up with any argument as to why he shouldn't be here.

I respect everyone's opinion no matter how wrong they are:)

We are all fans of the same team no matter how much we disagree. I apologize for being so harsh but in this case us Banks supporters were right and the dislikers(is that better than haters? Lol) were dead wrong.

HTTR.

---------- Post added September-2nd-2012 at 06:38 AM ----------

One more thing.

The people who dislike Banks so much always site someones preseason performance as reason why a certain player should have earned a spot instead of Banks. Briscoe, Robinson(whom im glad made the team), AA etc.But Banks had a damn good preseason as well. But his preseason performance gets responses like "He does it every preseason" or "Its only preseason, he's playing against 3rd and 4th stringers"

But for guys like Briscoe its "He had a great preseason and earned his spot" failing to menion the majority of his work was against 3rd and 4th stringers as well. Its hypocrisy.

Now the dislikers(theres that word i made up again:)) resort to calling us supporters childish because they dont like a certain H word they have been labeled with.

This is my last post on the subject for a while, basically there is no need to debate it any further until the season begins. Mainly because he is on the team now nd going no where, at leat for now anyways. Then we can praise, or be critical of his weekly performances.

HTTR

---------- Post added September-2nd-2012 at 06:38 AM ----------

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RandyHolt

RandyHolt

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Time after time last year, I saw Banks returning kicks up the gut. I presume it was designed but I cringed almost every time fearing fumbles. And as LL56 pointed out, it is an issue we have been somewhat lucky with. He does seem to get the fumble back, being small and quick may help him in that.

His game is speed and going wide, and I want to see returns called wide much much more often than last year. I think so many attempts at returning kicks up the gut held him back.

Banks while fearless like Nelms calls for fair catches. He is thus not Mike Nelms.

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Est.1974

Est.1974

Posted
Posted
Heck, Banks might be a guy we cut during the season depending on the development of other guys. By no means has Shanahan ever shown that he's just going to stick to a guy no matter what. That alone renders this debate silly, in my mind. :)

I think that's a good point. I expect that the roster will see changes throughout the first few weeks of the season. We could see a players in / cut each week as they essentially try-out a few guys.

Also, lets now forget that RG3 is still a rookie and we have new faces at RB & WR...With 3 road games in the first month, maybe the big play threat of Banks is seen as having better value in the short-term.

I'm expecting that we'll need 30 points to stick with the Saints for a start...

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Burgold

Burgold

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Posted

My feelings on Banks haven't changed. I want a healthy Banks on my team. A 100% Banks is money. He's a playmaker, a gamechanger with great speed and instincts. However, I am fearful of a 90% Banks being on my team. A little knick, any loss of speed whatsoever and he is a liability. He's got one dimension, speed/escapability. At his size, he is likely to get hurt.

Heck, at every size NFL players are always hurting. I'm not worried about injuries that take him out of the game, but the tweaks that most players fight through. Those tweaks take him from deadly to ordinary, but worse because he is such an emotional, high effort guy it leads to mistakes. He's muffed a lot of balls trying to be brilliant.

A brilliant Brandon Banks on a perfect field, healthy is something to scare special teams coaches. A game four Brandon Banks isn't.

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TSO

TSO

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I know but Mike tends to get stuck on players at times for better or worse. Banks did barely make it on since the coaching staff was split on him being on/off.

Like who? I've seen the complete opposite, LL. Mike will cut anyone.

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