New (FL) law forbidding doctors to talk to patients about guns angers physicians

[bcl05]

Would you agree that drowning is a child safety issue? It claims the lives of far more children annually than gun accidents. Why is the advice given by the AAP on this issue so different?

Absolutely. That's why the very same AAP document that I quoted about gun safety has an entirely comparable section about pool safety. Here it is:

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A swimming pool can be very dangerous for children. If possible, do not put a swimming pool in your yard until your children are older than 5 years. Help protect your children from drowning by doing the following:

Never leave your children alone in or near the pool, even for a moment.

An adult who knows CPR should actively supervise children at all times.

Practice touch supervision with children younger than 5 years. This means that the adult is within an arm's length of the child at all times.

You must put up a fence to separate your house from the pool. Most young children who drown in pools wander out of the house and fall into the pool. Install a fence at least 4 feet high around all 4 sides of the pool. This fence will completely separate the pool from the house and play area of the yard. Use gates that self-close and self-latch, with latches higher than your children's reach.

Keep rescue equipment (such as a shepherd's hook or life preserver) and a telephone by the pool.

Do not use air-filled "swimming aids" as a substitute for approved life vests.

Remove all toys from the pool after use so children aren't tempted to reach for them.

After the children are done swimming, secure the pool so they can't get back into it.

A power safety cover that meets the standards of the American Society for Testing and Materials (ASTM) may add to the protection of your children but should not be used in place of the fence between your house and the pool. Even fencing around your pool and using a power safety cover will not prevent all drownings.

Remember, teaching your child how to swim DOES NOT mean your child is safe in water

Last Updated

5/19/2011

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So they say that its best not to have a pool at all. If you have to have a pool, keep kids away from it and secure it with fencing and appropriate safety devices (life jackets, shepard's hook, etc.)

So you say that the AAP advice on pools is "so different." To my eyes, it looks almost identical to the advice regarding guns. Did you even bother to check?

[Burgold]

I don't think of pwned very often, but the good doctor just pwned someone.

[Larry]

The Florida law is not a violation of the 1st amendment... it does not prevent doctors inquiring about guns if there is a specific reason to do so.

And everybody knows that the First Amendment clearly states that "Congress shal make no law abridging Freedom of Speach inquiring About Things That The Government Thinks You Have a Good Enough Reason to Speak About".

[Cept One]

Legitimately curious, has your doctor ever inquired as to your gun ownership?

~Bang

No but i haven't been to the doctor in about 10yrs maybe longer...

[Bang]

No but i haven't been to the doctor in about 10yrs maybe longer...

i would bet my bottom buck that if you had, then your answer would be the same.

This is a red herring ploy. A non-issue.. but it has allowed one of our rights to be eroded.

If a doctor asked you, would you feel comfortable saying "I don't really think this is your business, and would rather not discuss it"... or calling the cops on the guy because he asked?

this is my problem with this. I get all the need to protect 2nd amendment rights. But I don't thnk it is necessary to do this in order to do so.

In fact, I believe anyone who thinks this is a good and necessary step should have their head examined (by a doctor of their choice, of course).

This is SO un-American. There's just no defense of it, IMO. You and me and anyone else are plenty capable of fending off the doctor's question politely and effectively without needing to restrict speech by law. (If he even asks, which I very much doubt he ever will.)

~Bang

[Henry]

For the record, my pediatrician asks if we have a gun in the house every time I bring one of the kids in for a checkup. I always thought it was a little weird, but I don't really care either. If it really bugged me I'd take my kids to a different doctor. :shrug:

[Larry]

I wouldn't go as far as saying they a purposefully lying. They are using statistics that were released by groups like the Brady Campaign and have been proven to be complete bull****.

:secret: Actually, the only statistics I've seen posted in this thread were released by the CDC, and are 100% accurate.

[Jumbo]

Kids: DO NOT take your guns into the pool.

[Bang]

Kids: DO NOT take your guns into the pool.

And of course, do NOT point your pool at anyone else.

~Blub

---------- Post added July-19th-2011 at 08:01 PM ----------

For the record, my pediatrician asks if we have a gun in the house every time I bring one of the kids in for a checkup. I always thought it was a little weird, but I don't really care either. If it really bugged me I'd take my kids to a different doctor. :shrug:

And you didn't call the law?

Don't you know he was trying to trample your rights?

You should have shot him.

~Bang

[Predicto]

So, my new understanding of the Second Amendment is that it is an unconstitutional infringement of your right to bear arms to ever even talk to you about gun safety.

Whew. Glad I cleared that up. I better go tell some judges.

[Burgold]

So, my new understanding of the Second Amendment is that it is an unconstitutional infringement of your right to bear arms to ever even talk to you about gun safety.

Whew. Glad I cleared that up. I better go tell some judges.

That's strange. I thought the second ammendment protected American's right to shoot their mouth off.

[Jumbo]

And of course, do NOT point your pool at anyone else.

Unless you intend to use it.

" "You can have my pool when you pry it from my cold, wet fingers"

[Burgold]

Unless you intend to use it.

" "You can have my pool when you pry it from my cold, wet, pruny fingers"

[Madison Redskin]

I think most gun owners would agree that the instant background check system signed into law by R. Reagan is necessary. Registration, waiting periods, magazine capacity and caliber restrictions on the other hand are not.

So, in your view, "caliber restrictions" are unnecessary. I agree they are unnecessary (as few things are truly necessary), but they are a rather good idea.

:pfft:

The Florida law is not a violation of the 1st amendment... it does not prevent doctors inquiring about guns if there is a specific reason to do so. What it does is prevent is doctors from pushing a politically motivated and and factually dishonest information in the guise of medical advise. The AAP's idea of gun safety is telling their patients don't own a gun.

So, in your view, the government is free to prohibit anyone from "pushing a politically motivated and and factually dishonest information"? People may only ask others questions, without fear of government regulation, if such questions are in connection with compelling safety concerns. Well, I'm sure Fox News will be disppointed to learn about your ruling.

[bcl05]

Since we're all having so much fun with the AAP's safety recommendations, I give you their fact sheet on baby walkers:

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Healthy Children > Safety & Prevention > At Home > Baby Walkers: A Dangerous Choice

Safety & Prevention

-+

Baby Walkers: A Dangerous Choice

"I was thinking about registering for a baby walker but a friend told me that baby walkers aren't safe. Why?"

Many parents think walkers will help their children learn to walk. But they don't. In fact, walkers can actually delay when a child starts to walk.

Children in baby walkers can:

Roll down the stairs — which often causes broken bones and severe head injuries. This is how most children get hurt in baby walkers.

Get burned — a child can reach higher in a walker. It is now easier for a child to pull a tablecloth off a table and spill hot coffee, grab pot handles off the stove, and reach radiators, fireplaces, or space heaters.

Drown — a child can fall into a pool or bathtub while in a walker.

Be poisoned — reaching high objects is easier in a walker.

Most walker injuries happen while adults are watching. Parents or caregivers simply cannot respond quickly enough. A child in a walker can move more than 3 feet in 1 second! That is why walkers are never safe to use, even with an adult close by.

What you can do

Throw out your baby walkers! Also, be sure that there are no walkers wherever your child is being cared for, such as child care centers or in someone else's home.

Try something just as enjoyable but safer, like

Stationary activity centers—they look like walkers but have no wheels. They usually have seats that rotate, tip, and bounce.

Play yards or playpens—these are great safety zones for children as they learn to sit, crawl, or walk.

High chairs—older children often enjoy sitting up in a high chair and playing with toys on the tray.

About safety standards

New safety standards for baby walkers have been in place since 1997. They are now made wider so they cannot fit through most doors, or they have brakes to stop them at the edge of a step. However, these improvements will not prevent all injuries from walkers. They still have wheels, so children can still move fast and reach higher.

The American Academy of Pediatrics has called for a ban on the manufacture and sale of baby walkers with wheels.

Last Updated

5/13/2011

Source

Baby Walkers: What You Need to Know (Copyright © 2008 American Academy of Pediatrics)

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Have at it. There are dozens more like this. We pediatricians are just nutty for child safety. Better muzzle us with laws...

[Burgold]

BC105 is infringing on my rights by posting all these guidelines. Where's the gobernmint!

[PokerPacker]

Since we're all having so much fun with the AAP's safety recommendations, I give you their fact sheet on baby walkers:

Have at it. There are dozens more like this. We pediatricians are just nutty for child safety. Better muzzle us with laws...

cut your losses, dude. If you continue you won't be permitted to speak to parents at all.

[Cept One]

So you say that the AAP advice on pools is "so different." To my eyes, it looks almost identical to the advice regarding guns. Did you even bother to check?

take a look at the language used

Do not purchase a gun, especially a handgun.

Remove all guns present in the home.

as opposed to

If possible, do not put a swimming pool in your yard

[bcl05]

take a look at the language used

as opposed to

Surely you realize that a gun is smaller and easier to remove than a swimming pool?

Also, the AAP seemed to reserve their strongest language for baby walkers. Might be a better comparison...

[Bang]

take a look at the language used

Hmm..

All of it thwarted utterly and completely by two little letters.

"NO"

Doc- "I recommend you remove all guns from your home"

You- "NO"

Doc " ... ok, well let's take a look at that knee."

Just curious bcl05.. what is the AAP position on small tiny pieces of plastic that kids might swallow?

How about cribs? Any guidelines there?

In the not too distant future...

Patient: Doc, it hurts when I do this

Doc: Well, don't do that

Police: FREEZE, COMMIE!

~Bang

[Cept One]

:secret: Actually, the only statistics I've seen posted in this thread were released by the CDC, and are 100% accurate.

:no:

the APP website does not source where it gets those statistics...

http://www.healthychildren.org/English/safety-prevention/all-around/Pages/Gun-Safety-Keeping-Children-Safe.aspx

---------- Post added July-19th-2011 at 04:46 PM ----------

Hmm..

All of it thwarted utterly and completely by two little letters.

"NO"

Doc- "I recommend you remove all guns from your home"

You- "NO"

Doc " ... ok, well you will have to find another doctor to take a look at that knee."

~Bang

fixed it for ya

[Bang]

:no:

the APP website does not source where it gets those statistics...

http://www.healthychildren.org/English/safety-prevention/all-around/Pages/Gun-Safety-Keeping-Children-Safe.aspx

---------- Post added July-19th-2011 at 04:46 PM ----------

fixed it for ya

So you mean to tell me that an American businessman can't decide who he does business with, or does that only count when they're gay?

Seriously, and this has nothing to do with you cept,, but this thread has taken pretty much all of the horse**** "philosophy" that the current Republican Party is supposed to believe, thrown it all in a barrel, and made it as easy as fish when it comes to shooting them.

(So long as some doctor doesn't try to convince me shooting lies and hypocrisies in a barrel is bad for me)

~Bang

[bcl05]

Come on. My doc told me to eat less, exercise more, and drink less coffee. Not happening. Not going to drop me as a patient. People disregard doctors' advice all the time. Anybody who dropped patients for noncompliance would rapidly be out of business. One or two nutty docs taking a dumb stand on this one issue have nothing to do with the AAP or pediatricians in general.

[Bang]

Not to mention the belief that there aren't any doctors who also believe in 2nd amendment rights is rather ludicrous.

Any of you smokers ever been dropped for smoking by your doctor? (not because of insurance)

~Bang

[Madison Redskin]

Cept one:

I'm still waiting for a response to this:

So, in your view, the government is free to prohibit anyone from "pushing a politically motivated and and factually dishonest information"? People may only ask others questions, without fear of government regulation, if such questions are in connection with compelling safety concerns.