luckydevil Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 Lucky, does this sound like a coup?a CIA plan that reportedly includes a coordinated campaign of propaganda, disinformation and manipulation of Iran's currency and international financial transactions. How about we join hands and sing kumbaya instead? It sounds like we are laying the foundation for a coup. It doesn't matter, the fact that our government is intervening in their affairs is bad enough. We should be sending men with suits (diplomats). In theory, 2008 would end this madness, but the establishment is hell bent on confronting Iran. God help us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowghost Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 If this was leaked, it was done on purpose. I don't really see how this would help, unless it was to make their President paranoid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo-toni Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 My whole confusion with Iran and whatnot is that aren't we kinda on the same side in Iraq? By us putting the Shia in power aren't we in fact putting people that are going to be sympathetic to Iran, perhaps controlled by Iran, in power? There is a sort of hierarchy of allegiances in the Middle East. First, to one's extended family/clan, second to one's ethnicity, third to one's scet, and lastly to one's country. Arabs and Persians generally hate/distrust each other. Also, a stable, democratic Shiite state in Iraq is the last thing Iran wants, because it robs them of their claim to being the champion of Shiism worldwide. In a sense, Iraq under Hussein was like the Vatican under the thumb of the French King during the "Babylonian Captivity" of the middle ages. Qom, the Iranian center of Shiite scholarship, is like Avignon, whereas Najaf and Sistani would be like Rome and the Italian pope. If Iraq becomes a successful prosperous tolerant nation, Iran becomes fairly irrelevant theologically speaking. And of course there's the fact that the mullahs don't want an American ally on their doorstep spreading ideas about secular truly democratic governments.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 Riggo that was well done :applause: you might add about the schism between the Shia that oppose religous leaders as government and the sect Imanutjob follows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 If this was leaked, it was done on purpose. I don't really see how this would help, unless it was to make their President paranoid. Oh, 1) I don't see this news article making anybody in Iran behave any differently. Because they've got to all be assuming that the CIA's been plotting against them for decades. (And their assumptions are correct.) 2) The only real reason I can see why anybody would leak this is that somebody wants to strengthen Iran's position, both in Iran and in the Mideast as a whole. Which in turn causes me to wonder if the story's actual source isn't Tehran. (Another possible piece of evidence in support of that theory: The US has been ticked at Iran for decades. No really big reason to attempt anything right now. But the reports I've heard are that the Iranian government is in need of a pick-me-up right now. I don't see any reason for Bush to be taking any big steps right now, but I do see an Iranian motive that wasn't there a few years ago.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 Yeah, and when Mahmoud Ahmadinejad feels backed into a corner, what do you suspect he'll do? I guess he'll just look at us and go, "Oh, yeah guys I was just kidding." Whatever!:doh: You don't understand the game. Iran has been playing a PR game with the world. They know full well what a job Bush did to the US's credibility on the world stage. We can't start an all out war with them and expect support, such an action would expand anti-US sentiment across the globe and most importantly among our western allies. It's time we start fighting back the same way these guys are fighting, in the shadows and with mind games. Iran can't take direct action to indirect action by the US. Doing so reverses the roles here, suddenly they are the attacker and the US is striking in defense. They know they can't survive that. Odds are he will feel backed into a corner and crack down on the freedoms of his own people and by doing so weaken his own position and intensify his opposition within his own country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slateman Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 Well, its not exactly covert now is it . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 A great thing? How in the world did you come to that conclusion. It is amazing how little people know about Iranian politics. The kooks are losing the battle of ideas. Mullahs are losing their grip and influence. The population is young and liberal.A CIA coup last time I checked, didn't work out well in that country. It gave rise to kooks. Iranians will rally with their government against a foreign power. It will only reinforce the notion that United States is an imperial power hell bent on trying to impose their views on others. This will only strengthen the current regime and the mullahs. It will only speed up the process to build a nuclear weapon. This is makes it even easier for Bin Landen to recruit ( it is fairly easy now for him) This is beyond stupid, it's dangerous. what coup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 I would be disappointed if we hadn't been undermining the crazy ragheads in their government Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 what coup? 1953. Read a book called "All the Shah's Men" The CIA, at the behest of Churchill and the British overthrew a democratically elected gov't in Iran and re-installed the Shah The coup itself was very cool, in terms of planning and execution. For 25 years it looked like a success Then came 1979 and the horrible blowback from the coup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Mike Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 You do understand that they have an ARMY right? The day this country is afraid of Iran, we may as well give up any and all rights to freedom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Mike Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 (I ticked off a bunch of people by declaring, for example, that 9/11 was a publicity stunt.) Tell you what. Tell the families of the thousands who died that day that it was a publicity stunt. Just please say it in person to the biggest dude you can find. And please, let me be there so I can watch the reaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 There should be a fullscale investigation into who leaked it, including press members called and forced to testiffy,And the guilty party should rot in Gitmo for life. Where is the journalistic integrity these days? Treason IMO. Oh, and Des nailed it regarding the actual issue. Agreed. And in the worry over "blowback", consider this is blowback on them for their covert operations in Iraq that have resulted in hundreds if not thousands of innocent lives being lost. You don't teach a bad dog by ignoring it.. you swat his ass. ~Bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 You know who would be thrilled if we invaded Iran? Israel...and nobody else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted May 23, 2007 Author Share Posted May 23, 2007 2) The only real reason I can see why anybody would leak this is that somebody wants to strengthen Iran's position, both in Iran and in the Mideast as a whole. Actually I disagree with this, I can honestly see someone seriously questioning Bush's decision to further provoke Iran, and them exposing the administration and their shadow role in potentially creating an expanded Gulf war. Here's my belief, I think that Bush is doing this to Iran not to move them off the nuclear program but to intentionally antagonize the Iranian government into taking direct action into Iraq. If they do so then Bush can stand back and say "oooohhh, look Iranian bad guys attacked without cause, lets kill them now too." It makes Iran look like the aggressors and Bush innocent, plus it would potentially rally support behind Bush which is what Bush really wants. Needless to say I don't trust Bush at all and if it is treason to expose the administration in this way then fine, because as long as we are making charges of treason I have a couple to be made and we can mail the summons to 1600 Penn. Ave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted May 23, 2007 Author Share Posted May 23, 2007 Agreed.And in the worry over "blowback", consider this is blowback on them for their covert operations in Iraq that have resulted in hundreds if not thousands of innocent lives being lost. You don't teach a bad dog by ignoring it.. you swat his ass. ~Bang The problem is that Iran is not a dog! It is one of the strongest military powers in the Middle East. Furthermore, do you have any idea what happens when you swat a mean and tempermental dog? They turn and bite, which IMO is just what Bush wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 The problem is that Iran is not a dog! It is one of the strongest military powers in the Middle East. Furthermore, do you have any idea what happens when you swat a mean and tempermental dog? They turn and bite, which IMO is just what Bush wants. IMO, what Bush (Cheney, Wolfowitz, etc.) wants is total chaos in the region. Mass Civil War, if possible. All the better to pilfer the crude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted May 23, 2007 Author Share Posted May 23, 2007 Tell you what. Tell the families of the thousands who died that day that it was a publicity stunt. Just please say it in person to the biggest dude you can find. And please, let me be there so I can watch the reaction. I'm not saying that I agree that 9/11 was a publicity stunt, but just playing Devil's Advocate, why should the families be upset at the person giving the potential revelation that 9/11 really was a publicity stunt, isn't this sort of like shooting the messenger? Just because you don't like the news you don't kill the mail man. This attitude seems kinds juvenile because it seeks to maintain the illusion at the expense of the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted May 23, 2007 Author Share Posted May 23, 2007 The day this country is afraid of Iran, we may as well give up any and all rights to freedom. Look, its not a matter of being afraid of Iran's army, its about creating another WAR! Why are we so eager to use our military, this is just insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted May 23, 2007 Author Share Posted May 23, 2007 Odds are he will feel backed into a corner and crack down on the freedoms of his own people and by doing so weaken his own position and intensify his opposition within his own country. You underestimate the hardliners in Iran, they don't care about opinion on the international stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted May 23, 2007 Author Share Posted May 23, 2007 but the establishment is hell bent on confronting Iran. God help us. You're not kidding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 Tell you what. Tell the families of the thousands who died that day that it was a publicity stunt. Just please say it in person to the biggest dude you can find. And please, let me be there so I can watch the reaction. I'm so sure that the 9/11 families thank the heavens that they have folks like "Mad Mike" defending their honor. Leave those families out of your discussion. I doubt that they either need or want your half-assed "support". If you can't add to the debate without invoking dead people you don't know, jump in your POS yellow Corvette and bounce..boy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#98QBKiller Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 'What happens now?' 'Well....now you, Rummy, Cheney, and Ashcroft LEAP out of the rabbit taking the Iranians TOTALLY by surprise!!!........alright I've got another idea, we build this giant wooden badger.....' Don't be silly Tarhog. They would never go to battle themselves. They''d send everyone else's sons and daughters to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 The problem is that Iran is not a dog! It is one of the strongest military powers in the Middle East. Furthermore, do you have any idea what happens when you swat a mean and tempermental dog? They turn and bite, which IMO is just what Bush wants. :laugh: Stop. Please. :rotflmao: You sound just like all the libs before Desert Storm. "OH MY GAWWWWWWDDDDD! Iraq has the forth largest army in the world! They are expert desert warriors! They'll dig in and decimate our Army! What a joke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 You underestimate the hardliners in Iran, they don't care about opinion on the international stage. Please, educate us. What do they care about? It certainly seemed like the cared about international opinion during the British incident. They went through a lot of trouble to make it seem like the acted legally, and then essentially told the British to shut up about us acting illegally or we'll keep them longer, and that whole video tape they released of them saying good bye and loading them on the plane all seemed to be designed to affect world opinion. Why go through all of that if you are not interested in world opinion? Just grab them up, say we grabbed them because we wanted to and could, and we'll release them when we want to if you don't care about world opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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