Report: Redskins front-runners for V. Young

[jflow78]

Posting what I can find from last season as he improved alot as a player.

I'll admit man, I did not watch the Titans much last season, outside the Skins game against them, but I'm pretty damn impressed by how good a passer he is in that second video. Like I said, I'm just terrified that he's going to become another AH, but that 2nd video nearly has me comforted that he's not McNabb anymore. He's a lot more accurate than I gave him credit for. Like I said before, McNabb was never accurate last season. That's one of the things that soured me on him was that it seemed like more luck than skill when his passes hit their targets and I didn't want that again, but if the videos are a good example, then he's really gotten a ton better.

[blindlywewander]

All this trade talk. Get it through your heads people. He'll be a free agent. The Titans have said multiple times that they will cut him. No one's trading for anyone. This is a discussion about a FA signing.

And as far as the Fisher trust issue thing, I think Fisher is horribly over rated. Fisher did well with Steve McNair, though his offense looked horrible in the later years with McNair (though McNair went on to lead another team to the playoffs immediately after leaving Tennessee). Other than Steve, Fisher has had Billy Volek, VY and Kerry Collins running the show. I'm not a supporter of Fisher's decisions at QB. I don't think his word means anything. He knows football and is a good coach, but he's not some offensive guru. I don't hold his opinion very highly. Just my 2 cents.

[addicted]

Agree the second video was more impressive than the first - that first video against the Cardinals was impressive in its own way but it showed a lot of the things that worry me about Young as well. In the second video he was much more accurate and consistent.

Love me some of these video posts. It's as if everything else doesn't matter and as long as you can see a 2-10 minute clip of "what might be" then you can forget everything else. Not the way to build your team imo

[MartinC]

He broke the record for rushing as a QB is rookie year. He doesn't take off as much now, he stays in the pocket most of the time now. If you watch his film you would see that. If he does take off its only to get much needed first downs or because none of the receivers are open.

I actually dont have problem with him not having lots of rushing yards - I want my QB to beat you with his arm not his legs. I like that in the videos LL56 has posted he shows paitence.

Are you sure about that rushing record - Mike Vick has at least one 1,000 yard year and a couple in the 900's.

[SpacePenguin]

Sub 60% completion, struggles short to intermediate, problems reading the whole field, leadership issues.

I thought they already figured out this type of qb does not fit into Kyle's offense, after last year.

Have any of you actually listened to his interviews with the media? I've been feeling sorry for TN for years. Man is as dumb as a rock lol...

Please no!

[elkabong82]

I actually dont have problem with him not having lots of rushing yards - I want my QB to beat you with his arm not his legs. I like that in the videos LL56 has posted he shows paitence.

Are you sure about that rushing record - Mike Vick has at least one 1,000 yard year and a couple in the 900's.

the record is just for rushing yards by a rookie QB. In his rookie season Vick had 289 rush yards, Young had 552 his rookie year.

[MartinC]

Love me some of these video posts. It's as if everything else doesn't matter and as long as you can see a 2-10 minute clip of "what might be" then you can forget everything else. Not the way to build your team imo

I'm not a fan of bringing Young here for reasons I have already stated in this thread - and I'm sure that any decision to sign him or not will be based on more than some YouTube footage. What LL56 has posted though shows Young doing some good things as a pocket passer, nothing but also nothing less.

[blindlywewander]

And if he doesn't then what is the point about going after this guy? If you don't think he's good enough to be your starter then forget him and bring in someone with less baggage.

That doesn't really make sense to me. We're going after him to evaluate and see if he can earn a spot. If not, he doesn't. That simple. The 'baggage' is so media-fed and over blown. If he can prove that he's a bit more mature and can continue his winning way, there's no doubt we should bring him here.

[MartinC]

the record is just for rushing yards by a rookie QB. In his rookie season Vick had 289 rush yards, Young had 552 his rookie year.

Thanks understood.

[jflow78]

Love me some of these video posts. It's as if everything else doesn't matter and as long as you can see a 2-10 minute clip of "what might be" then you can forget everything else. Not the way to build your team imo

Hey, I'm not on the "GO GET HIM!" train, but the videos helped me feel a little better about his accuracy issues, his lack of ability to run the offense, and his lack of ability to be coached. It's not hard to see that if you're going through your progressions to #3 and 4 you're running the offense, and if you're footwork is decent your passes are going to be accurate. Everyone knew Young had the natural talent, it was the progress as a passer that I hadn't seen, the videos prove (though to a limited point) that he has progressed there.

What still scars me is who he is off the field. There's not any video that will make me feel better after watching him punch a night club security guy because he was talking trash about UT. So, even though I'm giving great reviews of the progress I can see in the videos, I'm still just as worried that he'll fly off the handle at the slightest thing. I don't want another AH on this team, that's what I'm scared of more than anything.

EDIT:

Mostly, I'm trying to be objective about this, since I have no choice in the matter anyway, and I'm not willing to "quit on the team" if they sign him. Plus, I respect LL same as I do you and others on this board. So, I'm trying to be "open-minded" here.

[texasthunder]

.

"In 2009, Chris Johnson played 9 games with Vince Young at QB (not including Week-17, we exclude for the skew of performance data that a Game-16/Week-17 stats can be around the league). The first 6 games of 2009, Johnson played with Kerry Collins at QB – then Young took over for the rest of the season. The difference between Chris Johnson’s time with Young vs. with Collins was remarkable.

15.8 carries per game with Collins, 25.2 carries per game with Young (59.5% more carries with Young)"

Ask yourself why did CJ's rush attempts per game increase 59.5% with VY playing QB? I believe its because Fisher didn't trust VY throwing the ball as much as he trusted the old Collins doing that. TK just posted that Shanahan values Fishers evaluation of QB's greatly. If he trusted VY throwing the ball then he would have had him throw it more then Collins but they shifted the offense with VY under center to a primarily rushing attack. This isn't done by accident imo and it doesn't speak well of what Fisher thought of VY the pass throwing QB.

Plummer wasn't suspended by his former team twice for off the field stuff. Young was

.

Do you think it could have been due to the fact that Chris Johnson was averaging 6.1 yards per carry in those first six games?

Or that they also just had their bye week and the owner of the team told Fisher to put Young in ??

Those are just as plausable reasons as the speculation you are postng.

And in regard to suspensions-

Please provide a link that shows where Young was even suspended one time.

Here is one to the contrary:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5419427

[SkinsTribeVA]

We agree on this. This was the year that they came off an 0-5 start and were desperate.

Now you are making a poor arguement.

Your saying that his carries, not production increased almost 60% because of VY's performances?

Sorry don't buy that.

When you have as drastic a rise in carries like this it comes down to offensive philosophy more then anything. They went from a passing team to a rushing team. Doubt that had anything more to do with it then Fisher thinking he could win that way instead of relying on Youngs arm the way he tried to rely on Collins arm. It's not that CJ's rushing yards went up, the coaches call the plays and they rode CJ more with Young as the QB showing they liked that more then Young throwing the ball.

BecauseFisher wanted a balanced offense and thought that Collins was his best shot for the passing game. He beat out Young to start the year and Fisher threw the ball more then. When the bottom fell out and they were desperate at 0-5 he ditched the passing game and rode CJ not Youngs arm and benched Collins.

In fact in that span of 10 games we refer too all the time Young only threw the ball more then 200 yards in 4 of those games and actually had games of 89 passing yards, 116 passing yards, 125 passing yards, and 132 passing yards for the entire game during that span.

And some of you wonder why Im not believing the "he's a winner" argument

I wasn't making any absolute or causal claims in that post, I was just offering plausible alternative explanations because I think your "mid-season offensive philosophy shift" cannot explain the whole story, when the original post you made about it seemed to claim that was the only difference-maker.

About your last line, I'll post exactly what I've posted before: 30-17 as a starter, while the team without him was 15-18, and 13 of those 15 wins were when Kerry Collins finally played one season like the franchise QB he was supposed to be for Carolina. He's a winner, but he's got other issues.

[jflow78]

I actually dont have problem with him not having lots of rushing yards - I want my QB to beat you with his arm not his legs. I like that in the videos LL56 has posted he shows paitence.

Exactly how I feel. McNabb was good at beating you with his legs, Vick was even better, but neither was a great pocket passer IMO (though I don't watch the Eagles when they aren't playing the Skins, so I don't know if people are correct in saying Vick has progressed). I don't want a repeat of one of those guys.

[SkinsTribeVA]

Who believes that we would sign him over other teams who need QB's just to sit him on the bench to rot?

You just made one yourself

And if he doesn't then what is the point about going after this guy? If you don't think he's good enough to be your starter then forget him and bring in someone with less baggage.

-I did not make a straw man argument whatsoever because I was responding to this quote from you: "And my next question is why would you want him becoming the face of the Franchise with the history he has?"

-What one would deduce from your post is that there are only two options for a QB: be the face of the franchise or "sit on the bench to rot." As you know, there are a whole lot of situations a QB can be in between those two. I'm suggesting VY be forced to compete, possibly earning a starting spot (which could LEAD to him being the face of the franchise IF he wins over time), or possibly staying on the bench for a couple seasons, providing insurance or competition, or possibly even becoming future trade bait.

-I bet there are few people in the league that don't think VY has the talents to be an at least decent starting QB, if not great. It's a matter of his other issues and finding the right situation.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

I'm getting the impression the HC is reaching and thinking, ala last year with the proven vet., he can pick a QB and win with him in the here and now. And ala last year, I don't think the end result will be much different.

I really don't know what to make of VY. I've never been a fan (always thought he was Michael Vick, but not as athletic. And I don't much rate Vick either, for the record. Outside of last year, he's been little better than average with his arm. I prefer my QB have a good arm and head rather than hot legs); but he certainly has athletic ability. The clips LL put up would suggest, for want of a better word, that he's maturing. Particularly the Houston one were he showed a lot better poise. (The Cards one, although he finished it off, summed up VY the passer to me. Some good, some bad, some lucky. And a whole bunch of average.). But there's still his career stats to date. And they don't lie.

I guess ultimately if Shanahan wants him, then you get behind it and go with that. It's not like we're in a good position QB wise to start with, and the FA pool is REAL slim pickings. I just hope the Coach isn't thinking he can turn VY into his Elway and we can turn this right around now.

Hail.

[lookin4ahomeTexan]

Meant to post this with an earlier post North Shore vs Madison High School football. 61-58
45,000 people to watch a high school game! Had to listen to the first quarter on the radio cause I was at work.

Vince has been coming back from things his entirely life don't count him out!
fyi he was suppose to be paralyzed after getting hit by a car when he was little, he came back from that too.

[texasthunder]

The one main thing you all are forgetting:

He's been on the cover of Madden.................

[SkinsTribeVA]

The one main thing you all are forgetting:

Haha don't worry, the curse was already fulfilled in 2008 when he got injured and was the back-up for the rest of the season (13-3 with Kerry Collins).

[mezcal14]

:blahblah:

At the end of the day, what it comes down to is this:

The title of this thread is not "VINCE YOUNG REDSKINS STARTING QB 2011!!" It's discussing bringing Vince Young in here to compete for the QB position for the upcoming season.

Signing him and allowing him to compete with Beck and Grossman can ONLY be positive. It forces all three of them to elevate their games in order to win the starting job. The Shanahans know what they want to see in their starting QB, and will make their assessments throughout the pre-season. If Vince Young wins out, so be it. If he doesn't and is assigned to the backup or 3rd string, so be it.

In fact, I'd go so far as to say that his previous history, wins, losses, attitude, whatever, have NO relevance to this whatsoever. If the head coach decides he's the best quarterback on our roster and gives us the best chance of winning on Sundays, then by all means, let the kid start. I'm sure he will have a very clear picture of who his starting QB is, in terms of his skill set, his attitude, or what have you.

What's the problem with a quarterback competition in (if we see one) camp or the pre-season? Answer: there is none. If he manages to win the starting job, complain all you want, but at the end of the day, that decision will be made based on our ACTUAL roster and the QBs listed on it. We don't have Peyton Manning or Aaron Rodgers, so we will have to settle for the best player at the position on OUR team.

[SkinsTribeVA]

At the end of the day, what it comes down to is this:

The title of this thread is not "VINCE YOUNG REDSKINS STARTING QB 2011!!" It's discussing bringing Vince Young in here to compete for the QB position for the upcoming season.

Signing him and allowing him to compete with Beck and Grossman can ONLY be positive. It forces all three of them to elevate their games in order to win the starting job. The Shanahans know what they want to see in their starting QB, and will make their assessments throughout the pre-season. If Vince Young wins out, so be it. If he doesn't and is assigned to the backup or 3rd string, so be it.

In fact, I'd go so far as to say that his previous history, wins, losses, attitude, whatever, have NO relevance to this whatsoever. If the head coach decides he's the best quarterback on our roster and gives us the best chance of winning on Sundays, then by all means, let the kid start. I'm sure he will have a very clear picture of who his starting QB is, in terms of his skill set, his attitude, or what have you.

What's the problem with a quarterback competition in (if we see one) camp or the pre-season? Answer: there is none. If he manages to win the starting job, complain all you want, but at the end of the day, that decision will be made based on our ACTUAL roster and the QBs listed on it. We don't have Peyton Manning or Aaron Rodgers, so we will have to settle for the best player at the position on OUR team.

Hit the nail on the head. I'd be all for us bringing in VY to compete because it should create a solid QB competition among 3 viable but very different QB's (both in terms of style of play and history). If he's a headcase for us too, or just flat our sucks, then ship him out. That's the worst scenario. Best scenario: VY finishes out his career in DC leading us back to the level of annual contender.

[lookin4ahomeTexan]

So I want to ask this since we have visuals.

If Vince Young was so bad as a QB, with his stats and play on the field saying to the world that he doesn't have the ability to be a NFL QB.

How did he make it on the cover of the premier football game in the world? Since 05 I believe no one else were allowed to use NFL names so Madden is the only football game. So how did this scrub make it on the cover?

[SpacePenguin]

So I want to ask this since we have visuals.

If Vince Young was so bad as a QB, with his stats and play on the field saying to the world that he doesn't have the ability to be a NFL QB.

How did he make on the cover of the premier football game in the world? Since 05 I believe no one else were allowed to use NFL names so Madden is the only football game. So how did this scrub make it on the cover?

Hype isn't based in reality.

Why was Jamarcus Russell drafted first overall? By your logic, he must be good.

Hehehe

[terrifNick21]

So I want to ask this since we have visuals.

If Vince Young was so bad as a QB, with his stats and play on the field saying to the world that he doesn't have the ability to be a NFL QB.

How did he make on the cover of the premier football game in the world? Since 05 I believe no one else were allowed to use NFL names so Madden is the only football game. So how did this scrub make it on the cover?

I've agreed with you until this. Weak argument. Haha.

[SkinsTribeVA]

So I want to ask this since we have visuals.

If Vince Young was so bad as a QB, with his stats and play on the field saying to the world that he doesn't have the ability to be a NFL QB.

How did he make it on the cover of the premier football game in the world? Since 05 I believe no one else were allowed to use NFL names so Madden is the only football game. So how did this scrub make it on the cover?

I'm on your side, but I think most VY critics would response that he was still riding on the coattails of this....

edit: plus I don't think this helps your case haha...

http://www.maddenguides.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/browns-peyton-hillis-madden-12-custom-cover-ps3.jpg

[Lavarleap56]

VnCZ7N_H5fE

This video is every pass Vince young attempted last season game by game. I know it is long but if your bored and would like to learn and see for yourself the qb Vince became last season then I suggest watching it. The Pittsburgh game was a little rough but other than that it is ODVIOUS he improved leaps and bounds from his first few years. I tend to think if we actually watch it they will have a different opinion on Vince young's play on the field and his he does and would cut the redskins offense.