Westbrook36 Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Ok, I don't think I made myself clear. Comparing the careers of the two men is assinine at best. I mean, 3 to none is pretty cut and dry. BUT, for 2005, if I need a coach to win THIS YEAR, I'm taking Reid. Most of you will take Gibbs based off of what he did so many years ago.....you know, I can't really knock you either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagles_Legendz Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Originally posted by Westbrook36 Ok, I don't think I made myself clear. Comparing the careers of the two men is assinine at best. I mean, 3 to none is pretty cut and dry. BUT, for 2005, if I need a coach to win THIS YEAR, I'm taking Reid. Most of you will take Gibbs based off of what he did so many years ago.....you know, I can't really knock you either. I'll agree with this as well. I understand why Redskins fans would still take Gibbs, but I'd take Reid in '05 if I had my druthers, but an argument can be formed in either direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
33 Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Originally posted by Westbrook36 Ok, I don't think I made myself clear. Comparing the careers of the two men is assinine at best. I mean, 3 to none is pretty cut and dry. BUT, for 2005, if I need a coach to win THIS YEAR, I'm taking Reid. Most of you will take Gibbs based off of what he did so many years ago.....you know, I can't really knock you either. I'll agree with this as well.I understand why Redskins fans would still take Gibbs, but I'd take Reid in '05 if I had my druthers, but an argument can be formed in either direction. I don't dispute what you both are saying. I personally would have more fun taking Gibbs, as I imagine you guys with Reid. All I've been trying to say from the start is that while I give Reid a lot of credit for being easily the 2nd or 3rd best coach in the NFL currently, he won't be looked at that way without at least one ring. Which until he gets, he's a total failure. Sad, but true. The NFL is about rings when push comes to shove. But to say what coach you would want for this upcoming season is equally assinine. With what team? For the Skins, I take Gibbs. He knows the team, it's his team. For the Eagles I would probably pick Reid. But I can't help but think about Dungy being replaced a few years ago and Gruden coming in to take TB all the way. Having said that, I will let you know that I believe Reid to be a better coach than Gruden. But, sometimes a fresh approach makes the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagles_Legendz Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Originally posted by bhayesp I don't dispute what you both are saying. I personally would have more fun taking Gibbs, as I imagine you guys with Reid. All I've been trying to say from the start is that while I give Reid a lot of credit for being easily the 2nd or 3rd best coach in the NFL currently, he won't be looked at that way without at least one ring. Which until he gets, he's a total failure. Sad, but true. The NFL is about rings when push comes to shove. But to say what coach you would want for this upcoming season is equally assinine. With what team? For the Skins, I take Gibbs. He knows the team, it's his team. For the Eagles I would probably pick Reid. But I can't help but think about Dungy being replaced a few years ago and Gruden coming in to take TB all the way. Having said that, I will let you know that I believe Reid to be a better coach than Gruden. But, sometimes a fresh approach makes the difference. Very good points. Gruden is a personal favorite of mine, but there are times when Reid's steady hand is best for the Eagles. I don't expect any Redskins fans to what anyone else than their legendary coach either, so there probably won't be any ground gained in this discussion from either side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parlett316 Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Ok Eagle fans, which one, Buddy Ryan or Andy Reid? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagles_Legendz Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Originally posted by Parlett316 Ok Eagle fans, which one, Buddy Ryan or Andy Reid? I liked Buddy's attitude, but he had no success in the postseason, and little vision for offensive talent. I suspect a qualified offensive coordinator would have remedied that, but I'll take Reid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tr1 Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 The Eagles had a chance to come back at the end of the Super Bowl. The time mismangement, I believe, was not McNabb's fault, but Reid's fault. I think coaching evaluation is based on how one does in the heat of the battle, when everything is on the line. I think the coaching collapsed...it was a very bizarre ending. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Reid has not proven ANYTHING OTHER than with one QB and a team that is generally kept in tact over the years, that he can win games in a weaker division. That is not proof of goodness. It's proof he's been better than anyone else against him in the division for a while, but the division hasn't exactly been stellar. Reid has never displayed Gibbs' ability to adapt to personnel or handle any real adversity. Gibbs won championships with entirely different deployments of the offensive scheme. Different QBs. Different running backs. He won games when his team was overmatched due to injury. Gibbs WAS, absolutely, a horrible coach last year. He'll tell you the same. He was slow to get plays in. He wasn't thinking plays ahead like he used to. He didn't fully understand the personnel he had. But, even where he had a terrible coaching year, he recognized what that team needed and adjusted to fit what that team could do. Until Andy Reid does ANYTHING through adversity, I'll always take a guy like Joe Gibbs. Because, as of this moment in time, as much credit as I give Reid for some of the good things in Philly, you can't say he's proven anything except he can ride a very positive wave. A whole lot of coaches can do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
budski Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Reid is an excellant coach. Picking him or Gibbs for coaching a team is real easy based on recent records. I would pick Gibbs to coach NasCar. I would pick Reid to coach football. But if I were Reid I would be looking into his "big game" problems. It is clear he is following Reeves and Levys footpath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreek1973 Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Originally posted by blakman211 I was listening to Sirrius Radio today in my car and they finally were talking about the Redskins. After a few calls from people, an Eagles fan called in and spoke about Reid, particularly how - Reid has handled things this offseason compared to Gibbs; - He said that Gibbs couldn't handle problem players; - that Reid has a successful program in Philly; - that Reid was better at adjusting his offense, whereas Gibbs just gave up last year; I wanted to call in and just profanely denounce these statements, but I had already called in once and the show was about to end. So I just called my dad and we had a good laugh. ------ Reid?...Well lets see. Did Reid have to face two other teams that were Championship caliber teams like the Dallas and Giants year after year and still endup going to 4 SBs winning 3 of them? How good a coach would Reid be if he didn'thave Mcnabb? I mean how good would his offense be? Gibbs did it with 3 different QBs....oh I forgot even with Mcnabb Reid hasn't done it yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Reid is the equal to a runningback who's awesome between the 20's, but can't punch it in. I deeply believe that in their Def. Coord was their head coach, they got a Off. Coord who designed an offense for McNabb, not Reids "Favre" offense where D-Mac scrambles sometimes...... they would have at least 1 superbowl ring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceman Spiff Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Wonder how well Gibbs would have done with those eagles teams. Think they'd have a ring? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 In the end, there's the biggest difference between Reid and Gibbs. When Eagle fans talk of Reid, it is often to say a player on the Eagles fits perfectly with what the Eagles want to do. Westbrook, for example, is a perfect fit for what Reid wants to do. They'll say this. They'll be absolutely right. This is a great positive to be sure. Reid has a vision. He's got an idea. And he assists in finding players who fit within that vision and with those ideas. This is why he's a very good coach. Gibbs is a level above. When Redskin fans talk about Gibbs, as they hear through former players, it's not that any player fits well with what Gibbs wants to do. It's that Gibbs identifies WHAT that player CAN do, and asks him to do that, adjusting what he can do around what the player he has is capable of doing. As Doc illuminated for us some time ago, Gibbs' greatness as a coach is finding the things -- perhaps only one thing -- a player can do better than most or better than all, and putting him in position to do just that. Gibbs was gone for a long time. He had to learn exactly what his players could do and how to best compliment the players he had. While he may not enjoy immediate success with the changes he made, it is clear he knows exactly what he's doing. He's doing what he's always done. Fit what he does to what his players can. Reid does not do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaleighSkinsMann Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 3>0 ..........................hail skins!!!!!!!!!:logo: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chachie Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Originally posted by bubba9497 so how many Super Bowl trophies does Reid have? Ooooooooohh!!! RIGHT in the CHEST! :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
budski Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Art, Disagree with you on this one. Having a player fit a system is no differant than having a system fit a player, in fact it is the same. Once the player is in the system and whether it works out or not is dependent on how good the people are that pick the player. Reid is just as good as Gibbs at this I think. The problem exists in adapting your game plans for level 2 (playoffs) level 3 (superbowl). Reid can do it all, but there is something that is lacking when it comes to level 3. On top of that problem is the longer you stay the top dog, the more the other dogs learn how your tactics work and how to take you down. You said gibbs was good at adjusting, Reid is also, but adjusting in the playoffs, superbowl, are worlds apart from adjusting in the regular season. thats what separates the two men. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wskin44 Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Originally posted by Canadian Hog Andy Reid is a great coach. Period. He has proven himself at being very adept at getting his players ready to play with attention to detail and good game-planning for several years. However, when all the chips have been moved to the center of the table, Joe Gibbs has demonstrated a far superior ability at stepping up his game. Legends don't let opportunities slip through their hands. Gibbs gets to a Super Bowl or NFC Championship game, he wins. Until Reid starts doing the same more consistently, there will always be a gap between himself and the best of the best. Well said. Reid is a great coach. Gibbs is even greater. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GSF Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Art is exactly right. The Eagles have enjoyed the luxury of playing in a very weak division in recent seasons, which allowed them to gain home field advantage and a bye in the playoffs pretty easily. Year after year though, when they got some stiff competition deep in the playoffs they crumbled. I personally attribute Philly's perrenial choking directly to Reid. When the pressure was really on, Reid made some seriously bone headed play calls, he abandoned the run, and he showed poor clock management. Basically he panicked. I also think that the Eagles could have had already won a superbowl if Reid adjusted his ofense to fit McNabb's game a little better. Up until now, McNabb just hasn't consistently had the accuracy to be a great west coast QB like a Young or Montana. Reid's offense has been too 1 dimensional, and puts way too much pressure on McNabb to do it all. I consider Reid to be a good, but not great coach. I don't even rank him in the top 5. I would have to put the following coaches ahead of Reid: Bellichic Parcells Gibbs Fox Vermeil Holmgren Billick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Andy Reid is a good coach, but has he won any Superbowls? Gibbs had to get reacclimated (sp?) into the current NFL. I think that we will see much improvent this season on offense......:2cents: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-Prime Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Gibbs would never make a bet with Moss, that would result in him wearing speedo's.. Reid would.. Gibbs cares about us all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkart Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Originally posted by Westbrook36 Right now, in the salary cap era, Reid is better. He has proven it. But, I'm sure this thread will be full of talk of Superbowls from a decade ago. Yes your right this thread will talk about SB's from a decade ago, because they still count. Andy Reid is a great coach, but face it NO Super Bowls !!! You can not say he's better when he has only reached 1 Super Bowl, and lets not forget how he coached the last 5 minutes. It's all about the finish, ask Marv Levy. Did I remember his name right? :whoknows: Bills 4 time Super Bowl loser. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Higgs44 Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 My pic says it all:cheers: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
budski Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Dont forget the Vikings, of course the Broncos, now the Eagles. oh well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westbrook36 Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 If Gibbs has a year as bad as last, this question will be laughed at if asked again next offseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallsux Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 Originally posted by blakman211 I was listening to Sirrius Radio today in my car and they finally were talking about the Redskins. After a few calls from people, an Eagles fan called in and spoke about Reid, particularly how - Reid has handled things this offseason compared to Gibbs; - He said that Gibbs couldn't handle problem players; - that Reid has a successful program in Philly; - that Reid was better at adjusting his offense, whereas Gibbs just gave up last year; He "just gave up, huh?! That just goes to show the ignorance of most Eagles fans. :eaglesuck I wanted to call in and just profanely denounce these statements, but I had already called in once and the show was about to end. So I just called my dad and we had a good laugh. I would have to. FIRST & FOREMOST, Andy Reid is missing 3 little things...I mean, RINGS. Kinda hard to be better than a HOF coach when you don't have any RINGS to show off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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