PREDICTOR Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 I love healthy discussion in the offseason but this shredding and tearing Ramsey apart on every other thread is rediculous. Some of you act as thought Patrick Ramsey is a Dallas Cowboy. I have heard people speak less harshly of players and quarterbacks on Dallas. Patrick Ramsey is the Redskins quarterback. He has done nothing to deserve the abuse and expectations you have placed upon him. Chris Chandler, Stan Humphries, Jeff Hostetler, and a host of other quarterbacks ended up starting Superbowl games at some point in their careers..... and being praised for getting their teams to the Superbowl....yet they were never bashed as badly as Patrick gets bashed and criticized. I suppose some of you who have grown up in the me, me, me, and now, now, now era, are simply impatient and you believe that if you draft a QB in the 1st round, he must go to the Superbowl by his 2nd year like Marino did. But the truth is all QB's don't follow the same learning curve or talent curve. Each QB has his own path and own strengths, and thats incluidng the consideration that Patrick ha2 different systems and 2 different coaches in his first 3 years and Marino had the same coach and same system. We might want to consider that Peyton Manning has had the same system for 7 years and that Joe Montana, Brett Favre, and Steve Young were all considered great QB's....but ONLY after having been in the same system with the same coach for MULTIPLE years....multiple as in 4 or 5. In fact Steve Young, the highest rated passer of all time had to play in a different league first...then play with Tampa Bay.....and then sit on the bench for a couple of years in San Francisco....BEFORE ANYBODY EVEN NOTICED HIM. Patrick has 3 years of experience having thrown to such stellar performers as Rod Gardner, Jaquez Green...well this is the part where I have forgotten the list of Florida rejects that Spurrier brought in but you can fill it in for me. Wonder what would have happened if Patrick had Jerry Rice to throw to when he came into the league or Duper and Clayton like Marino had....and a system that he could stay in for 3 straight years. Patrick Ramsey has done NOTHING to make me believe that he isn't going to have a stronger year than anything we have seen thus far. Even with that, he should be even better NEXT year when he finally gets to start 2 years in a row with the same system and same receivers for the FIRST time in his life. The PRE season is a LEARNING season, its not the REAL season. And because its not the real season, players will be switched in and out and some plays will be called that you will never see during the regular season and the coaces will not bother gameplanning because they are too busy experiementing and a host of other things will go on that don't really matter a hill of beans. BE patient with Patrick and he will come along nicely. I believe you will see him impress you by the Cincy game which is coming up in about 2 weeks. But be patient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fansince62 Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Patrick Ramsey has done NOTHING to make me believe that he isn't going to have a stronger year than anything we have seen thus far. Even with that, he should be even better NEXT year when he finally gets to start 2 years in a row with the same system and same receivers for the FIRST time in his life. well...thanks for the penetrating analysis!!! you you you da man! now now now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
More Complete Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 True, but then you have guys like Tom Brady and Mike Vick who come in and win right away. Some of the criticism of Ramsey is fair. I do agree that some take it a bit to far at times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
da#1skinsfan Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 The guy has only gotten better with every opportunity hes had. If he started game 1, by game 3 he will be much improved. If he started game 10 (a la 2004), he'll be much improved by game 15. As Gibbs says, all we can hope for is he continues to improve like he has. I just hope he gets a full healthy season to show what he can do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfbovey Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 I think the blind defense of Ramsey is equally as bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walking Deadman Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 I'll wait to the 2nd or 3rd preseason game for a true judgement on how the WR corp and Ramsey will pan out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herrmag Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Well, this is a message board. You'll get people that think Ramsey is the next Danny Wuerffel, and you'll get some that think he's the next Joe Montana. My opinion is, I will give him little credit until he proves he deserves to be a starting QB in the NFL. Last year, I thought he came on strong towards the end. However, as we saw in the scrimmage, he didn't show much. It was JUST a scrimmage but, considering he's been working out all offseason, it is cause for alarm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redskin-one Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Pretty soon people will want Brunell back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fansince62 Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 predictor....ok...apologies for the sarcasm...but you were lecturing. these are grown men......many of us have been listening to excuses for a decade now. it's time for performance to be the only metric. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSteve Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 It's no use, and I agree with everything you said. Some Redskins fans just want to continue to abuse Ramsey like he stole their ATV. It's sad considering the average developmental span for a QB is 4-5 years before he starts showing serious improvement. And that, like you said, is in ONE SYSTEM. This is year 4. But only 2 years in the same SYSTEM. It will truly be a sad day if we let Ramsey walk simply because he wasn't given the adequate time he deserved. And to whomever mentioned Brady, he sat and had a chance to observe from the bench. And not only that, RAMSEY IS NOT BRADY. Michael Vick is NOT as good as RAmsey in terms of QB development and I'm a Vick homer. Vick gets by on his athleticism, and that is why he's successful. Ramsey does not have extraordinary athletic skills that enable him to accelerate his development or make his coaches put him on the field. He has to earn it, but it takes TIME. McNair sat on the bench for several seasons. McNabb wasn't all that great his first few years. Have some patience people. I have no friggin' idea why some of you want to start COMPLETELY OVER with Cambell and go through yet another QB developing when we have one ALREADY who is further along and hasn't been given a chance simply because you think that 3 years where he has only started the season once and has NEVER played a full regular season and preseason as the starter is enough. Please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redskin-one Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Originally posted by TheSteve And to whomever mentioned Brady, he sat and had a chance to observe from the bench. And not only that, RAMSEY IS NOT BRADY. Michael Vick is NOT as good as RAmsey in terms of QB development and I'm a Vick homer. Vick gets by on his athleticism, and that is why he's successful. Ramsey does not have extraordinary athletic skills that enable him to accelerate his development or make his coaches put him on the field. He has to earn it, but it takes TIME. McNair sat on the bench for several seasons. McNabb wasn't all that great his first few years. Have some patience people. I have no friggin' idea why some of you want to start COMPLETELY OVER with Cambell and go through yet another QB developing when we have one ALREADY who is further along and hasn't been given a chance simply because you think that 3 years where he has only started the season once and has NEVER played a full regular season and preseason as the starter is enough. Please. Good point - Agree 100%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chachie Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 I think Patrick Ramsey is not a QB that can be good all by himself. Like Rypien, Williams, and Theismann he needs the entire machine to be well-oiled for him to shine. Gibbs has gone far with "non-legendary" OBs before. I have been a Ramsey-lover for a few years now, but even I am starting to accept that he's just not a good defense-reader or coverage-buster. He's got a heck of an arm but not real versatile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
More Complete Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Originally posted by TheSteve And to whomever mentioned Brady, he sat and had a chance to observe from the bench. Yeah, for A WHOLE SEASON! ...and then what happened? Originally posted by TheSteve And not only that, RAMSEY IS NOT BRADY. That's my point. Thanks. I want Ramsey to succeed in the worst way. All I'm saying is the guys got some flaws and warrants criticism from time to time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RabidFan Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Originally posted by Chachie I think Patrick Ramsey is not a QB that can be good all by himself. Like Rypien, Williams, and Theismann he needs the entire machine to be well-oiled for him to shine. Gibbs has gone far with "non-legendary" OBs before. I have been a Ramsey-lover for a few years now, but even I am starting to accept that he's just not a good defense-reader or coverage-buster. He's got a heck of an arm but not real versatile. Correctamundooooo Chachie :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RunPortisRun Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 I really dont care about the Dallas QBs nor any other QB...I sssssoooooo want the Redskins to have a fanchise QB. I just see Ramsey as average. A player is always going to be judged by his past...so far Ramsey has shown very little IMO. I have grown tired of blind faith. I'm tired of losing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codeorama Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Michael Vick? Don't you guys mean Ron Mexico? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkowi Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Originally posted by TheSteve It's no use, and I agree with everything you said. Some Redskins fans just want to continue to abuse Ramsey like he stole their ATV. It's sad considering the average developmental span for a QB is 4-5 years before he starts showing serious improvement. And that, like you said, is in ONE SYSTEM. This is year 4. But only 2 years in the same SYSTEM. It will truly be a sad day if we let Ramsey walk simply because he wasn't given the adequate time he deserved. And to whomever mentioned Brady, he sat and had a chance to observe from the bench. And not only that, RAMSEY IS NOT BRADY. Michael Vick is NOT as good as RAmsey in terms of QB development and I'm a Vick homer. Vick gets by on his athleticism, and that is why he's successful. Ramsey does not have extraordinary athletic skills that enable him to accelerate his development or make his coaches put him on the field. He has to earn it, but it takes TIME. McNair sat on the bench for several seasons. McNabb wasn't all that great his first few years. Have some patience people. I have no friggin' idea why some of you want to start COMPLETELY OVER with Cambell and go through yet another QB developing when we have one ALREADY who is further along and hasn't been given a chance simply because you think that 3 years where he has only started the season once and has NEVER played a full regular season and preseason as the starter is enough. Please. excellent post. 100% with what he said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallsux Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Originally posted by PREDICTOR I love healthy discussion in the offseason but this shredding and tearing Ramsey apart on every other thread is rediculous. Some of you act as thought Patrick Ramsey is a Dallas Cowboy. I have heard people speak less harshly of players and quarterbacks on Dallas. Patrick Ramsey is the Redskins quarterback. He has done nothing to deserve the abuse and expectations you have placed upon him. Chris Chandler, Stan Humphries, Jeff Hostetler, and a host of other quarterbacks ended up starting Superbowl games at some point in their careers..... and being praised for getting their teams to the Superbowl....yet they were never bashed as badly as Patrick gets bashed and criticized. I suppose some of you who have grown up in the me, me, me, and now, now, now era, are simply impatient and you believe that if you draft a QB in the 1st round, he must go to the Superbowl by his 2nd year like Marino did. But the truth is all QB's don't follow the same learning curve or talent curve. Each QB has his own path and own strengths, and thats incluidng the consideration that Patrick ha2 different systems and 2 different coaches in his first 3 years and Marino had the same coach and same system. We might want to consider that Peyton Manning has had the same system for 7 years and that Joe Montana, Brett Favre, and Steve Young were all considered great QB's....but ONLY after having been in the same system with the same coach for MULTIPLE years....multiple as in 4 or 5. In fact Steve Young, the highest rated passer of all time had to play in a different league first...then play with Tampa Bay.....and then sit on the bench for a couple of years in San Francisco....BEFORE ANYBODY EVEN NOTICED HIM. Patrick has 3 years of experience having thrown to such stellar performers as Rod Gardner, Jaquez Green...well this is the part where I have forgotten the list of Florida rejects that Spurrier brought in but you can fill it in for me. Wonder what would have happened if Patrick had Jerry Rice to throw to when he came into the league or Duper and Clayton like Marino had....and a system that he could stay in for 3 straight years. Patrick Ramsey has done NOTHING to make me believe that he isn't going to have a stronger year than anything we have seen thus far. Even with that, he should be even better NEXT year when he finally gets to start 2 years in a row with the same system and same receivers for the FIRST time in his life. The PRE season is a LEARNING season, its not the REAL season. And because its not the real season, players will be switched in and out and some plays will be called that you will never see during the regular season and the coaces will not bother gameplanning because they are too busy experiementing and a host of other things will go on that don't really matter a hill of beans. BE patient with Patrick and he will come along nicely. I believe you will see him impress you by the Cincy game which is coming up in about 2 weeks. But be patient. :notworthy :notworthy :notworthy Is there a chance we could sticky this thread? That's a damn good post. Well put & great points made. I think a lot of us Ramsey supporters have said everything you just said multiple times to the constant groans about Ramsey's performance. But, this is Washington & the one job in Washington that receives more criticism isn't the President, but the QB. Every QB we have ever had...EVER...has been complained about more than the President himself. So, to some extent, it is to be expected, but I agree. The complaining about Patrick is rather excessive. Thank you for your post. Nice to see a good one about him again. :thumbsup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallsux Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Originally posted by dfbovey I think the blind defense of Ramsey is equally as bad. PREDICTOR is blind? How does he/she see Ramsey's performance to defend him then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallsux Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Originally posted by herrmag Well, this is a message board. You'll get people that think Ramsey is the next Danny Wuerffel, and you'll get some that think he's the next Joe Montana. My opinion is, I will give him little credit until he proves he deserves to be a starting QB in the NFL. Last year, I thought he came on strong towards the end. However, as we saw in the scrimmage, he didn't show much. It was JUST a scrimmage but, considering he's been working out all offseason, it is cause for alarm. Not really. As you mentioned, it was a scrimmage & not much should be taken seriously about it. FIRST thing you must remember is that there was NO RUNNING GAME to help balance the defense. So, they KNEW he was going to be throwing. It was also NOT a real game situation, even tho they were squaring off against a different team. I don't think there is any reason to be alarmed at all. Not yet, anyway. I think, more fans are taking Ramsey's scrimmage perfomance more seriously than I think even Ramsey did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamebreaker Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 That is a good point, the Ravens actually balanced their playcalling in the scrimmage. There was probably slightly more running plays than passing plays. I can recall only two plays where the Skins ran the ball with Ramsey behind center. The Ravens blitzed on every down and knew Gibbs wanted to see how the passing game would do. It also should be to no one's surprise that Campbell performed the best among the 3 QBs, and his unit also ran the ball the most as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fansince62 Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 agree Chachie! and your post is not PR bashing. JG has clearly sent a message to PR that the time has arrived to perform. he is due a chance over pre-season and on into the regular season to get it done. but the time for him to take it to the next level is - NOW. PR has some limitations vis other QBs. He is gonna have to separate himself from the pack through a more finely honed passing game and through his mental abilities (read, react, execute - quickly and correctly). otherwise......plan B is onboard and in development. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 I would also keep in mind that I'm sure the Redskins knew what the Ravens were doing on some of the plays. I think Gibbs might have asked Billick to throw certain things at them and vice versa since it was a scrimmage and each coach had things he wanted to work on with his team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flexxskins Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Originally posted by Chachie I think Patrick Ramsey is not a QB that can be good all by himself. Like Rypien, Williams, and Theismann he needs the entire machine to be well-oiled for him to shine. Gibbs has gone far with "non-legendary" OBs before. I have been a Ramsey-lover for a few years now, but even I am starting to accept that he's just not a good defense-reader or coverage-buster. He's got a heck of an arm but not real versatile. Very, very well put. Chachie, I think that you have spoken for alot of Redskins fans. That pretty much sums up exactly how I feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREDICTOR Posted August 9, 2005 Author Share Posted August 9, 2005 Originally posted by More Complete True, but then you have guys like Tom Brady and Mike Vick who come in and win right away. Some of the criticism of Ramsey is fair. I do agree that some take it a bit to far at times. And so did Dan Marino. So, can I assume you think ALL quarterbacks and all human beings are physcially equal and mentally equal and learn in exactly the same order and within the same time frame? And even if they did, then you would have to duplicate the exact same players from other teams and exact same weather conditions for games. You simply have to stop comparing apples to oranges...and then wondering why my apple doesn't taste like your orange...especially when they are grown in different fields under different weather condiditons. Everybody is NOT the same. And regarding Michael Vick...some would say that Patrick Ramsey is STILL a better passer than Vick. Michael Vick wins because he is a running back and not because of his superb passing skills. How many TD's did HE throw last year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.