So... was Fred Davis a wasted pick?

[skinsfanindallas88]

For the guy who asked how Calais Campbell is doing

Through 3 games Campbell has a whooping 7 tackles and 0 sacks

Not exactly settin the world on fire

[C26 Run]

Still too early to say. During the preseason, Davis looked better than Thomas and Kelly. All three are rookies still adjusting to the pro level. It is not fair to call them wasted picks. :helmet:

[turbodiesel#44]

LOL, seriously what's going on with him? I don't think he was a wasted pick. They went more with the philosophy BPA, and he's got talent, and as the offense gets better and jc more comfortable, we may see some 3 te sets, or cooley lined up in the slot or as a 4th reciever.

Yeah, that's it. When they move Cooley to WR. JC is going to start snapping the ball to Rabach because JC has a higher ass, and Jansen is going to earn his money returning punts.

Davis may be the most talented of our picks, but it's like having a real pretty third nut. BPA is a mechanism to reduce the possibility of a high first round bust breaking your cap with his huge salary. That's all it is. After the first fifteen or so picks, you weigh your team needs with BPA. Even then you don't take a QB if you don't NEED one. 2nd round and on, you should try to make YOUR team better by addressing YOUR needs. I was dismayed by the Davis pick, but was assured by trusted posters here we were going to use him in 2 TE sets. After the first round, BPA stands for Bench Players Atrophy.

Yoder is no Cooley, but I've always thought he was under-rated, over-shadowed and solid depth. Good blocker, decent hands. We had other needs on the OL that would have been better served. The only times I have seen Davis, Cooley was sitting. How does that help the team?

[Shilsu]

The problem with picking Fred Davis is that no matter how good he is, his impact will be minimal as a second TE. Even if he turns out to be a TD machine, his impact will pretty much be equivalent to having Darnerian McCants on our team.

The only way Fred Davis will turn out to be a good pick will be if Cooley suffers a very serious injury or is cut.

[westcoasthog]

"Was Fred Davis a wasted pick?"

No. Give him some time. Dude has all the potential in the world...let him develop it.

[turbodiesel#44]

The only way Fred Davis will turn out to be a good pick will be if Cooley suffers a very serious injury or is cut.

I was going to post that, but didn't want to use the "I" word.

[turbodiesel#44]

"Was Fred Davis a wasted pick?"

No. Give him some time. Dude has all the potential in the world...let him develop it.

We already developed Cooley. He's a PB player. Developing and/or playing Davis means Cooley is sitting, and therefore being wasted. Or else Davis is sitting. I still hope to see them both on the field together, but I don't see that fitting Zorn's version of the WCO very often. A guard or tackle for depth next year would have been a wise investment. Mark my words.

Awesome sig you got there!

[SkinsMaster88]

Wow, doesn't anyone have patience anymore. It's Week 3 and he's a rookie behind a top-5 TE in Cooley and a good blocker in Yoder. He'll eventually play a bigger role on the team. Especially as JC is getting more used to the offense and looking at multiple reads.

You could say it's a luxury to have 2 good TEs, but it does offer some flexibility in our packages to get great matchups.

2 strong RBs: Portis, Betts

1 heavy FB: Sellers

2 pass-catching TEs: Cooley, Davis

4 (potential) playmaker WRs: Moss, Randle El, Thomas, Kelly [+Thrash as a reliable possession guy who can step up when called upon]

Flexibility and versatility is what Davis offers us. Way too early to pass judgment yet.

[McD5]

What's wrong with Yoder?

Yes, he was a wasted pick, in the sense that we don't need him....and could have used another lineman much more.

[SkinsMaster88]

We already developed Cooley. He's a PB player. Developing and/or playing Davis means Cooley is sitting, and therefore being wasted. Or else Davis is sitting. I still hope to see them both on the field together, but I don't see that fitting Zorn's version of the WCO very often. A guard or tackle for depth next year would have been a wise investment. Mark my words.

I think that Zorn will implement more 2 TE sets for Cooley and Davis as time goes on. Those guys can create mismatches in the defense.

We haven't seen all of Zorn's playbook, and I'm sure he'll continue to add new wrinkles to his packages as he gets to know more of each player's skills.

[westcoasthog]

We already developed Cooley. He's a PB player. Developing and/or playing Davis means Cooley is sitting, and therefore being wasted. Or else Davis is sitting. I still hope to see them both on the field together, but I don't see that fitting Zorn's version of the WCO very often. A guard or tackle for depth next year would have been a wise investment. Mark my words.

Awesome sig you got there!

I understand where you are coming from. I do see us using two tight ends or sending Cooley out to WR though as time goes on and everyone gets comfortable with the offense and Zorn gets more comfortable as well. Maybe you guys are right...but they must have drafted him for a reason, and I believe he has the skill and potential to do whatever it is they drafted them to do.

[McD5]

For the guy who asked how Calais Campbell is doing

Through 3 games Campbell has a whooping 7 tackles and 0 sacks

Not exactly settin the world on fire

We have one lineman with more tackles than Calais Campbell. :doh:

And he has four more tackles that hofer Jason Taylor.

Seriously......where do these people come from?

Yes....he was a wasted pick.

[turbodiesel#44]

Wow, doesn't anyone have patience anymore.

Look son, I've been waiting since you were sucking a nipple for another SB, and would like to see one more before I pass on. You got to keep heading in the right direction to reach your goal. Redundant talent is an expensive luxury when you have easily projected age and injury concerns in your trenches. All you young guys are screaming give the rookies time, but the lines are old and injury prone. Their replacements need time too. We need to develop the lines, and right now we don't have enough young bodies there. Next year will be worse. By the time you are my age, I might be gone, but you will realize by then the flashy "skill" players aren't so flashy or skillful behind a weak line. I know the OL doesn't make the highlights, but they make the team. And you have to plan ahead.

Of course, if we go capless, please ignore the above. Danny can buy us a line.

[SittingBull]

see Rocky Mcintosh

[Oldskool]

We already developed Cooley. He's a PB player. Developing and/or playing Davis means Cooley is sitting, and therefore being wasted. Or else Davis is sitting.

Wrong answer. Again refer to Zorn saying that he wanted to draft Davis with the intention of having him used in 2 TE sets, much of which we have not seen yet in this offense.

Much of this offense is not in place yet, hence why you haven't seen Davis in the game much, and other "exotic" WCO packages such as FB/RB offset.

I'm really disappointed in people going chicken little over stupid **** like this. :doh:

[Area51]

FWIW, Cooley didn't do much until the second half of his rookie year. And that was when his only competition at TE was Robert Royal. Not every rookie is going to have an immediate impact.

Am I saying it was the right pick? No. I definitely wanted Campbell. But to call the pick a waste(or any) this early is WAY too soon. Yoder is getting older as well. The Cowboys gave up on Fasano and so far he's done pretty damn good in Miami, while they went out and drafted another TE in the second.

[AceSkinsFan]

Way too soon to tell, but my guess is that he was drafted to eventually replace Yoder. Next year we could be looking at two TE packages with Cooley and Davis, who would both be big receiving threats. We all complain about those times where Cooley needs to help block in pass protection. With Davis we'd either be able to free up Cooley and just let Davis block or send Davis out in the pattern which is a huge upgrade from Yoder as a receiver. Just a thought...

[cuchip703]

yeah, ummm, I thought he'd be much more of a factor early in the season....he's clearly not. And I have my doubts that he'll ever be much on a two TE package. So I'm seeing the use of this pick less and less (how is Calas Campbell doing?)....I hope I'm biting these words next week .

We just played against Calais this week....did you hear his name called at all. That's how he is doing.

[IbleedBnG83]

He CAN block...very well at that.

I'm almost certain he will get more involved. I'm sure we'll see some delayed releasing by the TE's when using Davis and Cooley to throw the defense off.

[cphil006]

Hopefully he plays...

[ouvan59]

Wow, doesn't anyone have patience anymore. It's Week 3 and he's a rookie behind a top-5 TE in Cooley and a good blocker in Yoder. He'll eventually play a bigger role on the team. Especially as JC is getting more used to the offense and looking at multiple reads.

You could say it's a luxury to have 2 good TEs, but it does offer some flexibility in our packages to get great matchups.

2 strong RBs: Portis, Betts

1 heavy FB: Sellers

2 pass-catching TEs: Cooley, Davis

4 (potential) playmaker WRs: Moss, Randle El, Thomas, Kelly [+Thrash as a reliable possession guy who can step up when called upon]

Flexibility and versatility is what Davis offers us. Way too early to pass judgment yet.

:applause: Well said.

And if we had drafted an offensive or defensive lineman in Davis' spot do you think he would be seeing the field right now? Highly unlikely. Why isn't anybody complaining about the Rinehart pick?

[HereComesTheDiesel44]

YES! Fred Davis was a wasted pick. Chris Cooley is one thing but Yoder is a solid player. He's a prototypical TE - excellent blocker who can catch the ball when he needs to. He's 30 yrs old so he has at least 5 more years, if not more to be a productive TE for the Skins. Fred Davis is talented and will be a great TE somewhere down the road, but we could have spent that pick on an o-lineman, d-lineman, or even a better cornerback. What a waste!

[HereComesTheDiesel44]

And if we had drafted an offensive or defensive lineman in Davis' spot do you think he would be seeing the field right now? Highly unlikely. Why isn't anybody complaining about the Rinehart pick?

Because Rhinehart is backing up a 36 year old guard in Kendall. Rhinehart will likely be a starter in the next year or two. Davis will never be a starter as long as we have Cooley. We already had 2 excellent TEs on our roster and there were too many holes on this team to draft a 3rd string TE. Dont get me wrong, I hope Davis does very well, and he very well might. He is a talented TE who has improved on his blocking tremendously, which was said to be his 1 weakness. But I just felt that we needed to address other needs (o-line, d-line, CB, LB, etc.) as opposed to a 3rd string TE. But, Davis is a Redskin, and therefore I will cheer for him and I hope he excels wearing the B&G

[GoSkins0721]

Wrong answer. Again refer to Zorn saying that he wanted to draft Davis with the intention of having him used in 2 TE sets, much of which we have not seen yet in this offense.

Much of this offense is not in place yet, hence why you haven't seen Davis in the game much, and other "exotic" WCO packages such as FB/RB offset.

I'm really disappointed in people going chicken little over stupid **** like this. :doh:

Bingo. :applause:

This offense is in growth mode. Week 2 against the Saints we started to see some of the multiple sets that Zorn has at his disposal. These were missing in Week 1 for multiple reasons, mostly injuries, lack of readiness on the part of the 3 rookies and I'm assuming lack of their playing time with JC.

During Gibbs I, it was the norm to see different offensive looks from week to week, depending on the opponent. That was missing in Gibbs II, I believe, because of a lack of personnel at the skill positions.

Zorn now has a stable of stallions to use. But these guys need to get more practice time with the 1st unit as Zorn continues to expand his playbook. :2cents:

[NoCalMike]

Well I also think the fact of the matter is, most offenses don't have enough plays/firepower to produce 2 tight ends with big numbers. I am sure Fred Davis will get some nice plays in, and will be "involved" in a bunch of packages, but Chris Cooley is just a special player right now and entering his prime. He is pretty much uncoverable by a lineman or a linebacker, and can muscle his way through any cornerback.

It is kind of similar to the Cowboys TE situation a couple of years ago. They have a stud in Witten, and then the other guy Fasano, who was no slouch either, but there just isn't enough balls to go around for the both of them to put up big numbers. Fasano is on the Dolphins now looking pretty good. Or look at the Cowboys in the 90's they had Novachek(sp?) and Moose. Both were good, but Moose was used primarily for blocking for the running game, but whenever he did get the ball thrown his way he made an impact.