RI: Tebow will have workout with Skins

[Skinsinparadise]

Drafting o-linemen thats for weak livered suckers and Nancy-boys. The game aint won in the trenches it's one with pretty passes sailing effortlessly through the air to waiting wide open speed demons for long gains.

I have no dog in the draft QB fight. If they draft no QB's am cool. However, I don't get the draft only comes down to one pick crowd.

if we draft Clausen at #4, we should have a decent shot at a LT with our early 2nd rounder like lets say a Safford. If we go Tebow or Pike or whomever with the 2nd and draft Okung with the first -- how is that a disaster for the draft O line or else crew?

Then you got the 4th, a high 4th where we likely can get someone decent. Maybe we have been too habituated to drafting in the Vinny era where we often didn't have 2nd, 3rd and 4th rounders or flubbed those picks so it all came down to the first round where Vinny was decent.

But yes the draft doesn't end after the first round. And most draft geeks consider high 2nd rounders as pretty good picks.

[The Tris]

What I don't understand is if mechanics are so gosh danged important to his future and career then -

Where were his coaches, advisers, etc. while he was playing in college? Isn't this something he could have worked on last summer? The summer before that?

It would seem like "how you throw the ball" and "throwing motion" are pretty basic elements.

How come no one noticed this a year ago? Or two?

My thought is someone did. And the tried to get him to change, but he sucked in games and went back to throwing like he always does.

Your thought would be correct.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/columns/story?columnist=schlabach_mark&id=4178702

"Meyer said the changes to Tebow's throwing motion are designed to better prepare him for playing in the NFL. After leading the Gators to a 24-14 victory over Oklahoma in the 2009 BCS National Championship Game, Tebow bypassed entering the NFL draft and instead returned to Florida for his senior season.

Tebow wouldn't say where NFL scouts projected him to be selected if he had entered April's NFL draft. NFL scouts and general managers love Tebow's production and leadership skills, but some have long been alarmed by his slow and sometimes unorthodox throwing motion.

"They said just to be myself and everything will be fine," Tebow said. "They said not to change the things that make me who I am."

But some NFL scouts are still perplexed about where Tebow will play in the NFL. At 6-foot-3 and 245 pounds, Tebow is big enough and strong enough to play other positions. He ran 475 times in his first three college seasons, most ever by an SEC quarterback. He enters his senior season with 43 career rushing touchdowns, a Florida record and tied for sixth-most in SEC history."

But that all went by the wayside as soon as the season began...he stuck to the motion he is most comfortable with, which is why I don't think these new changes are perminent at this point and time.

EDIT: These are the areas he was trying to improve his Senior Season. Sound familiar?:

"The three biggest areas Loeffler can help him improve:

1. Get the ball out quicker

2. Progression reads

3. More consistent accuracy intermediate/vertical."

[BillyKilmer]

god dammit.

Muhammad Dammit I'll use someone else god's name in vain

[TheismannQuote]

"_____ is a mobile quarterback with good quickness, agility, and awareness. He has a solid throwing motion, and he displayed fantastic accuracy completing 68% of his passes his senior year. He has the athletic ability to be a threat running the ball as well as throwing it.

____ is also a very intelligent quarterback who reads defenses well and makes good, quick decisions. He has a tremendous work ethic on the field as well as in the film room, and he displays good leadership qualities.

The junior from ____ doesn't possess the strongest arm in the draft and might fit best in a West Coast style of offense, but he can make all the throws to be successful in the NFL, and he remains accurate when he's on the run. He has good, quick footwork, sound mechanics, and a high release point. "

-----

"_______ has all the tutelege to become one of the better quarterbacks in the NFL in the near future. His ability to make the deep throw and pick up the blitz are major attributes that the Lions and Raiders definately need. He was sacked an insane amount of times this year but that was mostly due to the lack of a polished offensive line. His willingness to lead a team is also one of the very strong points to his game... Overall, I see ______ as a sure-fire top if not number one overall pick in April's draft. _____ has the size,skill,and athletic ability to be a pro-bowler numerous times before he turns 30. With the tutelege of quartback guru _______, ____ has nothing to worry about except if he wants to play in Detroit or Oakland next fall."

-----

"I can't remember being in such awe of a quarterback in my decade of attending combines and pro days."

--ESPN's Todd McShay

"____ is going to immediately energize that fanbase, that football team -- on the practice field, in that locker room. Three years from now you could be looking at a guy that's certainly one of the elite top five quarterbacks in this league. ...You're talking about a 2-3 year period once he's under center. Look out because the skill level that he has is certainly John Elway-like."

--ESPN's Mel Kiper

-----

I spent entirely too much time looking for reliable quotes on the internet. I should be working.

Anyhow. The point of the matter is...stop taking scouting reports as gospel. Scouts have 'rules of thumb' to go by and use past players as examples of what 'good' is. Just because someone doesn't throw like Manning or Brady doesn't mean they can't win like Favre or Roethlisberger. It's not a science.

Oh. The first scouting report was for Alex Smith. The Second was for Brady Quinn. The third was for Jamarcus Russell. I'm sure that there are many, many, many more out there but I don't want to look anymore.

[The Tris]

Anyhow. The point of the matter is...stop taking scouting reports as gospel. Scouts have 'rules of thumb' to go by and use past players as examples of what 'good' is. Just because someone doesn't throw like Manning or Brady doesn't mean they can't win like Favre or Roethlisberger. It's not a science.

Furthering that point, and to show that it cuts both ways, from SI's Stewart Mandel:

Quarterbacks

A. JaMarcus Russell

B. John Elway

C. Peyton Manning

D. Dan Marino

E. Ryan Leaf

F. Michael Vick

G. Tom Brady

H. Drew Brees

I. Brian Griese

Quotes

1. "________ has got all the tools and as good an arm as anybody. But he's too up and down, and the inconsistency of the team was reflected in him."

--An unnamed NFC general manager to The New York Times

2. "I was shockingly impressed with ________. He is very poised and makes good decisions. He may not have a great arm, but he has smooth mechanics and throws easily catchable passes. He is not the type of guy who is gonna get scared and force passes across the middle."

--Former NFL scout Russ Lande to a newspaper, the identity of which would give away the quarterback's identity.

3. "I can't remember being in such awe of a quarterback in my decade of attending combines and pro days."

--ESPN's Todd McShay

4. "______ is just different. He has the touch, the feel, the accuracy, all the intangibles you look for in a quarterback. Maybe it's because his father is a coach. [He] just seems to understand football more than any quarterback I've ever seen in college."

--Unnamed scout to The New York Times

5. "______ is the product of the system. Is he better than Cade McNown? Yeah, but I'm not sold on him."

--An unnamed scout to the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel

6. "Remember this: late third-round pick 1979, Joe Montana; late third-round pick [late-90s year], _______.

--SI.com's own Peter King

7. Ominous note on ________: This gentleman completed just 177 passes at the collegiate level, versus 1,003 completions for Drew Brees. Because [he] threw so little, he didn't have the chance to expose his weaknesses, which somehow makes him more desirable. If the first pick, [he] is expected to command a $15 million bonus. That's $84,746 per college completion!

--Gregg Easterbrook in Slate

8. "________ is going to immediately energize that fanbase, that football team -- on the practice field, in that locker room. Three years from now you could be looking at a guy that's certainly one of the elite top five quarterbacks in this league. ...You're talking about a 2-3 year period once he's under center. Look out because the skill level that he has is certainly John Elway-like."

--ESPN's Mel Kiper

9. "The knock on _______ is his body build. He's too skinny."

--The late Joel Buchsbaum (one of the original draft analysts) to The Detroit News

10. (Two-parter) Give me the linebacker-sized ____________, who at 6-5, 238 pounds is more rugged, less susceptible to injury than the 6-5, 222-pound ________. [Quarterback A] is a better athlete, stronger of arm and more fiery than [quarterback B]. To those who point out that he's also rawer, I say: So what? No quarterback does squat until he's been in the league at least three years. And to scouts cautioning that [quarterback A] is a "free spirit," spare me. You had the same line on Brett Favre.

--SI's own Austin Murphy

Answers

1. If you agree with this GM, then you probably would have passed on the quarterback. Indeed, 26 NFL GMs passed on Dan Marino in the 1983 draft.

2. Not many people agreed with Lande, which is why Tom Brady lasted until the sixth round. The paper, by the way, was The Michigan Daily, the student paper at Michigan.

3. In McShay's defense, that's pretty much what everyone said after JaMarcus Russell's pro day. Whoops.

4. This scout absolutely nailed John Elway in his evaluation.

5. This scout, meanwhile, completely whiffed on Drew Brees.

6. The man whose Web traffic pays my salary got a little carried away in a 1998 interview. Brian Griese had a nice career, but it didn't approach Montana's.

7. The Tuesday Morning Quarterback author offered a dire warning to anyone thinking of choosing Michael Vick. The Falcons traded for the right to pick him anyway, and the Chargers wound up with Brees and LaDanian Tomlinson in the same draft.

8. ESPN's Kiper, who is correct more often than he is wrong, drank the same Kool-Aid as everyone else regarding JaMarcus Russell in 2008.

9. Buchsbaum's statement represents the near-consensus opinion on Tom Brady in 2000.

10. Murphy tackled the debate that raged in 1998. Unfortunately, he endorsed Ryan Leaf (quarterback A) over Peyton Manning (quarterback .

[Redskinzfan30]

Tebow over Pike in 2nd round?

I've never really been impressed with Pike to be honest.

[GibbsFactor]

god dammit.

:ols::ols:

[kappaluvacee]

CIA-Allen, Can't get a read on this move. It may be some gamemanship being played here.

[alwaysaskin]

I'd rather have Tebow then Clausen, he's more mobile, if any QB could survive behind this O-Line it would be a guy like Tebow, who can make defenders miss

[darrelgreenie]

Gruden, Dungy, Childress (2 coaches out of the league and another who believes in T-Jax at QB, FWIW) and all other coaches who say they believe he will succeed are being smart and covering their reputation.

Do you really believe this^^

You think Tony Dungy and Jon Gruden are worried about their reputation?

Maybe, just maybe they are giving their honest opinion?

Would you be against Tebow if he was drafted in the 2nd round?

I would prefer Colt McCoy in the 2nd but if whomever Shany chooses would be fine with me.(although imo Tony Pike would be a real head scratcher)

Although i would prefer if he was taken later in the 2nd or even by acquiring a high 3rd round pick.

And BTW-Are you implying that Childress is wrong to believe in T-Jack?

I find the disparity in the perception of T-Jack and lets say Kevin Kolb or Matt Lienart very interesting.

Its like people forgot how well T-Jack played at then end of the 2008 before Favre got there.

[Rob Mexico]

I would like to have Tebow on our team. He plays to win the game. I think it is a good rick. Give him sometime to sit like a year or two and then see what he can do. The guy can play.

HAIL!

[TheismannQuote]

CIA-Allen, Can't get a read on this move. It may be some gamemanship being played here.

I do view this as more of a rouse for people to climb up for our 2nd round pick. Knowing that there are teams with interest in this being their 2nd round pick...we pick before them. Could get interesting on Draft Day(s)

I'm excited about that.

[Commander Adama]

Don't be bashful. Tell us how you really feel about it.

I know! That Spaceman Spiff is always pulling punches!

[War Paint]

Tebow over Pike in 2nd round?

I would much rather have Tebow over Pike. I heard that Pike lacks passion for the game. After seeing a segment on Pike while watching NFL Total Access, I have to agree with what I heard. He seemed unexcited and bland when talking football. No thanks.

[The Tris]

Do you really believe this^^

You think Tony Dungy and Jon Gruden are worried about their reputation?

Maybe, just maybe they are giving their honest opinion?

Maybe so.

And I don't think they are worried about their reputation, but there is literally NO upside for them to degrade or dismiss Tebow. They have absolutely no skin in this game, and it really doesn't matter what they say, so why would they do anything but praise a guy who by all accounts is as nice as can be and a winner? What can they possibly gain from saying Tebow will not succeed?

I really believe that went in doubt, it is easier for them to say "I believe he can be successful" than "he is going to struggle".

And BTW-Are you implying that Childress is wrong to believe in T-Jack?

I find the disparity in the perception of T-Jack and lets say Kevin Kolb or Matt Lienart very interesting.

Its like people forgot how well T-Jack played at then end of the 2008 before Favre got there.

T-Jax had a nice run to end the 2008 season, going 3-1 (abet against the Falcons, Lions and Cards defenses, and a Giants team comfortably in the playoffs) with 8 TDs and 1 INT.

Then he laid an egg in the playoffs going 15-35 for 164 yards, no TDs and an INT and a fumble.

So, they replaced a QB in his fifth year with an aging legend coming off surgery. AND they picked up Sage Rosenfelds. Hardly ringing endorsements for their long term T-Jax plans.

He's a sub 60% comps for his career, and has thrown 3600 yards, 21 TDs and 18 INTs in five seasons.

I highly doubt Vikings fans want Favre to stay retired and T-Jax to be the guy that gets them over the hump.

EDIT: If I had my pick of the three you listed, I would take Kolb, then T-Jax, then Leinhart.

2nd EDIT: I would take McCoy over Tebow in the 2nd 10 times out of 10.

I think Bradford is the only QB I would take with #4, but would not be upset with Clausen.

If Bradford is gone, and Shanny feels Clausen is a reach, I am for Okung or BPA (not another OT though), then I would favor McCoy over Lefevour at #37.

I think Tebow is a reach at #37, but intriguing if we had a 3rd.

I think Pike is garbage. And Skelton is a hail mary.

[gatorskin77]

Your thought would be correct.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/columns/story?columnist=schlabach_mark&id=4178702

"Meyer said the changes to Tebow's throwing motion are designed to better prepare him for playing in the NFL. After leading the Gators to a 24-14 victory over Oklahoma in the 2009 BCS National Championship Game, Tebow bypassed entering the NFL draft and instead returned to Florida for his senior season.

Tebow wouldn't say where NFL scouts projected him to be selected if he had entered April's NFL draft. NFL scouts and general managers love Tebow's production and leadership skills, but some have long been alarmed by his slow and sometimes unorthodox throwing motion.

"They said just to be myself and everything will be fine," Tebow said. "They said not to change the things that make me who I am."

But some NFL scouts are still perplexed about where Tebow will play in the NFL. At 6-foot-3 and 245 pounds, Tebow is big enough and strong enough to play other positions. He ran 475 times in his first three college seasons, most ever by an SEC quarterback. He enters his senior season with 43 career rushing touchdowns, a Florida record and tied for sixth-most in SEC history."

But that all went by the wayside as soon as the season began...he stuck to the motion he is most comfortable with, which is why I don't think these new changes are perminent at this point and time.

EDIT: These are the areas he was trying to improve his Senior Season. Sound familiar?:

"The three biggest areas Loeffler can help him improve:

1. Get the ball out quicker

2. Progression reads

3. More consistent accuracy intermediate/vertical."

Yeah Meyer was also going to add some plays that required Tebow to take snaps from under center, and none of those things ever happened.

A lot of Tebow's fans know this but apparently try to pretend it didn't happen.

Scott Loffler was an NFL Qb coach and brought in for the sole purpose of changing Tebows mechanics and he didn't.

As a Gator fan I love Tebow to death, and I do think with the right coaches and a lot of patience he MIGHT succeed in the NFL.

As a Redskins fan I don't see how we can justify taking a project with any of our picks, we only have 5 we have to make the most out of them.

[Zguy28]

OR being well built. :beatdeadhorse:

Just 68% said No in the first poll, this is the latest....

from Redskins Insider via the WP

Would you want the Redskins to draft Tim Tebow?

Yes, at quarterback.

39%

Yes, if he's used at another position.

6%

No.

53%

Created on Mar 18, 2010

Its up to 40% now.

What was funny was the other poll asking "Which distresses you the most?"

The Rex Grossman signing. 8%

The possibility of drafting Tim Tebow. 13%

Another season of Jason Campbell. 12%

Drafting Jimmy Clausen with the No. 4 pick. 65%

[Rob Mexico]

I realllllly don't want Clausen. I just can't stand the guy and I don't think he is going to be a star in the league. Not worth the #4 pick. Again....Tebow in later rounds yes.

[Dark Acre]

I think his upside is greater than any of the other Rd 2 QBs. McCoy, Lefevour, Pike all have physical limitations that limit their upside. Tebow's problem is not arm strength or size, but mechanics. Let him sit and learn for at least one full season and upside could easily be greater than any of the other prospects outside of the top 2.....

How successful have other QBs with mechanics problems been in being "coached up"?

[doghouse4x4]

How successful have other QBs with mechanics problems been in being "coached up"?

That Peyton Manning dude did ok.......

[haithman]

If anything the guy plays with an intensity and fire that we need. He WILL hold his players accountable and will work harder than anyone else. Remember that press conference he had where he pledged that we wouldn't see a player work harder than him for the rest of the season? Dude is a baller

[Commander Adama]

I would much rather have Tebow over Pike. I heard that Pike lacks passion for the game. After seeing a segment on Pike while watching NFL Total Access, I have to agree with what I heard. He seemed unexcited and bland when talking football. No thanks.

I would as well. Tebow is a winner. He did spectacular things in college, so I would not say he couldn't transition to the Pros. From his vast improvement from the Combine to the Pro Day is huge. To me that shows hunger, which I like.

[Morneblade]

I would as well. Tebow is a winner. He did spectacular things in college, so I would not say he couldn't transition to the Pros. From his vast improvement from the Combine to the Pro Day is huge. To me that shows hunger, which I like.

Dont you mean the Senior Bowl? He didnt throw at the Combine. I think the 2nd round is too high, but I would use a 3rd on him. Too bad we dont have one. I kinda dont care though. We have the Dragon. It will be Unleashed in a Preseason game near you.:laugh:

[The Robert Griffin Experience]

screen pass? that's KEVIN SPACEY gay.

[The Tris]

That Peyton Manning dude did ok.......

Please tell me you are joking about Manning having mechanics issues coming into the draft?

"Manning is probably the most prepared QB to enter the NFL draft in several years.. He has had a storybook college career, and has been in a top level program with excellent coaching, and he has maturity and great intangibles to go along with his natural skills.. He should be able to pick up the mental aspects of the game early on the NFL level, and should play very quickly. He has great overall field vision. He is a fierce competitor, and all of his mechanics are very solid. He has good arm strength, but not necessarily a “gun” that you might expect from a QB at the top of the draft.. He has adequate mobility and good overall AA, although he is not a scrambler by nature. He has done an excellent job of getting the most out of his abilities, but he is not quite as natural a player as Leaf. One question that some NFL scouts have is the question “will he get any better?”. At times he gives the appearance of being a self-made player, and sometimes those types of players don’t always go on to great NFL careers. In Manning’s case, he may be a solid and productive NFL QB, but he may not have Hall of Fame type skills, but it certainly won’t be for lack of effort.. He has probably been the most scouted player in the draft in recent years, and because that NFL teams tend to look too much at potential flaws, instead of accepting him for what he is, a great college QB that is on his way to an outstanding NFL career."