The Official Washington Basketball Thread: Wizards, Mystics etc

[Dukes and Skins]

If Kanter isn't there I'd be okay with walking out of the draft with something like this

6. Chris Singleton/Kawai Leonard(assuming Vesley isn't there)

18. Tobias Harris

34. Jeremy Tyler

[Weganator]

My dream draft right now is:

6. Jan Vesley

18. Chris Singleton (some drafts have him falling to us but i kinda doubt it)

34. Travis Leslie (Hyper athletic SG, compared alot to Tony Allen as a defender)

A draft like this would improve our defense and athleticism at SF and SG which would really help out alot.

[Going Commando]

So, if the Wizards deal Javale for the #2, who is going to play center next year? As frustrating as McGee can be, he hasn't even scratched the surface of his potential. We've seen flashes, and sooner or later he's going to figure it all out. I just don't want it to be on another team....I want it to be here, in DC. As much as I like Williams, I don't think it's a good idea to trade McGee to move up 4 slots.

From the way I understood it, it's not just moving up 4 slots. It's getting 2 and keeping 6 in the process.

I think DWill has a higher ceiling than Javale which makes the trade worthwhile. Losing Javale is also softened if you come away with Kanter at 6.

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

From the way I understood it, it's not just moving up 4 slots. It's getting 2 and keeping 6 in the process.

I think DWill has a higher ceiling than Javale which makes the trade worthwhile. Losing Javale is also softened if you come away with Kanter at 6.

Personally, I think DWill's ceiling is Antawn Jamison.

And thats not enough to give up McGee. :2cents:

---------- Post added June-6th-2011 at 10:19 PM ----------

Per Jonathan Givony

Some new game footage of Enes Kanter is circulating from his prep school days. I'm watching one game now. It's fairly underwhelming stuff.

I don't know if he's just tired here or what but he looks really lethargic playing vs very weak competition. Getting destroyed on defense. about 3 hours ago

# Watching some of the other Kanter games now. Pretty much the same story. Not putting any effort in. Playing zero defense. Not boxing out. 10 minutes ago

# I wasn't as high on Kanter as other media people prior to watching this, but now I'm legitimately concerned. Transition will be significant. 7 minutes ago

# Putting together some edits of the games I'm watching to give you guys an idea of what I'm seeing here. Should be up in next day or two. 3 minutes ago

http://www.draftexpress.com/twitter.php#ixzz1OWvEvt55

Edited June 6, 2011 by BRAVEONAWARPATH

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

Um how much longer are we as fans gonna give Javale a pass??

He's basically a veteran now so this "potential" argument doesn't do it for me

[SiCkSoULjA]

Um how much longer are we as fans gonna give Javale a pass??

He's basically a veteran now so this "potential" argument doesn't do it for me

He's 23 years old!! Let the man grow he was a project that was very raw coming out the draft I would say he progressed well. He's going too get better and he's a center those don't grow on trees anymore so if you have a potential good one you keep him and hope he turns the corner.

[Gator Bait]

Personally, I think DWill's ceiling is Antawn Jamison.

And thats not enough to give up McGee

I think on the offensive side his ceiling is Antawn...but unlike antawn, Dwill is much better on defense. AJ is also a much better rebounder.

I'd definitely give up McGee for an AJ that played defense.

[No Excuses]

I'm not really sure if Jamison is a good comparison for Williams. Jamison was a crafty player, but a lot of his limitations had to do with how slow footed he was and his piss poor agility. Williams just looks like a really smooth player.Yeah he's similar in the sense that he's a SF/PF hybrid, but Jamison was lacking athletically. He got by based on his jumper and his crafty offensive play. His poor athleticism was exposed throughout his career on the defensive end.

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

I think on the offensive side his ceiling is Antawn...but unlike antawn, Dwill is much better on defense. AJ is also a much better rebounder.

I'd definitely give up McGee for an AJ that played defense.

Teams around the league are dying for a decent bigman and I don't wanna give up ours up for an undersized 'tweener forward.

I'd give up #6 and next years 1st before I'd give up Javale.

Edited June 7, 2011 by BRAVEONAWARPATH

[CrypticVillain]

The Wizards better not trad McGee for the number two pick. Don't get me wrong, McGee isn't a beast, but we all know what we will get with him. On the other hand, I am not as sold on Williams as most people are. I sure as hell wouldn't give up McGee for him. :2cents:

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

The Wizards better not trad McGee for the number two pick. Don't get me wrong, McGee isn't a beast, but we all know what we will get with him. On the other hand, I am not as sold on Williams as most people are. I sure as hell wouldn't give up McGee for him. :2cents:

+1+1+1+1

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

It seems to me, this debate is less about McGee and more about Williams' potential.

Anyway, as I think I've said before, the only thing I'm certain of in this draft is that my head will freaking explode if we take Leonard at 6.

---------- Post added June-6th-2011 at 11:06 PM ----------

Let me ask, say this was last years class, would you trade Javale for Evan Turner?

(I have absolutely no point for this question. It's just some random scenario that popped into my head.)

Edited June 7, 2011 by G.A.C.O.L.B.

[No Excuses]

Based on what Turner showed last year, no way in hell. When it comes to potential, and especially if both players are equally raw, I'd take the big man.

Here's the thing though, wasn't Turner supposed to be NBA ready? He looked clueless in every Sixers game I watched.

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

It seems to me, this debate is less about McGee and more about Williams' potential.

Anyway, as I think I've said before, the only thing I'm certain of in this draft is that my head will freaking explode if we take Leonard at 6.

---------- Post added June-6th-2011 at 11:06 PM ----------

Let me ask, say this was last years class, would you trade Javale for Evan Turner?

(I have absolutely no point for this question. It's just some random scenario that popped into my head.)

Nope....but I wasn't high on Evan's potential to begin with.

[CrypticVillain]

Let me ask, say this was last years class, would you trade Javale for Evan Turner?

(I have absolutely no point for this question. It's just some random scenario that popped into my head.)

Nope. Big men are a premium in today's NBA. If you have one with a ceiling that hasn't been reached yet, you better make sure it is unreachable before you give up on it. McGee gets on my nerves a lot. His awareness on the court is freighting. However, I could see him getting better in better. He is only 23 years old. I think he deserves another season or two to show what he has. I am not trying to see another former Bullet/Wizard have success after we get rid of them.

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

I starrted to qualify my question "based only on Turner's scouting report last year." I'm def not a fan. I'll always cherish looking back at the Wall vs Turner debate and the laughter it brings.

[Destino]

Why do people say d will can play defense? Every scout points to his classic tweener struggles on defense. Some have mentioned his light lower body as well resulting in him getting moved around by college bigs. Trade a center for a undersized PF in a weak draft class? No. He doesn't have AJ offensive game at this point and he's not projected to be a great defender.

This draft is not good. Trade no starter for picks!!! Build options for next season instead.

[Going Commando]

I'm not sure why people are comparing DWill to Jamison. They are very different players. For one thing, DWill is a lot bigger and stronger than Jamison already,

He doesn't have a thin trunk, that's obvious just from looking at him.

Also DWill isn't undersized for a PF, that's a common misconception. He's longer than Blake Griffin, just as heavy, and almost as strong. He's probably the strongest player in the class.

The rest of the class being weak has no impact on DWill's quality. He'd be a high draft pick in next year's class too and he'd still have gone before Perry Jones and Harrison Barnes and Jared Sullinger if they'd come out this year.

---------- Post added June-7th-2011 at 05:34 AM ----------

I think the difference in quality between DWill and Javale will be substantial. I've been a bigger Javale fan than most but I don't think there is any way Javale is ever as good as Dwill would be playing for a PG like John Wall. DWill replaces all of the offensive finishing and above the rim ability we'd lose by trading Javale plus a whoooooole lot more on that side of the ball. His defensive potential is pretty high because of how big and athletic he is. I like Javale's length and ability to alter shots but let's be real here, he's not a great defender right now and you're projecting defensive quality with him as much as you would be with DWill.

In a Javale for DWill trade we swap a low IQ 4th year project for a high IQ potential All Star. **** the positional considerations, the talent differential is big enough to make the move an obvious one.

Making that trade still leaves a situation with Blatche though. You should be looking to get rid of him to make room at the 4, but the nice thing about DWill is he's a phenomenal shooter and has the footspeed to play the 3--this is a strength, not a weakness. I think Kanter will be there at 6 if we want to take him. They can be your starters at 3 and 4 if you find a veteran C and want to go big and beefy with your lineup or they can be your 4 and 5 and you've got a very quick front line that can run at a very high tempo.

DWill is basically a better, bigger, stronger, quicker, smarter, cleaner, and more productive version of Michael Beasley--Beasley as he should be. He could easily be an efficient 25 PPG guy with John Wall running the offense through him as the first option. I think he's worth that deal. But I actually doubt Minnesota takes that deal for just Javale. I wouldn't give up Javale and #6 to do it.

---------- Post added June-7th-2011 at 05:40 AM ----------

And as far as our center situation goes, you know it's only a matter of time before we acquire DeMarcus Cousins.

Edited June 7, 2011 by stevemcqueen1

[No Excuses]

I'm with you Steve. I'd trade McGee in a heartbeat for the #2 pick straight up. I wouldn't add the #6 pick either. At #6, take Biyombo. He'd be as much of a project than Javale and might show improvement at a faster rate since he already has pro experience in Europe.

Edited June 7, 2011 by No Excuses

[Gator Bait]

Teams around the league are dying for a decent bigman and I don't wanna give up ours up for an undersized 'tweener forward.

I'd give up #6 and next years 1st before I'd give up Javale.

next year's draft is the strongest since the LeBron draft....no way you trade a 1st for next year's draft. If anything...I'd trade this year's 6 for an unprotected next year (although we wouldn't be able to find any trade partners)

I don't see Javale as a decent center at this point....he could turn into one....but I'm not holding my breath.

[Gator Bait]

no one said Williams' game was like AJ....he just said his ceiling is antawn...as in a guy who can score 20 points per game and be the 2nd to 3rd best player on a good team

[Going Commando]

I'm with you Steve. I'd trade McGee in a heartbeat for the #2 pick straight up. I wouldn't add the #6 pick either. At #6, take Biyombo. He'd be as much of a project than Javale and might show improvement at a faster rate since he already has pro experience in Europe.

Bismack is an interesting replacement for Javale if you go that route. Apparently he's been playing very well in the Spanish league too and is dominant on a per minute basis.

Bismack isn't as tall as Javale but he's probably just as long and weighs almost as much. The nice thing about Bismack is that he's a smart guy, fantastic teammate and leader, and has an enormous motor. He's got dominant defensive potential just like Javale and I think he might be a little more likely to actually reach it. There would be some advantages to going with him over Javale.

Another plus for Bismack is that you can draft him and let him play in the ACB for another year while the lockout is going on and so he's developing for a whole year in the most talent rich and competitive league outside the NBA.

My problem with Bismack is that he doesn't bring anything to the table offensively and he's still probably only going to measure about 6'9 in shoes. If he had another inch or so I'd feel a lot better about taking him.

Getting Williams at alleviates the scoring problem a bit because he's so good offensively already. But I was kind of hoping we would upgrade our center with a guy who brings some more scoring to the table. I think Enes Kanter might be a better choice at 6 than Bismack because of that. He's a middle of the pack athlete but he can score and is smart and tough enough to pile up rebounds.

The only problem with Kanter is that you've only got that one game to go off of. Picking him, you're kind of grabbing your nuts and taking a leap that that one game wasn't a fluke. Bismack is safer.

---------- Post added June-7th-2011 at 11:38 AM ----------

no one said Williams' game was like AJ....he just said his ceiling is antawn...as in a guy who can score 20 points per game and be the 2nd to 3rd best player on a good team

I disagree about the ceiling because they're such different players. DWill has star qualities, is bigger, stronger, and more aggressive IMO. He's a better and more powerful finisher than Jamison coming into the league and already has a good shot from range. If DWill develops the kind of versatility and back to the basket game Jamison had then he'll be a more effective scorer on the whole and I think he could reach the 25 PPG mark running pick and pops/rolls offense with Wall.

The main difference is that I think DWill is a bigger and more powerful player and better athlete and he's got a killer instinct, has put his college teams on his back and rising to the moment. I think he'll be a better defender than Jamison, especially as a shot blocker. Those reasons alone mean his ceiling differs from Jamison. I could see DWill being our second best player and best offensive weapon and make a couple of All Star games,

And besides, even if he peaks at Jamison's level, that's still a better player than Javale.

Edited June 7, 2011 by stevemcqueen1

[Warhead36]

If we trade McGee for #2 and end up with Williams and Kanter I'd be ecstatic. A starting lineup of Wall/Young/Williams/Blatche/Kanter with Crawford, Lewis, Booker, and Seraphin as our primary reserves wouldn't be terrible(assuming the young guys improve and develop).

[Going Commando]

I think it'd be a coup to swap Javale and Blatche for a 4 and 5 like DW and EK/BB without giving up next year's pick, Blatche, nor #18 this year.

You could spend 18 on a pure perimeter stopper like Singleton or a shooter (Thompson if he's there). I'd go the shooter route if I had the choice but we don't know what'll be there.

Then next year you can deal Blatche and our pick to move into he slot you want to get the right starting caliber 3 for our organization. Might not have to deal Blatche either if there is a lockout and we get lotto chances based on the past few years.

My favorite options for a Kanter/DW/Wall/Crawford starting lineup would probably be either Michael Gilchrist or Harrison Barnes since they bring some rebounding and elite perimeter defensive potential and are unselfish team first guys who wouldn't mind taking a backseat to DW and Kanter offensively.

Getting Wall, Booker, Seraphin, Crawford, Williams, Kanter/Biyombo, Thompson/Singleton, and Gilchrist/Barnes in three years of drafting is a ridiculous and unprecedented coup. The cost of doing so has really only been Javale, Blatche (maybe), Hinrich, Armstrong, and whatever we gave up for Booker and Seraphin (can't remember right now). What I'd do then is sign Nick Young to anywhere up to about 6 million a year because of his shooting ability and ability to guard 2s and 3s. We'd basically have our entire core in place, they'd all be young with lots of BB IQ and motor and talent and athleticism.

And we'd still have two fairly significant trade assets in Rashard Lewis's contract and Andray Blatche to work with. We'd basically have too much talent already to do anything with them... Might have to package some of those young pieces together for a superstar.

---------- Post added June-7th-2011 at 11:57 AM ----------

If we trade McGee for #2 and end up with Williams and Kanter I'd be ecstatic. A starting lineup of Wall/Young/Williams/Blatche/Kanter with Crawford, Lewis, Booker, and Seraphin as our primary reserves wouldn't be terrible(assuming the young guys improve and develop).

Don't forget #18. That pick probably gets a key reserve too.

[Gator Bait]

I disagree about the ceiling because they're such different players. DWill has star qualities, is bigger, stronger, and more aggressive IMO. He's a better and more powerful finisher than Jamison coming into the league and already has a good shot from range. If DWill develops the kind of versatility and back to the basket game Jamison had then he'll be a more effective scorer on the whole and I think he could reach the 25 PPG mark running pick and pops/rolls offense with Wall.

The main difference is that I think DWill is a bigger and more powerful player and better athlete and he's got a killer instinct, has put his college teams on his back and rising to the moment. I think he'll be a better defender than Jamison, especially as a shot blocker. Those reasons alone mean his ceiling differs from Jamison. I could see DWill being our second best player and best offensive weapon and make a couple of All Star games,

And besides, even if he peaks at Jamison's level, that's still a better player than Javale.

can't disagree with anything here....if you remember, I was one of the first to jump on the Dwill bandwagon and saw him as a PF all along (when most were saying he didn't fit into any position)....kind of like you were the first to hop on the Harrison Barnes bandwagon.....too bad he didn't come out...that would be the top guy on my board.

---------- Post added June-7th-2011 at 01:18 PM ----------

If we trade McGee for #2 and end up with Williams and Kanter I'd be ecstatic. A starting lineup of Wall/Young/Williams/Blatche/Kanter with Crawford, Lewis, Booker, and Seraphin as our primary reserves wouldn't be terrible(assuming the young guys improve and develop).

might as well not even discus scenarios that include us getting #2 pick for McGee....there is absolutely no way this happens. The only way we get #2 for McGee is if we throw in other assets...like #6. I think #6 and McGee might get it done.