All Things Boxing

[StillUnknown]

So, any interest in Klitschko/Povetkin this weekend?  Personally thought this fight should have happened about 4 years ago. Seems like it wasn't too long ago when Wladimir was getting pasted by Corrie Sanders and Brewster.  And the three knockdowns during the Peter fight.   Someone just need to hit him and we'll have a fight.

 

Emmanuel Steward fixed Wlad's defense since those knockdowns. He's still chinny, but he does a much better job of protecting his chin nowadays. Povetkin has some skill, but it won't be enough to make up the size difference. A skilled small fighter will always have a hell of a time beating a skilled big fighter.

[Mr. Sinister]

The last heavyweight bout I saw was Haye/Chisora. I might check this one out.

Edited October 2, 2013 by Mr. Sinister

[Rexx1240]

I think he was implying that a lot of the great fighters(De La Hoya, Mosley, Cotto)he fought were past their primes. Other than Castillo, who are the great fighters he faced? Judah, Gatti, Hatton, JMM, Alverez?

 

Just because he makes the fighters look below average shouldn't discredit the victories. If you honestly think about it, if ANY one of the fighters you mentioned actually convincingly beat Floyd they're INSTANTLY considered great. They already have established careers in the sport plus a good following and fanbase. If any one of the guys were to hand Floyd his first L you def wouldn't be mentioning them in that question as if they're tomato cans.

Edited October 2, 2013 by T-REX1240

[DM72]

I never said that they were tomato cans. Other than Castillo has Floyd ever faced another "great" fighter in their prime? And before you say Zab Judah, he has lost every big fight in his career. Dude lost to Cory Spinks.

And I put the word "great" in quotation because I'm talking about great fighters, not good fighters.

[Rexx1240]

I never said that they were tomato cans. Other than Castillo has Floyd ever faced another "great" fighter in their prime? And before you say Zab Judah, he has lost every big fight in his career. Dude lost to Cory Spinks.

And I put the word "great" in quotation because I'm talking about great fighters, not good fighters.

 

Has Pacquiao?

[StillUnknown]

I never said that they were tomato cans. Other than Castillo has Floyd ever faced another "great" fighter in their prime? And before you say Zab Judah, he has lost every big fight in his career. Dude lost to Cory Spinks.

And I put the word "great" in quotation because I'm talking about great fighters, not good fighters.

 

Diego Corrales was undefeated and considered top 5 p4p when Floyd embarrassed him. Hatton, undefeated with some damn good wins on his record when Floyd knocked him out. Genaro Hernandez has 2 losses on his career to DLH & Floyd, Floyd dominated him at 21.

[Rexx1240]

Diego Corrales was undefeated and considered top 5 p4p when Floyd embarrassed him. Hatton, undefeated with some damn good wins on his record when Floyd knocked him out. Genaro Hernandez has 2 losses on his career to DLH & Floyd, Floyd dominated him at 21.

 

You know what SU when he first posed the question I started to type a response similar to the one you did. Then I deleted and decided to pose the question back because these are famously known fights so apparently the fighters are only considered "good" not "great" as he put it.

[DM72]

Those were good fighters, I don't know if I'd call any of them great. I just don't understand why Floyd gets a pass for avoiding a lot of great fighters when.others have been called-out.

[Rexx1240]

Those were good fighters, I don't know if I'd call any of them great. I just don't understand why Floyd gets a pass for avoiding a lot of great fighters when.others have been called-out.

 

Yea I figured you'd probably call them "good" but I wanted to know if you could say any differently for Pac against "great" fighters and also do you have examples of so many great fighters that Floyd avoided...

[StillUnknown]

Those were good fighters, I don't know if I'd call any of them great. I just don't understand why Floyd gets a pass for avoiding a lot of great fighters when.others have been called-out.

 

Since you don't include Hatton/Corrales/Hernandez as great (although all will be in the HOF), outside of Pac, what other "great" fighter has Floyd avoided?

[DM72]

Pacquiao fought JMM and Morales in their primes. Even though Oscar probably wasn't in his prime, he was still the overwhelming favorite to beat the smaller Pacquiao. Pacquiao destroyed Margarito. Not a great fighter, but was avoided. And before you make jokes, he was one of those guys Floyd avoided at the time.

The fighters off the top of my head Mayweather avoided is:

Tszu

Margarito

Pacquiao

Many also wanted him to fight Sergio Martinez. Now that Sergio has lost a little, wouldn't surprise me if Floyd fought him in May.

[DM72]

Since you don't include Hatton/Corrales/Hernandez as great (although all will be in the HOF), outside of Pac, what other "great" fighter has Floyd avoided?

You'd put Hatton in the HOF? And since when did you have to be great to be avoided? You know as well as I do that Margarito wasn't a great fighter, but no one wanted any part of him for a while.

Let's look at a guy like Erislandy Lara. I wouldn't consider him great, but he's a guy Floyd would think twice about fighting.

[StillUnknown]

You'd put Hatton in the HOF? And since when did you have to be great to be avoided? You know as well as I do that Margarito wasn't a great fighter, but no one wanted any part of him for a while.

Let's look at a guy like Erislandy Lara. I wouldn't consider him great, but he's a guy Floyd would think twice about fighting.

 

Hatton put in work at 140, he's borderline, but I'd probably put him in. I have soft spot for fighters who become more than the some of their parts. Hatton never really had an elite weapon, but compensated with tenacity & aggression. Really was sold on Hatton after he beat Tsyzu

 

Lara's biggest issue is that he keeps getting robbed of the signature win necessary to get people excited about fight with Floyd. His fight with Carlos Molina also set him back, scored a draw, but most felt Molina won.

 

With his inactivity in punch output, I'm not sure how much of a chance he really has. Without a dropoff from father time, nobody is going to outbox Floyd, he'll have to be outworked. Not sure Lara is capable of that.

Edited October 2, 2013 by StillUnknown

[Chachie]

Emmanuel Steward fixed Wlad's defense since those knockdowns. He's still chinny, but he does a much better job of protecting his chin nowadays. Povetkin has some skill, but it won't be enough to make up the size difference. A skilled small fighter will always have a hell of a time beating a skilled big fighter.

 

 

I don't know if it will be Povetkin, but Wlad will be hit again. It will be good for the HW division too. As long as a Klitschko has the belt, the HWs are an afterthought.

 

(For the record I'm a Klitchko Bros fan.)

[Rexx1240]

Pacquiao fought JMM and Morales in their primes. Even though Oscar probably wasn't in his prime, he was still the overwhelming favorite to beat the smaller Pacquiao. Pacquiao destroyed Margarito. Not a great fighter, but was avoided. And before you make jokes, he was one of those guys Floyd avoided at the time.

The fighters off the top of my head Mayweather avoided is:

Tszu

Margarito

Pacquiao

Many also wanted him to fight Sergio Martinez. Now that Sergio has lost a little, wouldn't surprise me if Floyd fought him in May.

 

 

You'd put Hatton in the HOF? And since when did you have to be great to be avoided? You know as well as I do that Margarito wasn't a great fighter, but no one wanted any part of him for a while.

Let's look at a guy like Erislandy Lara. I wouldn't consider him great, but he's a guy Floyd would think twice about fighting.

 

The obvious disdain and complete bias towards Floyd is too laughable to even begin to address. You say great yet mention Margarito??...Okay. I also won't waste time giving the whole background about why that fight didn't happen when the public was calling for it.

 

Then you actually mention Kostya Tszyu?? C'mon bro seriously. He got sent into retirement by Ricky Hatton. But that's another post for another day. 

 

But just to get to the point..You mentioned great fighters that Floyd avoided. Please name these great fighters please.

 

Also, how does Manny continue to get credit for the ODH fight but Floyd doesn't?? 

[Hooper]

I think Floyd would beat Manny now rather easily.

 

And would have beat him when Manny was in his prime. But that would have beat a fun fight and Floyd would have gotten hit more than he ever has in his career.

 

And when it comes to Marquez, Floyd didn't fight the Marquez who magically transformed his body into a piece of stone while pushing 40.

[DM72]

The obvious disdain and complete bias towards Floyd is too laughable to even begin to address. You say great yet mention Margarito??...Okay. I also won't waste time giving the whole background about why that fight didn't happen when the public was calling for it.

 

Then you actually mention Kostya Tszyu?? C'mon bro seriously. He got sent into retirement by Ricky Hatton. But that's another post for another day. 

 

But just to get to the point..You mentioned great fighters that Floyd avoided. Please name these great fighters please.

 

Also, how does Manny continue to get credit for the ODH fight but Floyd doesn't??

Try to follow. Who said he avoided "GREAT" fighters? You can deny it all you want to, but he avoided Tzsu, Margarito and Pacquiao. To sit there and say he didn't avoid anyone is very laughable. It's also funny that Floyd says that he won't fight Pacquiao because he lost twice but if the rumors are true, he'll be fighting the guy(Khan)that got KO'd by the guy(Garcia)who fought on his undercard in May.

I would love to ask Floyd does he still consider Alverez undefeated?

Edited October 4, 2013 by DM72

[Rexx1240]

Those were good fighters, I don't know if I'd call any of them great. I just don't understand why Floyd gets a pass for avoiding a lot of great fighters when.others have been called-out.

 

 

Try to follow. Who said he avoided "GREAT" fighters? You can deny it all you want to, but he avoided Tzsu, Margarito and Pacquiao. To sit there and say he didn't avoid anyone is very laughable. It's also funny that Floyd says that he won't fight Pacquiao because he lost twice but if the rumors are true, he'll be fighting the guy(Khan)that got KO'd by the guy(Garcia)who fought on his undercard in May.

I would love to ask Floyd does he still consider Alverez undefeated?

 

I like debating with you but you contradict yourself a lot man. Look, the fact of the matter is this: Floyd is the best of his time right now. There is nobody on his level. The scary thing is, as others decline with age Floyd seems to be like a damn bottle of fine wine. Pac never stood a chance in the ring with Floyd. His style would get him destroyed against Floyd. Pac is much like Alvarez, a good fighter but not great and not on Floyd's level but hyped enough by media and promoters to lure the casual fan into thinking he actually would give him a good fight. 

 

Every fight that doesn't get made you say the fight was ducked by Floyd. So Floyd has to fight every single fighter that calls him out?? C'mon really dude?? He'd be fighting every 3 months and for what.. to prove his self over and over again. It's mind boggling. Then people fail to realize that the promoters have A LOT to do with whether or not a fight actually gets made. Just because two fighters say they want to fight each other doesn't actually mean they'll be sitting at the table tomorrow signing contracts and picking a fight date. It's just not that easy dude. Sorry but it just isn't. Promoters really have all the power regardless of what the fighters say.

 

Then we get to the double standard. Pac had an option to pick between the winner of the Rios-Alvarado fight. Who does he pick?? The loser of the two. Now if Floyd were in that situation and made the same selection, he'd be CRUCIFIED by fans, media, and everybody else with a set of lips attached to their face. But for Pac it's perfectly acceptable.

 

Floyd fought ODH on Oscar's own terms. By terms I mean glove size, ring, weight, purse split, etc. Floyd def got the ****ty end of the stick there. Manny fights him (at an even older age than Floyd did) and Manny dictates all terms, draining the man in the process and still gets credit for beating an all-time great. Floyd chose to step up in weight and fight Cotto. Manny drained him. In discussions for a rematch, Manny refused to even make the catchweight 150!! So that's how Floyd ended up even getting the Cotto fight in the first place. Don't let me discuss Canelo. Manny wouldn't even be caught in the same ring with that boy. You, him, Arum, Roach, and everybody else knows that would be career suicide for Manny. But Floyd completely outclasses him and all people wanna dwell on is 2 damn lbs!! But conveniently disregard the fact that Floyd walked into the fight @149 and Canelo close to 170.

 

Look at the names that gets thrown at Floyd: Hopkins, Ward, Martinez, GGG, etc, etc, etc!! I mean it's crazy. If Floyd and Manny are (or were ever) considered equal then why have NONE of them names ever been realistically mentioned for Manny?? Exactly.  Everybody knows they aren't fair fights but who cares when it comes to Floyd because he's superman right, he can beat any and everybody right?? Manny has never gave anybody that idea of him in the ring. If any of those names are mentioned with Pac then who would actually be the favorite to win??

 

Pac gets to fight fighter after fighter at severe advantages for himself. Majority of his fights you will notice one or a combination of these things are always to his advantage: fighters are usually coming off a recent loss, coming up in weight, or forced to drain themselves to get the fight. It's very sad. Now Mayweather usually won't fight anybody unless they: either have a belt, undefeated, or coming off a big win. Yet and still we continue to debate 'opponent selection'.. Please, give me a break with that nonsense.

 

I could go on and on and on and on but I have already said WAAY too much and my apologies for the long post. It's just that the Mayweather-Pacquiao debate never seems to be debated fairly or with actual facts for the Pacquiao side of the argument. Rather bias statements and rumors which in turn always makes me rant in a completely bias manner for Floyd. But I will always use facts. I just ask that you do the same. Again my apologies for being so long winded. 

[ksun247]

Vlad should win tonight against Povetkin. Just hope Povetkin can challenge Vlad and make it interesting before getting KO'ed in 9. Not expecting much from Cotto tonight, but he needs to beat Delvin. Rodriguez can make a name for himself with a win. Cotto wins split decision. Terrance Crawford should win easily.

[DM72]

I like debating with you but you contradict yourself a lot man. Look, the fact of the matter is this: Floyd is the best of his time right now. There is nobody on his level. The scary thing is, as others decline with age Floyd seems to be like a damn bottle of fine wine. Pac never stood a chance in the ring with Floyd. His style would get him destroyed against Floyd. Pac is much like Alvarez, a good fighter but not great and not on Floyd's level but hyped enough by media and promoters to lure the casual fan into thinking he actually would give him a good fight.  Every fight that doesn't get made you say the fight was ducked by Floyd. So Floyd has to fight every single fighter that calls him out?? C'mon really dude?? He'd be fighting every 3 months and for what.. to prove his self over and over again. It's mind boggling. Then people fail to realize that the promoters have A LOT to do with whether or not a fight actually gets made. Just because two fighters say they want to fight each other doesn't actually mean they'll be sitting at the table tomorrow signing contracts and picking a fight date. It's just not that easy dude. Sorry but it just isn't. Promoters really have all the power regardless of what the fighters say. Then we get to the double standard. Pac had an option to pick between the winner of the Rios-Alvarado fight. Who does he pick?? The loser of the two. Now if Floyd were in that situation and made the same selection, he'd be CRUCIFIED by fans, media, and everybody else with a set of lips attached to their face. But for Pac it's perfectly acceptable. Floyd fought ODH on Oscar's own terms. By terms I mean glove size, ring, weight, purse split, etc. Floyd def got the ****ty end of the stick there. Manny fights him (at an even older age than Floyd did) and Manny dictates all terms, draining the man in the process and still gets credit for beating an all-time great. Floyd chose to step up in weight and fight Cotto. Manny drained him. In discussions for a rematch, Manny refused to even make the catchweight 150!! So that's how Floyd ended up even getting the Cotto fight in the first place. Don't let me discuss Canelo. Manny wouldn't even be caught in the same ring with that boy. You, him, Arum, Roach, and everybody else knows that would be career suicide for Manny. But Floyd completely outclasses him and all people wanna dwell on is 2 damn lbs!! But conveniently disregard the fact that Floyd walked into the fight @149 and Canelo close to 170. Look at the names that gets thrown at Floyd: Hopkins, Ward, Martinez, GGG, etc, etc, etc!! I mean it's crazy. If Floyd and Manny are (or were ever) considered equal then why have NONE of them names ever been realistically mentioned for Manny?? Exactly.  Everybody knows they aren't fair fights but who cares when it comes to Floyd because he's superman right, he can beat any and everybody right?? Manny has never gave anybody that idea of him in the ring. If any of those names are mentioned with Pac then who would actually be the favorite to win?? Pac gets to fight fighter after fighter at severe advantages for himself. Majority of his fights you will notice one or a combination of these things are always to his advantage: fighters are usually coming off a recent loss, coming up in weight, or forced to drain themselves to get the fight. It's very sad. Now Mayweather usually won't fight anybody unless they: either have a belt, undefeated, or coming off a big win. Yet and still we continue to debate 'opponent selection'.. Please, give me a break with that nonsense. I could go on and on and on and on but I have already said WAAY too much and my apologies for the long post. It's just that the Mayweather-Pacquiao debate never seems to be debated fairly or with actual facts for the Pacquiao side of the argument. Rather bias statements and rumors which in turn always makes me rant in a completely bias manner for Floyd. But I will always use facts. I just ask that you do the same. Again my apologies

for being so long winded.

And Floyd usually fights guys that poses no threat of beating him nor does he fight guys at their peak and he has fought guys coming up of in weight and at catch weights too. JMM came up in weight to fight Floyd and Floyd still came in over the agreed weight. His last fight against Alverez was at a catch weight. I ask again, does he still consider Alverez undefeated like he did Cotto? Probably not. People wanted to.see him fight Pacquiao but he threw in a roadblock. Then he "retired." Then he wanted Pacquiao to take a flat rate of $40M and no PPV revenue. Now he's using the excuses that Pac lost 2 times, Pac doesn't even fight in this country anymore and in order for him to fight Pac, he has to sign with Mayweather Promotions. I still.can't believe some people still buy into all of Mayweather's BS. Again, Chris Broussard, a Mayweather guy, has said from people he's talked to in the Mayweather camp, Floyd never truely wanted to fight Pacquiao. It's totally obvious to me.

[StillUnknown]

I think Wlad is pitching a shutout after 5, but he is fighting in a way that will allow him to be robbed by judges. Way too much holding from Wlad, but he's the only one landing anything of consequence.

 

 

This is a dreadful fight.

Edited October 5, 2013 by StillUnknown

[StillUnknown]

HBO gave up on the heavyweights to avoid fights like this

 

Horrible fight, all Wlad did was put his weight on the smaller man and Povetkin could do nothing to change the dynamic.

 

HBO would be wise to not replay that fight on tonight's card

Edited October 5, 2013 by StillUnknown

[Chachie]

I think Wlad is pitching a shutout after 5, but he is fighting in a way that will allow him to be robbed by judges. Way too much holding from Wlad, but he's the only one landing anything of consequence.

 

 

This is a dreadful fight.

 

 

 

 

 

Gawd awful. It's as if Wlad knows his chin still won't pass the punch test so he simply wrestles his way through fights. With his offensive prowess he should be dropping guys for the count in less than 6 rounds every time... especially today's talent stock at HW.

 

He's just too scared to open up and beat people down like I know he could.

Edited October 6, 2013 by Chachie

[Rexx1240]

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2013/oct/03/amir-khan-matchmaker-anderson-mayweather

 

If this fight actually does materialize, Team Khan is making a HUGE mistake by speaking on it rather than staying quiet. They'll really make themselves look bad when all is said and done.

[StillUnknown]

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2013/oct/03/amir-khan-matchmaker-anderson-mayweather

 

If this fight actually does materialize, Team Khan is making a HUGE mistake by speaking on it rather than staying quiet. They'll really make themselves look bad when all is said and done.

 

If it gets finalized, I doubt they care how it makes them look. The payday will soothe away any media criticisms.