WashingtonTimes: Voight: Is Obama creating a civil war in America?

[Destino]

nice pwn sacase btw

Really? Let's see...

Oh please!

Let's see...There was a 80 year old guy who was arrested for tresspassing at the mall. But of course since liberals like to be play the victim, he says it was because he was wearing a Bush T-Shirt. So you have a guy who happend to wear a Anti Bush T-Shirt get arressted for tresspassing.

1 - Nicole and Jeff Rank were arrested on Independence Day, 2004, for wearing anti-Bush T-shirts. They were on the grounds of the capitol in Charleston, West Virginia, where Bush was giving a speech ~

http://www.progressive.org/mag_mc082007

2 - A 61-year-old librarian was ejected from an ostensibly public McCain campaign event at the Denver Center of Performing Arts in Denver, CO on June 7 because she was brandishing a deadly memetic weapon: a hand-lettered sign that read "McCain=Bush." ~

http://majikthise.typepad.com/majikthise_/2008/07/woman-arrested.html

3 - Daniel Finsel of Lehighton, Pennsylvania, went to protest a visit by President Bush to nearby Kutztown on July 9. Finsel was carrying a huge sign, three feet by four feet, that said, "U.S. Aggression Breeds Terrorism." ~

http://www.progressive.org/mag_mcbushevent

Want me to keep googling this? One event my ass....

You have guys in Arizona, who exercise their constitutional rights to bear arms, who cause no problems and break no law not get arrested, what's the problem here?

Then you actually have the audacity to compare the two events? I bet you would complain about the old man getting arrested but then turn around and said it was ok for the mall to not renew the lease of the guy who was selling anti obama stuff.

Yeah I have the audacity of comparing the two events. We have loons at townhalls disrupting the events, how many arrested? We have loons with threatening signs with loaded weapons... how many arrested? One that I know of... the loon I point out below with the illegal gun hiding in the highschool Obama planned to visit a few hours later.

I do think what TSF Said was interesting. Liberals are quick to want to leave the country while conservatives are willing to fight for it.

By it you of course mean republican political stances being that no one is threatening the country... just republican ideology. (like I said earlier, here is the crazy "we are country" stuff)

Armed loons at Obama's events>? Really?

PORTSMOUTH — Police said a man arrested at the scene of President Barack Obama's visit to the city Tuesday was found to be in possession of an unlicensed loaded gun.

Richard Terry Young, 62, of 821 Ocean Blvd. in Hampton, was arrested around 9:40 a.m., hours before Obama's arrival, and charged with the misdemeanor crimes of criminal trespass and carrying a loaded pistol without a license

Young was found inside Portsmouth High School, where Obama later in the day held his town hall-style forum. Young was detained by the Secret Service and subsequently arrested by Portsmouth Lt. Corey MacDonald. Young was carrying a pocket knife, police said. A subsequent search of his vehicle, parked on school property, revealed a loaded hand gun, police said. ~

http://www.seacoastonline.com/articles/20090811-NEWS-908119961

Yes LJS, really.

[PeterMP]

One thing is certain. The loony right is more violent on than the loony left. Maybe there are more of them?

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

He's being sarcastic. And FTR it's small-l (I'm not a member of the Party).

My bad.

[Midnight Judges]

If Republicans want to revolt I say go for it. Good luck with that.

[sacase]

Really? Let's see...

1 - Nicole and Jeff Rank were arrested on Independence Day, 2004, for wearing anti-Bush T-shirts. They were on the grounds of the capitol in Charleston, West Virginia, where Bush was giving a speech ~

http://www.progressive.org/mag_mc082007

2 - A 61-year-old librarian was ejected from an ostensibly public McCain campaign event at the Denver Center of Performing Arts in Denver, CO on June 7 because she was brandishing a deadly memetic weapon: a hand-lettered sign that read "McCain=Bush." ~

http://majikthise.typepad.com/majikthise_/2008/07/woman-arrested.html

3 - Daniel Finsel of Lehighton, Pennsylvania, went to protest a visit by President Bush to nearby Kutztown on July 9. Finsel was carrying a huge sign, three feet by four feet, that said, "U.S. Aggression Breeds Terrorism." ~

http://www.progressive.org/mag_mcbushevent

Want me to keep googling this? One event my ass....

So basicially these were loons who were being disruptive and were arrested.

Yeah I have the audacity of comparing the two events. We have loons at townhalls disrupting the events, how many arrested? We have loons with threatening signs with loaded weapons... how many arrested? One that I know of... the loon I point out below with the illegal gun hiding in the highschool Obama planned to visit a few hours later.

By it you of course mean republican political stances being that no one is threatening the country... just republican ideology. (like I said earlier, here is the crazy "we are country" stuff)

The "loons" were not arrested because they were not being disruptive or breaking the law. The "loon" who was arrested broke the law. It's really such a simple concept. Break the law, get arrested. Don't break the law, don't get arrested.

So essentially what your problem is, is that you think that anyone who is not a liberal should be arressted because they are loons. If they disagree with your political views they are loons. Why do you hate the constitution?

[skinfan133]

You may be normal in every other way, but in my opinion your ideology is insane. Sorry, that's just how i feel.

Of course some are crazier than others and those are the people I was referring to.

It's ok, I think you're political ideology was handed down to you by Satan himself :thumbsup: no hard feelings.

[skinfan133]

It's not strange at all. What is strange is the mindset behind it. Democrats and liberals see America as a nation. Conservative define America as "themselves". Liberals are not america in their mind. In fact anyone not in line with their thinking is by their definition "un-american". They don't think of Obama as an American, he's a socialist. He's trying to take over their country. Forget the election or any of that ****... America is them. That is why anything a conservative leader supports is automatically viewed as being in line with America. The constitution isn't america, they are. This is why taking a gun to an Obama event with a threatening sign is ok in their minds. Getting arrested for wearin an anti-Bush t-shirt at a Bush event is also ok. There is no problem because the peson in the t-shirt was un-american, and thus bad, while the gun wielding loon was defending america (conservatism) from the bad socialist.

You can see this thinking at work on the campaign trail. The stop at a republican stronghold and call it "real america". Tune into Sean Hannity and you will see that he refers to his republican callers like so: "you are a great american!" and they reply in kind. He knows nothing about them but that they have told his call screener they are republicans and thus "great americans".

We've already heard of people that disagree with them being called threats to america. Now the amount of violent rhetoric is rising.

wow. you got it right. I don't believe it. you've uncovered my secret inner feelings about everything politics, as every other conservative/libertarian in this country.

:stfu: this is beyond hackery.

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

:munchout:

[ACW]

My bad.

It's cool

[Monte51Coleman]

Wasn't he the bad guy in last season's 24?

Yeah, apparently he wasn't acting.

[ACW]

Yeah, apparently he wasn't acting.

[Henry]

So our Founding Fathers were insane? :no:

Which ones?

Hamilton? Jefferson? Adams? Franklin?

I really really wish people would stop using 'founding fathers' in place of 'God' as the ultimate monolithic authority on everything. They all had very different ideas as to how this country should be governed. 'Founding fathers' represents a lot of people, some of whom favored a very strong federal government, some of whom favored a very weak central government, and some of whom thought each generation should tear the previous generation's government down and create a new one.

It seems all the rage these days to say the 'Founding Fathers' with capital 'F's would have liked this or disliked that. Bull. One of them may have liked something while another would have hated it. They weren't gods. They were men, just like us. The big difference between them and us is they understood the importance of compromise, an understanding we today are apparently seriously lacking. If we really want to honor what they stood for, we need to stop acting so damn dramatic about issues like health care and learn to work together without shouting like a bunch of grade-schoolers...

[Allen Iverson]It's health care. We're talking about health care. I mean, health care. It's just health care. Health. Care. It's ... just ... health ... care. It's HEALTH CARE[/Allen Iverson]

Put down the Hitler signs. Stop talking about 'soft tyranny'. Stop lecturing us about the founding fathers. Stop acting like the little brother in the back seat who pokes and pokes and pokes and then when he gets a poke back whines to daddy about it. Nobody is being rounded up and taken to camps and cooked or gassed or worked to death. Nobody is disappearing in the middle of the night and returned as ashes in a small box. It's FRICKIN HEALTH CARE.

Seriously. As a fairly moderate guy, as someone disgusted at the anti-war protesters in '03, as someone who hates Michael Moore, as someone who thinks Janeane Garafalo is out of her mind, as someone who wants to shove Kashi bars up the posteriors of Whole Foods boycotters, I think conservatives have been acting completely insane the last few months. Get over yourselves and respect the government the way you demanded it of liberals when your guy was in office.

Obama wants to start a civil war. That's rich. No. Obama is President and you don't like him. That doesn't make him evil or you special. Voice your dissent, but stop acting like the world is collapsing. The Dems are gonna win elections sometimes. And when they do, they are gonna try and pass laws. That's how it works.

Here endeth the rant. I need some oxygen.

[ACW]

I'm not conservative :cuss:

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

I'm not conservative :cuss:

Maybe not but you do talk about what the Founding Fathers intended quite a bit.

[skinfan133]

Henry, here's the thing: there are a ton of people who are fed up with both parties. I would rather see the constitution elevated by force than continue with the Bull **** that is being given to us by both parties. You, me, everyone is getting screwed by the political establishment. Once the people who voted for Obama realize that he is no different than anyone else elected into office, I think there will be even more public anger.

same ****, different flies my friend.

[Dan T.]

Well said Henry. Well said.

[Destino]

So basicially these were loons who were being disruptive and were arrested.

The "loons" were not arrested because they were not being disruptive or breaking the law.

Want me to post videos of town halls recently? Not being disruptive my ass. They are being ASKED to be disruptive. How many arrests over "disruptive"? You got it right the only one that got arrested was the one found with an illegal gun hold up in the place Obama was going to be later that day.

And btw - two of those "disruptive" people actually won a lawsuit because as it turns out all they were doing was protesting and not being disruptive. But don't let that get in the way because with the state of townhalls right now your disruptive point was never reasonable to begin with.

[Henry]

Once the people who voted for Obama realize that he is no different than anyone else elected into office, I think there will be even more public anger.

same ****, different flies my friend.

Uh, I voted for him and I know he's no different than anyone else elected into office. But I happen to like our system of government.

I actually understand the benefits of the *GASP* two-party system.

And I even know a few things about the founding fathers. Go figure.

[Koolblue13]

I would say he is just dumping gas on a fire thats been burning for almost 30 years.

[Henry]

I'm not conservative :cuss:

Well it turned into a rant, which means not all of it was directed at you.

But seriously, libertarians need to stop acting like they are the only people who have read the Constitution.

[Destino]

wow. you got it right. I don't believe it. you've uncovered my secret inner feelings about everything politics, as every other conservative/libertarian in this country.

:stfu: this is beyond hackery.

- Are liberals that oppose republican politics not talked about as being un-american?

- Are liberals pushing their own politics, the very ones they promised in election they won, not being refered to as socialists, tyrants, that are threatening america?

- Are republican towns not called "real america" by republicans?

- Are we not having this discussion in a thread where a republican is openly wondering if Obama is starting a civil war becuase *gasp* he wants to reform healthcar?

I mean feel free to point out where I am off here? I'm going by what your side is saying. It's getting ugly and now we are getting into implied violence.

[Larry]

One thing is certain. The loony right is more violent on than the loony left. Maybe there are more of them?

I wouldn't automatically jump to such a broad conclusion. The whacko animal-rights extremists, and the whacko environmental extremists, definitely have exhibited some behavior over the years that I wouldn't exactly call "peaceful".

(Remembering a Dennis Miller joke: The animal rights people decided that they'd throw blood on people wearing fur, but not leather, because it's safer to publicly assault rich women than motorcycle gangs.)

[#98QBKiller]

Which ones?

Hamilton? Jefferson? Adams? Franklin?

I really really wish people would stop replacing 'founding fathers' with 'God' as the ultimate monolithic authority on everything. They all had very different ideas as to how this country should be governed. 'Founding fathers' represents a lot of people, some of whom favored a very strong federal government, some of whom favored a very weak central government, and some of whom thought each generation should tear the previous generation's government down and create a new one.

It seems all the rage these days to say the 'Founding Fathers' with capital 'F's would have liked this or disliked that. Bull. One of them may have liked something while another would have hated it. They weren't gods. They were men, just like us. The big difference between them and us is they understood the importance of compromise, an understanding we today are apparently seriously lacking. If we really want to honor what they stood for, we need to stop acting so damn dramatic about issues like health care and learn to work together without shouting like a bunch of grade-schoolers...

[Allen Iverson]It's health care. We're talking about health care. I mean, health care. It's just health care. Health. Care. It's ... just ... health ... care. It's HEALTH CARE[/Allen Iverson]

Put down the Hitler signs. Stop talking about 'soft tyranny'. Stop lecturing us about the founding fathers. Stop acting like the little brother in the back seat who pokes and pokes and pokes and then when he gets a poke back whines to daddy about it. Nobody is being rounded up and taken to camps and cooked or gassed or worked to death. Nobody is disappearing in the middle of the night and returned as ashes in a small box. It's FRICKIN HEALTH CARE.

Seriously. As a fairly moderate guy, as someone disgusted at the anti-war protesters in '03, as someone who hates Michael Moore, as someone who thinks Janeane Garafalo is out of her mind, as someone who wants to shove Kashi bars up the posteriors of Whole Foods boycotters, I think conservatives have been acting completely insane the last few months. Get over yourselves and respect the government the way you demanded it of liberals when your guy was in office.

Obama wants to start a civil war. That's rich. No. Obama is President and you don't like him. That doesn't make him evil or you special. Voice your dissent, but stop acting like the world is collapsing. The Dems are gonna win elections sometimes. And when they do, they are gonna try and pass laws. That's how it works.

Here endeth the rant. I need some oxygen.

:applause::applause::applause:

Very well said Henry.

[Koolblue13]

I wouldn't automatically jump to such a broad conclusion. The whacko animal-rights extremists, and the whacko environmental extremists, definitely have exhibited some behavior over the years that I wouldn't exactly call "peaceful".

(Remembering a Dennis Miller joke: The animal rights people decided that they'd throw blood on people wearing fur, but not leather, because it's safer to publicly assault rich women than motorcycle gangs.)

Isn't the most dangerous extremists group in the country extreme leftist?

ELF.

[skinfan133]

- Are liberals that oppose republican politics not talked about as being un-american?

- Are liberals pushing their own politics, the very ones they promised in election they won, not being refered to as socialists, tyrants, that are threatening america?

- Are republican towns not called "real america" by republicans?

- Are we not having this discussion in a thread where a republican is openly wondering if Obama is starting a civil war becuase *gasp* he wants to reform healthcar?

I mean feel free to point out where I am off here? I'm going by what your side is saying. It's getting ugly and now we are getting into implied violence.

my side? MY side? wtf is that supposed to be? We're both ****ing American last time I checked.

I don't give a **** what republicans are calling liberals *I am neither* and therefore I take offense that you lump conservatives and libertarians in with republicans who can very often be an entirely different breed.

Because of my current ties and career path I refuse to comment on the issue of civil war.