Report: Non-Muslims Deserve to Be Punished

[Henry]

BUT, in WWI I believe they had a "little" help from America. We were right there next to them fighting tooth and nail.

We didn't have an effective division on the ground in Europe until 1918. While the British did their share, the real heavy lifting in that war was done by the French.

And I may be wrong, but I believe that England has always been the strongest military in Europe. At least their Navy is.

Not exactly. England and France had traditionally been called the Elephant and the Whale, because one had the strongest army and the other had the strongest navy. Basically, until the French got trounced in 1940, they had always been recognized as having a much stronger army than the British.

[alexey]

I also believe that even if we were the same size as them we would be more powerful. Our weapons and technology are second to none.

What if they were the same size as us?

[techboy]

That's why our education system is so screwed up. All the teachers are on ExtremeSkins during their planning periods.

Strictly speaking, I was just checking in before lunch (which falls during my planning period today). I missed lunch. :laugh:

I am not irritated and I dont know why you take it that way. besides telling me that I am wrong, misinformed and other things I dont know why you would assume I was hostile. I answered back everything you said and thought we were having a decent conversation until learning that I am just "wrong" in my thoughts.

Your opinion is not wrong, by definition. Some of the assumptions that appear to be underlying that opinion are in error, and appear to be the result of the same kind of thinking that leads to "NASCAR sucks" tirades- sweeping generalizations based upon popular misconceptions.

Still, if you were offended by my presentation, I apologize. I was blunt, but it was not my intention to be rude, or call you stupid, if that's how you took it.

No they cannot project their force around the world - only the UC has that capacity.

I know Berkeley's a good school, but are they elite enough to help UC project force around the world?

[BigMike619]

OK, since so many responded to my opinion I will just answer them here.

Henry, OK. I dont know enough to debate you so I will have to go by what you say.

alexey - i dont think they would be. We are far more superior in weapons and technology to take a back seat to any country.

techboy - tell me who said Nascar sucks and I will personally string them up by their balls. lol. I get what you are saying but I dont believe that I am under any error of thinking. I believe that France will be asking us for help because they arent going to be able to fully defend themselves. And I get where you were coming from now, thank you for clearing that up for me.

[Predicto]

First off, thank you for not bashing my opinion. I believe you disagree with me but I am grateful that you didnt call me "ignorant" or "stupid". So cheers to that.

BUT, in WWI I believe they had a "little" help from America. We were right there next to them fighting tooth and nail. And I may be wrong, but I believe that England has always been the strongest military in Europe. At least their Navy is.

The reason that England always had that powerful navy was to make it impossible for the French to invade them. The French had the great Armies, but if those armies couldn't get across the Channel, England was safe.

For four hundred years, the British made and changed alliances with varous other countries on the Continent so that they could counter French power. Heck, it took all of Europe combined to defeat Napoleon.

And yes, we joined in WWI, but it was at the end. That was the final straw that broke the Germans, but the French held those trench lines for several years with remarkable bravery, and lost 1.4 Million soldiers in the process. We lost 116,000 of our men in that war.

I dont believe they are the most powerful in the world, I believe that goes to Israel. But that is just my opinion from watching them keep all the other countries from taking over and how they handle it when you threaten them. I also believe that even if we were the same size as them we would be more powerful. Our weapons and technology are second to none.

Yes, our weapons and technology are second to none. But France's weapons and technology are second only to ours. You really do underestimate France if you think that Israel is more powerful than France. The French have a nuclear powered aircraft carrier task force and ten times as many naval vessels. They have twice the air force, they have more nukes. And their equipment is good. Not top of the line USA good, but very good.

[techboy]

techboy - tell me who said Nascar sucks and I will personally string them up by their balls. lol.

Yes, I chose that analogy for a reason.

[Henry]

Sorry Mike, I was a history major in college and read historical non-fiction for fun these days. 19-20th century American and European history specifically. I'm not trying to prove you wrong, I just love talking about this stuff.

[BigMike619]

Sorry Mike, I was a history major in college and read historical non-fiction for fun these days. 19-20th century American and European history specifically. I'm not trying to prove you wrong, I just love talking about this stuff.

Oh no no no. I took zero offense to it and actually didnt just skip over it.

I can respect anyone who has something to offer even if it does counter my thoughts. You have proven a good case here and thats why I said I cant argue with you.

[Predicto]

Sorry Mike, I was a history major in college and read historical non-fiction for fun these days. 19-20th century American and European history specifically. I'm not trying to prove you wrong, I just love talking about this stuff.

Same here. I was a political science/econ guy, but I am obsessed with Eurpoean history.

Henry - If you have not read "Dreadnaught," I highly recommend it.

[Corcaigh]

Henry, OK. I dont know enough to debate you so I will have to go by what you say.

In other words ... :owned:

Seriously, the French strategy in WW II around the Maginot Line was a catastrophic failure, but other military nations were similarly unprepared for blitzkrieg tactics.

But the French have a vary capable military, and have been fighting terrorism for fifty years before 9/11.

[BigMike619]

In other words ... :owned:

Seriously, the French strategy in WW II around the Maginot Line was a catastrophic failure, but other military nations were similarly unprepared for blitzkrieg tactics.

But the French have a vary capable military, and have been fighting terrorism for fifty years before 9/11.

Now why do you think I was owned because I told him that I didnt know as much as him? That right there shows that you have no place in a conversation between us.

He knows more then me and I said that he does. if I would have been "owned" I would have kept on arguing and proven to look like a fool.

[Henry]

Same here. I was a political science/econ guy, but I am obsessed with Eurpoean history.

Henry - If you have not read "Dreadnaught," I highly recommend it.

I'm currently in the middle of Troublesome Young Men which is, ironically, about British (and French) reluctance to stand up to Germany in the 30s.

It's pretty good, but really rips Chamberlain a new one.

[Old Bay]

Well, here's an interesting test case. On March 11, 2004, terrorists sympathetic to (and possibly part of) Al Queda bombed trains in Madrid killing 191 and wounding 1755. Did the Spanish:

A. Come running to the U.S. for help

or

B. Throw the pro-U.S. government out of power over their handling of the case, and elect a government that ran on the platform of pulling out of Iraq, and generally disassociating itself from the U.S.' actions in the Middle East?

I had read something that said that those attacks had as much to do with the Moor's being defeated (if not more) as it did to Spain's involvement in Iraq. Don't know the source, but it was by a professor of the Middle East at a prestigious university...wish I could remember name or said university, though.

People in that region have a very long memory, and the west is still held accountable for the Crusades as well. No statute of limitations at all, which is why there's so much violence, I suppose.

Glad things settled down here. It's good to have discussions, but sometimes there's too much semantic nitpicking going around.

[zoony]

Does this mean we can't make any french military jokes?

[BigMike619]

Does this mean we can't make any french military jokes?

I wouldnt. I heard the new MOD is just dying to use his new "ban" button

[headexplode]

It's good to have discussions, but sometimes there's too much semantic nitpicking going around.

Well, when you've rehashed the same topics hundreds and hundreds of times before, all that is left is semantic nitpicking.

[joeknows]

Sorry that this post is so long but...

Instructions to Muslims about Unbelievers

Koran 9:29

Fight those who do not profess the true faith (Islam) till they pay the jiziya (poll tax) with the hand of humility.

So here Prophet Mohammed is instructing a true Muslim to fight people of other religions until the unbelievers debase themselves and pay tax for their existence. So the greatness of Islam is revealed only when follwers of other religions are humiliated.

Koran 8:12

Remember Thy Lord inspired the angels (with the message): "I am with you: give firmness to the believers, I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers, Smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger tips of them."

Here Mohammed is giving step by step instruction on how to torture and kill Kafirs if they don't follow Islam.

Koran 9:5

"Then, when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolators wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then leave their way free. Lo! Allah is Forgiving, Merciful."

In the above verse Prophet Mohammed is clearly instructing his followers to kill the idolators in any brutal way possible until the idolators submit themselves to Islam. Allah is indeed merciful !!

Koran 9:73

Prophet, make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites and deal rigorously with them. Hell shall be their Home: an evil fate.

Here Mohammed is trying to justify his brutal acts. He conveniently claims divine justification for the expression of his hatred by saying Allah himself revealed to him personally that people of other religions are evil and belong in Hell. Therefore, according to Mohammed any barbaric act against the unbelievers is completely justified.

Koran 4:144

Believers, do not choose the unbelievers rather than the faithful as your friends. Would you give Allah a clear proof against yourselves ?

This verse clearly states that a Muslim can only befreind a Muslim. Mohammed in order to ensure that his followers will not befriend and get influenced by people of other religions, revealed this verse. This verse illustrates that if a Muslim befriends a Non-Muslim than the wrath of Allah will be on him. Therefore in Islam, people of other religions should be treated with contempt,disrespect and cruelty.

Koran 47:4

When you meet the unbelievers in the Jihad strike off their heads and, when you have laid them low, bind your captives firmly. Then grant them their freedom or take ransom from them, until War shall lay down her burdens.

In the above verse, Mohammed is giving detailed instruction about how to maim and torture unbelievers in Jihad. And finally when the Muslims are satisfied enough after torturing and maiming the unbelievers, they should proceed to demand ransom for the captives. All for the sake for all-merciful Allah !!

Koran 5:33-34

The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet and alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom; Save those who repent before ye overpower them. For know that Allah is Forgiving, merciful.

In this verse, Mohammed devises another recipe for torturing unbelievers. This particular recipe involves chopping off alternate limbs and expelling the Kafirs (people following other religions) out of the land.

http://www.flex.com/~jai/satyamevajayate/hell.html

sounds a bit like the old testament huh?

[joeknows]

i love being buddhist i dont have to hate you for not being buddhist.

its great.... no hate

[wyominghansen]

sounds a bit like the old testament huh?

I'm sorry but I don't know alot about the old testament. I guess it's time for me to learn (because I am rather daft about that subject). Could you fill me in on some of the interesting bits?

I'm not being a smartass. I actually like to learn.

[joeknows]

I'm sorry but I don't know alot about the old testament. I guess it's time for me to learn (because I am rather daft about that subject). Could you fill me in on some of the interesting bits?

I'm not being a smartass. I actually like to learn.

read about David. read about all the phillistines slaughtered by the jews for their lack of faith in the jewish god.

the most of the message i got from reading the old testsament was if you didnt believe in the jewish god...... you would suffer god made cotastrophies and he instructed the jews to kill the non believers or those that worshipped other idols.

[joeknows]

god told the jews he would clear the promised land of non believers and many times sent jewish armies to kill every man woman and child in certain villages for their idol worship.

read about the baals

just read the old testamnt

i find it amazing how many christians only know some stories or the verses the preacher uses and have never actually read the first half of their bible.

for me..... i really had to question the validity of the new testament based upon the old ..... and if the old testament is true....... i dont like that god......

therefore..... i am buddhist

[Henry]

Does this mean we can't make any french military jokes?

God no.

[Sarge]

god told the jews he would clear the promised land of non believers and many times sent jewish armies to kill every man woman and child in certain villages for their idol worship.

read about the baals

just read the old testamnt

i find it amazing how many christians only know some stories or the verses the preacher uses and have never actually read the first half of their bible.

for me..... i really had to question the validity of the new testament based upon the old ..... and if the old testament is true....... i dont like that god......

therefore..... i am buddhist

And then Jesus came to Earth and the New Testament was born. Something the muslims haven't gotten around to.

And if we aren't careful about the riff raff we let into this country, we'll end up just like England.

Full of radicals with leftist apologizing for them and their actions

[Henry]

And then Jesus came to Earth and the New Testament was born. Something the muslims haven't gotten around to.

And if we aren't careful about the riff raff we let into this country, we'll end up just like England.

Full of radicals with leftist apologizing for them and their actions

Sorry about Sarge. He tends to get a little radical now and then ...

Oh **** ... too late.

[joeknows]

And if we aren't careful about the riff raff we let into this country, we'll end up just like England.

or worse .... like france which is what 60+% muslim now?

And then Jesus came to Earth and the New Testament was born. Something the muslims haven't gotten around to.

and when were the crusades? the salem witch trials?...........

my point is this type of thought is not merely a muslim phenomona though...... christianity has been just as guilty of atrocity through the ages...

as well as judaism as per the old testament